does the Bible forbid "Christmas Trees"?

[Ron Amnsn]

Why is it that people that oppose Christmas Trees and the Christmas holiday as Pagan always accept the public holiday from work? 

 

Not so.  Christmas didn't become a US federal holiday until 1870 (144 years ago).  When the English Parliament abolished the observance of Christmas in 1647, nobody was getting a public holiday from work.  Christmas celebrations were also made illegal in Massachusetts at that time, and were still frowned upon a hundred year later.

[rudywoofs (Pam)]

unless one is over 144 years old, Christmas has always been a holiday during one's lifetime, and most probably was enjoyed as a holiday by the majority of people, including those opposing Christmas ... Sojourner's point is well-taken.

[Gregory Matthews]

Ron, the historic St. Nick. has more in common with Santa Claus than you may realize.   That person did leave gifts at the homes of children at night and at Christmastime.

 

NOTE:   The actual history of St. Nick depends on how deep one goes into it.

[Ron Amnsn]

Ron, the historic St. Nick. has more in common with Santa Claus than you may realize.

 

Yes, Nicholas did give gifts to the local children. Probably a good man.

 

But I don't think Nicholas himself was attributed with the supernatural powers that santa claus has, such as traveling through the sky to visit the homes of all Christian children worldwide within a span of 36 hours (the required speed would cause a mere mortal to burn up like a meteor), pulled by magic reindeer who don't tire, carrying mega tons of goodies in a magic bag he could sling over his shoulder, slipping down (and up) chimneys without getting soiled, knowing every child by name, and living the rest of the year at the North Pole manufacturing toys assisted by elves?  That's somewhat different than the historical Nicholas.

 

Did saint Nicholas allow people to put his likeness in their homes and yards or on the roof?  Did he have people in look-alike costumes posing for pictures with children at the malls?  If saint Nicholas was an honorable man, the things santa claus does and endorses today would be a shocking embarrassment to the historical saint. Nicholas would be the first to say, "That santa claus fraud is nothing like me."

[CoAspen]

Gasp...(to quote another) reindeer don't really fly? Gasp..Gasp, no magic bag?!!!

 

Some are uncomfortable with the 'magic' of the mind. Simple wonderment, excitement, good feelings, etc. that the Idea of a Santa Claus brings.

How about a lump of coal for Scrooge.

[Kevin H]

Ron:

 

First of all Paganism is a corruption of the truth and details about the Great Controversy that we find universally in Paganism and which the Bible gives us the truth about.

 

However, when we come to the feasts of the land, records from cities that were already in ruins by the time of Abraham were keeping them. They were tied to the agricultural seasons of that piece of property. In the spring they would eat unleavened bread. They were doing that the night that the Hebrews were eating the unleavened bread in Egypt, and they had been eating unleavened bread that night for centuries. In the fall they had their cleaning of the sanctuary with the two goats one going into the god for a sacrifice the other to be taken outside to the community as a scape goat. Same with the other festivals. They were all major mile stones for the agricultural cycle to the land. Thus while they carried remnants of the truths that Adam and Noah gave, Adam's and Noah's were more universal in scope and the feasts of the land are very focused on that specific piece of geography.

 

There are many archaeologists who do believe in God and the Bible. They also recognize this. This is facts that are written in the ancient records.

[Ron Amnsn]

Gasp...(to quote another) reindeer don't really fly? Gasp..Gasp, no magic bag?!!!

 

Some are uncomfortable with the 'magic' of the mind. Simple wonderment, excitement, good feelings, etc. that the Idea of a Santa Claus brings.

How about a lump of coal for Scrooge.

 

Bah! Humbug!  I could use a lump of coal.

 

Do you think santa claus is the first false supernatural being to bring such "magic of the mind", "wonderment, excitement, good feelings, etc." ?   Why do you think all the other false gods were so popular? 

 

Are we so arrogant as to think that the "ignorant" people of the past all really believed in their pagan gods that they fashioned for themselves, while we are superior because we don't "really believe" in the santa we have invented for our entertainment out of fragments of history and fantasy?  There's a good chance that some of the pagans were like us -- just pretending and playing with the possibilities that could happen if there could be such a wondrous being like the one they collectively imagined, while enjoying themselves at the festivities with the others who knew better than to believe in such nonsense.  Surely the pagan priests who ate the food left by the worshipers for the idols in the temples knew that the "gods" didn't actually eat all that food.  Yet they worked to maintain the wonderment, excitement and good feelings for the common people (and for their own profit).

[Ron Amnsn]

This is facts that are written in the ancient records.

 

Again, where is the documentation for this?

[Kevin H]

It's been about 30 years since I really studied this, but it was in much of what was required reading for classes at AUC and Andrews as well as referred to in a number of articles and sermons defending Mrs. White from Walter Rea's charges when "The White Lie" was published: One source would be to find recordings of debates with Walter Rea with some of our different theologians.

 

Some of my major readings in college and seminary included: John Bright "A History of Israel"  Aharoni's "The Land of the Bible" Thompson's "Archaeology" William Foxwell Albright's "Yahweh and the gods of Ancient Canaan" Passages in the Anchor Bible. Translations of say the Ebla tablets and other ancient writings. These would be a good starting spot.

 

Archaeologist are in two camps: The Biblical Minimalists and the Biblical Maxamalists. Here is a good information on your complaint against archaeology studies:  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pIfCbnhnmYg

[CoAspen]

>>>>Do you think santa claus is the first false supernatural being to bring such "magic of the mind", "wonderment, excitement, good feelings, etc." ? Why do you think all the other false gods were so popular?

Are we so arrogant as to think that the "ignorant" people of the past all really believed in their pagan gods that they fashioned for themselves, while we are superior because we don't "really believe" in the santa we have invented for our entertainment out of fragments of history and fantasy? There's a good chance that some of the pagans were like us -- just pretending and playing with the possibilities that could happen if there could be such a wondrous being like the one they collectively imagined, while enjoying themselves at the festivities with the others who knew better than to believe in such nonsense. Surely the pagan priests who ate the food left by the worshipers for the idols in the temples knew that the "gods" didn't actually eat all that food. Yet they worked to maintain the wonderment, excitement and good feelings for the common people (and for their own profit).<<<<<<

Who said Santa was a God? Those are your words!! I have never heard anyone call him a God, except for those who are against the idea of Christmas and Santa. Sounds like they may be the ones with the "God" problem, not the rest of the world!!