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Here are the two stained glass windows in the church where I am a member - For a description - http://www.spencervillesda.org/article/7/about-us

Do you think heaven will be a place where one agrees with everyone else on everything? This question comes to mind as I ponder who might be there... and I think to myself, "wow, if so-and-so is there, I *really* don't want to be there if I have to associate with him"..... And it's not particularly a matter of "forgiving" someone for anything; it's more a matter of a person's particular personality style and manner of communicating that is totally irritating to the extent that I'd rather not be in heaven just to avoid those particular people. It *has* been said that people in heaven will retain their personalities.. So....do you think we can pick and choose with whom we wish to associate in heaven, or will we all needfully associate with each other, with people continuing in their modus operandi and forever being a burr under my saddle on the heavenly ranch?

**off topic** this is how JoeMo's post appeared in the "preview" on my screen: I had to click to see who "Yahweh Bummer" was...

Will only the righteous be resurrected at the next "return" of Christ our LORD? When will the LORD judge "the nations" ?? I certainly believe that a judgment (execution of judgment) WILL take place on the day that Christ returns in glory. Daniel 12:1-3 suggests to me that BOTH redeemed and condemned will be resurrected on THAT DAY, but the verse does NOT say that "all" who "sleep in the dust" will be resurrected on that day. Daniel 12:1-3 “There will be a time of distress such as has not happened from the beginning of nations until then. But at that time your people – everyone whose name is found written in the book--will be delivered. Multitudes who sleep in the dust of the earth will awake: some to everlasting life, others to shame and everlasting contempt.” NIV Acts 24:15 “I have hope in God, which they themselves also accept, that there will be a resurrection of the dead, both of the just and the unjust.” NOTE: “a resurrection” - singular - involving BOTH the just and the unjust. John 5:28-29 “Do not marvel at this; for the hour is coming in which all who are in the graves will hear His voice and come forth – those who have done good, to the resurrection of life, and those who have done evil, to the resurrection of condemnation.” This verse might seem to speak of two resurrection events - one to life, and the other to condemnation - but Daniel 12:2-3 tells us that this is ONE resurrection event - at “the hour” - when TWO types of people are raised - those who have remained faithful to covenant, and those who refused or have forsaken covenant (Hebrews Chapter 6). But this leaves room for those individuals for whom probation continues BECAUSE their sins were committed in ignorance. The death of Christ covered all sins of ignorance. They were not counted against the individual. I do not believe they are written into the records of heaven. "He who is unjust, let him be unjust still; he who is filthy, let him be filthy still; he who is righteous, let him be righteous still; he who is holy, let him be holy still." (Rev 22:11 NKJ) The Revelation cry is addressed to the living - yes - and I believe is also describing a fixed judgment based upon the record of "works" of those who KNEW of God and that His will is supreme, but that record does not list those sins committed in ignorance. I believe probation will continue for the ignorant or immature. The vision of Ezekiel's Temple is all about that probation for "the nations". So is Zechariah 14, where "the nations" are invited to celebrate the Feast of Tabernacles with Israel. That probation will continue for "the rest of the dead" who will be raised AFTER the 1000 years of the 7th millennium. Respectfully Rachel Cory Prophecy Viewpoint

My belief is that Christ's death has bought a probation for mankind. Yes - His death has bought salvation and eternal life for those who believe, but it has also bought probationary time, during which every human being will be given the opportunity to choose. He/she will be reached with enough information upon which to base belief and surrender to God our Father - thru Christ. The ONLY way in which to accomplish a universal gospel teaching of EVERY man, woman and child is RESURRECTION of those who died in ignorance or immaturity. Christ's death has bought this probationary time.

>>>And please, help me understand this - other minorities - Asians of different nationalities, Africans, Blacks from the Caribbean, seem to move on and become fully integrated into American society, but why is it that there is such a significant segment of the American black population that feel like they are out of the loop of the American dream?<<< Could it be that those other minorities do not have a history of slavery in this country? Are you sure the other minorities are fully integrated into American Society? Is there data to back up that assumption?

Maybe someone here has seen the recent video of a white cop stopping a car with two black men inside. While he is dealing with the driver, the man in the passenger seat jumps out and shoots the cop over the roof of the car. If I were a cop, I would tend to be a little trigger happy, too, if I wanted to go home to my family that night after trying to make the city a little safer place. If I were a cop, I would be extremely upset, that after putting my life on the line every day to catch criminals and keep people safe from lawbreakers, I would be portrayed as racist and brutal. I might just quit my dangerous, stinking, thankless job and let the gangs, pimps, drug dealers, carjackers, robbers, thieves, thugs and murderers overrun the city. The ultimate solution, here on Earth, at least, would be to persuade everyone to respect and obey the laws of the land. Then no one would need to be arrested or shot because there are no cops and no crime. Until that day, though, blacks are by far more likely to be killed by another black than a white policeman. Women getting pregnant with no male breadwinner either abort them or lose them to lawless gangs. There's no daddy to tell the boys that if a cop stops you, be respectful, be honest, and don't make any sudden or suspicious moves, because that cop wants to stay alive, too. Rather than portray his clientele as innocent victims of brutality, the Rev. Al Sharpton should be encouraging them to respect the law, other people, their property, and their lives, don't wave guns around, and above all, never, ever, attack a cop or resist arrest.

