Will YOU be Left Behind???

[True-believer]

Ok. Good, but what if the person is looking into learning about other religions? Would they be a god educator about the rapture?

Yes, they would be a great educator about The Rapture.

[True-believer]

Originally Posted By: Cosmin

Ok. Though, I also never knew that most other religions believed in the rapture... I know lots of friends form my school who don't belive in the rapture but they are not SDA either. I mean LOTS not just a few.

Most Evangelical Protestant Christians do; I don't think Catholics do. I know several protestants who don't believe in it, though.

Most Evangelical Christians do believe in The Rapture;

Catholics do believe in The Rapture--but very differently to Evangelicals;

In the Christian Faith you can either believe in it or not, there are many options, like for instance:

1) Pre-tribulation 2) Mid-tribulation 3) Post-tribulation views;

AND:

1) Pre-millenial 2) A-millenial 3) Post-millinial views;

All different views are allowed to be preached in ALL Evangelical Churches like:

Baptists, Pentecostals, ChurchofChrist, Lutherans, Methodists--which is now Uniting, Anglican, Independant, except SDA's and only a few minor evangelical churches.

[True-believer]

In one sense we do believe in a rapture, cosmin, but not in the way that these movies and books say. When Jesus comes at the end of time he will rapture us up to him, but it will be when the dead in christ rise from there graves and us that are alive will meet him in the air, that is the true rapture. Not a rapture where God takes some and leaves the rest, just to come back several years later to see if they are ready than.

pk

Hey pkrause and Cosmin,

The above quote is coming from a sda point of view, remember there are other point of views also within the Christian faith that we are free to believe as long as it is backed up with the Bible, and the Bible only--and NOT Ellen G White.

[True-believer]

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Remember, this is SDA Doctrine of the Bible, so we need to do our own study, sola scripture, and find the bible truths for ourselves.

[True-believer]

Thanks for that. I've got that series taped. But that piece is really powerful. Really puts that rapture stuff in its place.

pk

So, you do believe in the Rapture, pkrause?

[True-believer]

When you read Left Behind, you know some of it may be true, and you are left to try to filter out the true from the false, and some of it filters into your brain as you subconsciously wonder, "what if?" LynnDel

Left Behind is NOT false, please study it via their point of view first and then compare it to your sda study and then see which one is more biblical, you'll soon discover that the Left Behind is far more biblically based.

[True-believer]

The Methodist church doesn't believe in the rapture. I grew up Methodist, and I never heard of the rapture until I became an Adventist. And it was in the Adventist church that I first heard of it.

The Methodist Church----which is now the Uniting Church does believe in The Rapture.

[True-believer]

No, but I have read the book that it is supposedly based on, and it isn't in there.

If you read both sides of the controversy of whether or not the Rapture is there or not, you'll soon discover that it is in there, it is biblically based.

---You need to do more of a througher research LifeHisCoast.

[GreatLakesGramma]

The Methodist Church----which is now the Uniting Church does believe in The Rapture.

My parents still belong to the United Methodist church, and they have not said anything about any merges or name changes. All of the Methodist churches around here still say "United Methodist Church" on their signs, in the phone book, etc. Things may be different with the church in Australia than they are here.

[Stan]

GLG

That is in the land down under..

[Stan]

In Canada they united with the Presbyterians and became the United Church of Canada, back in 1925

[GreatLakesGramma]

Stan, you were posting while I was editing mine to add the last 2 sentences.

TB, it was not Ellen White who came up with the Adventist view of the second coming. That was already firmly established before she ever had a single vision, as a result of many years of careful study by William Miller. The one significant error that Miller made was brought to light in a vision, but not to Ellen White, while the rest of Miller's conclusions were confirmed by the same vision. Mrs. White didn't have any visions until later.

[Kountzer]

Originally Posted By: LifeHiscost

No, but I have read the book that it is supposedly based on, and it isn't in there.

If you read both sides of the controversy of whether or not the Rapture is there or not, you'll soon discover that it is in there, it is biblically based.

---You need to do more of a througher research LifeHisCoast.

I am totally convinced that the Left Behind theories about end times and the rapture is totally bogus. You can cut and paste verses, take them out of context, and draw some illogical defense of left behind. That's what Hal Lindsey did with his book 'late great planet earth'. Dr Sam Bacchiocchi wrote a counter book that totally debunks Lindsey's book. There are about at least 12 other sda commentators on video that have said the same things that David Asscherick said. There are about 20 or more books written doing the same thing. I agree with them. I see no need to re invent the wheel.

