SDA church adding Sunday services

[rudywoofs (Pam)]

An interesting article on the Huntsville, Alabama, SDA First Church adding Sunday services..

http://www.al.com/living/index.ssf/2015/02/seventh-day_adventist_sunday.html

 

 

The Saturday-Sabbath is such a big deal to Seventh-day Adventists that it's their first name, and members around the world have endured significant cultural, economic and sometimes even governmental persecution because of members' determination to keep Saturdays as a day of rest and worship.

 

The "Adventist" part of "Seventh-day Adventist" refers to the belief that Jesus is coming again, literally and soon, in clouds of glory with angels and trumpets and a live-feed around the world so that every eye will see him. Both parts of the denomination's name point to how the more than 18 million Adventist faithful worldwide take the Bible at face value. Just last year, the SDA world president informed college professors that if they believed in evolution rather than the Bible's literal seven-day creation, then they were not really Adventists.

 

So why is one of the fastest-growing Adventist churches in the country - First Seventh-day Adventist Church, at 1303 Evangel Drive in Huntsville, Ala. -- beginning a Sunday worship service on Sunday, Feb. 8, 2015, at 10 a.m.?

 

"This is kind of next in the evolution of things," said First SDA Pastor Debleaire Snell, an energetic 37-year-old with an engaging smile and quick intelligence. "The Sunday service is going to be a first point of contact for the unchurched in the community and for people who, for whatever reason - beliefs, work - can't come on Saturday. We have communicated to the Conference office (the regional center) because they wanted clarity on this, but once we communicated the purpose to them, they saw that it is not a big deal."

 

Sabbath still on Saturday

The Sunday service is in no way meant to cancel the importance of receiving the gift of a 24-hour Sabbath from sundown on Friday until sundown on Saturday each week as a time of fellowship with God and family, Snell said. Anyone visiting an Adventist church for long will hear sermon illustrations about the blessings reserved for those who observe the Sabbath rest in the same weekly rhythm established, according to Genesis, as the crowning work of Creation. Adventists point to the traditions of Jews, who also keep Saturday as their holy day as a way to mark the fact that Saturday is still Creation's seventh day of the week and a continuing celebration of God's creative work in the world -- both at the beginning of time and now.

 

Traditionally, Adventists aim to make the Sabbath a day of rest and Bible study and do what they can to see that no one else works on Saturday because of them. That's why restaurants around Adventist churches do not fill up on Saturdays after worship service ends, and why Adventist families don't head to Wal-Mart on the way home.

 

"We're not changing the concept of the Sabbath - this Sunday service is for new members and maybe for our members who want a spiritual kick-start to their week," Snell said.

 

Snell said that many of his members have said they're likely to come on Sunday even after attending the Saturday, 11:30 a.m., service. The Sunday service, he said, would be a bit shorter, more informal and more focused on teaching than the Saturday service.

 

Snell points to the first-day gatherings of the early Christians described in Acts as an example of how believing communities meet when they can.

 

"This shows there is a paradigm -- the Early Christians created a gathering where people could hear and receive the full news of Jesus," Snell said. "We want to do that."

 

In the four years that Pastor Snell has been at First SDA, he has twice been named Pastor of the Year for the South Central Conference, an area that includes Alabama, Mississippi, Kentucky, Tennessee and the Florida panhandle. Read about his 2014 award here.

[Gail]

I have no argument with services on the other days of the week. I wish that there were enough attendees to warrant services on more days!

The worship service is a small part of what the idea of Sabbath rest encompasses.

[rudywoofs (Pam)]

From what the article said, the reasoning was more of an "evangelistic" effort to acquaint non-Adventists with the SDA church.  I'm wondering what the non-SDA area churches think about it...

[whbae]

Many years ago, here in Southern New England conference did exactly same thing in a church in Boston.  There were such a many protesting letters and phone calls to the president of conference, eventually the service was terminated.  The work of Satan does wonders to many sincere hearts who are a little foolish in reasoning.  I hope the conference will put a stop on this matter or fire the pastor.

