Christian Dress & Adornment

[mikeyswen79]

Of all the subjects popular within Adventism today, perhaps no subject is more sore in people's hearts (especially those of my generation) than the issue of Christian dress and adornment.

I have been studying on this subject for quite some time now through Ellen White and Scripture, as well as works by Adventist theologians such as Bacchiocchi.

I have a problem, though: I've come to two contrasting conclusions:

- One could conclude that the wearing of jewelry is only wrong when the jewelry is expensive, worn for showing off, or worn for some other adverse purpose. With this in mind, it is possible for people to wear bracelets and necklaces without those desires in their heart (in my opinion).

- All jewelry should be avoided.

The reason why I feel these two conclusions can occur is because one could interpret all that Ellen White has to say on jewelry as her taking issue with the expensiveness of the jewelry and the pride of the people who wear it. In other words, Ellen White, in almost ALL of her statements, seems to be dealing with more extreme cases of jewelry.

In addition, Paul in scripture deals with the issue of adornment, lavishness, pride, and expensiveness. However, nowadays, one can easily find jewelry that is practically free! Many people wear necklaces for sentimental purposes or just to compliment their outfit. They do not appear to struggle with pride and certainly aren't dishing out hundreds of dollars to obtain jewelry.

Granted, jewelry will almost always be needless. Yet, so will many other items such as more elaborate hair clips, hair bands, scarves that are more decorative than functional, pins, ties, bows, etc. I find it a little short-sighted to only apply 'needless apparel' to jewelry. When people use that argument to condemn jewelry I feel that they need to be consistent with that thought in all their dress. Yet, for most Adventists, I find that only jewelry gets attacked.

What do you guys think about this issue? My experience has shown me that it seems as if the vast majority of those who oppose jewelry do so because of tradition and without having ever studied the issue in great detail. Even Bacchiocchi's work was questionable because I found my mind able to see through his arguments in his book by the same title as this topic.

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Concerning modesty, the biggest struggle with my generation is defining what modesty IS. Most, if not all, girls my age (college age) wear bikinis, go to the beach in jean shorts and tank tops, and have no struggles with wearing shorts, tank tops, etc... in normal situations if the weather permits. I used to think of this as just plain wrong but I'm at the point where I realize that perhaps I never thought about the issue for myself and simply was repeating what I had heard others say about dress. I still feel that dress codes should be followed in all situations but I realize that the vast majority of young people will not be concerned with skirt lengths (within reason, of course. The showing of the butt or underwear is just ridiculous in most people's minds) or shorts length. In fact, the issue is sore that some people have left Adventist colleges where people are more zealous about the dress code than others.

What are your guys' thoughts on the issue of modesty?

P.S. Concerning my own personal conclusions on the subject of modest dress and jewelry, I am undecided.

[karl]

Nudity is normal in nudist camps. Anything else would attract attention.

Long dresses and bonnets are normal in Amish circles. Anything else would attract attention.

Can we conclude you are somewhere in the middle? If people notice what you have on before they notice you, you may have a problem. However, you want to be careful who you hang out with. If it's nudists...

We are witnesses for Christ, not for Nike or Revlon or Playboy or Kay jewelers.

[Gerr]

The best thing I could probably say about this well-worn out issue is for some statement about good taste, what we can afford, and modesty. But not to be forgotten is the need for the spreading of the gospel, and all the needs of broken humanity all around us. Then let the Holy Spirit speak to each about the details. What is said about jewelry and dress could be applied to all our possessions - cars, houses, etc.

[mikeyswen79]

I didn't meqn to say that hairbands or hair clips were somehow "bad", what I was meaning is that I have seen very elaborate (and probably) expensive hair clips, perhaps made out of gold for instance, on those who would oppose jewelry.

I am 20 years old.

I'm having a hard time formulating an opinion on how I feel about anything regarding modesty because it is largely subjective what people find modest or immodest. (example: in America miniskirts don't seem to be a big deal, but in Turkey and Egypt it's a horrible idea to wear those kinds of garments).

Regarding jewelry the only thing that is clear to me is that expensiveness and wearing it for attention-getting is wrong. Beyond that, I cannot say, I await clear guidance from the holy spirit on this issue.

[oldsailor29]

I have adorned my wife with a modest amount of jewels, a brooch and a ring total worth of which is only about 2K, but she chooses not to wear them in public.

[Dr. Shane]

I use to be 100% against the use of jewelry. My wife was too. We were both very conservative Adventists. As I studied the Bible more I was troubled that the areas that seemed to speak against jewelry also spoke against such things as pride and hairstyles. So my wife and I did an in-depth study of the issue. The conclusion we came to is that the warnings against jewelry are warnings against materialism. It is all about breaking the First Commandment. Today we use inexpensive jewelry and give it away as gifts.

