Heh - Carrie Prejean

[Bravus]

Your point is that premarital sex is somehow less sinful than married gay sex. Christian theology does not agree with you on that point.

[Woody]

Sin is Sin. Both scripture and the SOP clearly state this. The effects may be different ... but in the eyes of the law and therefore ... God .... they are all equal.

[Dr. Shane]

Your point is that premarital sex is somehow less sinful than married gay sex.

No, that is not my point. In fact, while running an outreach ministry for gays, I made the point on several occasions that premarital sex is not less sinful than gay sex. I also made that point in my autobiography.

Carrie Prejean was thrust into the gay marriage debate. That is a separate but related topic to gay sex. Carrie Prejean was competing in a beauty contest, not studying to become an ordained minister. Having pre-marital sex does not disqualify one from winning a beauty contest.

If anyone is to blame for making her the face of gay marriage opposition it is the religious organizations like Focus On The Family. Yes, she went along with it but that was not her intention from the beginning. Her intention was to win a beauty contest. It was a gay rights activist that caused this entire course of events to happen.

However let's ask ourselves that if we have had pre-marital sex (like I have admitted to doing) does that disqualify me from later taking a stand against pre-marital sex? Does it disqualify me from taking a stand against other sinful behavior?

[Dr. Shane]

Sin is Sin.

The issue of gay marriage is a political one - not a religious one. The political opponents of Carrie Prejean want to turn it into a religious issue so they can focus on her personal life.

[Woody]

Good Point Shane.

[olger]

Originally Posted By: Redwood

Well ... she sure does look good.

And the Lord does forgive. I just don't understand her motivation to sue the pageant. Perhaps if she had no covetousness, her previous life may have been left only in the memory of the One willing to forgive.

Blessings!

Well spoken, Sir.

og

[olger]

Well, so much for the moral high ground she seemed to want people to see her as occupying...

Complete agreement from

olger

[Woody]

Some here have large imaginations or fantasies.

[phkrause]

Personally I don't consider gay marriage a political issue or a religious issue. It seems to me that its a moral issue.

pk

[olger]

Are we now condemning all Christians that get breast implants? Now if a woman gets breast implants she cannot be a Christian?

Sorry, I know Christians that have breast implants and I would never question their faith in God.

Of course, this thread is about the sex video she made with her boyfriend. Again, I have a problem with the pre-marital sex. I have no problem with the video. A lot of lovers make those kinds of videos. That is no big deal.

hmm...

[olger]

Are we now condemning all Christians that get breast implants? Now if a woman gets breast implants she cannot be a Christian?

Sorry, I know Christians that have breast implants and I would never question their faith in God.

Of course, this thread is about the sex video she made with her boyfriend. Again, I have a problem with the pre-marital sex. I have no problem with the video. A lot of lovers make those kinds of videos. That is no big deal.

Suffice it to say Shane, that kind of sensual vanity is NOT a forerunner of spiritual maturity.

I have had clients ask my opinion on breast implants. My answer "I would much rather see your value come from within, and your husband love you for who you are." I don't advise them.

g

[olger]

Some here have large imaginations or fantasies.

oG

[phkrause]

Like Solomon said, vanity, vanity, all is vanity. Very good statement. How vain we are.

pk

[Woody]

Quote:

Suffice it to say Shane, that kind of sensual vanity is NOT a forerunner of spiritual maturity.

Not ALL women have your level of maturity og

[olger]

Perhaps if Miss Prejean had been saving more of her moral energy for her own sexuality she wouldn't have been placed in the position of being a judge of other people's... which then came back to bite her.

Gotta agree with David on this one.

While I applaud her opposition to the homosexual lifestyle, the very fact that girls like that parade around in bikinis in front of millions is a HUGE blind spot.

indeed,

og

[phkrause]

:)

pk

[Neil D]

I think that is an important point. She was thrust into the debate. She was in a beauty contest - not exactly a moral crusade. Once thrust into the debate she did accept speaking invitation from moral crusaders like Focus on the Family but can we blame her for that?

"thrust into the debate"????

Guys, the beauty contest in question is THE Miss America pageant.

By the time the contestants get to this point, they have been groomed and answered [possible ] hard questions and done so quite well... She was a professional....at her job...representing California. When she was asked that question, she knew EXACTLY what she wanted to say and what was the RIGHT WAY to answer it. And she made a choice....and got burned for it.

And now, she's trying to get $$$$$$ from her "poor experience" with the Miss America Pageant. Well, I'm not that sorry for her...

[Dr. Shane]

While I applaud her opposition to the homosexual lifestyle, the very fact that girls like that parade around in bikinis in front of millions is a HUGE blind spot.

og

This is a point I have made over and over. Carrie Prejean did not place herself on any moral high ground. Competing in a beauty contest is a far cry from studying in a seminary. I don't think it should come as a surprise to many that a beauty contestant had pre-marital sex. I mean come on... is that a shocker?

[Dr. Shane]

she made a choice....and got burned for it.

Well,,, I don't think she got burned at all. Does anyone know who won the pageant? Or should I ask, does anyone care? Carrie Prejean has gotten much more by all the controversy she has stirred up than she would have gotten by winning Miss USA. This video may never be released but even if it is may help her out. Paris Hilton's and Pamela Anderson's home-sex videos certainly didn't hurt them. Arguably, they have benefited from them.

And it looks like she won the law suit between her and Miss USA California Pageant. She didn't win as much as she wanted but they ended up writing her a check - not the other way around.

[Tom Wetmore]

You are reading way too much into the settlement.

And actually the use of the video was nto blackmail. It's existence rasied a legitimate issue under her contract. Allowing herself to be videotaped in a sex act would go directly to her qualifications and ability to fulfill her duties as Miss California.

And seriously Shane, you find nothing wrong with making private porn?!?!? The risk of it not remaining private should be self-evident and reason enough to not do it.

[GreatLakesGramma]

Guys, the beauty contest in question is THE Miss America pageant.

No, it was the Miss USA pageant. It's not the same.

[Neil D]

Ok, I stand corrected....

[Dr. Shane]

Quote:

You are reading way too much into the settlement.

The Pageant was suing her for $5,000 for the implants. She then was counter-suing them for a violation of privacy. She walked away without paying for the implants and with the Pageant paying her legal fees. That sounds like she won.

Quote:

And actually the use of the video was nto blackmail. It's existence raised a legitimate issue under her contract. Allowing herself to be videotaped in a sex act would go directly to her qualifications

Technically that may have been true, depending on the wording of the contract. However that is something that certainly could have been argued in front of a jury. The tape that was made was for private use. That is of great contrast to the nude pictures of Vanessa Williams (Miss America 1984) that forced her to resign. Vanessa Williams actually posed nude for money and in sexual acts with another woman. Yet Vanessa had it right when she said, "the best revenge is success." If Carrie Prejean follows Venessa's path, her greatest success lies ahead.

[Woody]

Ok, I stand corrected....

Are you sitting or standing now?

[Tom Wetmore]

I'm wondering if you and some others would be as eager to stand up for her and defend her actions if she hadn't spoken out on gay marriage and conseqently so readily embraced by and adopted as a poster child for the anti-gay right wing crowd...

I strongly suspect that she would have been kicked to the curb and everyone would have walked right on by without a second thought...