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I do not think that it is being wise as a serpent. I would be interested in a private message telling me who the retired evangelist is, if you do not want to make that public. If I understand you correctly, the evangelistic series will be held in the SDA Church building. If so, there is no way that local people will not discover the fact, at least once they enter the building, that it is a SDA building. If so, to cover up the sign looks bad.

I agree with Gregory. People will know, if they are planning to hold the meetings at the church!

very disappointing Jesus was upfront and honest.. I Stand with Jesus on this one.

that sounds SO deceitful....

My church is about to start evangelistic meetings in a little over two weeks. A seasoned, "retired" veteran evangelist will be the featured speaker. Drawing from his vast experiences, he has advised our board that the sign - "Seventh-day Adventist Church" be covered up and replaced with "Prophecy Seminar" or something similar sign. The reason is that he has seen time and time again that too many people would not set foot in an SDA Church if they knew right up front that it is being held by SDAs. The Board voted 10 to 4 to follow his suggestion, but the 4 against includes the head elder. The evangelist has many times polled those baptized in his meetings and has consistently backed up his recommendation. He says that if someone were to ask up front if this is being sponsored by the SDAC not to deny it. He just wants to wait until the 10th lecture (Re: Sabbath) before openly admitting/proclaiming that IT IS being sponsored by SDAs. Is this deception or just being "wise as serpent and harmless as doves"? What do you think?

"felt unable to provide needed care for an additional child," ... "had agreed to an adoption" ... "would not hand the baby over"... It sounds as if this woman was deeply troubled about having to give up her child for adoption. She didn't want to give her baby away, but she felt that she had no other choice and was deeply conflicted over this. She was most likely looking for an excuse to keep the child, or possibly a way to ease a troubled conscience. Either way, what a poor soul, I would have cried my eyes out if I had to deal with such a situation.

See: https://www.bing.com/images/search?q=Elephants+swimming&FORM=MD14ZN&OCID=MD14ZN&wt.mc_id=MD14ZN&PUBL=CAMP&CREA=MD14ZN&rnoreward=1

It's kind of a catch 22. My experience is that there are supporters and critics on both sides. Many "non-denominational evangelicals" are quite critical of the alleged legalism in Adventism (often attributed to Sabbath-keeping); and wouldn't step foot into an SDA church. Other more worldly (or less religious) folks feel deceived when they go to a neutral location; only to learn halfway into the meetings that the meetings are sponsored by SDA's trying to bolster their numbers and income. My experience also indicates that over half of new converts leave the SDA church within a year of baptism. To me, that is the saddest part about SDA evangelism. Most evangelistic meetings are high energy, educational, and entertaining. And then the evangelist team leaves; and people are stuck in a church much less exciting than the evangelist meetings; or are confronted by the "saints" who brow beat them with the "thou shalt nots" (about smoking drinking, eating meat, wearing jewelry or what they consider immodest clothing [like slacks on women, or how to "perfectly" keep Sabbath]. Much SDA literature (especially the older stuff) focuses on keeping people in fear of God's wrath rather than keeping them in love with Christ and confident in His forgiveness and mercy. Many SDA churches also discourage anything charismatic like raising or clapping of hands, dancing around during praise music, and prayer languages; which discourages many younger and "enthusiastic" worshippers. My personal opinion is that public evangelism should be conducted in order to bring people to a saving relationship with Christ; not necessarily a relationship with a denomination. Therefore, joining the SDA denomination should not be a "default" second step after baptism. Just my opinion.

Gerry: I have read your verses. Your question is an interesting one that could generate some discussion. I am not certain that I would want to get into all of the aspects of it. I will say that the answers are not, in my opinion, cut and dried.

In response to Aubrey; Baptism and joining the SDA denomination are two separate steps. I do not challenge what Aubrey stated. I will simply say that SDA rules require that joining the denomination be a separate step from baptism. However, standard SDA policy does not allow for baptism without joining the denomination as the second step. However, there are very rare situations in which such is permitted. An example may be in specific situations that involve prison ministry. But, even in these situations they are expected to be the exception. Whether or not they are actually the exception could be debated. However, in the past, some SDA evangelists have baptized without this second step. Generally the denomination has taken action that brings such evangelists into compliance with standard SDA policy. However, this question (issue) is probably not a high priority for denominational administrators. Therefore, there are SDA clergy who may baptize people who do not join the denomination. These probably do not make a general practice of doing so. For those who may wonder what my personal position and practice is: I can not say that I would always refuse to baptize a person who did not intend to join the SDA denomination. However, every time that I have been requested to do so, I have refused. I have reminded those people that the Bible teaches the benefits of participating in congregational life and advised them to be baptized in a situation where they intended to participate in its congregational life. Situations may arise where either a congregation will not accept a person into its membership or policy restricts one from joining a congregation. I once told a congregation that I was going to baptize a person regardless of their wish not to allow my baptism. The final decision was made for the congregation to support my decision to baptize. However, if they had not done so, I would have arranged for membership under a policy that allows for membership outside of a congregation. For those of you who teach written English: My multiple uses of the word "however, simply indicates the complexity of the issue.