[Tom Wetmore]

Many years ago, here in Southern New England conference did exactly same thing in a church in Boston.  There were such a many protesting letters and phone calls to the president of conference, eventually the service was terminated.  The work of Satan does wonders to many sincere hearts who are a little foolish in reasoning.  I hope the conference will put a stop on this matter or fire the pastor.

Then they should abandon Ellen White who actually encouraged this sort of outreach.

[CoAspen]

Thou shalt worship the Lord thy God on Sabbath only, the seventh day of the week. (chiseled in stone by Moses for commandment #11...not widely known)

[Gregory Matthews]

Well,  Tom, people who do not read Ellen White, in detail, and rely on 2nd hand references to her writings really do not know what she has said on a lot of point.

 

Yes, she clearly encouraged SDAs using Sunday for evangelistic outreach.

 

You know, I like the CD index to her writings.  However, there is a dark side to it.  Some how use it, use it instead of reading her writings. 
That index is not a method of getting to the full flavor of here written works. 

[Gregory Matthews]

Yes, CoAspen, I see that you left out the last part of the 11th Commandment:  "And whoever shall worship me on any other day shall spend eternity in the fires of damnation."

[Bill Cork]

Someone on Facebook had given some good quotes from Ellen White on this topic, and I failed to write them down, and cannot remember where on FB I saw them, and I've searched the electronic index to her writings to no avail.  So if someone has some references handy, I'd appreciate it!

[whbae]

The reason  the Southern New England Conference experimented with Sunday worship in Boston some time ago was that some people cannot come to church for Sabbath worship.  But the conference hope eventually they will switch to Saturday worship.

This was very deceptive reasoning.  Bate and Switch!

[Tom Wetmore]

Someone on Facebook had given some good quotes from Ellen White on this topic, and I failed to write them down, and cannot remember where on FB I saw them, and I've searched the electronic index to her writings to no avail.  So if someone has some references handy, I'd appreciate it!

Search "Sunday" and "meetings" and you may find what you are looking for.

[Tom Wetmore]

And then there is the amazing fact that Ellen White herself regularly stood in the pulpit and preached. On Sunday. In Sunday keeping churches. For their Sunday worship service.

[bonnie]

http://www.whiteestate.org/books/egwhc/EGWHCc26.html

 

 

 

[357]

The angel explains: “These are they who have once kept the Sabbath and have given it up.” She describes them also as having “trodden the Sabbath under foot.” There is no reference to Sunday. (See current edition, pp. 36, 37.)

 

 

 

 The charge declares that her statement in volume 9 as to engaging in missionary work on Sunday “avoids all possibility of persecution for Sunday work.” But we have just discovered from the quotations given that “God's people will feel the hand of persecution because they keep holy the seventh day.” And that statement is found only three pages before, and in the same context with, the passage quoted by the critic to prove his case against her!

   

In the setting of these passages that give Mrs. White's true teaching on the matter of Sabbathkeeping, the points in the charge become a little pointless. Let us consider briefly those not already answered:

1. Mrs. White “now directs her people to keep Sunday exactly as all conscientious Sunday observers do; that is, in holding religious meetings and doing religious work!”

We hardly believe that any minister of a Sundaykeeping church would agree with that statement. We are certain that no minister in the area where her instruction was put into effect would consider we were keeping Sunday “exactly as all conscientious Sunday observers do.” Mrs. White included in her instruction regarding these Sunday “religious meetings” the following: “We are to proclaim the truth in regard to the Sabbath of the Lord.”—Ibid., p. 233. Proclaiming the Sabbath truth means to an Adventist not simply presenting the evidence for the seventh-day Sabbath of the Lord but presenting the warnings of heaven against keeping the papal Sabbath, the first day of the week. Will someone explain how an Adventist could at one and the same time be keeping Sunday and denouncing Sunday worship?

2. “Now, if it [“holding religious meetings”] is acceptable to the Lord from Adventists, it must be acceptable to the Lord from Methodists, Baptists, Presbyterians, Congregationalists and others.”

