M. T. Cross Posted February 7, 2013 Posted February 7, 2013 Ummmm.... You're going to have to point out where I said anything was Satanic. What I said was mixing paganism and Christianity is not a good idea. It leads to a combination of the two, and that is not a good idea for Christianity. Quote
joeb Posted February 7, 2013 Posted February 7, 2013 My apologies it was not you that referred to Tolkien ( in short Nordic lore) as leading down a Satanic path. However, I will disagree that mixing the two is a bad idea. I would be willing to bet that there is more than one person here that has benefited from my insights (firmly rooted in paganism) as I have benefited from their Christian insights. The more we share, the more we learn. With that the more we know, the sounder and more rounded spiritually we are. And yet it is the RCC that your God allows to hold itself up as his beacon here on earth. The very people that for all of its formitive years held control over what that very Bible says. There is more ritualistic practice by the followers of Yahweh in the OT than I have seen in almost any pagan practice. No problem as to the confusion as to who said what. Been there and done that, a lot.... From your paradigm I have no doubt that you see no problem mixing paganism and Christianity. However, that is not the Biblical paradigm so I'll stick with it. I have no problem with you just because you're a pagan. I've had neighbors and friends who believed a lot like you do. We disagreed on a lot of spiritual ideas, but we got along just fine. You and I can do the same.... Quote Liberty cannot be established without morality, nor morality without faith.Alexis de Tocqueville
M. T. Cross Posted February 7, 2013 Posted February 7, 2013 Oh indeed we can. I am certainly not looking for a fight, just stating another view :) Quote
M. T. Cross Posted February 7, 2013 Posted February 7, 2013 Quote: How many committed Christians are getting sucked into all kinds of very questionable practices/beliefs? Does the fact that they're committed Christians make those practices/beliefs OK? How much New Age stuff has come into the Christian church via the conduit of "committed Christians"? How many pagan practices are condoned by, and practiced by, committed Christians? I guess I could kind of turn those questions around. How many of those "questionable" practices did pagans or New Agers originally borrow from monotheisn (I say that rather than Christianity becuse it happened before Christ was born) and adapt to their religion? The Bible talks about God's people meditating and God appearing to people in dreams and visions as early as the time of Abraham. Who's to say that early pagan/New Age religions didn't take these practices from monotheists and adapt them to their own purposes? Mabe the "chosen" people blessed pagans/New Agers by teaching them these practices. Who's to say we're not just taking back that which our forefathers relied on thousands of years ago? (I think I know the answer - were her initials EGW?? I can see the quotes raining in!) I find much of neo-Wicca to have borrowed heavily from Christianity.But then I view them kind of like the pagan version of the Catholics Church. Quote
Windsor Posted February 7, 2013 Posted February 7, 2013 As long as we are exposing evil infidel heretic satanic writers, let's not forget that sleeze ball C.S. Lewis (author of "Chronicles of Narnia"). Comparing Christ to a lion - really? And his church to a bunch of children and misfits? OOHH the pain! Seriously - how many of you that are "satanizing" "Left Behind" and the writings of Tolkien and Rowling ever read the books? You might be suprised at the blessings and spiritual insights these books contain. Did you know that Tolkien's and Lewis' books were banned by various countries and denominations for several years? Isn't Jesus the Lion of the Tribe of Judah? Quote Remember Adventists Online?
JoeMo Posted February 7, 2013 Posted February 7, 2013 MT, Quote: I would be willing to bet that there is more than one person here that has benefited from my insights (firmly rooted in paganism) as I have benefited from their Christian insights. The more we share, the more we learn. With that the more we know, the sounder and more rounded spiritually we are. I am one of those people. I truly appreciate your practical spiritual insights and open, honest transparency. Windsor, Quote: Isn't Jesus the Lion of the Tribe of Judah? He sure is; but that didn't stop overly zealous Christians from censoring his books when they first came out. This thread is the first criticism I've seen of Tolkien in years. I'm frankly amazed that there are still people who find His writings satanic. It boggles my mind. Quote
Administrators Gail Posted February 7, 2013 Administrators Posted February 7, 2013 Tell me, you guys- Who is the author of truth? Quote Isaiah 32:17 And the work of righteousness shall be peace; and the effect of righteousness quietness and assurance for ever.
