Club Adventist and the Jesuits...

[Stan]

If I had to do this again, I would word it different..

Here is my issue...

I have seen to many struggling and new Christian get excited, (and reacting to something taught from the pulpit), saying See How wrong THOSE people area? SEE!! SEE!! SEE!! POINT!!! POINT!!! POINT!!!!

When what they really need is something to grow their faith, something to help them overcome sin, and live the victorious life.

Something to help them get through the day, and grow strong in faith in our Heavenly Father.

Lives are not transformed, Hope is not built, Courage is not given, when the condemnation abides in someone's life.

EGW was not afraid to say she was wrong. I think it is in the book Evangelism, that she wrote that we have been far to harsh on the Catholics, and that we should be pointing out what is right not what is wrong.. when it comes to spreading the Gospel...

Some folks like Dr Vieth, tends to skip over those parts. That is my opinion. I know lives that have been changed for the cause because of his ministry. I just would rather that he red more of the little red books on dealing with Catholics and other similar organizations, as I said, that is just my opinion.

[Woody]

Quote:

EGW was not afraid to say she was wrong. I think it is in the book Evangelism, that she wrote that we have been far to harsh on the Catholics, and that we should be pointing out what is right not what is wrong.. when it comes to spreading the Gospel...

Thank you Stan. Thank you

Amen Amen

Love WON another

[rush4hire]

rush, who said anything about 'uniting with Rome'?? Please explain how we here might be following Rome?

[Taylor]

If I had to do this again, I would word it different..

Here is my issue...

I have seen to many struggling and new Christian get excited, (and reacting to something taught from the pulpit), saying See How wrong THOSE people area? SEE!! SEE!! SEE!! POINT!!! POINT!!! POINT!!!!

When what they really need is something to grow their faith, something to help them overcome sin, and live the victorious life.

Something to help them get through the day, and grow strong in faith in our Heavenly Father.

Lives are not transformed, Hope is not built, Courage is not given, when the condemnation abides in someone's life.

EGW was not afraid to say she was wrong. I think it is in the book Evangelism, that she wrote that we have been far to harsh on the Catholics, and that we should be pointing out what is right not what is wrong.. when it comes to spreading the Gospel...

Some folks like Dr Vieth, tends to skip over those parts. That is my opinion. I know lives that have been changed for the cause because of his ministry. I just would rather that he red more of the little red books on dealing with Catholics and other similar organizations, as I said, that is just my opinion.

Amen Stan! (I don't know much about Veith but I do agree with what you say.)

[rush4hire]

I have seen to many struggling and new Christian get excited, (and reacting to something taught from the pulpit), saying See How wrong THOSE people area? SEE!! SEE!! SEE!! POINT!!! POINT!!! POINT!!!!

When what they really need is something to grow their faith, something to help them overcome sin, and live the victorious life.

[Neil D]

But I disagree that the Catholic system is anything like fundamental Adventism.

You have absolutely no idea why Protestants rebelled against Rome, do you? You have no clue as to why Protestant's faith is superior to a Catholic faith...and why their is division between the two sects of Christendom.....You just parrot what some people tell you and you hide behind what they say.

Rush, without quoting someone, tell us what you know about what is positive about Adventism...No quotes...what are YOUR words...What is Adventism about?

[Taylor]

Rush, "little red books" refer to EGW books. They used to be all in "red covers" up until about 20 years ago.

[Taylor]

Originally Posted By: rush4hire

But I disagree that the Catholic system is anything like fundamental Adventism.

You have absolutely no idea why Protestants rebelled against Rome, do you? You have no clue as to why Protestant's faith is superior to a Catholic faith...and why their is division between the two sects of Christendom.....You just parrot what some people tell you and you hide behind what they say.

Rush, without quoting someone, tell us what you know about what is positive about Adventism...No quotes...what are YOUR words...What is Adventism about?

Um...while I often don't agree with Rush, I do think he knows what Catholocism and Adventism consists of...from his own personal study. He probably doesn't know everything but neither do most of us. I do think he has done some of his own study, so give him a bit of a break at least.

Just my 2 cents.

