Are we born justified?

[8thdaypriest]

I don't personally believe that "the curse of the law" was simply "natural" consequences. 

God gave "dominion" over the earth to Adam, conditionally.  The covenant with Adam required obedience.  Work 6 days, then rest one.  Marriage to "his wife" only.  And do NOT eat of that tree.   

God had to protect Adam's "dominion", BECAUSE there were much stronger evil spirit beings, who would take over IF God did not especially protect Adam and Eve.

When Adam disobeyed the expressed will of God.  God withdrew His special protection.  Satan was no longer confined to "the tree", and he took over the dominion. 

How could God recover the dominion FOR mankind?  A man would have to fulfill the TERMS of the covenant - perfect obedience.  Then God could give dominion to that perfect man.

Jesus fulfilled the TERMS of the Eden Covenant, and the Sinai Covenant.  He will therefore receive "the land" and "dominion" of the earth. 

God removed His the special protection from Jesus, when He suffered the "curse of the law".  The "curse of the law" is death - yes, but it is death which results from the loss of God's special protection.  When the Father removed His protection from Jesus, He was subject to torture (not just by men) but by every demon.  

So - What does this have to do with being born "justified" ?? 

"God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son.  That whosoever believeth in Him, should not perish, but have eternal life"  (John 3:16).

Jesus will be awarded "dominion".  Then Jesus will divide the sheep from the goats.  He will grant eternal life to THOSE WHO SERVE HIM.

Who ever would acknowledge Jesus as Lord, and would serve Him - would have eternal life.  Which means that NOT EVERYONE will be saved in His kingdom.

Infants and children CANNOT acknowledge Jesus as Lord.  They CANNOT pledge to serve Him.  Is it JUST that they be left "as if they never were" ?  I don't think so. 

Is it just as they be given eternal life WITHOUT EVER acknowledging Jesus as Lord, or pledging to serve Him?  I don't think so. 

Yes - Jesus tasted death "for every man".  Which gave Him the right to choose whom He would (from all men) - for His kingdom.  But that does not translate into Jesus choosing EVERY MAN for His kingdom.  Yes - the invitation is for "all".  But only those who surrender to Him - as Lord, will finally be granted eternal life. 

Edited May 3, 2015 by 8thdaypriest
misspelling

[Robert]

So - What does this have to do with being born "justified" ?? 

"God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son.  That whosoever believeth in Him, should not perish, but have eternal life"  (John 3:16).

​I don't think you are really reading what I am writing.  I am not teaching universalism (i.e., all will be saved).  Many will chose to remain under law because they have a high view of their goodness.  

What I'm stating is exactly what Rom 5:18 states.  That our condemnation is Adam has been legally reversed in Christ.  For those who can grasp or understand the gospel, faith is the appropriate response if they have passed the age of accountability, but for those who haven't they are safe in Christ.  My examples include infants, and the mentally handicapped, those who at no fault of their own can't chose.

Edited May 3, 2015 by Robert

[8thdaypriest]

Isaiah 45:25 "In the LORD all the descendants of Israel Shall be justified, and shall glory." (NKJ)

It doesn't say ALL MANKIND.  It says "the seed of Israel".  But who are the "seed of Israel".  ONLY those of faith.  

Just like Galatians  3:29.  "And if you are Christ's, then you are Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise."

Paul says "all Israel will be saved"  ( Rom. 11:26).  But - Paul is NOT speaking of physical DNA descendants.  He even says, "They are NOT all Israel, who are of Israel" ( Rom 9:6 ). 

There was biological DNA Israel, and there was "faith" Israel.  Paul says that all the Israel OF FAITH, will be saved, including the grafted in "mixed multitude" of us Gentiles.

HOW does one come to be Christ's?  He has to believe in Jesus as LORD, and surrender to serve Him.  He has to believe. 

I HAVE read what you have written Robert.  I just do NOT AGREE with your interpretation. 

I believe that in dieing, Christ won the right to save all humanity. 

But Christ has surrendered to His Father's will, and will therefore bring into His Kingdom ONLY THOSE who acknowledge Him as King, and strive to serve Him.  Believing involves surrender and service IF YOU BELIEVE that He is LORD and KING.  If you simply believe (assent in your mind) that Christ paid a penalty, so we don't have to, THAT is NOT ENOUGH.  The mafia "believe".  That's why they keep a priest on retainer.  They believe, but they have no plan to change any behavior, at least in this life.