JoeMo Posted February 7, 2013 Posted February 7, 2013 Gail, By faith, I proclaim that Jesus Christ is not only the author of truth; but He is the Personification of Truth("I am the Way the Truth, and The Light"). That being said, He does not only share His truths with Christians, He shares it with the whole earth. A time is coming when His Spirit will be poured out on all men. I am becoming increasingly convinced that that time is now. We Christians have a standard for truth in Isaiah 8:20. If a person speaks according to the Light; who cares whether or not that person is a card-carrying Christian? I'm just grateful for the enlightenment. Quote
joeb Posted February 7, 2013 Posted February 7, 2013 Tell me, you guys- Who is the author of truth? This is rhetorical question, right? Quote Liberty cannot be established without morality, nor morality without faith.Alexis de Tocqueville
Administrators Gail Posted February 7, 2013 Administrators Posted February 7, 2013 If God is the author of truth, and you find truth outside of Christianity, then that means, as JoeMo has stated, that God is working "out there" perhaps more than we will admit. Jesus was able to take a belief that was current in His time and wrap a truth around it. I'm speaking of the story of the rich man and Lazarus. Now, the OT believers did not believe in an eternal hellfire, that idea may have come in intertestamentally via the Greeks, but Jesus used it because the common people were all familiar with the belief. Some people have run with that story and believe in a never-ending hell-fire, when Jesus was teaching them the deeper truth that those who are the rich (royalty, priests of the day, those who are possessors of spiritual knowledge and blessing- the Jews) who despise the theme of God's love for all will not gain heavenly home before the beggars (despised by the church elite) who rely on God's love. My point is- first of all, discernment is needed as well as truth. Secondly, pointing out error is needful at times, but not always. Sometimes we will all gain more if we acknowledge the truth, however small we think the other person's grasp of truth is- when we see it "out there". It will take the wisdom of the Holy Spirit to recognise when God has been working in a secularly-minded soul. The person himself might not recognise it for what it is. But we can build on truth. When it is living water it will lead to more. Quote Isaiah 32:17 And the work of righteousness shall be peace; and the effect of righteousness quietness and assurance for ever.
Members phkrause Posted February 8, 2013 Members Posted February 8, 2013 If God is the author of truth, and you find truth outside of Christianity, then that means, as JoeMo has stated, that God is working "out there" perhaps more than we will admit. Jesus was able to take a belief that was current in His time and wrap a truth around it. I'm speaking of the story of the rich man and Lazarus. Now, the OT believers did not believe in an eternal hellfire, that idea may have come in intertestamentally via the Greeks, but Jesus used it because the common people were all familiar with the belief. Some people have run with that story and believe in a never-ending hell-fire, when Jesus was teaching them the deeper truth that those who are the rich (royalty, priests of the day, those who are possessors of spiritual knowledge and blessing- the Jews) who despise the theme of God's love for all will not gain heavenly home before the beggars (despised by the church elite) who rely on God's love. My point is- first of all, discernment is needed as well as truth. Secondly, pointing out error is needful at times, but not always. Sometimes we will all gain more if we acknowledge the truth, however small we think the other person's grasp of truth is- when we see it "out there". It will take the wisdom of the Holy Spirit to recognise when God has been working in a secularly-minded soul. The person himself might not recognise it for what it is. But we can build on truth. When it is living water it will lead to more. Quote phkrause When the righteous are in authority, the people rejoice; But when a wicked man rules, the people groan. Proverbs 29;2
