Moderators lazarus Posted August 9, 2015 Moderators Posted August 9, 2015 G-d's people use violence because violence works. It's a useful tool. G-d himself uses violence. Quote Great spirits have always found violent opposition from mediocrities. The latter cannot understand it when a man does not thoughtlessly submit to hereditary prejudices but honestly and courageously uses his intelligence. Einstein
Administrators Gail Posted August 9, 2015 Author Administrators Posted August 9, 2015 While it is true that the Bible records God using violence on people that collectively became so nasty that nothing else was effective (burning your children alive, killing others haphazardly and sex during worship?) They might have extinguished themselves through bloodshed if God had not intervened on behalf of His people. The Roman Empire imploded but not before its leadership and citizens experienced an immoral free for all. Our current society is getting there but still has a ways to go yet. Quote Isaiah 32:17 And the work of righteousness shall be peace; and the effect of righteousness quietness and assurance for ever.
Administrators Gail Posted August 9, 2015 Author Administrators Posted August 9, 2015 Yes. And there are so many "examples" in the Bible where God has acted violently. "And of course", they say, God often kills His enemies, and we should model our lives after His example. I am not sure that God's acts of violence were against His enemies as much as He was on the side of His people to save them. It is like there is a certain amount of injustice that God tolerates, maybe to give men a chance to make the decision themselves. But all apocalypses do eventually come to an end if left to themselves. Evil makes for distrust even among allies. Sooner or later wicked people are either murdered or commit suicide. DreamWeaver 1 Quote Isaiah 32:17 And the work of righteousness shall be peace; and the effect of righteousness quietness and assurance for ever.
LifeHiscost Posted August 9, 2015 Posted August 9, 2015 While it is true that the Bible records God using violence on people that collectively became so nasty that nothing else was effective (burning your children alive, killing others haphazardly and sex during worship?) They might have extinguished themselves through bloodshed if God had not intervened on behalf of His people. The Roman Empire imploded but not before its leadership and citizens experienced an immoral free for all. Our current society is getting there but still has a ways to go yet. Having lived in a society for many years where one could send their five year old daughter ten blocks to the grocery store to pick up a quart of milk and trust that she would be safe until she got back home, I'm satisfied the reading of the last eight chapters of the book "The Great Controversy" wold be a real help to anyone who would like to know where we are in reference to our future. …11"I overthrew you, as God overthrew Sodom and Gomorrah, And you were like a firebrand snatched from a blaze; Yet you have not returned to Me," declares the LORD. 12"Therefore thus I will do to you, O Israel; Because I will do this to you, Prepare to meet your God, O Israel.".....Amos 4 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VvApvRL-LCE As well I'd like to leave this URL, of which I've only watched 40 minutes of it's information but find it quite an eyeopener, based on the bible, revealing the world society we live in and what I'm satisfied gives the below reality. 32"Now learn the parable from the fig tree: when its branch has already become tender and puts forth its leaves, you know that summer is near; 33so, you too, when you see all these things, recognize that He is near, right at the door. 34"Truly I say to you, this generation will not pass away until all these things take place.…Matthew 24 God is Love! Jesus saves! Quote Lift Jesus up!!
Administrators debbym Posted August 10, 2015 Administrators Posted August 10, 2015 I am not sure that God's acts of violence were against His enemies as much as He was on the side of His people to save them. It is like there is a certain amount of injustice that God tolerates, maybe to give men a chance to make the decision themselves. But all apocalypses do eventually come to an end if left to themselves. Evil makes for distrust even among allies. Sooner or later wicked people are either murdered or commit suicide. God did bring an end to evil peoples when their cup of iniquity was full, to preserve and protect the rest of the world. for example the flood. It was not self interested revenge or hatred of people. God is merciful and gracious even when he brings an end to evil. God is not willing that anyone should perish, and he pleads with everyone, with all flesh. And one day all evil will be brought to an end forever. Each ending of an evil group or nation was a symbol of the complete end of evil in the universe. to bring about peace throughout the entire universe. DreamWeaver and phkrause 2 Quote deb Love awakens love. Let God be true and every man a liar.