This evangelist has no intention of withholding information until the end. He will disclose it when the Sabbath is brought up. And it will be held in the SDA church. Many will know that. Some will not who have driven by the church and have never paid attention. Btw, what do you think of the verses I cited in the previous post?

In 1992 an evangelist for the SDA church held meetings at a local community college. He did not share what church he was affiliated with until the evening that spoke about the Sabbath. Later, he offered baptisms at a local church that one of the attendees "suggested" might be willing to host the baptisms. My mother was baptized into the SDA church and was NEVER informed that she'd be joining a denomination--she thought she was receiving baptism by immersion because she was convinced that immersion was the "right" way to do it (vs. her previous sprinkling baptism). It was very, very deceitful. All the others who were baptised that same day left the church the following week. They felt, too, that they had been deceived by this man.

Very hard decision that's for sure, will be praying for you and Sully. I've had to put two dogs down and its never easy.

Please read the first few verses of 1 Sam 16 & Ex 5 and see if you think God was being deceitful. A lot of people drive by buildings and never pay attention.

20 But as for you, ye thought evil against me; but God meant it unto good, to bring to pass, as it is this day, to save much people alive. Genesis This above is a comment by Joseph and is an example helping to keep any wishing to follow the straight and narrow, from going overboard to keep themselves there. Much mischief could be avoided if we put our confidence in almighty God's care for us. 1 Corinthians 13:7 Love bears up under anything and everything that comes, is ever ready to believe the best of every person, its hopes are fadeless under all circumstances, and it endures everything [without weakening]. Isaiah 41:10 Fear not, for I am with you; Be not dismayed, for I am your God. I will strengthen you, Yes, I will help you, I will uphold you with My righteous right hand.’ G'day mates! God is Love!~Jesus saves!

I have read commentary by Christian writers lately, that EQUATES the Battle of Armageddon" with the "Battle of Gog and Magog". But one is at the end of this age, and one takes place 1000+ years later. The Battle of Gog/Magog is definitely centered around "the camp of the saints and the beloved City".

Armagedden is the battle for the souls of this world, being fought by Christ and Satan. Whom will you serve. So, where is it? Like many 'interpretations', this one has also been revised over time. The traditional view, that it is a 'physical' place, has been modified to a 'spititual' place. This is what I have been hearing for many years now. I always had trouble with the 'physical' interpretation and am quite comfortable with the 'spiritual' one. Too often the line between 'symbolic' and 'actual' gets extremely blurred in our effort to predict certain events, my opinion!

I'm so sorry, deciding when enough is enough is one of the hardest things a petparent can do. I had a ten year old cat that I raised since she was a 4 week old kitten. Her last year was miserable, she had constant diarrhea and vomiting, she could barely walk, and some sort of neuro problems, as she "lost" me constantly. I couldn't let her go, she was my furbaby, I was selfish and made her suffer unnecessarily for a year, before my family put their foot down and forced me to see her reality. It's awful. But when the time comes, you can make it as peaceful as possible, with her best friend right there letting her know it's okay. In the meantime, I pray that the meds do the trick. <3

I don't wish to divulge my finances here, but another thing to consider is that my wife and I are raising our grandson. Currently he is 2 1/2....I have to prioritize.

I wonder: Would his trachea surgery be a permanent solution? There comes a time when one thing just follows another and it is enough for the poor animal.

Do whatever is most merciful... It's hard when they suffer

What about Dr. Ben Carson way of introducing America to Adventism? I thought it reflected many SDA's I know. .. Too many up here like their guns a little too much

My first car was a white, 1960 Chevy Impala. My mother gave it to me. I remember that I could fix almost anything under the hood with a screwdriver and a pair of pliers. These days you need all kinds of electronic diagnostic instruments. But I was thrilled when Chevy revived the model in 2000. (Actually they revived it in 1994 after a nine year hiatus, for a couple of years, then they revived it again in 2000.)