The problem with Jack Sequeiras Teachings...

[Twilight]

I spent some thoughtful time with the Lord on this one, asking for clarity on the teaching of sanctification from Jack Sequeira's teachings.

------------------------------

On the subject of true biblical sanctification:

Sanctification is a gift from God.

This is "imparted" to us or given to us, as we walk with God.

This sanctification process, this cleansing of our characters, is something we have to engage in, something we co-operate in.

God works in us and we co-operate willingly

---------------------------

JS teaches:

Sanctification is something that Jesus did.

You accept that "sanctification" by faith.

But it is not something you strive for, it does not become "personal" to you.

What this really is, is the removal of sanctification.

It is taking the idea of "justification" and labelling it as "sanctifation".

In effect removing it.

This is the issue, this is the attack (knowingly or unknowingly by JS), on the truths of Gods word.

------------------------------

So in summary, JS presents the idea:

Sanctification is not something you are involved in, it is something Jesus did in the past and you do not need to engage in it in the present.

You have complete sanctification now.

But when Jesus comes, He will apply the benefits of "sanctification" to you...

"Obedience" is not necessary right now...

Personal striving for sanctification is not necesary...

---------------------

The truth is, the Holy Spirit applies Sanctification to us now, moment by moment, as we exercise the gift of obedience.

Sanctification, biblical sanctification is the truth under attack in our Church by this teaching.

The idea that we can overcome in Christ is being attacked.

Why is that important?

Because the enemy knows God is preparing a people to go through the time of trouble.

These people would have experienced biblical sanctification and are the last great argument against Satan's lie, that a human cannot keep the Law..

Your thoughts?

God bless,

Mark

PS.

I posted this here for clarity.

[Gerr]

Phil 2:13 "for it is God who works in you, both to will and to work for his good pleasure."

Lk 13:24 "“Strive to enter through the narrow door. For many, I tell you, will seek to enter and will not be able."

Heb 4:11 "Let us therefore strive to enter that rest, so that no one may fall by the same sort of disobedience."

John 8:11 "She said, “No one, Lord.” And Jesus said, “Neither do I condemn you; go, and from now on sin no more.”

1 Jn 3:6 "No one who abides in him keeps on sinning; no one who keeps on sinning has either seen him or known him."

[skyblue888]

I spent some thoughtful time with the Lord on this one, asking for clarity on the teaching of sanctification from Jack Sequeira's teachings.

------------------------------

On the subject of true biblical sanctification:

Sanctification is a gift from God.

This is "imparted" to us or given to us, as we walk with God.

This sanctification process, this cleansing of our characters, is something we have to engage in, something we co-operate in.

God works in us and we co-operate willingly

---------------------------

JS teaches:

Sanctification is something that Jesus did.

You accept that "sanctification" by faith.

But it is not something you strive for, it does not become "personal" to you.

What this really is, is the removal of sanctification.

It is taking the idea of "justification" and labelling it as "sanctifation".

In effect removing it.

This is the issue, this is the attack (knowingly or unknowingly by JS), on the truths of Gods word.

------------------------------

So in summary, JS presents the idea:

Sanctification is not something you are involved in, it is something Jesus did in the past and you do not need to engage in it in the present.

You have complete sanctification now.

But when Jesus comes, He will apply the benefits of "sanctification" to you...

"Obedience" is not necessary right now...

Personal striving for sanctification is not necesary...

---------------------

The truth is, the Holy Spirit applies Sanctification to us now, moment by moment, as we exercise the gift of obedience.

Sanctification, biblical sanctification is the truth under attack in our Church by this teaching.

The idea that we can overcome in Christ is being attacked.

Why is that important?

Because the enemy knows God is preparing a people to go through the time of trouble.

These people would have experienced biblical sanctification and are the last great argument against Satan's lie, that a human cannot keep the Law..

Your thoughts?

God bless,

Mark

PS.

I posted this here for clarity.

