Dr. Herbert Douglass On Abortion and "Planned Parenthood"

[John317]

“But know this, that in the last days perilous times will come: (2) For men will be lovers of themselves, lovers of money, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy, (3) unloving, unforgiving, slanderers, without self-control, brutal, despisers of good, (4 ) traitors, headstrong, haughty, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of God, (5) having a form of godliness but denying its power. And from such people turn away!” 2 Timothy 3:1-5, NKJV.

For some time I have deliberated regarding whether to say anything more about that

“third rail” in everyone's face these days—the abortion issue. A few days ago I copied out the Adventist church position on the subject—always leaving the final decision up to each person.

But what is rarely said, although it is always in the picture, either prominently or in the shadows—and that is the philosophy and program of Planned Parenthood. The more I think about that name, the more I must commend the originators of their title: It surely is another example of Orwelling, 1984 language like “war is peace” and the sign over the entrance to several German concentration camps, “Arbeit macht frei" (Work Makes Freedom”). Perhaps their program should be entitled: “Standing Parenthood Upside Down.”

Perhaps in the last few years Planned Parenthood has reached a new low. The sleazy genocide racket that pretends it's all about 'women's health' has been exposed as doing its best to get American kids addicted to fornication so they can increase the number of babies they murder each year, and make piles of cash [your tax money for the most part] doing it.

The American Life League has released a graphic new video report that it says shows how Planned Parenthood “exposes children to sexual material in order to seed a generation of sex addicts, who will become future customers for the abortion giant. . . . In the name of ‘education,’ Planned Parenthood exposes children as young as 10 years old to pornographic illustrations of masturbation, nudity, sexual activity, and much much more.”

“Any parent that sees the video of Planned Parenthood’s material for school children will be horrified,” Jim Sedlak, vice president of the American Life League, told Life Site News. “Planned Parenthood’s business model is aimed at making money from people who are engaged in sexual activity. Those are the women who will have abortions, which made up 51% of Planned Parenthood’s clinic revenue in 2010.” www.theblaze.com/.../hooking-kids-on-sex-graphic-new-vid-report-s.. mommylife.net/archives/2012/02/planned_parenth_40.html forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1057&message... (Note the video has been blocked on some venues!)

Now what's this all about: In one section the video, “Hooking Kids on Sex,” talks about a book for 10-year-olds with graphic images about how boys and girls can masturbate, put on a condom and have sexual intercourse. I repeat, “graphic images.”

The video begins with “graphic images” showing how Planned Parenthood regularly uses props shaped as male and female genitals. Far more than mere props as the book of graphic images goes on. Hooking kids on sex to guarantee future business that amounts to more than 50% of their abortion business is great, if they can continue to get away with it.

I find it more than interesting that Margaret Sanger was virtually kicked out of the USA for wanting to exterminate many black babies and other misfits in the human gene pool. She moved to Europe only to learn better methods from a socialist progressive culture, and to come back years later with the “planned parenthood” idea which really has nothing to do with parenting at all. www.dianedew.com/sanger.htm www.blackinformant.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/08/quotes.pdf

Really, could Paul to Timothy have described our world today any more clearly? Could anyone have foreseen even fifty years ago this blatant, “in-your-face,” attack on all that decent people for centuries only whispered, if anything had to be said. The sexualization of children, the cheapening of God’s gift of appropriate sex and marriage , the equating of every perversion’s legitimacy with equal standing to what God designed, and worst, to finally murdering the babies produced when its plans of cheap, loose sex are followed, resulting in undesired pregnancies—is there any more to be said, If so, it will truly be “in your face.”

Of course we are not asking for the shutdown of Planned Parenthood; after all, this is Free America! But full disclosure, like the marvelous sonar-gram does for expectant parents, is healthy for all concerned. In fact, many mothers who see the picture of their young child even three-months old simply refuse to continue their plans for an abortion. Such is the power of truth when its spotlight is turned on.

R&H, Aug. 5, 1902: "Those who place themselves under God's control, to be led and guided by Him, will CATCH THE STEADY TREND OF EVENTS ordained by Him to take place.”