 

[8thdaypriest]

Acts 13:38 "Therefore, my friends, I want you to know that through Jesus the forgiveness of sins is proclaimed to you. 39 Through him everyone who believes is set free from every sin, a justification you were not able to obtain under the law of Moses.

Romans 5:1 "Therefore, having been justified by (through) faith (belief), we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ," (NKJ)

The first step in the process is to respond to information presented - with BELIEF (faith).

James 2:24 "You see then that a man is justified by works, and not by faith only." (NKJ) 

A man MUST believe in Jesus as Lord, and agree to serve Him.  THAT is to enter into a Covenant with God through Christ.  He is THEN "in Christ".

Then he must demonstrate His service, and confess his faith.

[Samie]

When Jesus comes, He will reward each one according to what each has done. Matt 16:27; Rev 22:12

Only those whose names are in the book of life can enter heaven. Rev 21:27

Those whose names are not in the book of life will be cast into the lake of fire. Rev 20:15

Jesus said that overcomers will not be blotted out from the book of life (Rev 3:5).  "Blotting" signifies that names had been written otherwise there is nothing to blot.

IF a person's name is only written in the book of life after he enters into a covenant relationship with God, then children who die at infancy are doomed. But the prophet Isaiah saw in vision that in the new earth there are babies and little children (Isa 11:6-9). This tells us that the names of these babies are in the book of life. And we were all babies. Therefore we were born with our names in the book of life.

Unless blotted out at death (Heb 9:27) for not overcoming evil with good (Rom 12:21) while alive, we are heaven-bound. There is hope while alive.

 

 

[Robert]

A man MUST believe in Jesus as Lord, and agree to serve Him.  THAT is to enter into a Covenant with God through Christ.  He is THEN "in Christ".

Then he must demonstrate His service, and confess his faith.

​No, absolutely not....That is not the gospel.  What you are presenting is what Paul terms "another gospel, which is really no gospel at all."  

Edited May 3, 2015 by Robert

[Robert]

Out of the Reformation of the 16th Century developed two main distinct concepts of salvation that has since dominated Protestantism. The most popular one today is the Calvinist concept of salvation (John Calvin). According to this view, God actually redeemed or reconciled to Himself the human race on the cross of Christ. However, since the Bible clearly teaches that some will be lost, the Calvinists teach that Christ did not die for the entire human race on the cross, but only for those whom God predetermined He would save. Hence, they believe in a limited atonement.

In the other camp you have the Arminians (Jacob Arminius). They teach that Christ died for the entire human race on the cross. However, they also take into consideration that some will be lost. Therefore, according to their view, Christ did not actually save anyone on the cross, but simply made provision for our salvation. Hence, for this salvation to become an actual reality, one has to meet certain conditions, namely:  believe, repent, and confess all sins. Only then will God put you into Christ and save you.

The above is from the following website:  http://www.jacksequeira.org/issues02.htm

The problem is that Calvinism and Arminianism isn't presenting the gospel.  Adventist are mostly, if not entirely, Arminians.  They believe that  the sinner must believe, repent, and confess  and only then will God put you into Christ and save you, but that's not the clear teaching of the NT.

Take for example Romans 6:6 "we know that our old self (our old life or old man) was crucified with him so that the body of sin might be done away with, that we should no longer be slaves to sin"

When did your old life from Adam die in Christ?  Was it when you accepted Christ or was it when Christ died?  I will hold any answers to the immediate context.

 

 

Edited May 3, 2015 by Robert

[Robert]

​You ask when one's old self dies in Christ? If you read Rom 6:6 in context with  the 3 verses that go before it you would have your answer. This all occurs, according to Paul, at Baptism.

​So Christ's corporate death saved no one and baptism is our Savior?

Okay, let's go with this interpretation:  "we (context: Roman believers) know (from hearing the gospel) that our old self was crucified with him so that the body of sin might be done away with..."

Paul states that your old self was crucified (and therefore died) with Christ so that "the body of sin might be done away with". When was Christ crucified, when you were baptized? If that's the case then every time a sinner believes Christ dies again and again.  The is hybrid of Roman Catholic theology.  Paul clearly states that:

 Hebrew 9:5 "Nor did he (Christ) enter heaven to offer himself again and again, the way the high priest enters the Most Holy Place every year with blood that is not his own. 26 Then Christ would have had to suffer (die) many times since the creation of the world."

So we aren't put into Christ at Baptism.  If we are, please tell me how that is done?