Ted Oplinger Posted February 8, 2013 Posted February 8, 2013 If God is the author of truth, and you find truth outside of Christianity, then that means, as JoeMo has stated, that God is working "out there" perhaps more than we will admit. Jesus was able to take a belief that was current in His time and wrap a truth around it. I'm speaking of the story of the rich man and Lazarus. Now, the OT believers did not believe in an eternal hellfire, that idea may have come in intertestamentally via the Greeks, but Jesus used it because the common people were all familiar with the belief. Some people have run with that story and believe in a never-ending hell-fire, when Jesus was teaching them the deeper truth that those who are the rich (royalty, priests of the day, those who are possessors of spiritual knowledge and blessing- the Jews) who despise the theme of God's love for all will not gain heavenly home before the beggars (despised by the church elite) who rely on God's love. My point is- first of all, discernment is needed as well as truth. Secondly, pointing out error is needful at times, but not always. Sometimes we will all gain more if we acknowledge the truth, however small we think the other person's grasp of truth is- when we see it "out there". It will take the wisdom of the Holy Spirit to recognise when God has been working in a secularly-minded soul. The person himself might not recognise it for what it is. But we can build on truth. When it is living water it will lead to more. Gail, I must return the compliment you gave me on that thread i the Townhall forum - I appreciate these words of wisdom! Blessings! Quote "As iron sharpens iron, so also does one man sharpen another" - Proverbs 27:17 "The offense of the cross is that the cross is a confession of human frailty and sin and of inability to do any good thing. To take the cross of Christ means to depend solely on Him for everything, and this is the abasement of all human pride. Men love to fancy themselves independent. But let the cross be preached, let it be made known that in man dwells no good thing and that all must be received as a gift, and straightway someone is offended." Ellet J. Waggoner, The Glad Tidings "Courage is being scared to death - and saddling up anyway" - John Wayne "The person who pays an ounce of principle for a pound of popularity gets badly cheated" - Ronald Reagan
joeb Posted February 8, 2013 Posted February 8, 2013 If God is the author of truth, and you find truth outside of Christianity, then that means, as JoeMo has stated, that God is working "out there" perhaps more than we will admit. Jesus was able to take a belief that was current in His time and wrap a truth around it. I'm speaking of the story of the rich man and Lazarus. Now, the OT believers did not believe in an eternal hellfire, that idea may have come in intertestamentally via the Greeks, but Jesus used it because the common people were all familiar with the belief. Some people have run with that story and believe in a never-ending hell-fire, when Jesus was teaching them the deeper truth that those who are the rich (royalty, priests of the day, those who are possessors of spiritual knowledge and blessing- the Jews) who despise the theme of God's love for all will not gain heavenly home before the beggars (despised by the church elite) who rely on God's love. My point is- first of all, discernment is needed as well as truth. Secondly, pointing out error is needful at times, but not always. Sometimes we will all gain more if we acknowledge the truth, however small we think the other person's grasp of truth is- when we see it "out there". It will take the wisdom of the Holy Spirit to recognise when God has been working in a secularly-minded soul. The person himself might not recognise it for what it is. But we can build on truth. When it is living water it will lead to more. I believe you have misunderstood me. I have no problem with talking with someone who doesn't believe like I do and telling him/her he/she is right about something when they are. But, I do not believe we should study/read what is acknowledged to be full of pagan/witchcraft teachings in order to try to find any small bits of truth that may exist there. All we are doing is filling our minds with ideas from the source of God's enemy, and we have been clearly counseled against doing such things. As God is the author of truth we have one sure source of truth, God's inspired word. If we study it we will recognize falsehood when we see/hear it. In a way this is no different than what happened with Eve in the Garden of Eden. She was told don't even speak with the serpent. Why? Because the devil is a lot smarter that she_was/we_are and is a master deciever. What happened when she opened up a conversation with the serpent? She was deceived and opened up the floodgates of evil, suffering and death upon all of her posterity. Do you really think you/we are much different than Eve? Then what's the good that can come from allowing the devil to mainline his ideas into our brains by opening a direct route into it by reading his literature? Quote Liberty cannot be established without morality, nor morality without faith.Alexis de Tocqueville
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