Spiritual Formation has too many definitions to condemn it...

[Stan]

That is such a tiring subject, mostly it is people who are talking about Contemplative Prayer...

It is similar to condemning vegetarianism because many Wicca's promote it.

IE Don't become a vegan because witches are often vegans.

If you are going to condemn Spiritual Formation, define it first. JUST Spiritual Formation.

[BobRyan]

It is easy to define.

1. Empty your head.

2. Repetition of a mantra - no matter the content

3. imagine a being appearing to you and answering your questions.

4. Turn over the management and oversight of your worship with God - to some "spiritual director"

Which one of these did Ignatius miss? none?

in Christ,

Bob

[Gibs]

For me I have chosen Jesus Christ as my Spiritual director and He is with me 24,7.

More than spiritual formation came in with emerging church and all would be miles ahead if it had been kept out.

Bob made a good list above and smaller items I think could be added, as in who do we trust.

1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

[Windsor]

Why would anyone put a condom on spiritual formation? To keep it from spreading?

[Gibs]

Take it clean out of any and all churches and pitch it back where it came from would be best.

Then enlist the one and only TRUE ONE with the true Spirit!

1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

[Gerr]

What does spiritual formation and condom have in common?

[ClubV12]

Stan, that was a mean typo! :)

[Woody]

Good question Gerry. I simply see no connection. Any connection is due to the one who is making the connection. And to them I say - GET A LIFE.

[Patrick Lawrence]

Stan the key is to have enough information to see the larger picture of spiritual formation. Because it is not movement with a set of fundemtal beliefs or goals or leaders it is be nature hard to define. But what I notice from studying it is a core set of false beliefs, practices and ideas. Then you have proponents of it advocating some number of these errors. Many times on the edge you will find some one with a lot of true things to say with just a small amount of this error. But they seem always to recomment books and speakers with a little more error. Most people teaching these errors fully understand how controversial their ideas and practices are.

Any way what would be needed is this. First an exaustive list of the practices and ideas explaing the problems with them. Then a list of the speakers and writers and their books etc that promote some part of this listing the parts they promote. And also something showing how they are all conected. Since it is a small community really most have some relation to each other. When you have this information you can start to see how much it has infiltrated our church. And I am no conspiracy theorist. You can see my posts on here about Walter Veith to see that. But this is a big problem in the church. It has affected the local college and church here in Texas. With the head pastor and head of the college both. And many conferences are even worse. It is bad enough now that the general conference president and leaders of the church are having to come out and warn against it. This is one of the greatest dangers to the church at the moment I believe.

[phkrause]

Stan, that was a mean typo!

I'm in agreement Club, I believe its definitely a typo

[Naomi]

Originally Posted By: ClubV12

Stan, that was a mean typo!

I'm in agreement Club, I believe its definitely a typo

Typo or not, it got attention

[Tom Wetmore]

Whether or not it was a typo, I think it should remain as is. I see it as more of a Freudian slip. It seems when it comes to a new birth experience many of our people become ardent supporters of spiritual contraception.

[Stan]

For those new to this, the autocorrect of a typo chanced what I had for condemn as condom.. slightly different meaning.

[Stan]

It is easy to define.

1. Empty your head.

2. Repetition of a mantra - no matter the content

3. imagine a being appearing to you and answering your questions.

4. Turn over the management and oversight of your worship with God - to some "spiritual director"

Which one of these did Ignatius miss? none?

in Christ,

Bob

Actually that is not it at all. You are talking about contemplative prayer, which has a few other names as well.

The second chapter of the Adventist Manual for Ministers is call Spiritual Formation. The textbook at andrews does not talk about contemplative prayer at all.

[Gerr]

If spiritual formation means being like Jesus, I'm all for it.

If SF means walking in the footsteps of Jesus, I'm all for it.

If SF means studying the Word more, I'm all for it.

If SF means spending more time in prayer, I'm all for it.

If SF means emptying my mind and mindlessly repeating a mantra, I'm against it.

If SF means letting some human spiritual guide control my thinking, then I'm against it.

[olger]

Why would anyone put a condom on spiritual formation? To keep it from spreading?

EXACTLY !!!

[olger]

There is a professor at Andrews who has studied this stuff extensively, including going to all their meetings. He is currently working on a book. It ought to be a good one! He is also financing his own research - which is very important. That means no one is telling him what results to come up with.

A couple of his observations:

All the roads lead to Rome on this stuff.

It is a monster - bigger than we realize.

Those who defend it are almost always ones who have involved themselves in it.