I agree. This has been and will continue to be the issue. But there comes a time when those who do not believe this will be left behind having reached the point of no return. But for us who believe, and by faith take hold of the merits of Christ's sacrifice, the soul-cleansing blood is applied and we shall grow up into Christ until the full corn of His character is in the ear. Then the controversy will end and God will honor His people during the great time of trouble. None of the plagues shall come near them and He will translate them without seeing death.

sky

[Gail]

I've read it being described as a 3-part process:

We have been sanctified- We've been set apart as part of God's family: 1 Corinthians 1:2; 1 Cor.6:11; Heb.10:10

We are being sanctified by the truth- it is a growing and ongoing process- John 17:19; Heb.2:11

We will be sanctified when Jesus comes- The final cleansing and removal of our sinful natures (glorification) will be complete when Jesus returns in power and glory.

[Twilight]

Lk 13:24 "“Strive to enter through the narrow door. For many, I tell you, will seek to enter and will not be able."

This was the thought that came to me when I was seeking the Lords guidance, that we are to "strive".

This is really important for us to understand.

This "passive" false gospel removes this effort that we make in Christ's strength, that is the false part.

Mark :-)

[skyblue888]

"For this I also labor, striving according to His working, which worketh in me mightily." Col.1:29.

[Woody]

"You have shown that you are conservative, and that your ideas are narrow. " 5T 370

[Woody]

I've read it being described as a 3-part process:

We have been sanctified- We've been set apart as part of God's family: 1 Corinthians 1:2; 1 Cor.6:11; Heb.10:10

We are being sanctified by the truth- it is a growing and ongoing process- John 17:19; Heb.2:11

We will be sanctified when Jesus comes- The final cleansing and removal of our sinful natures (glorification) will be complete when Jesus returns in power and glory.

Excellent Gail. You really put it all together so simply here. Thanks for the clear light on the subject.

[Woody]

Avoid foolish questions, and genealogies, and contentions, and strivings about the law; for they are unprofitable and vain. Titus 3:9. {UL 270.1}

"Study to show thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth. But shun profane and vain babblings, for they will increase unto more ungodliness." The special, deceptive work of Satan has been to provoke controversies, that there might be strivings about words to no profit. He well knows that this will occupy the mind and the time. It raises the combativeness, and quenches the spirit of conviction, in the minds of many, drawing them into diversity of opinions, accusation, and prejudice, which closes the door to the truth. " {RH, September 11, 1888 par. 7}

"Pride of talent, pride of intellect, can not exist in hearts that are hid with Christ in God. There would be no strivings to let self stand forth conspicuously unless Deity and humanity combined had stood in the gap to stay the sentence of a broken law. Its penalty would have fallen, without abating a jot of its severity, upon the sinful. It fell on Jesus, the world's Redeemer, to give man another trial. Then let us humble ourselves, and adore Jesus, but never, never, exalt self in the least degree. God forbid that we should foster in ourselves independence. Make haste that none of us may occupy the fearful position of him for whom Christ died in vain." {RH, September 4, 1900 par. 12}

"And the servant of the Lord must not strive; but be gentle unto all men, apt to teach, patient, in meekness instructing those that oppose themselves; if God peradventure will give them repentance to the acknowledging of the truth." {AA 501.2}

[skyblue888]

Gail, you wrote:

We will be sanctified when Jesus comes- The final cleansing and removal of our sinful natures (glorification) will be complete when Jesus returns in power and glory.

******************

Gail, by "sanctified" you meant "glorified" as the saints will receive a new body at the coming of Jesus. As far as the work of sanctification is concerned, it will have been finished before Jesus appears in the clouds of Heaven. It is important to make that distinction because some, like Red for example, teach that our characters will be changed at the coming of Christ and they call that the work of sanctification!!!

your thoughts, Gail

sky :)

[Gail]

Oh, no- do I have to get into whether we will have our sinful natures at Christ's coming or not? LOL That's a whole 'nother topic!

