the great apostasy

[skyblue888]

The Apostle Paul, in his second letter to the Thessalonians, foretold the great apostasy which would result in the establishment of the papal power. He declared that the day of Christ should not come, "except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition; who opposes and exalts himself above all that is called God, or that is worshiped; so that he as God sits in the temple of God, showing himself that he is God."

And furthermore, the apostle warns his brethren that "the mystery of iniquity does already work." 2 Thess.2:3,4,7.

Even at that early date he saw, creeping into the church, errors that would prepare the way for the development of the papacy. (1884 Great Controversy, 51)

to be continued

[skyblue888]

Little by little, at first in stealth and silence, and then more openly as it increased in strength and gained control of the minds of men, the mystery of iniquity carried forward its deceptive and blasphemous work. Almost imperceptibly the customs of heathenism found their way into the Christian church. The spirit of compromise and conformity was restrained for a time by the fierce persecutions which the church endured under paganism. But as persecution ceased, and Christianity entered the courts and palaces of kings, she laid aside the humble simplicity of Christ and his apostles for the pomp and pride of pagan priests and rulers; and in place of the requirements of God, she substituted human theories and traditions.

The nominal conversion of Constantine, in the early part of the fourth century, caused great rejoicing; and the world, arrayed in robes of righteousness, walked into the church. Now the work of corruption rapidly progressed. Paganism, while appearing to be vanquished, became the conqueror. Her spirit controlled the church. Her doctrines, ceremonies, and superstitions were incorporated into the faith and worship of the professed followers of Christ." 51,52.

to be continued

[skyblue888]

This compromise between paganism and Christianity resulted in the development of "the man of sin" foretold in prophecy as opposing and exalting himself above God. That gigantic system of false religion is a masterpiece of Satan's power--a monument of his efforts to seat himself upon the throne to rule the earth according to his will.

Satan once endeavored to form a compromise with Christ. He came to the Son of God in the wilderness of temptation, and showing Him all the kingdoms of the world and the glory of them, offered to give all into His hands if He would but acknowledge the supremacy of the prince of darkness. Christ rebuked the presumptuous tempter and forced him to depart. But Satan meets with greater success in presenting the same temptations to man. To secure worldly gains and honors, the church was led to seek the favor and support of the great men of earth; and having thus rejected Christ, she was induced to yield allegiance to the representative of Satan--the bishop of Rome." p.52.

to be continued

[skyblue888]

It is one of the leading doctrines of Romanism that the pope is the visible head of the universal church of Christ, invested with supreme authority over bishops and pastors in all parts of the world. More than this, the pope has arrogated the very titles of Deity. He styles himself 'Lord God the Pope,' assumes infallibility, and demands that all men pay him homage. Thus the same claim urged by Satan in the wilderness of temptation is still urged by him through the Church of Rome, and vast numbers are ready to yield him homage.

But those who fear and reverence God meet this Heaven-daring assumption as Christ met the solicitations of the wily foe: 'Thou shalt worship the Lord thy God, and Him only shalt thou serve.' Luke 4:8. God has never given a hint in His word that He has appointed any man to be the head of the church. The doctrine of papal supremacy is directly opposed to the teachings of the Scriptures. The pope can have no power over Christ's church except by usurpation." 53

to be continued

[skyblue888]

Romanists have persisted in bringing against Protestants the charge of heresy and willful separation from the true church. But these accusations apply rather to themselves. They are the ones who laid down the banner of Christ and departed from "the faith which was once delivered unto the saints." Jude 3.

Satan well knew that the Holy Scriptures would enable men to discern his deceptions and withstand his power. It was by the word that even the Saviour of the world had resisted his attacks. At every assault, Christ presented the shield of eternal truth, saying, "It is written." To every suggestion of the adversary, He opposed the wisdom and power of the word. In order for Satan to maintain his sway over men, and establish the authority of the papal usurper, he must keep them in ignorance of the Scriptures. The Bible would exalt God and place finite men in their true position; therefore its sacred truths must be concealed and suppressed.

