SDA church adding Sunday services

[bonnie]

Let me flip this around. If a normally Sunday keeping church had services on Saturday, how would any of you feel about attending such a service? And if you did attend would you consider that consistent with your belief in keeping the Sabbath?

I say that because a number of Sunday keeping churches do just that. It is not uncommon for Catholic Churches to hold mass on Saturday and some of the mega-churches hold multiple services throughout the weekend including on Saturday just to accommodate the number who attend. I would be willing to bet that in some of those the attendance on Saturday is more than the total number of Adventists attending services in the area or even that live in the vicinity.

Let me flip this around. If a normally Sunday keeping church had services on Saturday, how would any of you feel about attending such a service? And if you did attend would you consider that consistent with your belief in keeping the Sabbath?

Keeping the Sabbath is far more than walking into a church and sitting in the pew for an hour. Would I consider the attending of another denomination on Sabbath for convenience etc be consistant with my belief.? No,other denominations do not believe as we do. While I may visit out of curiosity or an invitation it does not replace

The SDA denomination has distinctive beliefs ,not any old day is good enough for the Lord. Attending another denomination on Sat or Sunday on a regular basis that preach contrary to what we believe is not part of keeping the Sabbath.

I say that because a number of Sumday keeping churches do just that. It is. OT uncommon for Catholic Churches to hold mass on Saturday and some of the mega-churches hold multiple services throughout the weekend including on Saturday just to accommodate the number who attend. I would be willing to bet that in some of those the attendance on Saturday is more than the total number of Adventists attending services in the area or even that live in the vicinity.

So? There isn't any mistaking,the Catholic chruch holds mass on sat night.Not a generic get together. Sheer numbers a sign of success.

Your post was more informative than I think you intended

[CoAspen]

A number of years ago our local church started a Sunday service. Its purpose was to introduce ourselves and beliefs to the local community. Nothing was watered down. Some were against the idea for some of the reasons given here.  I sensed then and among some of the comments here an uncomfortableness with worshiping God in an 'official' manner on any other day than the seventh, if you are an SDA. Our service was not for members, as a replacement, but the community. We often castigate non seventh day worshipers, but I wonder if we, SDA's, have a true understanding of what it means to worship God and worshiping on the seventh day. I used the word 'and' because I think they are two separate issues.

 

Our church had a complete turnover in personnel so the Sunday service did go away as did other outreaches. We now have more traditional outreaches, but still involved in ministries that are simply helping others and not 'preaching', but walking the talk.

[bonnie]

A number of years ago our local church started a Sunday service. Its purpose was to introduce ourselves and beliefs to the local community. Nothing was watered down. Some were against the idea for some of the reasons given here.  I sensed then and among some of the comments here an uncomfortableness with worshiping God in an 'official' manner on any other day than the seventh, if you are an SDA. Our service was not for members, as a replacement, but the community. We often castigate non seventh day worshipers, but I wonder if we, SDA's, have a true understanding of what it means to worship God and worshiping on the seventh day. I used the word 'and' because I think they are two separate issues.

 

Our church had a complete turnover in personnel so the Sunday service did go away as did other outreaches. We now have more traditional outreaches, but still involved in ministries that are simply helping others and not 'preaching', but walking the talk.

Introducing yourself and your beliefs to the community in a upfront manner as this is why we are having Sunday services is a little different than wanting to provide Sunday services for the unchurched. Sunday services are readily available for anyone that wants to attend a church and doesn't have a specific belief or preference.. Yes,I do have a problem with making Sunday another "official worship day".

It isn't a question of castigating non SDA worshipers. It is a difference in belief,I believe a belief that is biblically based. If my church began a outreach of bible study or similar on Sunday mornings I wouldn't have any problem with it. Making Sunday another "official worship day" I do

[Ellen]

Adventists worship every day.  Why should a service in the chuch make a difference on Sunday. 

 

Having a church service on Wedesday doesn't send a message that we have switched our Sabbath; but because non-Adventists primarily consider Sunday their Sabbath they jump to the conclusion a service on that day makes it a Sabbath.  What kind of thinking is that?

[debbym]

Adventists worship every day.  Why should a service in the chuch make a difference on Sunday. 

 

Having a church service on Wedesday doesn't send a message that we have switched our Sabbath; but because non-Adventists primarily consider Sunday their Sabbath they jump to the conclusion a service on that day makes it a Sabbath.  What kind of thinking is that?