LifeHiscost Posted August 10, 2015 Posted August 10, 2015 God did bring an end to evil peoples when their cup of iniquity was full, to preserve and protect the rest of the world. for example the flood. It was not self interested revenge or hatred of people. God is merciful and gracious even when he brings an end to evil. God is not willing that anyone should perish, and he pleads with everyone, with all flesh. And one day all evil will be brought to an end forever. Each ending of an evil group or nation was a symbol of the complete end of evil in the universe. to bring about peace throughout the entire universe. God did bring an end to evil peoples when their cup of iniquity was full, to preserve and protect the rest of the world. for example the flood. It was not self interested revenge or hatred of people. God is merciful and gracious even when he brings an end to evil. God is not willing that anyone should perish, and he pleads with everyone, with all flesh. And one day all evil will be brought to an end forever. Each ending of an evil group or nation was a symbol of the complete end of evil in the universe. to bring about peace throughout the entire universe. God is Love Jesus saves! Quote Lift Jesus up!!
Outta Here Posted August 10, 2015 Posted August 10, 2015 It wouldn't be right to call anyone Christian then, because we all fall short of the glory of God in one way or another. Gail 1 Quote
pnattmbtc Posted August 10, 2015 Posted August 10, 2015 (edited) I don't think God is violent. I think Jesus Christ revealed that God is not violent, and is actually not just non-violent, but anti-violent. God has allowed violence to occur, as He allowed divorce to occur, because of the hardness of men's hearts, but Jesus Christ reveals God's character; God is not violent. To some extent, "God's people" are violent because they view God as being violent. Edited August 10, 2015 by pnattmbtc Stewart (SDA) 1 Quote Christ exalted the character of God, attributing to him the praise, and giving to him the credit, of the whole purpose of his own mission on earth,--to set men right through the revelation of God.
Administrators Gail Posted August 10, 2015 Author Administrators Posted August 10, 2015 Is it right to call people who do such things "Christian" or God's People?" Is it fair to call an "apostate" (for lack of better word) "one of God's children?" When the Catholic, or any other church says they were "Christians" when they committed such atrocities, I have a problem with that, and with media also referring to such people as "Christians," as if to blame Christians for all the evil in the world, and like, oh, an atheist, or some other religion would never do that. We would be much better off as a church, as individuals, as a society, if we learned to call something what it is. And, as we know, this is not "politically" correct. I agree with Aubrey. Who wants to start drawing lines? Where would you put them? When God wanted to put an end to His children in the wilderness, Moses intervened, saying that if that happened the nations would see God as Someone who brought His people out of bondage just to kill them in the wilderness. Moses offered to have his own name blotted out of the book of life rather than have the Hebrews annihilated. As wicked as they were corporately, as devoid of faith and rebellious, Moses still identified with them as his people. Christ died to save us while we were yet sinners. We would be goners if He didn't. So- the question maybe now should be, "What do we do with them?" And, "How do we change the negative perception due to history's record?" Quote Isaiah 32:17 And the work of righteousness shall be peace; and the effect of righteousness quietness and assurance for ever.
pnattmbtc Posted August 10, 2015 Posted August 10, 2015 I agree with Aubrey. Who wants to start drawing lines? Where would you put them? When God wanted to put an end to His children in the wilderness, Moses intervened, saying that if that happened the nations would see God as Someone who brought His people out of bondage just to kill them in the wilderness. Moses offered to have his own name blotted out of the book of life rather than have the Hebrews annihilated. As wicked as they were corporately, as devoid of faith and rebellious, Moses still identified with them as his people. Christ died to save us while we were yet sinners. We would be goners if He didn't. So- the question maybe now should be, "What do we do with them?" And, "How do we change the negative perception due to history's record?" Who is "them"? That is, "What do we do with them?" is referring to whom? Quote Christ exalted the character of God, attributing to him the praise, and giving to him the credit, of the whole purpose of his own mission on earth,--to set men right through the revelation of God.
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