Members rudywoofs (Pam) Posted October 22, 2006 Author Members Posted October 22, 2006 Please don't refer me back to EGW. She's a nice lady and all, but I had her writings crammed down my throat as a kid. She wasn't there at creation or at the falling of mankind. I am trying VERY HARD to give Mrs White the respect I think she deserves for her writings. But Please....point me to the Bible first.... please. please. please. Quote Pam Meddle Not In the Affairs of Dragons; for You Are Crunchy and Taste Good with Ketchup. If we all sang the same note in the choir, there'd never be any harmony. Funny, isn't it, how we accept Grace for ourselves and demand justice for others?
Moderators Nan Posted October 22, 2006 Moderators Posted October 22, 2006 Pam the idea that this earth is on show to the universe is Biblical. One text is 1 Cor 4:9, Paul is speaking of the apostles here - 'we have been made a spectacle to the whole universe, to angels as well as to men'. Elsewhere the sons of God are described as shouting for joy at the creation of the earth. To our human perspective it does seem unfair - we are landed here with problems not of our making, we just have to wear the consequences of what our first parents did. And I am sure the evil one does his utmost to encourage such feelings. Maybe we have to come to know Jesus and what the plan of salvation costs Him and His Father, to understand things better. But I agree this is not an easy question to answer. Ultimately we believe the rewards for those who choose to follow Him will far outweigh all the troubles here. "We shall be like Him, for we shall see Him as He is" - 1 John 3:2 - I believe that means our characters will approach the likeness of His, not that we will become 'as Gods'. The words of Isaiah in the 40's chapters of his book do away with that possibility, as he describes the majesty, the power and the love of God. This is an inadequate answer, but expresses some of the ways I have personally dealt with this issue. I love to read those chapters in Isaiah, starting with ch 40. Quote
Norman Byers, N.D. Posted October 22, 2006 Posted October 22, 2006 Hi Pam, I just saw this thread. I have been thinking about this since I read it. I have thought about it before and just thought that, "What God meant was that man now knew the results of of good and evil as God does." I will add more to this. We are gods (God's children) and Adam & Eve were gods before they sinned. Satan was offering them a title that they already had. He did this with Jesus in another way as well. If you ar the son of God.... Joh 10:34 Jesus answered them, Is it not written in your law, I said, Ye are gods 35 If he called them gods, unto whom the word of God came, and the Scripture cannot be broken; Also see Ps 82 Adam was the son of God so if you are a son of a/the God then you are a god. That's why the Jews thought Jesus was blaspheming. Joh 10:36 Say ye of him, whom the Father hath sanctified, and sent into the world, Thou blasphemest; because I said, I am the Son of God? So what good & evil did they come to know that God knew? Well before they sinned they did not know the diffemce between good and evil but after they sinned they did. God does not want us to know this because it is not good for us and we cannot handle it. Have you ever done something and it comes back to haunt you in the future? You wish that you had never done it, because it is a constant temptation. Paul knew this too and counsels us, Phi 4:8 Finally, brethren, whatsoever things are true, whatsoever things are honest, whatsoever things are just, whatsoever things are pure, whatsoever things are lovely, whatsoever things are of good report; if there be any virtue, and if there be any praise, think on these things. God didn't want them to eat of the tree of life because they would never die and they would always have these thoughts or as we now call it, "the carnal mind" that Adam inherited when he sinned, and we are born with. God on the other hand is capable of handling this knowledge, not that He has sinned, but Jesus is one with us: And whether one member suffer, all the members suffer with it; or one member be honored, all the members rejoice with it. Now ye are the body of Christ, and members in particular. 1Co 12:26, 27 I have just thought this through so I maybe off but let me know what y'all think Norman Quote The unconditional pardon of sin never has been, and never will be. PP 522
Morning Glory Posted October 22, 2006 Posted October 22, 2006 Hi Norman, I just read this, and it really makes a lot of sense to me. Thank you for your explanation of man being god....I had never thought of that before. Of course it makes sense that since Adam was the son of God as Genesis clearly states, that he is god, also. Ummmmm that is deep. I will have to contemplate that concept. Morning Glory Quote Kindness is the oil that takes the friction out of life.
Moderators John317 Posted October 26, 2006 Moderators Posted October 26, 2006 Then why would we need the Tree of life in the new earth when we have immortality after the resurrection? It is evident, based on what both the Bible and the Spirit of Prophecy say about this, that the tree of life gives immortal vigor and strength and is for the healing of the nations. Having immortality will not be everything. That merely keeps us from being subject to death. There will also be the necessity of growing and becoming stronger, not only physically but spiritually and mentally, after a life-time of mental and emotional scarring on this earth. The fruit from the tree of life has real healing properties and will impart health to those who partake of it. Quote John 3:16-17 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life. [17] For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but in order that the world might be saved through him.
Moderators John317 Posted October 26, 2006 Moderators Posted October 26, 2006 Please don't refer me back to EGW. She's a nice lady and all, but I had her writings crammed down my throat as a kid. She wasn't there at creation or at the falling of mankind. I am trying VERY HARD to give Mrs White the respect I think she deserves for her writings. But Please....point me to the Bible first.... please. please. please. If I'd known how you feel about Ellen White, I never would have referred you to God's prophet. But since I am a Seventh-day Adventist and this is ClubAdventist, I thought it perfectly appropriate to refer to a source that I believe contains the truth about the subject under discussion. It's too bad people evidently misused her writings and made you dislike her. Quote John 3:16-17 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life. [17] For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but in order that the world might be saved through him.
