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When i was selling books as a very young naive christian man i came across a former Miss Alabama who's life went really bad Years before i met her ..the love of her life was doing something with his gun and accidentally shot himself in the gut and she watched him die. i invited her to my cute lil country church and told her we had vegetarian potluck every week i told her she didnt have to bring anything well the night before we went together to church i went over there and there was white flour all over her and she was a bit manic making a giant A GIANT pot of chicken and dumplings I didnt know what to say seeing she has been slaving all night ... so the next morning we went to church and im just praying didnt know what to do i did know one thing for sure if i told anyone what was in it that dish it wouldn't been touched and she would have been crushed so i said nothing i was so embarrassed and soooo protective of her well we are sitting together with the elder's wife who i really didnt know and she was gushing to my guest how tasty her dish was she asked what's it made out of and i looked at her sheepishly and told her it was chicken her smile froze and then recovered quickly and smiled wider and said it was wonderful i will forever to eternity be grateful for that moment

it is similar to when any primary caregiver who has no back up goes down. Usually those who have no preparation to take an responsibility just flounder. i think of a husband who dies leaving an utterly dependent wife who cannot write a check, drive a car, or pay a bill... hey i know it sounds awful but it has happened. it can be a single mom or single grandmother who has been taking care of everyone, and when she becomes ill the takers are not prepared to give. I think pastor should not be the core of spiritual care-giving in a congregation. He should be coaching the members and training everyone in ministry.

I agree; but "overcoming" requires effort (in some cases a lot of effort) to achieve. Doesn't that make it a "work"?

I've heard it said that only the "pure" species that God created in the Garden of Eden will be permitted in the New Earth. But does that mean the various types or breeds that evolved are not looked upon by God as His creation now? The dogs and cats that we have now are generally not considered to be anything like what was around 2000 or even 1000 years ago, with the exception of a few breeds. Does God reject any of His creation now just because they are not the pure specimens of the Garden of Eden? Does He accept them as they are now? Does he reject any because it wasn't born as 100% representative of the created ideal? Does God give us a command not to love and care for the creatures of today, and accept them as they are? What about people? I can't think of anyone who was born as 100% representative of the created ideal. Think about it.

The ancient Egyptians celebrated a week-long feast to the god of the underworld during the same week that Passover was celebrated. They sacrificed a pig to this god, and ate leavened honey cakes. The LORD was showing the Israelites that He was greater than the "god" of the underworld - Satan. I thought maybe the 7 days saw them safely through the Red Sea crossing. I looked at Reese Chronological. In Reese, Israel left Egypt on Nissan 15 and camped by the Red Sea before dark on the evening of Nissan 17. All that night the wind blew across the Sea. They crossed the Red Sea (and Pharaoh with his army was destroyed) on the 18th of Nissan - 4 days after they departed Egypt. So the 7 day period doesn't fit that. I know the Israelites did not have time for their bread to rise, and they "carried their kneading bowls bound up in their clothes". They did not receive the manna until the 16th day of the second month - a month AFTER they left Egypt. (Exodus 16). We do know they cooked with the manna. They must have used leaven for the baking occasionally, because the command for Pentecost was the offering of two loaves "baked WITH leaven" (Lev 23:17). The Lord's command was that all "leaven" be removed from "your houses" before the sun set on the 14th day of Nissan. My husband read's the labels on soup cans, etc. to remove all leaven. He puts everything in a big box and takes it out to the shed for the week (Exo 12:15). lol The search for the leaven makes the point that removal of all leaven is impossible, especially if we are searching with mortal eyes. Jesus was cleaning the "leaven" from His "house" [the Temple] when He drove out the money changers. I'm just wondering about the WEEK. What is the fulfillment? Leaven was a symbol of sin. Which is why the "bread" of the Passover (Jesus) was "without leaven" or honey which facilitates leavening. Do you think it may have fulfillment significance at the end of this age - before our "Passover" from this kingdom of Satan/Pharaoh?

Emperor Constantine was a flaming anti-Semitic. He actually wrote, "We will have nothing to do with the detestable Jewish crowd." Constantine commanded that no Christian festival could be celebrated on the same day as a Jewish festival. And once he proclaimed himself head of the church, the die was cast. The same thing happened to the 7th Day Sabbath. Pagans newly converted to Christianity wanted to avoid persecution, when possible.