We agree that it would be acceptable to the Lord if the members of these Protestant churches followed her counsel for Adventists, which means keeping God's holy Sabbath day, and then, if

 

[360]

the situation requires, using Sunday in missionary work, holding religious meetings that extol the true Sabbath and warn against the false.

3.“Lastly,if Methodists, Baptists and other Christians have the mark of the beast because they ‘give Sunday to the Lord’ in religious service, why will not Adventists also have it if they give the day to the Lord in the same way?”

But how would Adventists receive the mark of the beast for holding religious services on Sunday if those services had as one of their purposes a warning against the mark of the beast? We might add that Adventists do not teach that anyone has the mark of the beast simply because he keeps Sunday. That mark will be placed only upon those who, having received a knowledge of the Scriptural claims of the Sabbath, willfully continue to keep the papal Sunday. In proof of this we quote these words from Mrs. White:

“When Sunday observance shall be enforced by law, and the world shall be enlightened concerning the obligation of the true Sabbath, then whoever shall transgress the command of God, to obey a precept which has no higher authority than that of Rome, will thereby honor popery above God. He is paying homage to Rome, and to the power which enforces the institution ordained by Rome. He is worshiping the beast and his image. As men then reject the institution which God has declared to be the sign of His authority and honor in its stead that which Rome has chosen as the token of her supremacy, they will thereby accept the sign of allegiance to Rome—‘the mark of the beast.’ And it is not until the issue is thus plainly set before the people, and they are brought to choose between the commandments of God and the commandments of men, that those who continue in transgression will receive ‘the mark of the beast.’”—The Great Controversy, p. 449.

[bonnie]

” Mrs. White included in her instruction regarding these Sunday “religious meetings” the following: “We are to proclaim the truth in regard to the Sabbath of the Lord.”—Ibid., p. 233. Proclaiming the Sabbath truth means to an Adventist not simply presenting the evidence for the seventh-day Sabbath of the Lord but presenting the warnings of heaven against keeping the papal Sabbath, the first day of the week. Will someone explain how an Adventist could at one and the same time be keeping Sunday and denouncing Sunday worship?

 

Is the above going to be what is presented in the Sunday services? The Catholic church has services on Sat evening. This is for those that have other plans for Sunday? Are we doing the same

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Is this the same as 

[pierrepaul]

In none of the 8 versions of the Bible I have (NJV, NIV, Louis Segond, Bible en français courant, Reina-Valera, João Almeida, Nova versão internacional, Luther Bibel) is there anything in the fourth commandment about holding church services on the Sabbath.

[bonnie]

In none of the 8 versions of the Bible I have (NJV, NIV, Louis Segond, Bible en français courant, Reina-Valera, João Almeida, Nova versão internacional, Luther Bibel) is there anything in the fourth commandment about holding church services on the Sabbath.

There are several verses  referring to Jesus teaching /attending the synagauge on Sabbath as was his custom. Same is true of Paul.

I feel reasonably safe in assuming we should be doing same

[whbae]

bonnie,

You beat me to it.  I was about make the same statement!

[Tom Wetmore]

Scripture speaks of Jesus going to the the temple on other days as well.

This raise a question in my mind. Based on the comments of some here Imsuspect it would be answered in the negative. What if an Adventist Church that typically basically sits empty and unused 6 days a week suddenly had its doors open every day of the week with a worship service held morning, noon, and evening of every single day? Would you have a problem with that?

Assuming this happened, what would or should be different about the services that occur on Saturday?

[bonnie]

Scripture speaks of Jesus going to the the temple on other days as well.

This raise a question in my mind. Based on the comments of some here Imsuspect it would be answered in the negative. What if an Adventist Church that typically basically sits empty and unused 6 days a week suddenly had its doors open every day of the week with a worship service held morning, noon, and evening of every single day? Would you have a problem with that?

Assuming this happened, what would or should be different about the services that occur on Saturday?

Sabbath worship or just another day of the week meeting?  If you don't understand the difference I doubt that any explanation would work

for you.