This logic was adopted by the Roman Church. For hundreds of years the circulation of the Bible was prohibited. The people were forbidden to read it or to have it in their houses, and unprincipled priests and prelates interpreted its teachings to sustain their pretensions. Thus the pope came to be almost universally acknowledged as the vicegerent of God on earth, endowed with authority over church and state." 53

to be continued

[skyblue888]

The detector of error having been removed, Satan worked according to his will. Prophecy had declared that the papacy was to "think to change times and laws." Daniel 7:25. This work it was not slow to attempt. To afford converts from heathenism a substitute for the worship of idols, and thus to promote their nominal acceptance of Christianity, the adoration of images and relics was gradually introduced into the Christian worship. The decree of a general council finally established this system of idolatry. To complete the sacrilegious work, Rome presumed to expunge from the law of God the second commandment, forbidding image worship, and to divide the tenth commandment, in order to preserve the number.

The spirit of concession to paganism opened the way for a still further disregard of Heaven's authority. Satan, working through unconsecrated leaders of the church, tampered with the fourth commandment also, and essayed to set aside the ancient Sabbath, the day which God had blessed and sanctified (Genesis 2:2, 3), and in its stead to exalt the festival observed by the heathen as "the venerable day of the sun." This change was not at first attempted openly. In the first centuries the true Sabbath had been kept by all Christians. They were jealous for the honor of God, and, believing that His law is immutable, they zealously guarded the sacredness of its precepts. But with great subtlety Satan worked through his agents to bring about his object. That the attention of the people might be called to the Sunday, it was made a festival in honor of the resurrection of Christ. Religious services were held upon it; yet it was regarded as a day of recreation, the Sabbath being still sacredly observed." 54,55.

to be continued

[Guest]

I have an 1884 edition of the Great Controversy. I also have one from 1888, and three from 1911. They don't make books like that anymore.

Ok, as you were....

[John317]

You're right, Richard.

Today most people are too afraid of possibly offending anyone to tell the truth. There's also "political correctness." So we compromise. Ellen White didn't go out of her way to offend anyone-- in fact, she didn't enjoy that part of her work-- but she was faithful to tell the truth as God gave her the truth.

The church must be willing to tell the truth no matter what the cost if it's going to do what God raised it up to do. Ours is not going to be a popular message with very many in the world. It calls for people to radically change their lives.

[cheddar]

Well the truth on this thread is that the pope doesn't fit the man of sin in 2 Thes. 2:3,4 for two reasons.

1) The verse says that he sits in the temple of God. The vatican is not a temple it's a church. The greek word for church refers to a gathering of believers and the greek word for temple refers directly to the Jewish sanctuary consisting of a holy and most holy. I wasn't raised Catholic so maybe they see the vatican as a temple but I don't think they do and it doesn't fit anyway.

2) The man of sin claims to be God. Again I was not raised Catholic so I don't know the mindset but I think most see the pope as the representative of God not God himself. If we were to ask most Catholics if the pope were God, I think most would say no. The pope was born into this world like everyone else so once again the represtative of God and God himself are not the same thing.

The former and present day Catholics out there can check my facts on this one.

[John317]

... the pope doesn't fit the man of sin in 2 Thes. 2:3,4 for two reasons.

1) The verse says that he sits in the temple of God. The vatican is not a temple it's a church. The greek word for church refers to a gathering of believers and the greek word for temple refers directly to the Jewish sanctuary consisting of a holy and most holy.

1 Cor. 3:16

Do you not know that you are God's temple and that God's Spirit dwells in you?

NOTE: the above refers to the church as God's temple.

Ephes. 2:19-22

So then you are no longer strangers and aliens, but you are fellow citizens with the saints and members of the household of God, [20] built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Christ Jesus himself being the cornerstone, [21] in whom the whole structure, being joined together, grows into a holy temple in the Lord. [22] In him you also are being built together into a dwelling place for God by the Spirit.

NOTE: the above refers to the church as "the holy temple."

Therefore in New Testament terms "the temple of God" refers to the church.

The Jewish sanctuary was deserted by God. The Holy Spirit left it. It has lost its meaning for the people of God. The Jewish sanctuary was no longer the temple of God by this time. God allowed it to be utterly destroyed, and its services were transferred to the heavenly sanctuary where Christ is High Priest. Rev. 11: 18.

The Bible predicted that there would come into the church a great apostasy,"the falling away," which history itself shows occurred just as prophecy predicted it would. As soon as the apostles died, many false doctrines started entering the church of God:

Acts 20:28-31

Pay careful attention to yourselves and to all the flock, in which the Holy Spirit has made you overseers, to care for the church of God, which he obtained with his own blood. [29] I know that after my departure fierce wolves will come in among you, not sparing the flock; [30] and from among your own selves will arise men speaking twisted things, to draw away the disciples after them. [31] Therefore be alert, remembering that for three years I did not cease night or day to admonish everyone with tears.