DB

[True-believer]

TB, it was not Ellen White who came up with the Adventist view of the second coming. That was already firmly established before she ever had a single vision, as a result of many years of careful study by William Miller. The one significant error that Miller made was brought to light in a vision, but not to Ellen White, while the rest of Miller's conclusions were confirmed by the same vision. Mrs. White didn't have any visions until later.

Ok, But I don't have a problem with Ellen G White's view of the End Times, I think it is awesome, I do understand that it was around before her time by William Miller, but I am questioning their authenticity!!!

How do we know what they presented, (William Miller) presented to the sda church is biblical truth, I am questioning their authenticity, sorry Catherine, but, when I read the Bible and study it using sola scripture, at first I can see the sda point of view of the End Times, and then when I go deeper, I can see things that the sda church can't see, the Rapture, seven years tribulation, second coming of Christ with the saints, ruling and reigning on a Cleansed Earth for a thousand years, it could be because I was either brought up with this version of the End Times or I find it to be more biblically based.

To tell the truth, I see more of Post-tribulation, pre-millenial Rapture//Second Coming as the same event and ruling in heaven for a thousand years...

But...

I can see the Pre-tribulation point of view as well...

But, it doesn't matter what point of view we take, because we can't loose our salvation over it.

Once we're saved, we are always saved forever, so this difference over the End Times will NOT determine our Salvation, that is already done. Praise the Lord always.

[True-believer]

Originally Posted By: True-believer

If you read both sides of the controversy of whether or not the Rapture is there or not, you'll soon discover that it is in there, it is biblically based.

---You need to do more of a througher research LifeHisCoast.

[/quote']

I am totally convinced that the Left Behind theories about end times and the rapture is totally bogus. You can cut and paste verses, take them out of context, and draw some illogical defense of left behind. That's what Hal Lindsey did with his book 'late great planet earth'. Dr Sam Bacchiocchi wrote a counter book that totally debunks Lindsey's book. There are about at least 12 other sda commentators on video that have said the same things that David Asscherick said. There are about 20 or more books written doing the same thing. I agree with them. I see no need to re invent the wheel.

DB

DB,

Your too closed minded, and you need to stretch your understanding and knowledge in this field a whole lot more bro.

[True-believer]

Verbal Contact

Date: 08 Jun 2009, 06:28 PM

Subject: God is Coming (Please Read)

Body: Blessing everyone, I hope and pray you are all prayed up and ready for the rapture.

HISTORY ABOUT ME- Since the age of 7, god have been sending and communicating messages, and visions through my dreams. 1The first I had at 7 years of age was about the last day of the "7 years of Trials and tribulations." It was one of the most scariest dreams of my life, and when I woke up screaming, I told my mom my dream and we found most of it in the Bible. The following Sunday I spoke of it in the church, and everyone was amazed because I could hardly read let a lone knew that much about Revelation in the Bible. 2The second dream I remember the most was at about 15 or 16 years of age I was walking in a desert and I saw thousands of school buses full of people headed in one direction. I then begin to walk in the same direction to only notice there was a cliff they were all going over and and I could hear lots of screams, and it begin to get really hot. I knew over that cliff was HELL. I tried to stop the buses but they were moving too fast and almost hit me. I yelled out "Oh, God Please help and stop them. They don't know that theres a cliff and they are all going to die. Please help Lord. Then a Loud voice from God came out and said "THESE ARE THE FALSE PROFITS WHO HAVE LED MY SHEEP IN THE WRONG DIRECTION." I then woke up screaming and my mother was there to ask me what I dreamed of. So I told her. We turned on the television only to see all these preachers selling prayer cloths and what they could do for you for a small price if you send in you donations. I have had many visions and dreams but these stand out the most. 3The third I am about to speak about is recent!!! In this dream there was another rap group trying to mimic my Christian Rap Group "Verbal Contact." My self and my partner finally caught up with them. My partner Blaze was very upset giving them a piece of his mind, but not with and foul language. They were having some words when I slowly walked away and looked to the sky. As I looked to the sky I saw a clear foot with a hole in it, and I dropped to my knees asking God to forgive me of all my sins. Then I looked up and saw a clear hand come through the sky, so I started praying harder. Next the voice of God came through and said "I WANT YOU TO TELL EVERYONE THAT I AM ON MY WAY BACK, AND I WILL BE THERE SOON, ALSO THERE ARE 4 PEOPLE I WANT YOU TO PRAY FOR, BEN ANCRUM(he is my Christian Rapping Partner.) When I turned to look at him in the dream he was still arguing with those two other guys. THE SECOND PERSON WAS A YOUNG LADY I WORK WITH," BUT THE LAST 2 NAMES I CANT REMEMBER. I then woke up praying for the 2 individuals like he said and I prayed for everyone else in the world since I couldn't remember who the last 2 were. This was not just a dream but a vision. I have had lot's of dreams that have come true. I cant tell you all of them, even though I want to. I was given the name Joseph at one time, because I was called the dreamer, such as he was. Please don't take this message lightly God is on his way back so please get you lives right with him. This is a warning for remember the rich man wanted to go back and warn his friends and family about Hell but God said they wouldn't believe him as to many wont believe me. Please read the book of Daniel and the book of Revelations, and see if the last days match to what is starting to appear now. GOD IS ON HIS WAY BACK AND YOU DONT WANT TO BE LEFT BEHIND!!!