Would I have a problem with what you suggest? No,not if the line was clearly drawn concerning the importance of the Sabbath. Your question is far different than having "worship service" Sabbath and Sunday

We have a very active large Evangelical congregational church close to us. Altho there are services during the week,well attended,prayer meetings etc,no one would confuse their Sunday service for other "meetings" at the church during the week.

For me,holding a regular church service on Sundays for those that wish to attend church on Sunday or in some get acquainted with SDA beliefs effort dilutes what Sabbath and Sabbath worship is all about.

When you suggest this is what EW did....And then there is the amazing fact that Ellen White herself regularly stood in the pulpit and preached. On Sunday. In Sunday keeping churches. For their Sunday worship service. 

As you pointed out it was in a Sunday keeping church. Not having a Sunday worship service following our Sabbath worship as if either day is just fine,whatever works.

I believe that most SDA pastors if invited would preach in a Sunday keeping church

Many in the church today want to get as close to the line as we can come without going over in proving we are just like every other denomination and make sure no one is offended by what we believe or maybe that should what we did believe.

 

.

[Gregory Matthews]

Bonnie said:

Many in the church today want to get as close to the line as we can come without going over in proving we are just like every other denomination and make sure no one is offended by what we believe or maybe that should what we did believe.

 

Somewhat judgmental.  It may have some truth, although  it is still a somewhat judgmental statement.

 

However, I do not believe that it applies to the majority of SDA clergy who do conduct services on Sunday and I doubt that Bonnie has any understanding of why they may be doing so.

 

The Biblical emphasis is on the quality of the Sabbath day, which is the 7th day.  The Biblical emphasis is not on a battle against any other day.  Rather it is on the blessings that are reserved for the Sabbath.

 

Bonnie may speak from experience when she mentions what dilutes the Sabbath.  I can only say that others may have a different experience and those who participate in such may actually not dilute the meaning and experience of the Sabbath but they may enhance it.

 

 

 

             

[bonnie]

Bonnie said:

 

 

 

Somewhat judgmental.  It may have some truth, although  it is still a somewhat judgmental statement.

 

However, I do not believe that it applies to the majority of SDA clergy who do conduct services on Sunday and I doubt that Bonnie has any understanding of why they may be doing so.

 

The Biblical emphasis is on the quality of the Sabbath day, which is the 7th day.  The Biblical emphasis is not on a battle against any other day.  Rather it is on the blessings that are reserved for the Sabbath.

 

Bonnie may speak from experience when she mentions what dilutes the Sabbath.  I can only say that others may have a different experience and those who participate in such may actually not dilute the meaning and experience of the Sabbath but they may enhance it.

 

 

 

             

Not sure where you are finding anything that indicates we should be in a battle against any other day.

Typically when some are disagreed with it is "because they just don't understand"

Or they are treated to the scorn and ridicule of the more enlightened ones. SDA's don't believe in eternal hell fire. Is it safe to assume the sarcasm and ridicule is reserved for SDA's that disagree and not for those that keep Sunday?

 

Thou shalt worship the Lord thy God on Sabbath only, the seventh day of the week. (chiseled in stone by Moses for commandment #11...not widely known)

 

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Posted 06 February 2015 - 10:56 PM

Yes, CoAspen, I see that you left out the last part of the 11th Commandment:  "And whoever shall worship me on any other day shall spend eternity in the fires of damnation."

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

EW was brought up,tell me do those that preach Sunday services follow thru with the advice of EW on this as in............” Mrs. White included in her instruction regarding these Sunday “religious meetings” the following: “We are to proclaim the truth in regard to the Sabbath of the Lord.”—Ibid., p. 233. Proclaiming the Sabbath truth means to an Adventist not simply presenting the evidence for the seventh-day Sabbath of the Lord but presenting the warnings of heaven against keeping the papal Sabbath, the first day of the week..

 

 

 

Your Sunday service would soon fall in attendance.

 

[bonnie]

"The Sunday service is going to be a first point of contact for the unchurched in the community and for people who, for whatever reason - beliefs, work - can't come on Saturday. We have communicated to the Conference office (the regional center) because they wanted clarity on this, but once we communicated the purpose to them, they saw that it is not a big deal."