 

when we have camp meetings we have very wonderful worshipful services day after day.  it is wonderful.  I see nothing wrong with creating wonderful  worship services on any day of the week.  This does not take away from the Holy Sabbath day at all.  Our behavior cannot take away or add to the power and gift  of God's blessing in the Sabbath hours each week.

[LifeHiscost]

when we have camp meetings we have very wonderful worshipful services day after day.  it is wonderful.  I see nothing wrong with creating wonderful  worship services on any day of the week.  This does not take away from the Holy Sabbath day at all.  Our behavior cannot take away or add to the power and gift  of God's blessing in the Sabbath hours each week.

OTOH, how can the solemnity of the Seventh Day Sabbath be changed to another day when it was the finger of God that wrote it in stone the original Decalogue?

 

God is Love!  Jesus saves! 

[bonnie]

when we have camp meetings we have very wonderful worshipful services day after day.  it is wonderful.  I see nothing wrong with creating wonderful  worship services on any day of the week.  This does not take away from the Holy Sabbath day at all.  Our behavior cannot take away or add to the power and gift  of God's blessing in the Sabbath hours each week.

Why this persistence in implying that someone that disagrees has a problem with  worship services outside the Sabbath services? Camp meeting weekday services and daily activities are far different than Sabbath services.

One day and one day only was set aside and sanctified by God.Many,by no means all those that worship on Sunday believe the day really doesn't matter. God didn't say here are two days,take your pick,either is equally important to me.  A regular church service to accommodate those that choose to worship on Sunday is making Sunday equal in importance to Sabbath.

I disagree that we can't take away from the Holy Sabbath. It is done all the time,our behavior does take away the gift of God's blessing 

[Tom Wetmore]

Let me flip this around. If a normally Sunday keeping church had services on Saturday, how would any of you feel about attending such a service? And if you did attend would you consider that consistent with your belief in keeping the Sabbath?

I say that because a number of Sunday keeping churches do just that. It is not uncommon for Catholic Churches to hold mass on Saturday and some of the mega-churches hold multiple services throughout the weekend including on Saturday just to accommodate the number who attend. I would be willing to bet that in some of those the attendance on Saturday is more than the total number of Adventists attending services in the area or even that live in the vicinity.

The focus is on Sabbath keeping and not any other points of difference. Aside from other beliefs that may different, would you consider that the people who go to these churches on Saturday are keeping/observing the correct day as Sabbath?

[bonnie]

The focus is on Sabbath keeping and not any other points of difference. Aside from other beliefs that may different, would you consider that the people who go to these churches on Saturday are keeping/observing the correct day as Sabbath?

No. Not unless they are convicted of the importance of the Sabbath. Are they attending because it is convenient and really don't distinguish between Sabbath observance and attending church on Sunday? There is more to keeping the Sabbath than a couple of hours in church.

I remember my FIL saying when Sat nite mass began,"See the day isn't really important,just so you go"

[Gregory Matthews]

Bonnie said:

A regular church service to accommodate those that choose to worship on Sunday is making Sunday equal in importance to Sabbath.

 

Hardly.  God gave importance to the Sabbath.  Someone having a worship service on sunday does not in any sense transfer importance to Sunday.  It remains with the 7th day.

[bonnie]

Bonnie said:

 

 

 

Hardly.  God gave importance to the Sabbath.  Someone having a worship service on sunday does not in any sense transfer importance to Sunday.  It remains with the 7th day.

Many Sunday church goers would disagree with you on that

[whbae]

The Sabbath is likened to a birthday celebration.  Such as celebrating the birth of the earth.  My birthday is Feb. 6.  If my family and friends come to me saying that we would like to give your birthday party on Feb. 7 because it is convenient for us would I be happy with it?  I do not know about you, but I won't be.  I don't think God would be happy for such a thing either. 

Better yet, today is the Valentine's day.  If I tell my wife " I would like to celebrate this valentine's day tomorrow and send you a gift tomorrow" I wonder how thrilled my wife would be!

[LifeHiscost]

If God wasn't really too concerned re:  which day should be kept for recognition of and reverence for Him as Creator, why would He preface His injunction with the Word "Remember"? Not to mention Moses reaction when the children of Israel failed to observe the first commandment even before it was written down, by building a golden calf and having a party around it. After all, doesn't God want us to have fun and do that which makes us feel good?

 

God is Love!  Jesus saves! 