[skyblue888]

Gail!!! what are you saying? of course our sinful bodies will be changed when Jesus returned. Thats not what I am talking about. I am asking you whether our characters need to be changed before He returns. Thats why I said you must have meant "glorified" and not "sanctified" if you were talking about character and not the body.

sky

[Woody]

A lot of sinners will be in heaven. This must change. In heaven there can be no sin. Sin must cease. So we will be changed so that we will no longer sin.

[Woody]

"Through the merits of the Redeemer, God accepts the efforts of sinful man in keeping His law, which is holy,just and good" Sons and Daughters of God p. 41

"It is God's design to restore that similitude by giving to man victory over sin and over every temptation. The restoration will be completed at the second coming." 7BC 649

"Perfection now is ours only in Christ, but the ultimate, all-comprehensive transformation of our lives into the image of God will take place at the Second Advent ...

Neither Christlike character traits nor faultess behaviour is the ground of our acceptance with God. Saving righteourness comes from the one righteous Man Jesus and is conveyed to us by the Holy Spirit. We can contribute nothing to Christ's gift of righteousness - we can only receive it. No one other than Christ is righteous; independent human righteousness is only filthy rags. " Seventh-Day Adventists Believe p. 145-6

"If you give yourself to Him, and accept Him as your Saviour, then, sinful as your life may have been, for His sake you are accounted righteous. Christ’s character stands in place of your character, and you are accepted before God just as if you had not sinned." CSA 30

[Twilight]

Originally Posted By: Twilight

I spent some thoughtful time with the Lord on this one, asking for clarity on the teaching of sanctification from Jack Sequeira's teachings.

------------------------------

On the subject of true biblical sanctification:

Sanctification is a gift from God.

This is "imparted" to us or given to us, as we walk with God.

This sanctification process, this cleansing of our characters, is something we have to engage in, something we co-operate in.

God works in us and we co-operate willingly

---------------------------

JS teaches:

Sanctification is something that Jesus did.

You accept that "sanctification" by faith.

But it is not something you strive for, it does not become "personal" to you.

What this really is, is the removal of sanctification.

It is taking the idea of "justification" and labelling it as "sanctifation".

In effect removing it.

This is the issue, this is the attack (knowingly or unknowingly by JS), on the truths of Gods word.

------------------------------

So in summary, JS presents the idea:

Sanctification is not something you are involved in, it is something Jesus did in the past and you do not need to engage in it in the present.

You have complete sanctification now.

But when Jesus comes, He will apply the benefits of "sanctification" to you...

"Obedience" is not necessary right now...

Personal striving for sanctification is not necesary...

---------------------

The truth is, the Holy Spirit applies Sanctification to us now, moment by moment, as we exercise the gift of obedience.

Sanctification, biblical sanctification is the truth under attack in our Church by this teaching.

The idea that we can overcome in Christ is being attacked.

Why is that important?

Because the enemy knows God is preparing a people to go through the time of trouble.

These people would have experienced biblical sanctification and are the last great argument against Satan's lie, that a human cannot keep the Law..

Your thoughts?

God bless,

Mark

PS.

I posted this here for clarity.

I agree. This has been and will continue to be the issue. But there comes a time when those who do not believe this will be left behind having reached the point of no return. But for us who believe, and by faith take hold of the merits of Christ's sacrifice, the soul-cleansing blood is applied and we shall grow up into Christ until the full corn of His character is in the ear. Then the controversy will end and God will honor His people during the great time of trouble. None of the plagues shall come near them and He will translate them without seeing death.

sky

Amen, it is these subtle false teachings that will lead many away.

This is so popular a teaching, it appeals to the carnal mind, I am sure it will gain wide support amongst many, who either do not want to overcome, or are frustrated because they cannot do it in their own strength...

The enemy has placed this teaching in all the other protestant churches, now it is our turn it seems.

Mark

[skyblue888]

"It is God's design to restore that similitude by giving to man victory over sin and over every temptation. The restoration will be completed at the second coming." 7BC 649

"Perfection now is ours only in Christ, but the ultimate, all-comprehensive transformation of our lives into the image of God will take place at the Second Advent ...