All people are not "emerging" at the same rate. Some are farther down the path than others.

rejoice always,

G

[Gibs]

It is straight from Ignatius Loyola with an Adventism wrapper on it.

What should any protestant church do with it? Pitch it back on the heap they picked it up from!

1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

[ClubV12]

Chuckle, snort, gotta love auto correct, a rather fitting typo as Tom and some others pointed out.

[BobRyan]

Originally Posted By: BobRyan

It is easy to define.

1. Empty your head.

2. Repetition of a mantra - no matter the content

3. imagine a being appearing to you and answering your questions.

4. Turn over the management and oversight of your worship with God - to some "spiritual director"

Which one of these did Ignatius miss? none?

Actually that is not it at all. You are talking about contemplative prayer, which has a few other names as well.

The second chapter of the Adventist Manual for Ministers is call Spiritual Formation. The textbook at andrews does not talk about contemplative prayer at all.

Contemplative prayer has some issues as you appear to agree - but it is an entirely separate part of the SF teaching that calls for spiritual directors.

As Derek Morris pointed out - the term spiritual formation is being coopted by our church in some cases as a term for spiritual growth - unwittingly thinking that it is not what it is. The result is that programs that may not have the pillars of actual Spiritual Formation are given that label - as if we did not realize what we were doing.

Here is a Christian organization that does know what SF is speaking about the teaching openly-

http://www.saintvincentseminary.edu/programs-pillar_II

F5 at this link provides another example of a christian organization adopting the principles of SF.

http://www.kenrickparish.com/academicoffice/collegehandbook/Formation%20%28Handbook%20on%20Four%20Pillars%29.pdf

How many of what the SF proponents call the "pillars" of SF can the SDA groups omit and still claim it as SF?

And what is the thinking that wants to claim the name of something that is clearly a form of error?

in Christ,

Bob

[debbym]

from a page by an evangelical concerns about sf, not the sf in the sda church manual.

http://www.understandthetimes.org/

Spiritual Formation and Transformation

This trend away from the authority of God’s Word to the reinvented form of Christianity has overcome all evangelical denominations like an avalanche. Few Bible teachers saw this avalanche coming. Now that it is underway, few realize it has even happened.

However, there is another big piece to the puzzle that must be identified in order to understand what is emerging in the Emerging Church. While biblical Christianity has been dumbed-down and the light of God’s Word diminished, another avalanche of deception is underway that is equally devastating. (spiritual formation)

This is best described by the Word of God giving way to experiences that God’s Word forbids. The best way to understand this process is to recall what happened during the Dark Ages when the Bible became the “forbidden book.” Until the Reformers translated the Bible into the language of the common person, the people were in darkness. When the light of God’s Word became available, the gospel according to the Scriptures was once again understood.

This trend, which is underway today, shows us that history is in the process of repeating itself. As the Word of God becomes less and less important, the rise of mystical experiences is alarming and these experiences are being presented to convince the unsuspecting that Christianity is about feeling, touching, smelling and seeing God. The postmodern mindset is the perfect environment for the fostering of what is called “spiritual formation.” This teaching suggests there are various ways and means to get closer to God. Proponents of spiritual formation erroneously teach that anyone can practice these mystical rituals and find God within. Having a relationship with Jesus Christ is not a prerequisite.

These teachings, while actually rooted in ancient wisdom (the occult), were presented to Christendom post-New Testament and not found in the Word of God. The spiritual formation movement is based upon experiences promoted by desert monks and Roman Catholic mystics – these mystics encouraged the use of rituals and practices, that if performed would bring the practitioner closer to God (or come into God’s presence). The premise was that if one went into the silence or sacred space, then the mind was emptied of distractions and the voice of God could be heard. In truth, these hypnotic, mantric style practices were leading these monks into altered states of consciousness. The methods they used are the same that Buddhists and the Hindus use as a means of encountering the spiritual realm

Such methods are dangerous, and are not sanctioned in the Bible – God gives no instruction for this. On the contrary, he warns severely against divination, which is practicing a ritual or method in order to obtain information from a spiritual source. While proponents of spiritual formation (like Richard Foster) say these methods show that the Holy Spirit is doing something new to refresh Christianity, I would suggest that what is happening is not new and is not the Holy Spirit.

The spiritual formation movement is being widely promoted at colleges and seminaries as the latest and the greatest way to become a spiritual leader in these days. These ideas are then being exported from seminaries to churches by graduates who have been primed to take Christianity to a new level of enlightenment.