[CoAspen]

Me thinks some people are missing the point.....possibly on purpose....I see no one seeking or suggesting a downplay of the 7th day of the week.  What is being suggested is meeting people where they are  comfortable and explaining why we choose to keep the 7th day. It is called evangelism to your local community. People seem to be having a difficult time grasping that concept!!

 

By the way...the God I understand is one that wants us to enjoy life while on this earth, not to feel guilty and even have fun. But maybe there is a view of God as a being who wants to squash people for stepping out of line and a no fun  league!!

[Tom Wetmore]

I am thinking that we are becoming rather like the Jews were in Jesus' days here on earth, when it comes to the Sabbath. And perhaps a bit like the dispute of the early church over Jews and gentile believers and the issue of circumcision.

Some comments and reactions sort of make it sound like unless you keep the Adventist Sabbath in an Adventist Church, singing hymns from he Adventist hymnal and having Adventist prayers and sermon spoken by Adventist lips from an Adventist pulpit, God will not be pleased with your keeping of the Sabbath.

[bonnie]

I am thinking that we are becoming rather like the Jews were in Jesus' days here on earth, when it comes to the Sabbath. And perhaps a bit like the dispute of the early church over Jews and gentile believers and the issue of circumcision.

Some comments and reactions sort of make it sound like unless you keep the Adventist Sabbath in an Adventist Church, singing hymns from he Adventist hymnal and having Adventist prayers and sermon spoken by Adventist lips from an Adventist pulpit, God will not be pleased with your keeping of the Sabbath.

This is a very extreme misrepresentation of what has been said. Attending church because of convenience,curiousity or you like the people is a far cry from

observing the Sabbath. Are those that do this going to burn in everlasting hellfire as been claimed is the belief of those narrow minded,self righteous SDA's?  Another extreme misrepresentation. Does it take more to follow the biblical command to keep observe to 7th day than to walk into a church for a couple of hours a week? I think so.

Sabbath is not a Adventist Sabbath. Adventists believe in God's Sabbath. You are not keeping God's Sabbath by attending on Sunday or attending a adventist church out of convenience. Attending is not the same as "keeping/observing the Sabbath 

What is an adventist prayer? Is that like the Catholic prayer book? I don't think you have to be adventist for God to answer prayer. I firmly believe a very dedicated Catholic nurse,her prayers and love is the reason our second son,a preemie we were told would not survive, lived and thrived under her care for three months. She volunteered many hours rocking ,singing and praying while rubbing the rosary on his back. 

When she attended mass on Sunday she was not observing the 7th day sabbath as God directed. She was doing what she believed to be right. Regardless of believing she was right at that time,if she were alive when Christ returns and was still attending Mass on Sunday her

decision to follow a man instead of God would have what consequences?

 

 

 

 

 

Some comments and reactions sort of make it sound like unless you keep the Adventist Sabbath in an Adventist Church, singing hymns from he Adventist hymnal and having Adventist prayers and sermon spoken by Adventist lips from an Adventist pulpit, God will not be pleased with your keeping of the Sabbath.

 

 

I would much rather listen to a sermon from a Sunday keeping Christian pastor than listen to the above from a tolerant,loving accepting liberal pastor or speaker

[bonnie]

I am thinking that we are becoming rather like the Jews were in Jesus' days here on earth, when it comes to the Sabbath. And perhaps a bit like the dispute of the early church over Jews and gentile believers and the issue of circumcision.

Some comments and reactions sort of make it sound like unless you keep the Adventist Sabbath in an Adventist Church, singing hymns from he Adventist hymnal and having Adventist prayers and sermon spoken by Adventist lips from an Adventist pulpit, God will not be pleased with your keeping of the Sabbath.

If I remember correctly Abell ended up getting smacked upside the head because Cain,altho willing to offer a sacrifice as commanded by God chose to decide for himself what his obedience would look like. God was not pleased

[Gregory Matthews]

Attending a church service on the 1st day of the week is not keeping a Sunday Sabbath, regardless of what anyone might think.

 

Attending a church service on the 1st day of the week, is not in any sense, breaking the Sabbath.

 

Attending a church service on the 7th day of the week, is not keeping the Sabbath.

 

Keeping the Sabbath is much more than attending a church service on the 7th day of the week.