Members rudywoofs (Pam) Posted October 26, 2006 Author Members Posted October 26, 2006 I WROTE that I was TRYING to give Mrs. White the respect I thought she deserved. I am having a difficult time with a number of church-related issues at the moment. I am sorry that I am not a EGW conformist and that I am obviously NOT a proper Adventist to be on this forum. Quote Pam Meddle Not In the Affairs of Dragons; for You Are Crunchy and Taste Good with Ketchup. If we all sang the same note in the choir, there'd never be any harmony. Funny, isn't it, how we accept Grace for ourselves and demand justice for others?
Administrators Gail Posted October 26, 2006 Administrators Posted October 26, 2006 I WROTE that I was TRYING to give Mrs. White the respect I thought she deserved. I am having a difficult time with a number of church-related issues at the moment. I am sorry that I am not a EGW conformist and that I am obviously NOT a proper Adventist to be on this forum. Don't fear, there are LOTS of folks on here who are not proper Adventists! I'm not quite sure what one is, even Quote Isaiah 32:17 And the work of righteousness shall be peace; and the effect of righteousness quietness and assurance for ever.
Members rudywoofs (Pam) Posted October 26, 2006 Author Members Posted October 26, 2006 thanks Gail.. Quote Pam Meddle Not In the Affairs of Dragons; for You Are Crunchy and Taste Good with Ketchup. If we all sang the same note in the choir, there'd never be any harmony. Funny, isn't it, how we accept Grace for ourselves and demand justice for others?
Moderators John317 Posted October 26, 2006 Moderators Posted October 26, 2006 I WROTE that I was TRYING to give Mrs. White the respect I thought she deserved. I am having a difficult time with a number of church-related issues at the moment. I am sorry that I am not a EGW conformist and that I am obviously NOT a proper Adventist to be on this forum. If you will read what I wrote, you will see that I didn't say anything about anyone's being or not being a "proper Adventist". But to expect someone never to mention Ellen White in the ClubAdventist is like being on a Mormon site and expecting people to keep mum about the Book of Mormon or Joseph Smith. If you don't want to read what she wrote, that is your decision, but you really have no reason to get upset because someone mentions her or refers to what she wrote on a particular topic. It is OK to have a "difficult time" with any number of church-related issues, but one should be willing to talk about them and to allow others, even those who believe in Ellen White, the right to say what they believe. I am not asking you to change what you say or believe, only to allow others the same freedom to express themselves that you enjoy. Quote John 3:16-17 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life. [17] For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but in order that the world might be saved through him.
Moderators John317 Posted October 26, 2006 Moderators Posted October 26, 2006 Originally Posted By: rudywoofs I WROTE that I was TRYING to give Mrs. White the respect I thought she deserved. I am having a difficult time with a number of church-related issues at the moment. I am sorry that I am not a EGW conformist and that I am obviously NOT a proper Adventist to be on this forum. Don't fear, there are LOTS of folks on here who are not proper Adventists! I'm not quite sure what one is, even I never mentioned anything about a "proper Adventist." Quote John 3:16-17 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life. [17] For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but in order that the world might be saved through him.
Parade Orange Posted October 27, 2006 Posted October 27, 2006 Think about this presentation the wages of sin is death. That is GOD's LAW of the universe. Adam and Eve sinned and the angel of death was going to rush to take their lives but JESUS stopped him or her cause of what was decided eons ago in the counsel of GODS just a thought Quote All progress in the Spiritual Life is knowing and Loving GOD"there is non upon earth that I desire besides YOU" PS 73:25That perspective changes EVERYTHING-suffering and adversity are the means that makes us hungry for GOD. Disapointments will wean us away wordly occupations. Even sin(when repented of) becomes a mechanism to push us closer to HIM as we experience His Love and Forgiveness.
Moderators John317 Posted October 29, 2006 Moderators Posted October 29, 2006 Then why would we need the Tree of life in the new earth when we have immortality after the resurrection? Ellen White has a lot of interesting things to say about the Tree of Life. I was reading some of her statements in the New Study Bible today at church. The pastor mentioned that we can touch one of the leaves from the Tree of Life right now, and then he held up the Bible. This agrees entirely with what Ellen White says. If you have the New Study Bible, or Vol. 7-A of the SDA Bible Commentary, look up the comments on Revelation 22 and read what she says about the verse 2. She says such things as that both the Bible and Christ are the Tree of Life to us. By the way, she is not saying that the Tree of Life is not also literal. She speaks many times of it as a literal tree containing "supernatural virtue" and being "for the sustaining of life and immortality". See Early Writings 17, 19, 20, and 289. Quote John 3:16-17 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life. [17] For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but in order that the world might be saved through him.
Look Alive! Posted October 29, 2006 Posted October 29, 2006 I WROTE that I was TRYING to give Mrs. White the respect I thought she deserved. I am having a difficult time with a number of church-related issues at the moment. I am sorry that I am not a EGW conformist and that I am obviously NOT a proper Adventist to be on this forum. What does "asthanos" mean? It's in your picture of the bat there. Don't worry, everyone is permitted a honeymoon period to get over their issues before being deemed "not proper" for the forum. Just be durned sure you either get rid of ALL issues before the honeymoon period expires or learn to keep mum about them. (*teasing*) Quote "Do ye look on things after the outward appearance? if any man trust to himself that he is Christ's, let him of himself think this again, that, as he is Christ's, even so are we Christ's." -- 2 Corinthians 10:7
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