Kosher Matzah came about because of the Orthodox, who wanted to make absolutely SURE that not a molecule of fermentation could come into contact with the mix before it was fired. We make our own "unleavened bread" for our Passover feast. It tastes good - sort of like a crunchy thin pizza crust. We are eating it all this week. We had five people over on Monday evening. We do the foot washing ceremony too. We feel it really sends the message that we were sent to serve, not to be served. We don't do the "full blown" seder, but we tell the story of the first Passover, and the story of "Christ our Passover", and we look forward to our final rescue/deliverance from this kingdom ruled by "Pharaoh", and we very much look forward to Passover with Christ in His Father's kingdom. Luke 22:15-16 "Then He said to them, 'With fervent desire I have desired to eat this Passover with you before I suffer; for I say to you, I will no longer eat of it [Passover] until it is fulfilled in the kingdom of God.'" Matthew 26:27-29 "Then He took the cup [the 3rd cup of the Passover], and gave thanks, and gave it to them, saying, 'Drink from it, all of you. For this is My blood of the new covenant, which is shed for many for the remission of sins. But I say to you, I will not drink of this fruit of the vine from now on until that day when I drink it new with you in My Father's kingdom." I think of Passover like I do the Sabbath. Why take 2000 years off - just to start keeping it again in the kingdom. One can celebrate the Feast without the sacrifice of a lamb. We divide men/women for the foot washing. The next day Sharon (age 72) called to tell me that her husband was so impressed when Klaus prayed for him, that he also prayed out loud. That was the first time in 43 years - that he had prayed out loud. Everyone there felt the presence of Christ with us. Passover is an awesome time.

You have touched a point with me. I once spent a year working with an organization that provided clinical care to HIV infected people. Some were female. A few were not adults. Some were NOT homosexual. Some were of SDA background to include being SDA members. But, the majority were homosexual males. In this position, I would typically share a meal with them each week. Working closely with them changed my life, attitudes and understanding of issues related to HIV, homosexuality and more. * I got to know several homosexual SDA related people who were flamboyant in their homosexuality, but were living a celibate life. This is a choice that some people can make. * I got to know some homosexual SDAs who were appreciative of their congregations who were attempting to maintain contact with them. * As Freud once stated, human sexuality exists on a range. Normal heterosexuals in their lives and practices exist on a wide range. So also it is for homosexuals. One cannot place all homosexuals in the same box as to sexuality in their life and practice. * I came to understand the need of homosexuals for civil rights.

Greetings all, Its been a couple of months and I decided to simply take some time out of church in general and try and clear my thoughts, not simply about just this but some other issues also. Last Sabbath I went back and attended church there on my own because my wife and children did not want to come along when I gave them the option. I did not really enjoy the meeting and pretty much just felt uncomfortable being there. I collected the items from my overflowing pigeon hole and left after the meeting ended. I have spoken to one of the Elders and the Pastor and they are great people who clearly understand what the issues are, yet the simple fact is that these people are currently putting out spot fires in various places. Currently they are down to a guitar and a piano for 'worship' because the two kids that played the drums have been criticized so often over their drumming being 'disrespectful' that they and a number of young people have left the fellowship altogether. The realization that I have come to however is that I have lost none of my passion nor my interest in the Adventist Church. Yet I realize that I need to fellowship at an evangelical post modern styled group if I am to include my family members and actually enjoy being a part of the local fellowship. I don't think that there is any chance that I will ever again be involved in a fellowship like this Adventist Church. Whilst I may embrace the doctrine of the SDA, my background is growing up in the Salvation Army where its intensely evangelical and where all people are made welcome, my experience in visiting other Evangelical and Pentecostal groups that the same ethos is there as well. I know there are plenty of good SDA churches out there, and the challenge will be simply to find one and transfer across to it. On the positive side, for no particular reason I happened to come across the daily show by TD Jakes on cable, I have been getting a massive amount from his messages and it has been something that has challenged me to get back into church again and to be focused on God and what He is saying. My feeling is becoming more and more that God isn't as hung up on which local church we belong to as we are. Time will tell I suppose, this weekend I am looking forward to fellowshipping at my old church for the Easter Program and I hope to begin visiting some more fellowships in the weeks to come and will simply see how that goes! Thank you all for your support and advice, it is very much appreciated!