 

In many ways, the SDA Church has failed to communicate to its members the richness of the blessings that are attached to Sabbath keeping due to the fact that all to often its focus has been on simply attending a worship service that was held on the 7th day of the week.  God has much more to teach us on this issue.  If we as a church fail to rise to the standard that God would want us to have, God will raise up people from outside of our denomination to proclaim his message for "end time"    Lyndon, is correct.  The Sabbath message is critical for people living in "end time."    However, the critical element of that message is much deeper than a mere day on which people spend two hours in worship.  Where we as a denomination have lost our way and have become much like the Protestant world is where have focused on a mere two hour and the day on which we spend those two hours.  Satan is delighted to have us do that, for in doing that we deprive ourselves of the Sabbath blessing that God has in mind for us, on the 7th day.

[bonnie]

Attending a church service on the 1st day of the week is not keeping a Sunday Sabbath, regardless of what anyone might think.

 

Attending a church service on the 1st day of the week, is not in any sense, breaking the Sabbath.

 

Attending a church service on the 7th day of the week, is not keeping the Sabbath.

 

Keeping the Sabbath is much more than attending a church service on the 7th day of the week.

 

In many ways, the SDA Church has failed to communicate to its members the richness of the blessings that are attached to Sabbath keeping due to the fact that all to often its focus has been on simply attending a worship service that was held on the 7th day of the week.  God has much more to teach us on this issue.  If we as a church fail to rise to the standard that God would want us to have, God will raise up people from outside of our denomination to proclaim his message for "end time"    Lyndon, is correct.  The Sabbath message is critical for people living in "end time."    However, the critical element of that message is much deeper than a mere day on which people spend two hours in worship.  Where we as a denomination have lost our way and have become much like the Protestant world is where have focused on a mere two hour and the day on which we spend those two hours.  Satan is delighted to have us do that, for in doing that we deprive ourselves of the Sabbath blessing that God has in mind for us, on the 7th day.

No one has disagreed with anything in this post that I know of

[LifeHiscost]

No one has disagreed with anything in this post that I know of

My own growth in grace is incumbent upon me asking the question of myself, "What are your reasons for attending worship services on the seventh day Sabbath, and why." Then if I think I've learned anything from the answer, I tell others that are interested and willing to listen. I'm of the opinion that I fall so far short of the glory of God that to attach discrepancies to the experience of others as a primary focus of attention, even though Jesus did under certain circumstances, is largely counter productive for anyone interested in helping others find their way to the Kingdom.

 

Hope you all have a happy President's Day. Does the mail deliver today?

 

God is Love!  Jesus saves! 

[rudywoofs (Pam)]

 Where we as a denomination have lost our way and have become much like the Protestant world is where have focused on a mere two hour and the day on which we spend those two hours.  Satan is delighted to have us do that, for in doing that we deprive ourselves of the Sabbath blessing that God has in mind for us, on the 7th day.

 

Of what does the "Sabbath blessing" consist?  IOW, could you describe the "Sabbath blessing"?  Is it tangible, or intangible?

[Gregory Matthews]

Lyndon, note that in your citation EGW says that it is the substitution of the false for the true.  The true in the 7th day as the Sabbath.  The false is the 1st day as the Sabbath.   Also, not the phrase "force men to keep the first day."  Keeping the Sabbath is not attending church for two hours.  Keeping involves a 24-hour day period of time.

 

I find it interesting that while you quoted from 7SDABC, page 980, you have not cited anything from 7SDABC 910.  Here she says: " . .  . the first day of the week instead of the seventh is now the Sabbath." 

 

That is the issue.

 

Ad to your video clip.  Have you actually listened to it.  in that video clip the preacher cites as a sign that the end of time is near that the U.S. Congress has voted that climate change is factual.  He tells us that this vote was the result of the influence of the Pope.  Frankly such talk disrespects the Bible.  It is absolute nonsense.  The Bible never tells us that a belief in climate change is a sign of end time.

[rudywoofs (Pam)]

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

is Andrew Henriques a bona fide SDA minister?   The only place I can find him is on his own internet site called, "Saved to Serve" (under the website of http://prophesyagain.org/)  His wife, Hilari Henriques, writes for Advindicate...

[CoAspen]

A continued attack by some on the .org by others who have 'issues' has been going on for some time....through out the forum. Thanks to Rudy for continued research on the 'rest of the story'. As Bravus says....Truth is important!!
Those claiming to be SDA's but then present half truths, innuendo, slander and misrepresentation are not in any way concerned with truth....of any kind!!

[Gregory Matthews]

Andrew Henriques is present in many places on the Internet.  However, I cannot find in any of them a clear statement as to his denominational background.  It seems that he does not want to give people that information.