1 Tim. 4:1-3

Now the Spirit expressly says that in later times some will depart from the faith by devoting themselves to deceitful spirits and teachings of demons, [2] through the insincerity of liars whose consciences are seared, [3] who forbid marriage and require abstinence from foods that God created to be received with thanksgiving by those who believe and know the truth.

2 Thes. 2:7

For the mystery of lawlessness is already at work. Only he who now restrains it will do so until he is out of the way.

[John317]

Well the truth on this thread is that the pope doesn't fit the man of sin in 2 Thes. 2:3,4 for two reasons.

2) The man of sin claims to be God. Again I was not raised Catholic so I don't know the mindset but I think most see the pope as the representative of God not God himself.

Do you think any Christians would be tricked by someone claiming to be "God"? I doubt any would. The moment someone makes such a claim, any Christian's alarm would go off, as it were. It would be a dead give away.

But do you think any Christians would be tricked by someone claiming to speak for God and to act in the place of Christ? Yes. Billions throughout history already have been tricked.

One of the titles of the pope is "Vicar of the Son of God."

You are right that most Catholics, and even a growing number of protestants, see the pope as "THE representative of God."

Pope Leo XIII said, "We [popes] hold upon this earth the place of God Almighty." (See Encyclical Letter, The Reunion of Christendom, dated June 20, 1894.)

"The pope is not only the representative of Jesus Christ, but he is Jesus Christ, Himself, hidden under the veil of flesh." (Catholic National, July 1895)

He is deep inside the temple of God and has been for over 1,500 years.

He teaches millions of Christians around the world to disobey God's law.

Isn't this exacly what you would expect the "man of sin" to tell people? He has practically the whole Christian world believing that they can deliberately disobey the law of God.

[Overaged]

That Pope Leo XIII was a nasty dude.

[John317]

That Pope Leo XIII was a nasty dude.

I don't know anything about the kind of person he was, but his theology was evidently pretty messed up.

[skyblue888]

Pope Leo XIII said, "We [popes] hold upon this earth the place of God Almighty." (See Encyclical Letter, The Reunion of Christendom, dated June 20, 1894.)

"The pope is not only the representative of Jesus Christ, but he is Jesus Christ, Himself, hidden under the veil of flesh." (Catholic National, July 1895)

John317

_______________

If these statements fail to convince anyone, what will?

Thanks for sharing them with us John.

sky :)

[skyblue888]

The detector of error having been removed, Satan worked according to his will. Prophecy had declared that the papacy was to "think to change times and laws." Daniel 7:25. This work it was not slow to attempt. To afford converts from heathenism a substitute for the worship of idols, and thus to promote their nominal acceptance of Christianity, the adoration of images and relics was gradually introduced into the Christian worship. The decree of a general council finally established this system of idolatry. To complete the sacrilegious work, Rome presumed to expunge from the law of God the second commandment, forbidding image worship, and to divide the tenth commandment, in order to preserve the number.

The spirit of concession to paganism opened the way for a still further disregard of Heaven's authority. Satan, working through unconsecrated leaders of the church, tampered with the fourth commandment also, and essayed to set aside the ancient Sabbath, the day which God had blessed and sanctified (Genesis 2:2, 3), and in its stead to exalt the festival observed by the heathen as "the venerable day of the sun." This change was not at first attempted openly. In the first centuries the true Sabbath had been kept by all Christians. They were jealous for the honor of God, and, believing that His law is immutable, they zealously guarded the sacredness of its precepts. But with great subtlety Satan worked through his agents to bring about his object. That the attention of the people might be called to the Sunday, it was made a festival in honor of the resurrection of Christ. Religious services were held upon it; yet it was regarded as a day of recreation, the Sabbath being still sacredly observed." 54,55.

________________________________

Constantine, while still a heathen, issued a decree enjoining the general observance of Sunday as a public festival throughout the Roman empire. After his conversion, he remained a staunch advocate of Sunday, and his pagan edict was then enforced by him in the interests of his new faith. But the honor shown this day was not as yet sufficient to prevent Christians from regarding the true Sabbath as the holy of the Lord. Another step must be taken; the false Sabbath must be exalted to an equality with the true. A few years after the issue of Constantine's decree, the bishop of Rome conferred on the Sunday the title of Lord's day. Thus the people were gradually led to regard it as possessing a degree of sacredness. Still the original Sabbath was kept.