Now Romans 7:4 is stating the same as Romans 6:6 "you also died to the law in the body of Christ"!  Your old life from Adam died to the law (because the justice of the law demanded your death) where?  "In the body of Christ"!  When did Christ as the Son of Man, die?  2000 years ago!  That's when your corporate life from Adam died and you were legally justified unto life.

Edited May 4, 2015 by Robert

[Robert]

Rom 4:25  Who was delivered for our offences, and was raised again for our justification.

 (If he were raised for our justification then justification did not occur at the cross but was associated with his medatorial work in the sanctuary above.)

 

Rom 5:7 For scarcely for a just man will one die; yet perhaps for a good man someone would even dare to die. 

8 But God demonstrates His own love (agape) toward us, in that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us. 

9 Much more then, having now been justified by His blood (His corporate life laid down in death), we shall be saved from wrath through Him. 

10 For if when we were enemies (unbelievers) we were reconciled (past tense) to God through the death of His Son, much more, having been reconciled, we shall be saved by His life.

 

We were reconciled (justified) by Christ's corporate death 2000 years ago!

 

Hebrews 10:9  See, I have come to do your will (His Father's will)." He abolishes the first (covenant) in order to establish the second. 10 And it is by God's will that we have been sanctified (set apart) through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all. 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited May 4, 2015 by Robert

[Robert]

"By His obedience to all the commandments of God (the law), Christ wrought out a redemption for man. This was not done by going out of Himself to another, but by taking humanity into Himself. Thus Christ gave to humanity an existence out of Himself. To bring humanity into Christ, to bring the fallen race into oneness with divinity, is the work of redemption" (Ellen White)

When did God put you into Christ? At the incarnation, not at baptism.  God put your corporate life from Adam into Christ by blending Christ's Deity with our corporate, fallen life from the womb of Mary.  That's how your corporate life was put into Christ.  Christ, as God, was united with our fallen, corporate life that needed redeeming. For thirty something years Christ perfectly obeyed His Father's law and on the cross Christ suffered the justice of God's law.  Where was your corporate life when He obeyed and when He died the 2nd death?  In Christ!  That's the gospel.  Anything outside this is "another gospel". 

You were justified in Christ 2000 years ago.  Now that you have reached the age of accountability you have a choice, reject this gospel or accept it. If you accept it you have justification by faith.

Edited May 4, 2015 by Robert

[Samie]

NKJ 2 Timothy 1:

9   [God] has saved us and called us with a holy calling, not according to our works, but according to His own purpose and grace which was given to us in Christ Jesus before time began,

10 but has now been revealed by the appearing of our Savior Jesus Christ, who has abolished death and brought life and immortality to light through the gospel

On the cross, Christ fashioned humanity into His body (Eph 2:11-16). When He - the Head - died, His Body - humanity - died together with Him (2 Cor 5:14,15; Heb 2:9). By that death, all sins were forgiven (Col 2:13) and humanity was reconciled to God (Rom 5:10). By that death, we were made holy and perfect (Heb 10:10,14). When the Head resurrected, the Body was resurrected together with Him, and we all were born again into a living hope (1 Pet 1:3).  The sins we now commit Christ does not impute against us (2 Cor 5:18, 19); instead He continually justifies us, having been raised for our justification (Rom 4:25), and God remembers our sins no more (Heb 10: 16,17).

But the act of sinning is proof that a person has not yet overcome evil with good, and only overcomers will not be blotted out from the book of life (Rev 3:5)

[8thdaypriest]

When Jesus comes, He will reward each one according to what each has done. Matt 16:27; Rev 22:12

Only those whose names are in the book of life can enter heaven. Rev 21:27

Those whose names are not in the book of life will be cast into the lake of fire. Rev 20:15

Jesus said that overcomers will not be blotted out from the book of life (Rev 3:5).  "Blotting" signifies that names had been written otherwise there is nothing to blot.

IF a person's name is only written in the book of life after he enters into a covenant relationship with God, then children who die at infancy are doomed. But the prophet Isaiah saw in vision that in the new earth there are babies and little children (Isa 11:6-9). This tells us that the names of these babies are in the book of life. And we were all babies. Therefore we were born with our names in the book of life.

Unless blotted out at death (Heb 9:27) for not overcoming evil with good (Rom 12:21) while alive, we are heaven-bound. There is hope while alive.

 

 

​Children are NOT DOOMED, because their names are NOT written into the Book of Life when they are born.  They will be resurrected with "the rest of the dead" to continue their lives during the 8th Day kingdom of Messiah.  The 8th Day will be the 8th millennium.  They will "grow up", and then they will choose whom they will serve. 