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Wow, thankyou for this, I am looking forward to The Rapture, keep on spreading this important word. Wow, thankyou for this, I am looking forward to The Rapture, keep on spreading this important word. l

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True-Believer Luke

Luke Goss

Online Now! 08 Jun 2009, 11:40 PM

Wow, thankyou for this, I am looking forward to The Rapture, keep on spreading this important word. -Delete-

Travis

Travis Arterburn

8 Jun 2009 8:48 PM

wow man thts awsome tht just shows tht God will use anybody even kids

Gerri

8 Jun 2009 7:41 PM

God Bless You! Brother The truth shall make us free. John 8:32 KJV

~{Praying 4 Mr.Rite}~

Jamecia Galbreath

8 Jun 2009 7:32 PM

So true, d signs of d times r evrywhere. Changes n da weather, economic, men wit men, women wit women, famines d signs r here he kan cum any day now I gotta get myself bk 2getha b4 itz 2 late.

I &#9829; MY HUSBAND DANIEL

Maria Nicholson

Online Now! 8 Jun 2009 7:29 PM

AMAN!!! may God bless you for warning his people and the poor lost people!!! continue your prayers for the world!!! there are so many people that have never heard about the sweet name of Jesus!!! He is coming and it will be soon!!!

Theophilus A.K.A iPod-R…

Brandon Rogers

8 Jun 2009 7:27 PM

I really believe what you are saying whole heartedly because I have never in my life heard so much about Chirist's return until recently. I definitely believe that Jesus will return in my lifetime and very soon though I dont know the exact time.

Paul(Right Now)

8 Jun 2009 6:42 PM

amen brother. will you guys pray for me please? my lifes been difficult this year and i want to be ready.

[True-believer]

The above post is not from me, I cut and paste off MySpace because it is relevant to this topic of The End Times, The Rapture of the True Church before the great tribulation period, just read that guy's dream in the above, God gave him a vision of this tribulation period after the Rapture.

[GreatLakesGramma]

TB, not all visions and dreams are from God. The Koran was given to Mohammad in vision by an angelic being. Why should we believe this vision over those of Sister White, whom God showed a drastically different version of the end times? Our church has studied the rapture doctrine, and found it to be unbiblical. Just as Kountzer has said, it's a cut and paste interpretation.

But, as you have said, our salvation does not depend on which version we believe. It's more a matter of not being deceived by the enemy, who will impersonate Jesus, and fool most professing Christians. He is giving people of all religions visions and dreams to prepare them to be deceived when he comes. If you can find it, read "Deceived by the New Age," by Will Barron. It gives you a good look at what Satan's doing with non-Christians.

[Planey]

But, it doesn't matter what point of view we take, because we can't loose our salvation over it.

We certainly can lose our salvation if we wait for "a more convenient time", expecting to be have a "second chance" after the Rapture.

Another seven years to make up your mind?

I don't think so.

And if you're counting on that then you will be sadly disappointed when Jesus returns just once in His Second Coming.