The arc-deceiver had not completed his work. He was resolved to gather the Christian world under his banner, and to exercise his power through his vicegerent, the proud pontiff who claimed to be the representative of Christ. Through half-converted pagans, ambitious prelates, and world-loving church-men, he accomplished his purpose. Vast councils were held, from time to time, in which the dignitaries of the church were convened from all the world. In nearly every council the Sabbath which God had instituted was pressed down a little lower, while the Sunday was correspondingly exalted. Thus the pagan festival came finally to be honored as a divine institution, while the Bible Sabbath was pronounced a relic of Judaism, and its observers were declared to be accursed." 55,56.

to be continued

[Overaged]

Pope Leo XIII said, "We [popes] hold upon this earth the place of God Almighty." (See Encyclical Letter, The Reunion of Christendom, dated June 20, 1894.)

"The pope is not only the representative of Jesus Christ, but he is Jesus Christ, Himself, hidden under the veil of flesh." (Catholic National, July 1895)

John317

_______________

If these statements fail to convince anyone, what will?

Thanks for sharing them with us John.

sky

[Overaged]

I don't get it. What's wrong with the 1911 version? Are you saying older versions are "better?" I have several older versions; I would say no.

[skyblue888]

I have both the 1884 and the 1911... there are some slight changes in the wording here and there but the message is still the same, from what I have read.

sky

[skyblue888]

The great apostate had succeeded in exalting himself "above all that is called God, or that is worshiped." 2 Thessalonians 2:4. He had dared to change the only precept of the divine law that unmistakably points all mankind to the true and living God. In the fourth commandment, God is revealed as the Creator of the heavens and the earth, and is thereby distinguished from all false gods. It was as a memorial of the work of creation that the seventh day was sanctified as a rest day for man. It was designed to keep the living God ever before the minds of men as the source of being and the object of reverence and worship. Satan strives to turn men from their allegiance to God, and from rendering obedience to His law; therefore he directs his efforts especially against that commandment which points to God as the Creator.

Protestants now urge that the resurrection of Christ on Sunday made it the Christian Sabbath. But Scripture evidence is lacking. No such honor was given to the day by Christ or His apostles. The observance of Sunday as a Christian institution had its origin in that "mystery of lawlessness" (2 Thessalonians 2:7, R.V.) which, even in Paul's day, had begun its work. Where and when did the Lord adopt this child of the papacy? What valid reason can be given for a change which the Scriptures are silent?" 56,57.

to be continued

[skyblue888]

In the sixth century the papacy had become firmly established. Its seat of power was fixed in the imperial city, and the bishop of Rome was declared to be the head over the entire church. Paganism had given place to the papacy. The dragon had given to the beast "his power, and his seat, and great authority." Revelation 13:2.

And now began the 1260 years of papal oppression foretold in the prophecies of Daniel and John. Daniel 7:25; Revelation 13:5-7. Christians were forced to choose either to yield their integrity and accept the papal ceremonies and worship, or to wear away their lives in dungeon cells, or suffer death by the rack, the fagot, or the headsman's ax. Now were fulfilled the words of Jesus: "Ye shall be betrayed both by parents, and brethren, and kinsfolks, and friends; and some of you shall they cause to be put to death. And ye shall be hated of all men for My name's sake." Luke 21:16, 17.

Persecution opened upon the faithful with greater fury than ever before, and the world became a vast battlefield. For hundreds of years the church of Christ found refuge in seclusion and obscurity. Thus says the prophet: "The woman fled into the wilderness, where she hath a place prepared of God, that they should feed her there a thousand two hundred and three-score days." Revelation 12:6.

to be continued

[skyblue888]

The accession of the Roman Church to power marked the beginning of the Dark Ages. As her power increased, the darkness deepened. Faith was transferred from Christ, the true foundation, to the pope of Rome. Instead of trusting in the Son of God for forgiveness of sins and for eternal salvation, the people looked to the pope, and to the priests and prelates to whom he delegated authority. They were taught that the pope was their earthly mediator and that none could approach God except through him; and, further, that he stood in the place of God to them and was therefore to be implicitly obeyed. A deviation from his requirements was sufficient cause for the severest punishment to be visited upon the bodies and souls of the offenders. Thus the minds of the people were turned away from God to fallible, erring, and cruel men, nay, more, to the prince of darkness himself, who exercised his power through them. Sin was disguised in a garb of sanctity. When the Scriptures are suppressed, and man comes to regard himself as supreme, we need look only for fraud, deception, and debasing iniquity. With the elevation of human laws and traditions was manifest the corruption that ever results from setting aside the law of God." 58

to be continued

[cheddar]

I’m not disagreeing with most of the facts you’ve presented about the papacy. The RCC has been a persecuting power thru most of its existence and has changed the sabbath to Sunday and has set up a counterfeit system of worship. But that does not mean the pope automatically fits the ‘man of sin’. I’m sure that Paul knew the difference between the terms church and temple, yet he chose to use the word temple as an identifier of the man of sin. The last earthly temple ceased to exist long before the RCC ever came on the seen.