The 8th Day ANSWERS THE QUESTION, of what happens to children, pagans whom the missionaries did not reach, and all those with mental disabilities.

We will keep on repeating and repeating and repeating our beliefs concerning this issue Samie.  I'll keep on posting my beliefs.  And you will keep on posting yours.  Because we want those who read the posts at this forum to consider our differing viewpoints.  

[8thdaypriest]

"By His obedience to all the commandments of God (the law), Christ wrought out a redemption for man. This was not done by going out of Himself to another, but by taking humanity into Himself. Thus Christ gave to humanity an existence out of Himself. To bring humanity into Christ, to bring the fallen race into oneness with divinity, is the work of redemption" (Ellen White)

When did God put you into Christ? At the incarnation, not at baptism.  God put your corporate life from Adam into Christ by blending Christ's Deity with our corporate, fallen life from the womb of Mary.  That's how your corporate life was put into Christ.  Christ, as God, was united with our fallen, corporate life that needed redeeming. For thirty something years Christ perfectly obeyed His Father's law and on the cross Christ suffered the justice of God's law.  Where was your corporate life when He obeyed and when He died the 2nd death?  In Christ!  That's the gospel.  Anything outside this is "another gospel". 

You were justified in Christ 2000 years ago.  Now that you have reached the age of accountability you have a choice, reject this gospel or accept it. If you accept it you have justification by faith.

​So Robert, I have to "accept it" - meaning I have to accept your version of the gospel, OR I will be LOST because I'm teaching "a different gospe".  Is THAT what you're saying? 

[8thdaypriest]

    Galatians 3:26-27 and 4:6   “For you are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus.  For as many of you as were baptized into Christ have put on Christ.”  “And because you are sons, God has sent forth the Spirit of His Son into your hearts, crying out, ‘Abba, Father!’”

Romans 16:7  [Paul writing] “Greet Andronicus and Junia, my countrymen and my fellow prisoners, who are of note among the apostles, who also were in Christ before me.”

We are "in Christ" after we are "baptized into Christ".   That happens at a POINT IN TIME.   Every human being was NOT "in Christ" from the moment of His death. 

 

[pnattmbtc]

​"The things He has revealed are for us and for our children. There are things we do not now understand. We are ignorant of many things that are plainly revealed. " {3SM 313.3}

"The question has been asked me, 'Do you think that the Lord has any more light for us as a people?'  I answer that He has light that is new to us and yet it is precious old light that is to shine forth from the Word of truth.  We (Ellen White includes herself) have only the glimmerings of the rays of the light that is yet to come to us (future tense)."  — Ellen G. White, Selected Messages Vol. 1, page 401

​EGW wrote specific reasons regarding why infants/small children would not be in heaven.  We have received some light on this subject.  She spoke of the importance of how infants/young children are raised in terms of the implications of their eternal destiny.  The light regarding Romans 5:18 happened during EGW's lifetime.  She has many quotes which reflect this.  She lived almost 30 years after 1888.

If I'm understanding you, you're asserting the following:

1.She said we didn't have all light, and would receive new light.

2.Your interpretation or Romans 5:18 is that infants are born justified, which is new light she didn't know about.

If I'm understanding you correctly, I think this idea is problematic for the reasons I pointed out above.  If I'm not understanding you correctly, please correct my misunderstanding.

[Robert]

2.Your interpretation or Romans 5:18 is that infants are born justified, which is new light she didn't know about.

​Not just Romans 5:18, but other verses.  We come into this world justified until we can comprehend spiritual issues.  Then, to retain our justification in Christ, the gospel must be accepted by faith.  Hence justification by faith.  If not, faith saves us and not Christ.

Edited May 5, 2015 by Robert

[Robert]

    Galatians 3:26-27 and 4:6   “For you are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus.  For as many of you as were baptized into Christ have put on Christ.”  “And because you are sons, God has sent forth the Spirit of His Son into your hearts, crying out, ‘Abba, Father!’”

Romans 16:7  [Paul writing] “Greet Andronicus and Junia, my countrymen and my fellow prisoners, who are of note among the apostles, who also were in Christ before me.”

We are "in Christ" after we are "baptized into Christ".   That happens at a POINT IN TIME.   Every human being was NOT "in Christ" from the moment of His death. 

On Gal: To put on Christ means to accept the gospel (something infants and mentally handicapped can't do).  

On Romans: Here Paul is speaking of faith, that is, accepting our position "in Christ".  Andronicus and Junia accepted Christ before Paul.