[miz3]

Excellently spoken John317.

If "Planned Parenthood" is to exist of course it should:

1. Never ever use Federal taxes and/or any public taxes for that matter to fund its operations of any kind.

2. It should be privately funded if funded at all.

3. It should be accountable to obey the laws of this nation. At present it is breaking the laws against murder at every level possible. Murder is not allowed in our society yet they are allowed to operate these murder mills. This is a major reason God is not able to bless this Nation any more.

4. Life begins at conception. There is no argument here in spite of the "abortionists" claims. We do not even need the Bible to know this. However, the Bible is most clear that Life from God begins at conception.

I will not ever retreat from this position no matter how many names and characterizations are thrown at me.

I am thoroughly ashamed of the SDA Church .org on this issue because we should be at the very lead point on this issue. Instead we are not even at the tail of this position. We condone the murder of Life in our very hospital institutions. This is most disgraceful.

Such practices in the SDA Church .org must stop immediately. Strong language on this is not strong enough to convey the sinfulness of this abortion practice.

[Gordon1]

Hi John, Not sure if that commentary belongs to you or Douglass.

Hooking us all on sex relates to the Hugging and Modesty threads as well.

And not all realize the connection to the feminist movement promoted by the Rockefellers and Gloria Steinem.

[olger]

Douglass is a good soul.

[miz3]

Douglass is a good soul.

[Gustave]

The SDA church is neck deep into Planned Parent-hood...

...PP being a recent name for it's earlier.

..."The Race Betterment Foundation".

It was initially believed that Anthropoid Apes could mate with Negro females...

...Producing confused races of "men" who would then perpetuate this hominid anomaly.

...To preserve the standing of the white race it was thought best to cull.

...The confused or lesser races of men.

Eventually, after it was confirmed that Apes could not breed with humans....

...And produce confused fruit ( as it was called )as well as Hitler use of the program against Jews.

...The name was changed to PP.

...The group now believes there are too many humans on the planet.

...And offers abortion to all - however it still mainly targest blacks and other minorties.

http://www.eugenicsarchive.org/html/eugenics/static/images/200.html

http://www.adventistarchives.org/docs/LUH/LUH19400528-V32-21__B.pdf#view%3dfit

http://www.adventistarchives.org/docs/LUH/LUH19411125-V33-45__B.pdf#view%3dfit

http://www.adventistarchives.org/docs/LUH/LUH19420519-V34-19__B.pdf#view%3dfit

http://www.adventistarchives.org/docs/RH/RH19460523-V123-21__B.pdf#view%3dfit

http://www.adventistarchives.org/docs/RH/RH19661124-V143-53__B.pdf#view%3dfit

[doug yowell]

The SDA church is neck deep into Planned Parent-hood...

What do you mean,G? How is it neck deep?

[doug yowell]

Thanks for the post,John.I wonder why HD didn't address the church's response to the issue? Why pick exclusively on PP when the largest private provider of abortions in the USA has been owned by either current or former SDA's? I wonder what he would say to having one of our former SDA pastors (now deceased)speak at a local PP grand opening here in the IE? I guess that HD's lack of support for PP means that he's not truely pro-life either (see other thread)?

[Gustave]

Officers of the SDA Church sat "on the board" of the Race Betterment Foundation...

...Which indeed became PP.

...SDA medical facilities suck thousands of babies out of Mothers.

Would you like for me to provide you with more documentation?

[John317]

Hi John, Not sure if that commentary belongs to you or Douglass.

All of it is by Herbert Douglass. He sent it to me in an e-mail and gave me permission to post it here.

[doug yowell]

Officers of the SDA Church sat "on the board" of the Race Betterment Foundation...

...Which indeed became PP.

...SDA medical facilities suck thousands of babies out of Mothers.

Would you like for me to provide you with more documentation?

Sure.

[John317]

Would you like for me to provide you with more documentation?

Yes, do. I especially want the facts on this topic about Loma Linda U Medical Center.

[John317]

Thanks for the post,John.I wonder why HD didn't address the church's response to the issue?

