Can one be an adventist and NOT believe that Ellen White was a prophet

[Gregory Matthews]

Neil:  Yes.   Such has happened.

 

 

[Lauralea]

Neil many years ago when I had cancer, I was being treated by the head oncologist at the regional cancer center ( a referral center for cancer treatment- at the time there were 80 in the United States) in Chattanooga Tennessee. He was a Christian, not an Adventist, who would make comments about Ellen White. He told me that my cancer was unrelated to lifestyle, but that a friend of mine, who had lung cancer from prior smoking, would not have gotten it had he always followed our teachings. He used to comment about Ellen White.. One day, he asked me directly who she was. I told him she was a woman with a third grade education who lived in the 1800s and early 1900s and said among other things that cancer was caused by a germ, and that she was one of the founders of the Adventist church. "I believe her to be a modern prophet" I concluded. He replied that based on what I had said, this was probably the case. Later, I gave him a copy of Ministry of Healing. He thanked me and said he would read it with interest.

[Lauralea]

No matter, though, because SDAism is just another distraction from the true system of the Temple Service, a system that will be restored in the Kingdom of YHVH, a system that will last forever.

​I am half Jewish, and while I believe the symbolism of the rituals is significant, the early church as a body, including Paul, who was a prophet, decided that the Mosaic law was not binding on Gentile converts. Having said that, I believe we will have a temple service in the restored kingdom. Actually the SDA church is the only group I am aware of that believes both in the Messiah Jesus or Jeshua, the Sabbath given at Mount Sinai, avoiding unclean foods as set forth by Moses, as well as the symbolic application of the Day of Atonement being applicable to the time before the Second Coming.

[Bravus]

It occurred to me.....If a person can be an Adventist and not believe she is a prophet, could a person believe she is a prophet, and not be an Adventist?

 

Of course, this is all academia....and somewhat humorous.....somewhat......

​This is a fascinating question! Certainly one could be a 'non-canonical' Adventist: a member of an offshoot rather than the main organism church.

[Stan]

When I was an ABC manager, did that for 20 years, 40 counting overtime   , and I sold a lot of EGW to Catholic Priests who gave books like STC and Christ Object Lessons to the Church members at Christmas.  BOTh in Oshawa, Canada and Los Angeles, we sold a lot to various Orthodox priests.  Many ABC makers will tell similar stories.

[Bravus]

Perhaps not so many of the original, unexpurgated Great Controversy to Catholic priests, though...

[Stan]

No, but they are more human that we like to think they are. Did sell some, any intellectual has no problem viewing other view points. Many would not disagree with some of the historical points.  EGW was not the "in your face' that so many of her followers can be. 

 

Theories are theories, Truth, what ever that is, invites and begs for investigation.  Judgement day is not going to be a test of 28 questions, (we used to think it was 27) but how we treated others.

[Stan]

EGW, was, in my opinion, the most aggressive, liberal thinking person, we have ever had in leadership. As an Ordained Minister in the Adventist Church, she stood tall.

[Stewart (SDA)]

Can a Mormon be a Mormon without confidence and belief in Joseph Smith at all?

 

Did EGW view her self as a prophet?  Did she admit to errors? Was she claiming infallibility? Are her writing a sledgehammer or more Pastoral?

I like the question about Joseph Smith... and I do wonder whether Mormon discussion sites attract as many anti Joseph Smith people, as SDA discussion sites seem to attract anti Ellen White people.

_________

Sometimes I also get the impression that there is some misunderstanding about what  Mrs. White did, and did not, claim.

 

Let's bear in mind that she wrote things like this,

"My commission embraces the work of a prophet, but it does not end there..." (1Selected Messages, p. 36), and, "If others call me by that name [i.e. a prophet/prophetess], I have no controversy with them" (1SM p. 34).

Ellen White definitely claims that her work embraces (or includes) the work of a prophet, but of course she did not make this claim prominent in her work.

[Aliensanctuary]

Can a Mormon be a Mormon without confidence and belief in Joseph Smith at all?

Likewise, can a Muslim still be a Muslim if he/she does not think that Mohammed was a prophet? Likely, that person will be decapitated by the fanatics.

I think we could keep the good and discard the bad and still be true to our religion. If any one of us wrote a book about the Kingdom of God, it would contain errors and misunderstandings, also. We might claim that angels visited us and gave us the particular ideas of our religion, but those claims must be held to a very, very high standard. Because so many religions have conflicting beliefs, we must realize that something is amiss.

Now, if someone creates a new religion and develops a following by making claims of divine revelation, if that person is intentionally or unintentionally creating a deception, they can lead many, many people off of the main road and into one of the ditches on either side, fanaticism or extreme liberalism.

We already know a little about what the Kingdom of YHVH is like from the teachings of Christ and the Scriptures of old. These Scriptures already explain to us what we need to know to join that Kingdom. The sideshows of denominational "prophets" will only distract us from our mission, which is to teach others about the Kingdom and conduct our lives in a way that demonstrates our beliefs. When Elijah comes, then we will understand, then we can fully prepare ourselves to join the Kingdom. If we create denominational "prophets" before that time we will only find ourselves sliding closer and closer to the side of the road that leads to the Kingdom, closer to, or into, one of the ditches that lead to nowhere.

Instead of listening to the conflicting garbage that all religions teach, we should focus our thinking on what the Kingdom of YHVH is, as revealed to us in the Scriptures. Only this will prepare us for what lies ahead.

 

[Stan]

A prophet is not a Psychic.  

If we are talking about a prophet, we must define a prophet.

EGW did not like to be called a prophet.