Every human being shares Adam's fallen life.  This life Christ assumed from Mary's womb.  So yes, our corporate humanity was in Him at the incarnation. Baptism is a symbol of that truth.

 

​

Edited May 5, 2015 by Robert

[Robert]

​So Robert, I have to "accept it" - meaning I have to accept your version of the gospel, OR I will be LOST because I'm teaching "a different gospel".  Is THAT what you're saying? 

​It was Paul who said:

Gal 1:6 I am astonished that you are so quickly deserting the one who called you by the grace of Christ and are turning to a different gospel-- 

7 which is really no gospel at all. Evidently some people are throwing you into confusion and are trying to pervert the gospel of Christ. 

8 But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach a gospel other than the one we preached to you, let him be eternally condemned! 

9 As we have already said, so now I say again: If anybody is preaching to you a gospel other than what you accepted, let him be eternally condemned! 

 

Paul is saying that if you knowingly pervert the gospel (the truth as it is "in Christ") you deserve the 2nd death or eternal condemnation.  So we need to be very careful what gospel we present.  The gospel must answer the following question:

 

How can God justify the ungodly [Romans 4:5] and still maintain His integrity to His holy law which condemns sinners [Galatians 3:10]?

 

 Keep in mind no law will allow an innocent person to die for the crime of a guilty. Now, can you answer the above question?

Edited May 5, 2015 by Robert

[Robert]

​Children are NOT DOOMED, because their names are NOT written into the Book of Life when they are born.  They will be resurrected with "the rest of the dead" to continue their lives during the 8th Day kingdom of Messiah.  The 8th Day will be the 8th millennium.  They will "grow up", and then they will choose whom they will serve

​Not supported by Scripture....It is nothing but supposition.

[pnattmbtc]

    Galatians 3:26-27 and 4:6   “For you are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus.  For as many of you as were baptized into Christ have put on Christ.”  “And because you are sons, God has sent forth the Spirit of His Son into your hearts, crying out, ‘Abba, Father!’”

Romans 16:7  [Paul writing] “Greet Andronicus and Junia, my countrymen and my fellow prisoners, who are of note among the apostles, who also were in Christ before me.”

We are "in Christ" after we are "baptized into Christ".   That happens at a POINT IN TIME.   Every human being was NOT "in Christ" from the moment of His death. 

 

​It's not at the moment of His death, but His incarnation.  There is a lot of scripture which deals with corporate solidarity in Christ (e.g. there are themes of Christ as the New Israel, the New Adam), perhaps the clearest being Romans 5:12-18.  If you read through the arguments of Sequeira, they are persuasive.  Especially the idea that if we argue that we are in Adam because we have sinned like Adam sinned, then it would follow that we are justified because we are righteous like Christ was righteous, which is the opposite of Paul's point.

I should add that the corporate aspect of the gospel is just one aspect of corporate solidarity in Scripture.  As Westerner's, it's not a way that we are used to thinking, but it's definitely there.  For example, that Levi paid tithe to Abraham is a corporate idea.

 

[pnattmbtc]

​Not just Romans 5:18, but other verses.  We come into this world justified until we can comprehend spiritual issues.  Then, to retain our justification in Christ, the gospel must be accepted by faith.  Hence justification by faith.  If not, faith saves us and not Christ.

​This doesn't address the points I made.  Please address them.

In regards to your comments here, one doesn't retain the justification with which one is born; that's corporate justification which doesn't go away.  "To the death of Christ we owe even this earthly life" (Corporate justification, in effect as long as one is alive). Only justification by faith can be retained.  

[pnattmbtc]

​It was Paul who said:

Gal 1:6 I am astonished that you are so quickly deserting the one who called you by the grace of Christ and are turning to a different gospel-- 

7 which is really no gospel at all. Evidently some people are throwing you into confusion and are trying to pervert the gospel of Christ. 

8 But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach a gospel other than the one we preached to you, let him be eternally condemned! 

9 As we have already said, so now I say again: If anybody is preaching to you a gospel other than what you accepted, let him be eternally condemned! 

 

Paul is saying that if you knowingly pervert the gospel (the truth as it is "in Christ") you deserve the 2nd death or eternal condemnation.  So we need to be very careful what gospel we present.  The gospel must answer the following question:

 

How can God justify the ungodly [Romans 4:5] and still maintain His integrity to His holy law which condemns sinners [Galatians 3:10]?

 

 Keep in mind no law will allow an innocent person to die for the crime of a guilty. Now, can you answer the above question?