As well, these contemplative practices are being promoted by emergent leaders such as Brian McLaren, Robert Webber, Dallas Willard and others. Publishers like NavPress, InterVarsity and Zondervan are flooding the market with books promoting contemplative practices based on Eastern mysticism. Pastors and church leaders read these books and then promote the ideas as if they were the scriptural answer to drawing close to God.

[debbym]

if you really want to believe there is only a genuine and true spiritual formation and it is outlined in our ministers manual, then you will not find any of these discussions interesting.

if you think it is fear mongering, and conspiracy theory to be concerned about a contemporary spiritual formation, then you will be closed and avoid the conversation.

if you believe it is imbalanced sda fanatics that are bring attention to it, then you will be more likely to label it and dismiss it and stigmatize the concerns.

we are all wanting to be responsible to our walk with God, and to let our light shine to those around us, as faithful Christians. We all want to avoid giving our energy to matters that are a waste of time, and will lead us to be less available to show God's love.

we can intellectually discuss true and false spiritual formation, but this does not necessarily prepare us to meet deception. With prayer, and sincerity review this information and perhaps there will come a time when you will meet it.

http://www.ktfministry.org/en/sermons/1183/the-emerging-church-and-spiritual-formation

"John Henry Newman

Robert Webber is enthusiastic about the Church Fathers of the Roman Catholic faith. He believes that you can only benefit by reading them. He also believes that reading them will help you become more accepting of the Roman Catholic Church.

So the real agenda behind this emerging church movement is to direct you to Roman Catholic authors, mystics and Fathers, Roman Catholic practices such as contemplative prayer, submission to spiritual guides, rituals, etc. and especially to the acceptance of other faiths, and in particular the Roman Catholic faith. It may be that some of the leaders don’t realize what is involved in this movement. However, a little diligent search of credible sources can quickly reveal what the emerging church movement and Spiritual Formation is all about.

And this is where spiritual formation comes in. Because of their vulnerability to Rome’s teaching through the emerging church movement, now many Christians are going to come under the influence of teachings that will lock them into a connection with Rome from which it will be difficult, if not impossible, to escape.

Spiritual Formation is a system of practices that were originally invented by Ignatius Loyola the founder of the Jesuits. His was an intricate system designed to train the young Jesuit, known as a novitiate, to submit his mind and his will to his superior. “Spiritual Direction” by a superior rendered the novitiate an obedient subject ready to do his superior’s bidding. It also involved Spiritual Disciplines such as Loyola’s famed Spiritual Exercises. All of this was involved in the practice of Spiritual Formation.

The Evangelical version of spiritual direction involves a similar kind of relationship between the spiritual director and the subordinate, known as a cohort, as they are often called (the cohort may well be what a novitiate would be in a Jesuit school). The cohort, who is under the spiritual director, becomes obedient to all that the director tells him to think or do – at least in an ideal setting. I’m sure it doesn’t always happen that way however, though that is the goal.

Those who want training in Spiritual Formation are told to find a person who is trained to be a spiritual director and let that person mentor him so that he can come under his superior’s spiritual discipline; similar to what is done in the Jesuit order.

Richard Foster, an influential promoter of Spiritual Formation wrote that “the less commonly practiced [religious] activities like solitude and silence and meditation and fasting and submission to the will of others as appropriate are in fact more foundational for Spiritual Formation.”

Reference: Foster, Richard, Ancient Future Faith, published by Baker Book House and is available from any major outlet.

In spiritual formation you are taught that the best way to approach God is through another person. This is a Roman Catholic principle. Those teaching Spiritual Formation often quote from Catholic mystics and authors like Thomas Aquinas, Thomas Merton and Thomas a Kempis, and many others.

Richard Foster strongly promotes these Catholic mystics. He says, “to immerse ourselves in these great works is to allow our vision to be expanded by a great treasure of spirituality.”

Sometimes the teacher of Spiritual Formation tells his students that spiritual direction comes in an “incarnational setting,” which means that Christ comes and dwells in you when you submit your plans and activities to the review and guidance of your personal spiritual director, another human being. Students are told to “model” their mentor or spiritual director, and copy or emulate him, and then teach it to others.

The basic idea is that we can only grow spiritually if we have another person to imitate. This replaces Christ. We will be confused in our “spiritual direction,” until we have someone like this over us.

Until recent times, Spiritual Formation was mainly used by Roman Catholics and particularly the Jesuits. But in the last decade or so the principles of Spiritual Formation have gone mainstream evangelical and now they are flooding like a tsunami into God’s church.

Today however, when you hear people who promote Spiritual Formation talk about it, they use terms that sound very appealing. They talk about growing in Christ. They talk about devotion, Bible study, prayer, meditation.