See: http://spectrummagazine.org/article/2017/03/24/landmark-sermon-chris-oberg-discusses-science-sex-and-gender NOTE: The above article is about a sermon preached in a SDA pulpit. It contains a link to the 41 minute video that was actually presented.

are you referring to the female pastor? I am not aware of who she is or if she is even a pastor or if they even filmed the video in church settings, but my question is... if it was a sermon, it was obviously given to the members?? I didn't see any members but if you approve then you approve. If you do not approve, don't feel as if having disapproval is grounds for you being put under shock therapy sessions... God would never want anyone under shock therapy sessions for having an opinion... However, if you are unwilling to listen to sound words and doctrine, you might begin carrying around your own 'stun gun' so you can put yourself under your own shock therapy sessions whenever someone tries to discuss anything about God with you... Oh, and by the way,,, you spelled gender wrong in your title. maybe not wrong but you left out a letter.

I do not foresee anything that would drive me away from God's remnant church. I was sharing with a fruend in a 12-Step group that I am an Aventist. He shared that a friend of his visitted the Adventist church and liked it. The next week was potluck and she was asked to bring a vegetarian plate so she did. However at potluck one of the members talked down to her saying she wouldn't eat the dish because it had cheese. So she left and never went back. i confessed to my friend that sounded like something that could happen because there is a small minority of self-rigteous folks in every church. Before I could finish the story, my friend agreed and commented that self-righteous folks are not just limmited to the Adventist churches. I went on to tell him of a Mexican family that visitted a church in Minnesota where I attended college. When they brought chicken to potluck, our pastor sat at their table and ate their chicken with them. The self-righteous folks were ready to hang the pastor for hearosy.

I'd like to see the critters I grew up to know and love would be in Heaven also, and I have some speculations on this topic, too, but never mind it. I've considered both possibilities. We can only speculate what God will do, and our speculations cannot change the result. The real question is: Can you still love God if He doesn't bring your precious pets to Heaven for you? For me, I know I can. I think, though I don't know for sure, that He will recycle the animals that we grew up to know and love, rather than making brand new animals, because animals are living breathing creatures and He cares about them, too, and you're right that humans haven't retained their original perfection, either, and we humans must also be made new, but we will still be ourselves. God will make all things new. If He chooses to discard the pets that we've had on this Earth and give us new pets, I'm sure I'll grow attached to them, too, and be able to love them, also. No, by using the words "recycle" and "discard", I'm not trying to put pets into the same category as inanimate, inorganic objects such as plastic toys or teddy bears, but am thinking in terms of creation, filling the new Earth with perfected, new versions using the old to build them, or completely starting over. I don't know what God will do, but will trust in His wisdom. But we know from the Bible, which was written for people (not for animals), that God has a plan to recycle/restore us to perfection and to fill Heaven and the new Earth with people who have existed on this planet, though not all can be restored, because they resist God and trust in their own judgement and the opinions of others that are against God, and will not allow Him to restore them. I think not all animals, if God chooses to restore them, that have existed will be in Heaven. It's not for us to know whether God will save them, nor how He will do it, and/or whether or not there is a judgement for them. Otherwise, I believe He would have written it in His word, unless His statement that He will "make all things new" in Revelation 21, is the indicator that they will not be there, but that new animals will.

Pam, I have to admit I do not know how to explain what Ellen G. White meant when she talked about "amalgamation" of animals, and even of "man and beast." She did not offer any specific examples, or say which races might be the product of amalgamation. (Pygmies? Neanderthals? Sasquatches?) But variations based on pre-existing DNA in the original Genesis parent is not amalgamation.

Think about all the species of animals that have gone extinct that we knew nothing about. While I do believe that just the "pure" Garden of Eden animals will be in the New Earth, we will have all of eternity to breed back our favorite breeds and probably even come up with a few new ones. I think this also goes for food. Tangelos comes to mind, yet we will be able to have both oranges and tangerines, so why not be able to put them together there too? As for people, I think we are to accept them all as Jesus accepted them. Yet he called all the Scribes and Pharisees snakes and vipers, but on an individual level He converted Joseph of Arimathea.

Life is precious I was stunned many years ago when I heard God will only have the New Earth with the original species. All life is precious. Instincts and cognitive abilities and nurturing and the desire to survive in all the animals exist 6000 years ago and today. God watches it all and notice when a critter falls from a nest. Yesterday and tomorrow All Creations Groans.!

I wouldn't want to narrow God by our narrower human views.