Graeme

[GreatLakesGramma]

Planey, I don't think anyone who believes the rapture doctrine actually wants to wait to be ready. They don't want to be here during the tribulation.

However, since we believe we are going to be here during the tribulation, we know we need to be ready to get through it, while they may not be prepared to deal with it.

[John317]

Planey, I don't think anyone who believes the rapture doctrine actually wants to wait to be ready. They don't want to be here during the tribulation.

However, since we believe we are going to be here during the tribulation, we know we need to be ready to get through it, while they may not be prepared to deal with it.

There are at least five dangers connected with belief in the "secret rapture" or the "rapture".

1) It teaches that we do not yet know who the antichrist power is, and therefore it leaves people defenseless against this power, its teachings and its influence. Believers in the "secret Rapture" won't understand the issues in the battle between good and evil that arise just before the Second Coming. This will mean they will join virtually the whole world in "wondering" and following after the beast-powers of Rev. 13.

2) It teaches that most of the book of Revelation is not relevant to Christians prior to the Rapture. Therefore these believers in the rapture are not benefited by the instructions and warnings in Revelation for those living just before the Second Coming of Christ. These warnings include the warning against receiving the "mark of the beast" and the seven last plagues.

3) It causes people to believe that they will be taken out of this world before Christ returns and before the events leading up to Christ's return. This means that those who believe in the Rapture cannot prepare in the way that God intends for them to prepare for the Second Coming. The book of Revelation shows that part of this preparation is coming into harmony with God's moral law through the power of His indwelling Spirit.

4) It means that when the events predicted in the book of Revelation occur, those who have believed in the Rapture will believe that God left them "behind" to face death at the hands of the antichrist. This will have the effect of shaking their faith and causing great spiritual and doctrinal confusion, a loss of trust in God and in the Scriptures.

5) Finally, not knowing how Christ returns and believing in the secret Rapture will leave people vulnerable to Satan's deceptions as he deceives people into accepting him when he impersonates Christ.

[True-believer]

Quote:

There are at least five dangers connected with belief in the "secret rapture" or the "rapture".

Quote:

These five dangers seem to be out of place with your theology John317, I don't believe that the five you mention are really dangers, let me explain...

Quote:

1) It teaches that we do not yet know who the antichrist power is, and therefore it leaves people defenseless against this power, its teachings and its influence. Believers in the "secret Rapture" won't understand the issues in the battle between good and evil that arise just before the Second Coming. This will mean they will join virtually the whole world in "wondering" and following after the beast-powers of Rev. 13.

Quote:

Ok, I come from a Pentecostal background, and I also do firmly believe that the Rapture of the Church will come soon.

Out of my own research, we, the Pentecostals do know who the End-Times Anti-Christ will be, and his power thereof.

It will not leave people defenseless against its power, its teachings and its influence.

It is NOT a secret Rapture, but every eye will see and every ear will hear, it is not a secret, it will not be quiet, instead it will be very loud, and everyone would know about it before it comes--so it can't be a secret.

Quote:

2) It teaches that most of the book of Revelation is not relevant to Christians prior to the Rapture. Therefore these believers in the rapture are not benefited by the instructions and warnings in Revelation for those living just before the Second Coming of Christ. These warnings include the warning against receiving the "mark of the beast" and the seven last plagues.

Quote:

It teaches that the book of Revelation is relevant--the whole book is relevant to ALL Christians and to the world prior to the Rapture.

Us Believers will be benefiting a lot from the Rapture, we will miss ALL the chaos and evil that the Anti-Christ will put on this earth--all the unnatural and natural disasters will increase mightly and more powerfully--and us believers will escape it all being Raptured up or "Caught Up" to heaven during that time, Amen, thankyou God.

The Mark of the beast will either be a physical sign or a spiritual sign that denotes that you yourself belongs to Satan or God--choose carefully.

Quote:

3) It causes people to believe that they will be taken out of this world before Christ returns and before the events leading up to Christ's return. This means that those who believe in the Rapture cannot prepare in the way that God intends for them to prepare for the Second Coming. The book of Revelation shows that part of this preparation is coming into harmony with God's moral law through the power of His indwelling Spirit.