1, You mentioned the Millerite movement and the early SDA founders. I would be interested to know what forms of Ecumenicism have ever been held between the SDA and the Assemblies of God / Church of the Four Square Gospel in relation to their teachings and beliefs on Glossalia and Spiritual Gifts in general? I think the SDA and the AOG C4SG have something to share with one another in relation to the operation of the gift of prophecy, healing, toungues, along with how each group views the relationship between the book of Daniel and the Revelation. Could it be that SDA's might benefit from addressing the fact that by their own admission and opposition of a creed that there is a role for the use of the modern gift of prophecy as practiced by the AOG-CFSG post Ellen White? 2, Have we ever sat down with the Apostolic Church and discussed the role of Apostles in the modern church as practiced in Apostolic church circles. Do we need to learn anything about the laying on of hands in dedication of our church leaders? Is it scriptural to remove those offices and to replace them with President, Vice President, Board Member, Secretary and so forth? 3, Could we learn anything from the Pentecostal Church of God re their support for the modern nation of Israel, the Jewish people and the city of Jerusalem? I know our theology around the religion of Judaism is generally regarded to be replacement theology, yet is there anything for us to learn about the role of the geographical area in prophecy post the ressurection of Christ?

Thank goodness this is just a message board

Not sure how to answer that question lazarus. I was born the color I am, that's all I know. And being born Jewish, well that's just life, we can't change who we are, how we're born, color of our skin, culture, etc. I guess that doesn't really answer the question. All I can say, I just have to live with it!!

Unity based on what? Would the RCC abandon the infallibility and primacy of the pope? Would the RCC accept liberty of conscience? The worship of Mary and the saints? Would the other Protestants abandon Sunday for the 7th-day Sabbath? Would the Pentecostals abandon their gibberish glossolalia? Would they all accept the non-immortality of the soul? Accept that the wicked do not burn ad infinitum? Amos asked - Can two walk together except they be agreed?

We have ALREADY done that! After the Great Disappointment of 1844, our pioneers examined the doctrines popularly taught among Christians in their day. They were bitterly stung and disappointed because of the popular notion that the earth was the sanctuary that Jesus was coming to cleanse. That prompted them to compare every doctrine with Scripture. From the Baptists, they accepted baptism by immersion. From the Lutherans, justification by faith. From the Methodists, sanctified living and, I believe, also church structure. The Sabbath from the 7th-day Baptists, etc. etc. In their search for truth, they discovered OTHER truths such as the state of the dead, the heavenly sanctuary, and healthful living. The problem with the other Christian churches is that when their pioneers died, they became frozen theologically. They refused to go farther. Not only that, some have abandoned truths they used to believe and are now cuddling up to Mama. And of course, the RCC is completely set in concrete. That is what prompted the Reformation. They set up a creed that could not be changed. That is quite a contrast to the SDAC. The Adventist Church is not also known as a Movement for nothing. We may have a set of fundamental beliefs, but they are not set in stone. We are willing to modify them as more light is revealed. This was also true among the other Protestant in their formative years, but that spirit died with their founders. So, can you give us an example of a Biblical truth taught by some other denomination that we aught to adopt?

Ecumenism is more of a process than a goal. Ecumenism to me is the principle or process of promoting and seeking unity among Christian denominations. I say "Christian" because - for example - Muslims don't believe Jesus is the Son of God or a Savior. That minimizes the common ground on which to cooperate. Taking it to Adventism, why do we need a denominational difference between SDAs and "Reformed" SDAs? Does one believe that the other lacks sufficient "truth" for salvation? Sojourner mentioned the responsibility of other denominations to reach out to SDAs. I agree. Ecumenism is a 2-way street. dgrimm says "our job as true followers of GOD is to teach people these truths so they can make a better choice for salvation". Put the shoe on the other foot. Are there not truths we can also learn from other religions so we can make a better choice for salvation? Like I said above - ecumenism is a 2-way street. I was speaking to a brother today about this at church. He said something I found to be profound. "Salvation is easy - believe in the Lord Jesus Christ and you shall be saved. Denominational (club) membership is a step up. There are rules specific to the club which you must follow to remain a member in good standing. You want to be a leader in your club - here are some more rules to add to your list." That made some sense to me. A relationship with Christ is one thing; a relationship with a church is another. While one enhances the other, one doesn't depend on the other. One can be a staunch member of a denomination without having a relationship with Christ; and vice-versa.

Maybe we'll all be essentially the one being in the afterlife. Maybe we all are now and this life is for discovering that, so that it'll be easier for me to love everyone. Who knows?

I would suggest that Psychotherapy is free and readily available in the new earth. (I think Psychologists will be there)!

Some people are gifted persuaders and love to discuss the finer points of various topics, hoping he can bring others around to his point of view. Will persuaders still be persuading in heaven?

I don't care, I just want Koala's in my yard! :D

i believe we will have endless possibilities in all forms of technology, artistery, and it will be mind expanding possibilities. God will be in is true place in every heart, their will Pure Love, peace, and joy .... and endless praise and glory to God. and everything we do will glorify God, our creator and redeemer. we will do whatever we want, if we want to build we will, if we want to settle in gardens we will.