​Here's what Waggoner wrote about Galations 3:10:

 

“Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law.” Let us stop right here and contemplate this fact, leaving the way of redemption for later consideration. We need to consider the statement very carefully, for some who read it straightway rush off frantically exclaiming, “We don’t need to keep the law, because Christ has redeemed us from the curse of it,” as though the text said that Christ redeemed us from the curse of obedience. Such read the Scriptures to no profit. The curse, as we have seen it, is disobedience. “Cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them.” Therefore, Christ has redeemed us from disobedience to the law. God sent forth His Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, “that the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us.” Rom.8:4.

Some one may lightly say, “Then we are all right; whatever we do is right so far as the law is concerned, since we are redeemed.” It is true that all are redeemed, but not all have accepted redemption. Many say of Christ, “We will not have this Man to reign over us,” and thrust the blessing of God from them. But redemption is for all; all have been purchased with the precious blood—the life—of Christ, and all may be, if they will, free from sin and death. By that blood we are redeemed from our “vain manner of life.” 1Pet.1:18, R.V.

Stop and think what this means; let the full force of the announcement impress itself upon your consciousness. “Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law,”—from not continuing in all its righteous requirements. We need not sin any more. He has snapped asunder the cords of sin that bound us, so that we have but to accept His salvation in order to be free from every besetting sin. It is not necessary for us any longer to spend our lives in earnest longings for a better life, and in vain regrets for desires unrealized. Christ raises no false hopes, but He comes to the captives of sin, and cries to them, “Liberty! Your prison doors are open. Go forth.” What more can be said? Christ has gained the complete victory over “this present evil world,” over “the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life,” and our faith in Him makes His victory ours. We have but to accept it."

Edited May 5, 2015 by pnattmbtc

[Robert]

​This doesn't address the points I made.  Please address them.

In regards to your comments here, one doesn't retain the justification with which one is born; that's corporate justification which doesn't go away.  "To the death of Christ we owe even this earthly life" (Corporate justification, in effect as long as one is alive). Only justification by faith can be retained.  

​Our earthly life is not eternal life.  Romans 5:18 states, "the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life".

Christ has reversed our condemnation in Adam, legally, by answering the demands of His law.  His justification of humanity is a historical event that is not undone.  However, it can rejected.  To those who reject the gospel there's only condemnation.

[Samie]

​The rewarding of EVERYONE according to what each has done will be when Jesus comes again. This Jesus Himself explicitly said. That there will be rewarding at some other point in time like at the 8th millennium or beyond, I find no basis in Scriptures, as Robert also pointed out.

When one's name is in the book of life, eternal life; otherwise, God's wrath, and finally thrown into the lake of fire.

Edited May 5, 2015 by Samie

[Robert]

​Here's what Waggoner wrote about Galations 3:10:

 

“Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law.” Let us stop right here and contemplate this fact, leaving the way of redemption for later consideration. We need to consider the statement very carefully, for some who read it straightway rush off frantically exclaiming, “We don’t need to keep the law, because Christ has redeemed us from the curse of it,” as though the text said that Christ redeemed us from the curse of obedience. Such read the Scriptures to no profit. The curse, as we have seen it, is disobedience. “Cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them.” Therefore, Christ has redeemed us from disobedience to the law. God sent forth His Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, “that the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us.” Rom.8:4.

Some one may lightly say, “Then we are all right; whatever we do is right so far as the law is concerned, since we are redeemed.” It is true that all are redeemed, but not all have accepted redemption. Many say of Christ, “We will not have this Man to reign over us,” and thrust the blessing of God from them. But redemption is for all; all have been purchased with the precious blood—the life—of Christ, and all may be, if they will, free from sin and death. By that blood we are redeemed from our “vain manner of life.” 1Pet.1:18, R.V.

Stop and think what this means; let the full force of the announcement impress itself upon your consciousness. “Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law,”—from not continuing in all its righteous requirements. We need not sin any more. He has snapped asunder the cords of sin that bound us, so that we have but to accept His salvation in order to be free from every besetting sin. It is not necessary for us any longer to spend our lives in earnest longings for a better life, and in vain regrets for desires unrealized. Christ raises no false hopes, but He comes to the captives of sin, and cries to them, “Liberty! Your prison doors are open. Go forth.” What more can be said? Christ has gained the complete victory over “this present evil world,” over “the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life,” and our faith in Him makes His victory ours. We have but to accept it."

​Yes, but victory is not the gospel.  That's the fruit of the gospel.  The gospel is what Christ did in our corporate, fallen humanity through His doing & dying.