 

I like the fact that over the years, she corrected her self.  At an older age she said "I have learned much over the years" or something similar to that.

[Gerr]

 Are her writing a sledgehammer or more Pastoral?

Had she sent you one of those "testimonies", how would you view it?

[Gerr]

 

 

I like the fact that over the years, she corrected her self.  At an older age she said "I have learned much over the years" or something similar to that.

Learning something is not the same as correcting something, is it?

[Gregory Matthews]

Learning may require correction.

[Neil D]

​This is a fascinating question! Certainly one could be a 'non-canonical' Adventist: a member of an offshoot rather than the main organism church.

​Perhaps.....over the years of being here, I can say that there were some members that I thought were more [ahem] to use sort of a racial slur "White" than Adventist....but that would mean that we would have to define what an "Adventist" is...and there are soooo many  variations....and it would make us...more...bias...perhaps....

Edited June 14, 2015 by Neil D
misspelt words or my fingers were working faster than my autospell checker

[whbae]

Mrs. White said if her statement conflicts against the Bible then, we should take the Bible.

Having said that I am surprised how many SDAs do not read her writings, just take someone else's word for it.

The other day about 12 retired couples went out to eat.  Almost all of them are vegetarians, however, what surprised me was their appetite for cheese.  The woman with only 3rd grade education stated the cheese is not fit for food has been vindicated by secular dieticians lately.  These dieticians strongly recommend not eat cheese because of high content of saturated fat.  We, the SDAs even have coined the word "haystack".  What is in the haystack?  If you do not know you should find out.    Just being a vegetarian is not enough, one should follow recommendations of Council on Diet and Food written by the lady prophet.

[phkrause]

Mrs. White said if her statement conflicts against the Bible then, we should take the Bible.

Having said that I am surprised how many SDAs do not read her writings, just take someone else's word for it.

The other day about 12 retired couples went out to eat.  Almost all of them are vegetarians, however, what surprised me was their appetite for cheese.  The woman with only 3rd grade education stated the cheese is not fit for food has been vindicated by secular dieticians lately.  These dieticians strongly recommend not eat cheese because of high content of saturated fat.  We, the SDAs even have coined the word "haystack".  What is in the haystack?  If you do not know you should find out.    Just being a vegetarian is not enough, one should follow recommendations of Council on Diet and Food written by the lady prophet.

​Actually Won, I've heard from about cheese at least 50 years ago. When I was going to the Jewish Adventist Church back in the late 50s early 60s the Pastor, J.M. Hoffman, did evangelistic meetings for Jewish people in NYC. He would do Daniel & Revelation meetings, with a health series. He spoke of cheese then, so its not a new thing, but as you say, the rest of the world is finally catching up with what EGW said, in many areas.

[whbae]

Peter,

That's funny, 50 years ago !  About that time I was living in LA, I was invited a party held by nonSDAs.  They brought all kinds of food but vegetarian dishes.  The hostess came to me why I was not eating.  I said I am a vegetarian , then he ask me if it was a religious reason. He asked me if I was a SDA, I said yes.  He immediately asked his helpers to bring me the cheese!  I guess in that region that SDAs are vegetarians and eat cheese, plenty cheeses.

[CFK1]

Ellen White was either a prophet or a false prophet.  I believe she was a prophet.  Personally I would not join a church that follows the writings of someone I consider a false prophet.

​Can a prophet be right and also be wrong?   

If someone begins to be God-inspired (a prophet), does that mean he is God-inspired 100% of the time from that point on?

Does "inspiration" come and go as in God inspired this thought ... but not that thought; God inspired the prophet to write this ... but not that?  

If so, how do you know which God inspired and which God did not inspire? 

[Gregory Matthews]

I suppose you all know that you can purchase fat-free cheese, which does not conatin any fat.

 

 

[phkrause]

I suppose you all know that you can purchase fat-free cheese, which does not conatin any fat.

 

 

​Exactly GM

[hch]

A prophet is not a Psychic.  

If we are talking about a prophet, we must define a prophet.

EGW did not like to be called a prophet.

 

I like the fact that over the years, she corrected her self.  At an older age she said "I have learned much over the years" or something similar to that.

​That attitude appears to be biblical:

For we know in part, and we prophesy in part.
But when that which is perfect is come, then that which is in part shall be done away. (1Co 13:9-10)

Perhaps the problem is not so much Ellen as it is how some folks misconstrue what Ellen writes.

 

 

[Stan]

I suppose you all know that you can purchase fat-free cheese, which does not conatin any fat.

 

 

​I have acquired that as well. The people also removed 82+% of the flavour.

[Gregory Matthews]

Amen!  Or misuse what she writes.

 

Perhaps the problem is not so much Ellen as it is how some folks misconstrue what Ellen writes.

 

 

[Gerr]

Mrs. White said if her statement conflicts against the Bible then, we should take the Bible.

Having said that I am surprised how many SDAs do not read her writings, just take someone else's word for it.

The other day about 12 retired couples went out to eat.  Almost all of them are vegetarians, however, what surprised me was their appetite for cheese.  The woman with only 3rd grade education stated the cheese is not fit for food has been vindicated by secular dieticians lately.  These dieticians strongly recommend not eat cheese because of high content of saturated fat.  We, the SDAs even have coined the word "haystack".  What is in the haystack?  If you do not know you should find out.    Just being a vegetarian is not enough, one should follow recommendations of Council on Diet and Food written by the lady prophet.

We often have haystack in our potluck, but I pass on the cheese.  I do eat DiGiorno's frozen veg pizza now & then which has a little bit of cheese in it.