Good question. Not sure. Maybe I'll ask him.

[miz3]

My first post was most clear about Planned Parenthood.

I want to make myself most clear about the issue of abortion itself.

Under no circumstances whatsoever is it every correct to have an abortion. The only time a baby should be aborted is if it happens "accidentally" (never on purpose) and/or "naturally".

In no instance should any human attempt to abort an unborn baby from the womb. That includes rape and incest. As to the "health of the mother" (often a catch all crutch to legitimize abortion) God will make the choice not the human being.

Our advanced medical procedures and knowledge give us no excuse concerning the health of mother and/or baby.

Abortions make both the parents and the unborn permanent victims of this atrocity.

Second, the FACT that the SDA Church .org and its clearly owned and operated medical facilities are used as abortion mills is to me most repugnant. I would that I could use stronger language in this regard.

It is vital that the SDA Church .org change its doctrine on abortion. It may not a written part of the Fundamental twenty-eight but such prolific practice makes it a doctrine written in the life and blood of the countless humans that have died.

We rail against Hitler and His Jewish genocide, against Stalin for his even greater genocide within Communist Russia, and against Mao in China who beat them all by killing more than Stalin/Hitler put together.

How a Church that makes such high and lofty claims as being "God's remnant" can be so involved in such a satanic atrocity that defies human language must be held accountable.

Where is the "brethren" who have the power to shut such atrocities down?

Third, we should all know just how much deeper the SDA Church .org is in this mess. Thank you Gustave.

We need to have good honest and truthful data. It does us no good if the data is dishonest and is false.

[ClubV12]

miz, your first post on planned parenthood was NOT clear, it is fundamentally confusion and opinion containing no facts. You have not made yourself clear on abortion at all, in my opinion.

miz3 says,

"We rail against Hitler..."

No, WE don't, YOU might, like you do with anybody and everybody who does not agree with your opinion.

[Dr. Rich]

My first post was most clear about Planned Parenthood.

I want to make myself most clear about the issue of abortion itself.

Under no circumstances whatsoever is it every correct to have an abortion. The only time a baby should be aborted is if it happens "accidentally" (never on purpose) and/or "naturally".

In no instance should any human attempt to abort an unborn baby from the womb. That includes rape and incest. As to the "health of the mother" (often a catch all crutch to legitimize abortion) God will make the choice not the human being.

Our advanced medical procedures and knowledge give us no excuse concerning the health of mother and/or baby.

Abortions make both the parents and the unborn permanent victims of this atrocity.

Second, the FACT that the SDA Church .org and its clearly owned and operated medical facilities are used as abortion mills is to me most repugnant. I would that I could use stronger language in this regard.

It is vital that the SDA Church .org change its doctrine on abortion. It may not a written part of the Fundamental twenty-eight but such prolific practice makes it a doctrine written in the life and blood of the countless humans that have died.

We rail against Hitler and His Jewish genocide, against Stalin for his even greater genocide within Communist Russia, and against Mao in China who beat them all by killing more than Stalin/Hitler put together.

How a Church that makes such high and lofty claims as being "God's remnant" can be so involved in such a satanic atrocity that defies human language must be held accountable.

Where is the "brethren" who have the power to shut such atrocities down?

Third, we should all know just how much deeper the SDA Church .org is in this mess. Thank you Gustave.

We need to have good honest and truthful data. It does us no good if the data is dishonest and is false.

Again Miz3, your post was right on point and I must fully agree. It was easy to understand and ClubV12 probably does not want to admit that SDA medical personal are not above God's law on murder. When John the Baptist jumped in the womb of Liz, that shows me that abortion IS murder regardless of statutory (man made) law.

[miz3]

Again Miz3, your post was right on point and I must fully agree. It was easy to understand and ClubV12 probably does not want to admit that SDA medical personal are not above God's law on murder. When John the Baptist jumped in the womb of Liz, that shows me that abortion IS murder regardless of statutory (man made) law.

Thank your Dr. Rich. You are correct the Bible does make the case for what we believe about abortion and your reference to the Bible is a major point in this case.