These things are acknowledged by all as important for Christian growth. All of us need to study our bibles and pray and meditate on Christ. But these promoters of Spiritual Formation are taking this in a different direction.

They also promote books by Spiritual Formation authors like Leonard Sweet, Brian McLaren, Don Pagitt, Forster Freeman and others who are dedicated to the ecumenical movement and the convergence of all religions as well as Spiritual Formation. These authors, in turn, recommend that we read and study the Roman Catholic mystics such as Thomas Merton, Thomas Keating, Thomas Aquinas and others. These authors will help you find your way to Rome.

One key element of Spiritual Formation is something called “Contemplative Spirituality.” Other related terms include “contemplative prayer,” or “centering prayer.” These are all names for essentially the same thing. This is nothing more than a mixture of what new age pagan practitioners of meditation and Roman Catholic monks have taught for centuries.

Listen to what Thomas Keating, a Roman Catholic monk, has to say about contemplative prayer, otherwise known as centering prayer. It’s from his book Open Mind, Open Heart. “Spiritual disciplines, both East and West, are based on the hypothesis that there is something that we can do to enter upon the journey to divine union once we have been touched by the realization that such a state exists. Centering prayer is a discipline designed to reduce obstacles… choose a sacred word [to repeat]… Twenty to thirty minutes is the minimum amount of time necessary for most people to establish interior silence.”

Reference: Thomas Keating’s book, Open Mind, Open Heart is published by The Continuum International Publishing Group, 2006 and is available from most major outlets.

In other words, you repeat religious or Bible words (it doesn’t really matter which ones) in order to “center” your thoughts until you feel like you have unity with God. Jesus taught that prayer is to be simple and straightforward, treating God as our Father and our friend, and He specifically mentioned repetition as vain and useless. He said “but when ye pray, use not vain repetitions, as the heathen do: for they think that they shall be heard for their much speaking.”

The idea of “interior silence” that the mystic Keating talks about is a mystical concept in which the mind is emptied of thought and distractions, which can only be done through a hypnotic repetitive practice. It is actually a New Age concept that this Catholic monk was teaching.

In more recent times, this same thing has been resurrected and adopted by the mainstream emerging church movement through the work of another Catholic monk named Thomas Merton. Merton wrote a number of books that the emergent church recommends to its adherents.

The Vatican also endorses contemplative prayer. I’ll quote you a passage from an online Roman Catholic book called From St. John of the Cross to Us.

“The Second Vatican Council, for example, gave both religious and lay people a new sense of freedom and a desire for spiritual renewal. …Centering Prayer and meditation groups… have helped introduce large numbers of Christians to a deeper life of prayer.”

This practice of contemplative prayer, endorsed by the Vatican and used in many denominations, especially those involved in the emerging church movement, is mystical to its core, and is designed to unite eastern mysticism and Roman Catholicism while at the same time being attractive to those enthralled with the ecumenical movement. For some in God’s church to present this to His people is a horrendous danger.

But yet that is what is happening today. One well-known TV ministry is promoting Spiritual Formation through a class, or seminar it offers to churches and institutions, and even on TV. Originally the title of the class was called “Spiritual Formation,” but it was changed when a lot of people reacted negatively and wondered if this class had to do with Ignatius Loyola and the Jesuit teaching. The new name is Jesus 101. This rather generic name disguises the real intent of the program. It comes from a common term used in ecumenical circles. There are Catholic books by that name; there are Bible study courses by that name; there are blogs by that name, etc. The subtitle for the course is also deceptive. It is “Growing in Jesus/Discipleship.” But the real intent behind the Jesus 101 course is Spiritual Formation." (with an earthly agenda)

[Gibs]

I can't see putting a SDA wrapper on spiritual formation makes it kosher and pleasing to our God and Saviour. If you read it, it is almost word for word what Ignatius Loyola brought forth.

The worship service to be pleasing to God must have every tint of anything occult completely out of it.

This is something that must be rigorously guarded against!

1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

[Stan]

GIBS, please tell me specifically, with names, on Adventist doing this.

[olger]

Quote:

The worship service to be pleasing to God must have every tint of anything occult completely out of it.

This is true, according to the following verses:

Romans 14:23 "Whatsoever is not of faith is of sin.."

2 Corinthians 6:14 "For what fellowship has righteousness with lawlessness? And what communion has light with darkness?"

Ephesians 5:11 "And have no fellowship with the unfruitful works of darkness, but rather expose them."

Rejoice always brethren, and read the Word

`G