Neither Christlike character traits nor faultess behaviour is the ground of our acceptance with God. Saving righteourness comes from the one righteous Man Jesus and is conveyed to us by the Holy Spirit. We can contribute nothing to Christ's gift of righteousness - we can only receive it. No one other than Christ is righteous; independent human righteousness is only filthy rags. " Seventh-Day Adventists Believe p. 145-6

These two quotes are not from the pen of Ellen White, are they?

[Twilight]

I've read it being described as a 3-part process:

We have been sanctified- We've been set apart as part of God's family: 1 Corinthians 1:2; 1 Cor.6:11; Heb.10:10

We are being sanctified by the truth- it is a growing and ongoing process- John 17:19; Heb.2:11

We will be sanctified when Jesus comes- The final cleansing and removal of our sinful natures (glorification) will be complete when Jesus returns in power and glory.

Like this:

We have been justified (made righteous through the merits of Christs blood).

We are being sanctied through the truth. (This is the part JS removes in his teachings).

We are glorified when we receive our new bodies.

------------------

Only the second changes our characters.

Which is why this teaching is so dangerous.

Mark

[Woody]

I prefer what Gail posted. I don't think it needs to be picked apart. What she has posted is clearly what Seventh day Adventist believe.

[skyblue888]

Red, u didn't answer me! were these two quotes you posted from Ellen White or not? thanks

and Gail, you never meant that our characters will be changed at the second coming, did u? :)

[Gail]

No. I meant that the sinful natures that are our heritage from Adam's fall, that dog us through our earthly walk, will finally be healed.

[skyblue888]

Thanks Gail. That's what I thought.

[Twilight]

"It is God's design to restore that similitude by giving to man victory over sin and over every temptation. The restoration will be completed at the second coming." 7BC 649

The above is not a quote from SOP is it Redwood?

If not, it would be dishonest to present it as such.

Or hide it in a selection of SOP quotes, so that it looks like it is.

Mark

[Twilight]

Red, u didn't answer me! were these two quotes you posted from Ellen White or not? thanks

and Gail, you never meant that our characters will be changed at the second coming, did u?

And I doubt he will answer Sky, how many times have we seen this now?

Mark

[skyblue888]

Originally Posted By: skyblue888

I agree. This has been and will continue to be the issue. But there comes a time when those who do not believe this will be left behind having reached the point of no return. But for us who believe, and by faith take hold of the merits of Christ's sacrifice, the soul-cleansing blood is applied and we shall grow up into Christ until the full corn of His character is in the ear. Then the controversy will end and God will honor His people during the great time of trouble. None of the plagues shall come near them and He will translate them without seeing death.

sky [/quote']

Amen, it is these subtle false teachings that will lead many away.

This is so popular a teaching, it appeals to the carnal mind, I am sure it will gain wide support amongst many, who either do not want to overcome, or are frustrated because they cannot do it in their own strength...

The enemy has placed this teaching in all the other protestant churches, now it is our turn it seems.

Mark

Amen!

"Those who are loyal to the truth will, through the merits of Christ, overcome all weakness of character that has led them to be molded by every varying circumstances." 1 S.M.85.

"Still others who are condemned by the law will repent of their transgressions and, through faith in Christ's merits, will perfect Christian character." 1 S.M.31.

[Gail]

Originally Posted By: Gail

I've read it being described as a 3-part process:

We have been sanctified- We've been set apart as part of God's family: 1 Corinthians 1:2; 1 Cor.6:11; Heb.10:10

We are being sanctified by the truth- it is a growing and ongoing process- John 17:19; Heb.2:11

We will be sanctified when Jesus comes- The final cleansing and removal of our sinful natures (glorification) will be complete when Jesus returns in power and glory.

Like this:

We have been justified (made righteous through the merits of Christs blood).

We are being sanctied through the truth. (This is the part JS removes in his teachings).

We are glorified when we receive our new bodies.

The word "sanctified" is used in the verses I quoted.