[rush4hire]

Rush, "little red books" refer to EGW books. They used to be all in "red covers" up until about 20 years ago.

[Woody]

You will know them by their love.

[Gail]

If you were in the shoes of someone who is not of the Adventist faith, what method of informing would leave the best taste in your mouth? IOW, how would you like to be treated if it were you? That is how we have been commanded to live and deal with others.

[rush4hire]

If you were in the shoes of someone who is not of the Adventist faith, what method of informing would leave the best taste in your mouth? IOW, how would you like to be treated if it were you? That is how we have been commanded to live and deal with others.

[Gail]

Quote:

I hope that answers your question, Gail.

Not exactly. I was thinking more about the delivery of the message and in regards to respect for others.

If a person were to deliver a message to me that is different, I can handle that. If a person delivers it with an "I'm right, you're wrong" attitude, no matter what the message includes I will probably shut down my ears to rudeness.

Some people can bear fruit with their message, no matter how difficult it is to give.

[rush4hire]

Not exactly. I was thinking more about the delivery of the message and in regards to respect for others.

If a person were to deliver a message to me that is different, I can handle that. If a person delivers it with an "I'm right, you're wrong" attitude, no matter what the message includes I will probably shut down my ears to rudeness.

Some people can bear fruit with their message, no matter how difficult it is to give.

[Norman Byers, N.D.]

Quote:

I don't believe it is...but then that is YOUR passion....an adventism that fights against something.

What is Adventism FOR? What does it stand for? What does it mean to be an Adventist? If you can not answer these questions, you are NOT an adventist....

That's my opinion...and I will stick with it....until corrected.

Hi Neil,

it is true that many who take the name Seventh-day Adventist and some who have left the movement and started their own church, are in ministry or live for one thing; to fight against something or someone.

It dawned on me one day, long ago; what we do now we will be doing in heaven. If we truly love God, we will praise Him and tesify of His mercy, love and grace. When the saved get to heaven they will simply continue to praise God and Jesus who died for them.

If we spend our time defending and fighting against something for the sake of being right what will we do when we get there? The habits and character that are formed here will be taken to heaven.

Those who fight to be right will have nothing to say and be totally board with their existance. In Mercy to them, God will let them stay here and suffer what is probably better than what they would experince in heaven: death and finally, the 2nd death

Norman

[rush4hire]

It dawned on me one day, long ago; what we do now we will be doing in heaven. If we truly love God, we will praise Him and tesify of His mercy, love and grace. When the saved get to heaven they will simply continue to praise God and Jesus who died for them.

[Norman Byers, N.D.]

Quote:

OK.

So King David will be board because there are no Philistines to kill? And so will all the other soldiers who spent their whole lives killing Philistines at the Lord's command?

And we see all the prophets, including Jesus, vehemently rebuking sin and correcting error. Will they also be bored in heaven, because there will be no sin to rebuke or error to correct?

You need to consider the retirement factor. People can spend their whole life doing hard labor, sweating, and enduring the hot sun, and when they get old enough, they can just retire, and spend the rest of their life doing whatever. They are not bored. They find something to do.

So, I see some holes in your theory, Norman.

I specifically was referring to people who want to fight just to be right. That's all they are interested in. I thought I made that clear but I guess I need to be more specific.

If Jesus wanted to be right all the time for the sake of being right, He would have argued against the false trial that sent Him to the cross and would have gone about correcting the Romans as well. In His own words here is what He did: John 17:4 I have glorified thee on the earth: I have finished the work which thou gavest me to do.

He did not go around correcting all the wrongs, trying to be right all the time. That does not win hearts, I know I used to be like that. Here's a perfect example.

Luk 12:13 And one of the company said unto him, Master, speak to my brother, that he divide the inheritance with me.

Luk 12:14 And he said unto him, Man, who made me a judge or a divider over you?

Jesus did not tell either of them who was right or wrong but went on to say be careful of coveteousness. then He told the parable of the man with who wanted to tear down his barns and build bigger ones and take it easy.

It did not matter to Jesus who was right or wrong so He went on to describe the principles of the Kingdom of God and gloryfied God. More people were edified and are still being edified as you read.

