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If God says, "What more could I have done," then who are we to say HE must do more, until every last created sentient being is brought to love and salvation??? I believe the all-powerful Creator has limited Himself. He WILL NOT violate the human mind/will. He will not use mind manipulation. THAT is where He has drawn a line - for Himself. Everything else - short of that - He HAS DONE. He has used "tough love" allowing human beings to experience the consequences of their choices. He has rescued them. He has taught them. He has revealed Himself to them. He sent His Son to become a human and then die by torture (a sacrifice beyond our full comprehension). Israel and what happened to Israel, is a MODEL - a TYPE, for what God has done for the whole world, and how God will deal with the whole world. Just looking at that MODEL, almost all of those who left Egypt (who had been slaves) DIED IN THE WILDERNESS. They resisted the Holy Spirit, forgot all the miracles, and were "broken off" because of unbelief. They could not deny that God existed. They just doubted that He would defeat their enemies and give them the land HE had promised. I believe this is the BOTTOM LINE argument. Universalists keep saying "He is responsible" therefore "He must do more" until HE has saved everyone. I say there IS NO MORE that He can do, without violating man's free will. In the MODEL: When divine "fire" consumed Nadab and Abihu - it killed them. It didn't "cleanse them" so they now behaved righteously. When divine "fire" consumed the 250 princes - same thing. I don't buy the argument that the fire is just "cleansing". It cleanses "the camp" - Yes. But it cleanses the camp by consuming "the chaff", AFTER the wheat is harvested.

I like your line of reasoning, Rachel. For me the issue is free choice and the depth of that. While reading this thread through, a thought passed my mind: What if the wicked, after having the fire burn out all the sin, could see God without the burden of the baggage and make a better informed choice for Him? I guess that’s what universalists might be hoping will occur. That would be a help to humans trying to understand why God saves who He does. But it seems like an extra step for a God who knows all hearts.

I have read the material on the Fulcrum 7 website as posted by Photodude. In this post, I will not comment on the issue of female ordination. Perhaps I will comment later? I will comment on the issue with the Chico congregation. I have concerns as to two aspects of this issue: 1) Mark Woodson in a cited letter, clearly states that the NCC has taken action on the issue with the Chico congregation and indicates that it continues to consider that situation. I will suggest that we should trust our leaders. We should trust that what Mark Woodson has said is true. The Chico situation was considered and action was taken. Yes, human leaders are human and not always correct. But, no person should be subject to continued trials simply because someone does not believe that a right decision was made. In trusting our leaders, we do not have to know every aspect of the case. 2) I take very seriously the statement that action has been taken. IOW, one might say that there has been a disciplinary trial and action has been taken. I do not believe that the facts of such trials and the disciplinary action taken should be published to inform the millions of SDA members around the world. I do not believe the every SDA member needs to know every fact and every disciplinary action taken in cases where it is alleged that there is misconduct on the part of a denominational employee. The NCC has made available on a limited basis additional facts about this situation that are not generally known. I am aware of these facts. I do not believe that the Adventist world at large needs to know of those facts. In addition, the Chico situation has resulted in a significant action. I do not believe that persons involved in such an action need to be further humiliated by publishing such to the world at large. Folks, enough is enough. Discipline has been taken. If such was inappropriate, let us leave it with God. Once a person has been tried, that should be enough. One should not be subject to continued trials that never stop, simply because someone does not think that a desired decision was made.

From the article by Reindeer Bruinsma:

I agree that God offers reconciliation to every human being (which may be semi-universalism); but there are human beings who probably will - by their own informed free will - refuse to be reconciled. God - out of his great love for these people and His respect for free will, will sadly let them go. He's not gonna drag people kicking and screaming into the Kingdom.