If we read further in 2nd Thes. Chap 2, Paul also says that the man of sin will be consumed at the 2nd coming and during this time God will send a strong delusion to the whole world that they might all believe a lie. What greater delusion could there ever be than Satan coming and impersonating Jesus Christ. Nothing even comes close to this. Nothing the papacy has ever done or ever will do comes close to this. If the pope is anything in bible prophecy he might be the false prophet of the beast but the beast/man of sin is Satan.

[skyblue888]

That's right, he has set up a counterfeit system of worship. In the language of Daniel the prophet "He has planted the tabernacles of his palaces between the seas and the glorious holy mountain." Dan.11:45. Between the multitudes of this earth and Christ. "He has set up his throne between God and man, to appropriate the adoration that belongs to God alone." E.G. White, 6 B.C.1119. But just before Jesus appears in the clouds of heaven, he will come to his end and none shall help him. (Dan.11:45)

Of course it is Satan who is behind this counterfeit system of worship. The pope is only his representative here on earth. For 1260 years the pope reigned supreme. In 1798 General Berthier entered Rome and took the pope in captivity and he died in captivity as predicted in Rev.11. Since then the pope lost his temporal supremacy. But this wound is going to be healed and again he will rule supreme for a short time only to be destroyed at the time of the sixth plague by the very ones who once had crowned him with laurels.

Satan himself will impersonate Christ before the close of probation at the time of the death decree. The false prophet is Apostate Protestantism.

sky

It is true Satan is the man of sin, the son of perdition, the mystery of iniquity. The pope is only his vicegerent acting in his stead and by the same token he too is the man of sin, the son of perdition, the mystery of iniquity.

[skyblue888]

Those were days of peril for the church of Christ. The faithful standard-bearers were few indeed. Though the truth was not left without witnesses, yet at times it seemed that error and superstition would wholly prevail, and true religion would be banished from the earth. The gospel was lost sight of, but the forms of religion were multiplied, and the people were burdened with rigorous exactions.

They were taught not only to look to the pope as their mediator, but to trust to works of their own to atone for sin.

Long pilgrimages, acts of penance, the worship of relics, the

erection of churches, shrines, and altars, the payment of large sums to the church--these and many similar acts were enjoined to appease the wrath of God or to secure His favor; as if God were like men, to be angered at trifles, or pacified by gifts or acts of penance!

Notwithstanding that vice prevailed, even among the leaders of the Roman Church, her influence seemed steadily to increase. About the close of the eighth century, papists put forth the claim that in the first ages of the church the bishops of Rome had possessed the same spiritual power which they now assumed. To establish this claim, some means must be employed to give it a show of authority; and this was readily suggested by the father of lies. Ancient writings were forged by monks. Decrees of councils before unheard of were discovered, establishing the universal supremacy of the pope from the earliest times. And a church that had rejected the truth greedily accepted these deceptions." 58,59.

to be continued

[Overaged]

I’m not disagreeing with most of the facts you’ve presented about the papacy. The RCC has been a persecuting power thru most of its existence and has changed the sabbath to Sunday and has set up a counterfeit system of worship. But that does not mean the pope automatically fits the ‘man of sin’. I’m sure that Paul knew the difference between the terms church and temple, yet he chose to use the word temple as an identifier of the man of sin. The last earthly temple ceased to exist long before the RCC ever came on the seen.

If we read further in 2nd Thes. Chap 2, Paul also says that the man of sin will be consumed at the 2nd coming and during this time God will send a strong delusion to the whole world that they might all believe a lie. What greater delusion could there ever be than Satan coming and impersonating Jesus Christ. Nothing even comes close to this. Nothing the papacy has ever done or ever will do comes close to this. If the pope is anything in bible prophecy he might be the false prophet of the beast but the beast/man of sin is Satan.

Satan is not a man