As for the retired people who find something else to do sure, that's not what I'm referring to. When a Character has been formed here on earth and it is one that does nothing but want to be right there will be nothing to say in heaven because everything will be right. But if one spends their time glorifying God they will be right at home. Having said that, it does not mean that I am saying we are never to stand up for what's right or that being right does not matter. Take heed how you hear, or in this case how you read.

I see your logic concerning King David but you have left out a major point. Read Psalms and tell me how often you see David praising God. I think you'll find that he will be right at home in eternity because he did not spend all his time fighting to be right, just for the sake of being right.

That should have filled the holes for you. I don't post this to be right but rather so you can understand

Norman

[rush4hire]

That should have filled the holes for you. I don't post this to be right but rather so you can understand

That's neat. I guess. I have a sick baby that kept me up all night. And I'm so tired right now, that I can't even think to spell my own name. I'm trying to think how what you said, is relevant to this topic. And I can't figure it out.

So, I'm going to set it aside.

The only thing I can say is, if you come up with a theory, then that's great. You should share it, and get some feedback. But don't you think it's better to make a new thread, maybe in theology forum. Post your ideas and say "I got this theory. What do you guys think?", or something...

I'm sorry if that sounds rude. I don't mean to tell you what to do. I really just don't know what else to say at this time.

Wife took the baby to the hospital. I'm going to get a nap in.

See ya.

I'll read that again later.

[rush4hire]

I specifically was referring to people who want to fight just to be right. That's all they are interested in.

[Norman Byers, N.D.]

Quote:

I know what you mean, though. Combativeness is an issue that should be addressed. I just don't see how it applies to this topic.

It doesn't apply to this topic. I was simply commenting to Neil about something I learned. That's it, simple as that. You commented on it and I explained myself.

Norman

[bygjymbo]

I have to ask this... why is their fear and trembling from some people over Jesuits?

Snipped by me for brevity...

Can I use the excuse... A Jesuit made me do it?

I've been thinking about this question for a couple of days, since this thread began.

It's not what a Jesuit, or their influence can do to me. They can't change my faith at all. Sola Scriptura.

But what about my loved ones who haven't come to know Jesus? What about my friends and neighbors? What about my country?

2 Timothy 4:3 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears;

Here is an example. It may be a conspiracy, it may not. But The effect is the same.

Since January, "Oprah and Friends" has been offering a year-long course from the New Age teachings of "A Course In Miracles" workbook over XM Radio. Marianne Williamson, a New-age leader, will teach the course. It originates from the channellings of Helen Schucman who claims that this is new revelation from Jesus.

The course workbook bluntly states: "This is a course in mind training" and is dedicated to "thought reversal".

Lesson 29-teaches "God is in everything I see".

Lesson 61-tells each person to repeat the affirmation "I am the light of the world".

Lesson 70-Say and believe "My salvation comes from me".

More quotes: "There is no sin". "A slain Christ has no meaning." "The journey to the cross should be the last useless journey".

It's indoctrination, pure and simple. It's anti-Christian and anti-Bible...and it's suckin' in millions of people.

WHY ARE WE AFRAID TO EXPOSE THIS STUFF AS THE EVIL GARBAGE THAT IT IS?? Why is there no outcry against Oprah Winfrey and her kind? WHAT ARE WE AFRAID OF??

There's your fear, Stan. But it's kinda reversed, isn't it??

I'm glad that Martin Luther had the guts to nail his thesis to the door.

[bygjymbo]

BTW. Jesus thrashed the money changers.

Combativeness can be mis-placed or it can be righteous. When it comes to the Name of God and His Son Jesus Christ, is that mis-placed?

Or maybe we should be rejoicing louder, so that the world will hear us?? A voice, crying in the wilderness.

Mt 10:33 But whosoever shall deny me before men, him will I also deny before my Father which is in heaven.

Mt 10:34 Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword.

Mt 10:35 For I am come to set a man at variance against his father, and the daughter against her mother, and the daughter in law against her mother in law.

Mt 10:36 And a man's foes shall be they of his own household.