Quote:

Jesus meets His believers in the air when we are Raptured--(Caught Up), and seven years later we will return with Jesus in His Return to a cleansed earth to set up His 1000yrs reign on earth, oh let us praise God for this glorious event.

We don't believe in the Rapture, we believe in our Lord Jesus Christ, and we look forward to the Rapture, when we will be "Caught Up" to Himself and spend from that moment onwards in His wonderful and glorious presence.

Quote:

4) It means that when the events predicted in the book of Revelation occur, those who have believed in the Rapture will believe that God left them "behind" to face death at the hands of the antichrist. This will have the effect of shaking their faith and causing great spiritual and doctrinal confusion, a loss of trust in God and in the Scriptures.

Quote:

Yes, very true, that is why we need to make the decision right now to put our trust and faith in Jesus Christ as our Lord and Savior and not in doctrinal matters such as the Rapture, but we the believers in Jesus have something glorious to look forward to, we get to miss the great tribulation, but we still need to be careful because Satan also believes in Jesus and trembles, so we can't just be believers, or spectators, but we must choose a side--is it with Jesus or Satan--please decide!!!

It would be terrible for you to be LEFT BEHIND and to be put through the entire of point 4 above.

Quote:

5) Finally, not knowing how Christ returns and believing in the secret Rapture will leave people vulnerable to Satan's deceptions as he deceives people into accepting him when he impersonates Christ.

Quote:

Well, we are not believing in a secret Rapture but a very loud Rapture--you could call "The Big Bang Rapture"--but we don't believe in it--we believe in Jesus and have our hope in Him alone and have faith that when the Rapture does come He will change up incorruptible and give us brand new immortal bodies and take us up to heaven with Himself.

But the people who are LEFT BEHIND will have a great delusion to believe the lie of the Anti-Christ--Satan's deceptions as he deceives people into accepting him instead of Christ.

[True-believer]

However, since we believe we are going to be here during the tribulation, we know we need to be ready to get through it, while they may not be prepared to deal with it.

While you go through the tribulation Catherine, I'll bypass you and be "Caught Up" or Raptured before the great tribulation, but anyhow, I'll see you on the other side if your faith keeps on being strong during the tribulation, I'll see ya at the end of the seven years on a cleansed earth when Jesus sets up His earthly Kingdom for 1000yrs on earth with us True Believers.

[SivartM]

I don't quite understand how one can "not believe in the rapture, but in Jesus". If you believe that the rapture will happen, then don't you believe in the rapture? :\

[John317]

Quote:

Ok, I come from a Pentecostal background, and I also do firmly believe that the Rapture of the Church will come soon.

Out of my own research, we, the Pentecostals do know who the End-Times Anti-Christ will be, and his power thereof.

Who do you believe the antichrist will be? What Bible evidence can you show for your identification?

Quote:

It will not leave people defenseless against its power, its teachings and its influence.

If we believe the Bible is pointing to one power as the antichrist, and it turns out that we are wrong, and that the Bible is actually pointing in a different direction and identifying a totally different power as the antichrist, I believe you can see how we would be defenseless against the true antichrist. It would be like an army preparing for an attack from one direction or from one enemy, when the attack will come from a different direction and from an entirely different enemy.

Quote:

It is NOT a secret Rapture, but every eye will see and every ear will hear, it is not a secret, it will not be quiet, instead it will be very loud, and everyone would know about it before it comes--so it can't be a secret.

There are other believers and books on the the Rapture theory who refer to it as "the secret rapture." But it is certainly true that most references are simply to "the rapture."

There are different interpretations of the Rapture. Some believe that Christ will snatch believers out of the earth and that those who are left behind won't realize until later that believers were taken. The is how the well-known films and books by Tim LaHaye portray it. I realize that not everyone believes in this portrayal or in this view.

I completely agree with you that Christ's return can't be secret, because the Bible says it will be very loud and that the dead will be raised, and there will be a loud trumpet call and a loud voice. It also says there will be brilliant light from the angels of God seen from one part of the world to another. Matt. 24: 27; 2 Thess. 1:9. It certainly appears from these scriptures that the wicked are left dead on the earth. Do you believe the wicked are left alive? What scripture shows that when Christ returns, the wicked are left alive and well on the earth?

Notice Matt. 24: 28. Jesus also compares it to what happened at the Flood and at the destruction of Sodom. In both these cases the people were left dead, not alive.