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Full article... http://www.churchleaders.com/pastors/pastor-articles/252237-9-traits-church-bullies.html Summary 1. They do not recognize themselves as bullies. To the contrary, they see themselves as necessary heroes sent to save the church from her own self. 2. They have personal and self-serving agendas. They have determined what “their” church should look like. Any person or ministry or program that is contrary to their perceived ideal church must be eliminated. 3. They seek to form power alliances with weak members in the church. They will pester and convince groups, committees and persons to be their allies in their cause. Weaker church staff members and church members will succumb to their forceful personalities. 4. They tend to have intense and emotional personalities. These bullies use the intensity of their personalities to get their way. 5. They are famous for saying “people are saying.” They love to gather tidbits of information and shape it to their own agendas. 6. They find their greatest opportunities in low-expectation churches. Many of the church members have an entitlement view of church membership. They seek to get their own needs and preferences fulfilled. They, therefore, won’t trouble themselves to confront and deal with church bullies. That leads to the next issue, which is a consequence of this point 7. They are allowed to bully because church members will not stand up to them. I have spoken with pastors and church staff who have been attacked by church bullies. While the bully brings them great pain, they have even greater hurt because most of the church members stood silent and let it happen. 8. They create chaos and wreak havoc. A church bully always has his next mission. While he or she may take a brief break from one bullying mission to the next, they are not content unless they are exerting the full force of their manipulative behavior. 9. They often move to other churches after they have done their damage.Whether they are forced out or simply get bored, they will move to other churches with the same bullying mission. Some bullies have wreaked havoc in three or more churches.

Even though there was a blizzard raging outside, Moishe trudged his way to the kosher bakery, where he asked the owner for six rolls. “Your wife must like rolls,” the owner said. “How do you know these are for my wife?” Moishe asked. “Who else would send you out in weather like this?”

Marv Epstein tells his doctor that he’s incapable of doing all the things around the house that he used to do when he was younger. When the examination is over, Marv says, “Okay, Doctor. In plain English – what’s wrong with me?” “Well, in plain English,” says the doctor, “you’re just lazy.” Marv nods. “OK, now give me the medical term so I can tell my wife.”

I know that it has been frequently said that that the GC Executive Committee never did anything to to follow up on the resolution that had been referred to them in 1881. That has mostly been a conclusion reached by some who are opposed to WO. I think that perhaps they were looking only for some follow up documentation of what they did. I have concluded that there were in fact actions consistent with that 1881 resolution. The Michigan Conference acted positively on it and so did the General Conference. The 1881 GC Session minutes reflects that the president of the Michigan Conference was present and participated in the discussion of the resolution. In 1883, that same man signed a credential issued by the Michigan Conference to Ellen G. White identifying her as an ordained minister. In subsequent years for the rest of her life, the General Conference itself issued the same credential to her. The credentials were signed by two officers of the General Conference. Just a few short years after the 1881 resolution, two of the officers of the GC who were a part of the GC Executive Committee to which the resolution had been referred were in fact the ones who signed her credential issued by the General Conference. And several of those on the GC Executive Committee were present for the 1881 discussion of the resolution. I would submit that there is indeed evidence that something did indeed happen with that resolution. It appears that with no opposition or dissension they simply acted consistent with the resolution by officially recognizing EGW as an ordained minister.

I find too much of the arguments of both sides to be quite speculative and trying to build up philosophies that they can hang their view on. I find Fleming's arguments to be "Here is what the Bible says, this is the context where it said it" and you see a clear "Thus saith the Lord." and all the texts used to try to form philosophies based on Calvinism and which do not fit what I understand Mrs. White's view to be does not measure up to the "Thus Saith the Lord". I use consistent methods into why I believe that Mrs. White is a prophet, why I believe in 1844 and the Investigative Judgment, and these same hermeneutics lead me to the conclusion that the Bible teaches the ordination of women. I see the arguments for headship as Satan's trogon horse to loosen the foundation and prepare Conservatives when the issues of Fundamentalism come to focus to make of no effect the spirit of prophecy. I cannot accept the arguments for headship without having my reasons for being a Seventh-day Adventist tumble down and I'd have to become a Baptist or something else. And what I mean by "ignorance" is not in being ignorant. It is in I see a whole bunch of arguments as to why I should not support women's ordination. These do not fit with my understanding of the Bible, Mrs. White or the investigative judgment. If I was say a member of say the Unitarian Universalists or another very liberal group these arguments might make sense. Those who present those arguments may be convincing to those who are seeing these liberal reasons for ordaining women. However I do not see it answering the "Thus Saith the Lord" that I read. I do not find it in harmony with my understanding of Mrs. White and my view on the ordination of women are from the same hermeneutics that convince me that we are indeed living in the time of the investigative judgment. That this is a lost Bible truth that as our forefathers rediscovered the Sabbath, so we have rediscovered the lost Bible truth about women's ordination. As to your 4 points 1. I appreciate your honesty. However you need to be aware that when it comes to say my views you are barking up the wrong tree. You can try to tell that the Seventh-day Adventist church should stop encouraging vegetarianism because Hindus believe that cows are gods and in eating cows we affirm that they are not a god. You may be an expert in the Hindu faith but that is not why I have vegetarianism as a goal. 2. If I was living in the ancient world and happen to pass through Israel or Judah, what would those tassels mean to me? What was their cultural significance to say someone from Africia, or Egypt or Babylon, or Europe or Asia etc. They would routinely run into these tassels However in Israel/Judah everyone was wearing them, not just a few. But I believe I said that the tassels as such cannot be argued for more than a reminder to Israel that they were a kingdom of priests and the priesthood of all believers. It was Jesus Ben Sirach who wanted women to remove them because he wanted the Jews to STOP having women priests and Rabbis. 3. Who said anything about it being a "secret" sign? It is no more secret than Jesus riding into Jerusalem on a donkey. It is a very blatant stand. The Rabbis were arguing over whether or not women should be ordained. Jesus made a open and blatant stand as to which side of the argument he was on. 4. First of all may I remind you that it was not only the priestesses who were temple harlots in Paganism, but the priests as well. Using that as an argument opposing women's ordination sounds like "God was afraid of female harlots, but did not mind confusion over homosexuality." why didn't God simply have no priesthood since priests were prostitutes in paganism? Now again I will say that I have not heard any argument except for linguistic arguments in the Psalms for women priests. Only that some scholars I strongly respect have commented that there were both male and female priests. What I do know is that Rabbi Jesus Ben Sirach wanted the Jews to stop having women Priests and Rabbis. And YES there were women Rabbis. Ancient lists of Rabbis have been discovered and there are women's names on them. We know how Rabbis were ordained. We know that the liberal Rabbis were opposed to women's ordination while the conservative Rabbis supported women's ordination. And we know how Jesus responded to this argument.

