Romans 5:18 and the BRI

[Robert]

On 2/9/2016 at 3:06 PM, Kdogae86 said:

Are you suggesting that Universalism is true? 

I missed this question, I think?

Anyway, the answer is yes and no....

Christ has universally saved all men (fallen mankind) in Himself.  His finished work is not provisional, rather it is an historic fact.

Now, does that mean that all men will be in heaven?  No!  

Why not?  Some, in fact maybe many, will reject what is already true of humanity "in Christ". To reject the gospel is to reject life.  It's suicide. 

In the judgment not one lost sinner will be able to point the finger at God and blame Him for his or her predicament.  Christ has done it all.  His work is finished.  But, that complete work can be and will be rejected by many.  Those who reject Christ's finished work remain under the jurisdiction of the law.  To remain under law means death, the 2nd death or goodbye to life forever. 

[Robert]

Let me quote Pastor Sequeira again because he makes a very good point"

Adventists traditionally belong to the Wesleyan Arminian school of theology.....Arminians believe that Christ only “potentially” or “provisionally” saved all of mankind on the cross.  For this provisional salvation to become a reality, one must repent and believe in Jesus Christ.  Only then will God place that person into Christ and the provision will become a reality.  Thus, traditionally, we Adventists have limited the in Christ motif only to believers.

The main argument that has often been used to prove that the in Christ motif applies only to believers is Romans 16:7.  In this chapter of greetings Paul makes this statement:  “Greet Andronicus and Junias, my relatives who have been in prison on with me....  They were in Christ before I was” (NIV, emphasis mine).  Clearly, what Paul is implying is that these two men accepted the truth as it is in Christ and were converted before Paul himself.  To build a whole theology on this one text while ignoring all the other in Christtexts Paul uses (some 64 times) is very poor exegesis, to say the least.

Further, this conclusion is a subtle form of legalism, salvation by works, since repentance and faith contribute towards ones salvation.  Whereas, according to Paul, it is the goodness of God (the reality phase or objective facts of the gospel) that leads one to faith and repentance (Romans 2:4).  Hence, faith is not allowing God or giving Him permission to put us into Christ but accepting with grateful hearts what God has already accomplished for mankind in Christ (1 Corinthians 1:30-31; 2 Corinthians 5:18-20; Ephesians 1:3-4).

It is here where I disagree with the teachings of the Biblical Research Institute (BRI) of the GC, as well as some of the Independent Ministries.  I believe that the true everlasting gospel, which God raised the Advent Movement to proclaim to the world in its global mission, is neither the limited atonement of Calvinism nor the provisional salvation of Arminianism.  Rather, it is the incredible good news that on the cross the entire human race was actually or objectively redeemed, justified, and reconciled to God by the death of His Son (John 3:17; 17:4; 19:30; Romans 5:5-10,18; Ephesians 2:5, 6, 8, 9; 2 Corinthians 5:19).

[Robert]

22 minutes ago, Kdogae86 said:

Further, this conclusion is a subtle form of legalism, salvation by works,since repentance and faith contribute towards ones salvation.

Where were you when Christ assumed our corporate humanity?  Where were you when the Divinity of Christ was untied to our corporate fallen humanity?  You the individual did not exist and therefore you can add nothing to what Christ has already done.  Salvation therefore does not equal what Christ did plus your belief and repentance. If it does add then it is a subtle form of works.

[Robert]

On 2/14/2016 at 4:09 PM, Kdogae86 said:

The sinner could only bring the animal and themselves slaughter the animal. Beyond that the sinner had no participation in the atonement at all. If a sinner did not participate in the daily or the yearly, they were removed from the camp.

The sacrificial system was not an atonement of any kind.  It was symbolic.

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Something to consider...Hebrews 10 ²⁶ For if we go on sinning willfully after receiving the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins....

How do you view the above?  Do you believe Paul is speaking of transgression against the law?

[8thdaypriest]

Robert has been teaching his version of the Gospel for 15 years on this forum - that somehow all humanity (past/present/future) was metaphysically merged into the body of Christ when He died, and therefore every person DIED for their own sins in this way.  According to Robert, I am cursed, and I am lost BECAUSE I do not believe or teach his version of the Gospel. 

I admire his dogged stick-to-it-tiveness, but honestly Robert - if we were all "saved" and we can only become unsaved by rejecting the Gospel that you present, then WHY present it?  Aren't you causing us to be lost - to reject your "true Gospel".   I was ignorant of it, until I read your posts and Samie's. 

I posted a study on my website titled "DOMINION".  It explains my understanding of the atonement - what Christ did and why He did it. 

http://www.prophecyviewpoint.com/htdocs/11-DOMINION.pdf

Rachel Cory, prophecyviewpoint.com

[Robert]

On 2/17/2016 at 10:41 AM, 8thdaypriest said:

According to Robert, I am cursed, and I am lost BECAUSE I do not believe or teach his version of the Gospel. 

No, not according Robert - according to Paul.  

However, God accepts us in our ignorance.  he accepts us where we are at. You must understand the gospel before you accept it.  Otherwise God is unfair.

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if we were all "saved" and we can only become unsaved by rejecting the Gospel that you present, then WHY present it? 

Because God doesn't want you to remain ignorant. The gospel is good news to sinners, but bad news to the self-righteous.