 

 

"We're not changing the concept of the Sabbath - this Sunday service is for new members and maybe for our members who want a spiritual kick-start to their week," Snell said.

 

 

Most small town communities have several Sunday keeping churches that already provide an alternative to attending church on Sabbath. Some are very generic in their beliefs and are certainly open to the "unchurched". What is trying to be accomplished thru Sunday services besides to show the unchurched we aren't any different than everyone else? Come visit us instead of all the other Sunday keeping churches

Why are we now providing Sunday services to "new members"?. Has something changed that new members have not already made their decision to observe Sabbath,sometimes losing their jobs as a result or are at odds with family over this decision?

[Gregory Matthews]

Bonnie asked:

What is trying to be accomplished thru Sunday services besides to show the unchurched we aren't any different than everyone else?

 

1)  We have an obligation to reach those who are not in a relationship with Christ and we should not leave that to other denominations.

2)  To teach people Biblical truth.  Contrary to what Bonnie may have experienced, SDA pastors who preach on Sunday do preach distinctive SDA doctrine.  Bonnie is simply uninformed on this point.

 

It should be noted that with the vigor that Bonnie present her position, few reading here really want to challenge her.

[bonnie]

Bonnie asked:

 

 

 

1)  We have an obligation to reach those who are not in a relationship with Christ and we should not leave that to other denominations.

2)  To teach people Biblical truth.  Contrary to what Bonnie may have experienced, SDA pastors who preach on Sunday do preach distinctive SDA doctrine.  Bonnie is simply uninformed on this point.

 

It should be noted that with the vigor that Bonnie present her position, few reading here really want to challenge her.

Interesting post to say the least.

 

 

1)  We have an obligation to reach those who are not in a relationship with Christ and we should not leave that to other denominations.

 

Why the exaggeration . Nothing remotely like that has been said.  There are numerous ways to have a outreach. Bible study hour  works well for those that have them. Sunday mornings for the unchurched or to acquaint those unfamiliar with SDA's

To teach people Biblical truth.  Contrary to what Bonnie may have experienced, SDA pastors who preach on Sunday do preach distinctive SDA doctrine.  Bonnie is simply uninformed on this point.

That may be,then call it what it is. The opportunity to teach SDA doctrine. Not providing a place for those that don't have anywhere else to attend church unless we open our doors on Sunday

Actually what I have experienced is the many successful outreach endeavors from those that believe those nasty sunday keepers are going to burn in hell for eternity. Bible study hour,meals for the hungry,clothing give aways,helping the elderly in the community that are not able to do many things for themselves etc.Been very successful in reaching those that don't know what SDA's are all about.

 

 

It should be noted that with the vigor that Bonnie present her position, few reading here really want to challenge her.

 

 

Really? I am not the one that began after the first 4-5 posts with ridicule and sarcasm towards those that disagree to make them less than I am

 

Thou shalt worship the Lord thy God on Sabbath only, the seventh day of the week. (chiseled in stone by Moses for commandment #11...not widely known)

 

Nowhere has this been even suggested. But it does make some feel quite superior I think

 

 

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Posted 06 February 2015 - 10:56 PM

Yes, CoAspen, I see that you left out the last part of the 11th Commandment:  "And whoever shall worship me on any other day shall spend eternity in the fires of damnation."

 

 

The purpose of the above was for what reason? Ridicule and "judgement" towards those that disagree with the "more enlightened" minds here.That seems to be the best,most effective way in dealing with those that don't accept someone's personal viewpoint as gospel 

 

[Tom Wetmore]

Let me flip this around. If a normally Sunday keeping church had services on Saturday, how would any of you feel about attending such a service? And if you did attend would you consider that consistent with your belief in keeping the Sabbath?

I say that because a number of Sunday keeping churches do just that. It is not uncommon for Catholic Churches to hold mass on Saturday and some of the mega-churches hold multiple services throughout the weekend including on Saturday just to accommodate the number who attend. I would be willing to bet that in some of those the attendance on Saturday is more than the total number of Adventists attending services in the area or even that live in the vicinity.