Now that is interesting!

A priest, a Pentecostal preacher and a rabbi all served as chaplains to the students of Northern Michigan University in Marquette. They would get together two or three times a week for coffee and to talk shop. One day, someone made the comment that preaching to people isn't really that hard. A real challenge would be to preach to a bear. One thing led to another, and they decided to do a seven-day experiment. They would all go out into the woods, find a bear and preach to it. Seven days later, they're all together to discuss the experience. Father O'Flannery, who has his arm in a sling, is on crutches, and has various bandages, goes first. "Wellll," he says, in a fine Irish brouge, "Ey wint oot into th' wooods to fynd me a bearr. Oond when Ey fund him Ey began to rread to him from the Baltimorre Catechism. Welll, thet bearr wanted naught to do wi' me und begun to slap me aboot. So I quick grrabbed me holy water and, THE SAINTS BE PRAISED, he became as gentle as a lamb. The bishop is cooming oot next wik to give him fierst communion und confierrmation." Reverend Billy Bob spoke next. He was in a wheelchair, with an arm and both legs in casts, and an IV drip. In his best fire and brimstone oratory he proclaimed, "WELL, brothers, you KNOW that we don't sprinkle...WE DUNK! I went out and I FOUND me a bear. And then I began to read to him from God's HOOOOLY WORD! But that bear wanted nothing to do with me. I SAY NO! He wanted NOTHING to do with me. So I took HOOOLD of him and we began to rassle. We rassled down one hill, UP another and DOWN another until we come to a crick. So I quick DUNK him and BAPTIZE his hairy soul. An' jus like you sez, he wuz gentle as a lamb. We spent the rest of the week in fellowship, feasting on God's HOOOOLY word." They both look down at the rabbi, who was lying in a hospital bed. He was in a body cast and traction with IV's and monitors running in and out of him. The rabbi looks up and says, "Oy! You don't know what tough is until you try to circumcise one of those creatures."

Agreed. Capitalism, with the intrinsic greed of corporations and the resulting destruction of environment and social systems, is the antithesis of the Kingdom of YHVH. Unrestrained capitalism is responsible for putting the world's food supply at risk by the widespread use of gmo's, hybrid seeds that can't produce more seed, and seriously limiting the variety of food crops. Capitalism moves into towns and sucks their wells dry, forcing the poor suckers who live there to find some other source of water. Capitalism funds wars and terrorism, allowing select corporations to make obscene profits on weapons that maim and kill. I suspect the Kingdom of YHVH is based more on a system of self-supporting communes and a carefully controlled monetary system that can't be abused.

It's from the Review and Herald, October 12, 1876, p. 116. you can read the entire article, "The Two Bodies" on p. 116 by James White here: http://docs.adventistarchives.org/docs/RH/RH18761012-V48-15__B.pdf#view=fit

I had a customer this week who stated a study Bible commentary that Sheol was a real place, a holding place, for the dead for both the good and the wicked. He claimed that this place is where Jesus went before He ascended. I pointed him to Fudge's book and told him this is what one evangelical discovered when he studied the position. I also explained that the idea of consciousness in death is not found in the Old Testament but is an idea that although was widespread by the time of Jesus came into Hebrew society via Hellenistic influence between the testaments. I pray for this customer... He is a very likable guy and he does help me know what exactly is out there in regard to beliefs about the state of the dead.

Biggest problem with belief.net, they put a little paragraph of info and make you jump thru 10 pages of stuff to read everything. Everything in this link, as usual for belief.net, could have been put in to one short webpage. However, it was good info.