[doug yowell]

How a Church that makes such high and lofty claims as being "God's remnant" can be so involved in such a satanic atrocity that defies human language must be held accountable.

[Dr. Rich]

Sadly, the report that the well known doctor who did abortions here in LLU and was killed in his air plane in Montana last year, was blasted by locals which made them suspects in the crash. My daughter worked with his daughter and we all were upset with so many people saying bad things about how he 'deserved' what he got. I hate to even write this here, but I need to in order to get people to lay off these people becaue God is the real judge on this whole issue. Personaly, I don't like it. But then I am not a woman who has been raped either.

[doug yowell]

Sadly, the report that the well known doctor who did abortions here in LLU and was killed in his air plane in Montana last year, was blasted by locals which made them suspects in the crash. My daughter worked with his daughter and we all were upset with so many people saying bad things about how he 'deserved' what he got. I hate to even write this here, but I need to in order to get people to lay off these people becaue God is the real judge on this whole issue. Personaly, I don't like it. But then I am not a woman who has been raped either.

I think you mean that his children and grandchildren were killed in that tragedy. It is highly unlikely that the tens of thousands of his clients were all raped and pregnant. No one can stand in judgment of God's "justice" in this tragic matter, but we can all stand in judgment on the Dr.'s callous disregard of the value (God) placed on the unborn children he terminated.

[ClubV12]

Miz3 doesn't want to admit his opinions have nothing to back them up.

Book, chapter and verse miz3, bible and bible only. Your opinons are meaningless.

[miz3]

G's, original PP link was dated in 1921 when,I think, Dr. Kellogg and the Battle Creek San were both severed from SDA control.SDA participation in the practice of abortion during the 1970's and 1980's is well documented. That was 20 years ago. What Nic and others have been calling for is up to date verifiable data. Something that will show SDA's and the world what our guidelines have actually accomplished and whether or not Adventism is deserving of the criticism it seems to ignore regarding it's actual practice.Good and honest data may show that SDA's have indeed gotten out of the abortion business.It's a little premature to make the call without the evidence, one way or the other.

OK, if the SDA Church .org has severed itself from doing abortions in her institutions, and has stopped supporting abortion in any and every way, then you have a point.

I am willing to view more honest truthful current data if such exists. If it does not exist then the SDA Church .org is to fault for not correcting a satanic practice and deserves all the ridicule it gets.

Does such up to date data exist?

[ClubV12]

Book, chapter and verse miz3, bible and bible only. Do you have anything to add to the discussion or not?

[tall73]

SDA participation in the practice of abortion during the 1970's and 1980's is well documented. That was 20 years ago. What Nic and others have been calling for is up to date verifiable data. Something that will show SDA's and the world what our guidelines have actually accomplished and whether or not Adventism is deserving of the criticism it seems to ignore regarding it's actual practice.Good and honest data may show that SDA's have indeed gotten out of the abortion business.It's a little premature to make the call without the evidence, one way or the other.

A number of sources reported on a competition in bids to build a medical center in the Montgomery County area of Maryland. Both Catholic and Adventist hospitals put in bids.

Planned Parenthood and others supported the Adventist bid over the Catholic bid as Adventist hospitals would offer elective abortions and sterilizations, as opposed to the Catholic hospital.

Here is an Adventist statement on the subject:

http://www.adventistreview.com/article/4...s-expansion-bid

Notice the following quote in reference to the competing Catholic hospital (which was selected):

By contrast, the winning bid, by Holy Cross Hospital, part of Michigan-based Trinity Health, calls for a hospital to be constructed on public land as part of the Montgomery College community college campus in Gaithersburg, Maryland, only 3.8 miles from Shady Grove Adventist Hospital. Opponents of the move, including Americans United for Separation of Church and State, decry the placement of a private, religiously owned hospital on public land; others noted the hospital would operate under religious restrictions barring a range of reproductive health services including fertility treatments, birth control and abortion.

Articles about the incident were posted in this forum as well.

[ClubV12]

So, nothing to offer but rumor and speculation Tall73?

I think you data is flawed and your opinions misplaced,,,, "brother".