The matter of dress is very cultural. I don't think we should dress provocatively. I think far too many women today are dressing like only prostitutes would have 50 years ago. There is a good selection of fine clothing that does not require a woman to show everything that only her husband should be seeing.

[karl]

Hosea 2:13 And I will visit upon her the days of Baalim, wherein she burned incense to them, and she decked herself with her earrings and her jewels, and she went after her lovers, and forgat me, saith the LORD.

Self adornment is a symptom of leaving our allegience to God.

Walking humbly with God is incompatible with strutting our stuff.

Isn't the removal of jewelry something His people did when they were seeking the Lord? I know Jacob had his family take off their jewelry when they were seeking the Lord's favor.

[The Searcher]

Dear Friends,

As I have thought about the issue two things come to mind. One, when I look in the mirror am I dressing to make an impact with the opposite sex? Or am I dressing to accent my sexuality? Or am I dressing in order to glorify God?

Two: Am I my brothers keeper? Is what I am wearing going to put a stumbling block before others? Christ tells us that it would be better for a person to put a millstone about their neck, then to cause the least of His children to stumble. He also declares that nothing which sins or is a cause for stumbling will be in heaven.

Women, does a revealing dress put a stumbling block before your brothers in the faith? Men, does your clothing put a stumbling block before your sisters? God will hold each of us responsible for anything which places a temptation before others or causes another to stumble. We cannot just dress as we please and expect God will just hold the other's responsible for their thoughts or actions. God will also hold the person responsible who brings the temptation. We are to do nothing which brings temptation to another. Caveat: within reason. Scooping neck lines, short length skirts and dresses for women, tight-fitting clothes or revealing clothing of any kind for both men and women. Jeans which fall-off at the slightest disturbance are probably not a good item of wear.

Dress appropriately, tastefully, and in such a way so that men and women who see you glorify the God whom you serve.

And the same applies to jewelry. Does what I wear glorify God or not? Will it cause others to be tempted. Romans 14 is the applicable source.

I have nothing against jewelry nor clothing. Rather, I must remember that I am my brothers keeper. I should dress, act, and speak in such a way as to glorify God. That is the ultimate criteria for all that I do, speak, and wear.

Sincerely,

The Seeker

[rudywoofs (Pam)]

slightly

This thread reminds me of the one about the expensive cars that people buy and that the men ooh and ahh over out in the church parking lot.

[Woody]

Big men need big toys.

[Dr. Shane]

Materialism isn't just a symptom, it is leaving God. It is violating the First Commandment. In Biblical times, materialism was commonly manifested through self-adornment. Today it has many more manifestations: Big-screen TVs, boats, snowmobiles, jet skis, fancy cars, Iphones, Blackberries and the list can go on and on.

[Gerr]

Just tagging on.

Here is how screwed up our thinking has become about jewelry. I can put a lei made of flowers around my neck, but will probably get flack for wearing some trinkets around my neck. Put a flower on my wife's hair or dress, but try a shiny piece of metal or polished rock!

[Woody]

Materialism isn't just a symptom, it is leaving God. It is violating the First Commandment. In Biblical times, materialism was commonly manifested through self-adornment. Today it has many more manifestations: Big-screen TVs, boats, snowmobiles, jet skis, fancy cars, Iphones, Blackberries and the list can go on and on.

Please define how big is big for big screens. I enjoy my 'big' screen.

[rudywoofs (Pam)]

Originally Posted By: Shane

Materialism isn't just a symptom, it is leaving God. It is violating the First Commandment. In Biblical times, materialism was commonly manifested through self-adornment. Today it has many more manifestations: Big-screen TVs, boats, snowmobiles, jet skis, fancy cars, Iphones, Blackberries and the list can go on and on.

Please define how big is big for big screens. I enjoy my 'big' screen.

Probably bigger than 45 inches. j/k

I think it all depends on the use for which something is intended and if you can afford something or not. I can't afford most things. If Newly hadn't been given to me, I wouldn't have been able to afford him. But the companionship and love that I get from having a dog again is worth more to me than most anything else.

I think God likes his children to have pleasure. I think it makes Him happy.

[SivartM]

Discussions about adornment make me think of neckties.

Why are cloth necklaces allowed (almost required, actually) but not necklaces with rocks?

[Daryl]

Where did this idea of wearing neckties for work and for church come from and why?

In other words, I can see the practical purpose for wearing a watch, but what is practical purpose for wearing the necktie?

[Woody]

Quote:

Probably bigger than 45 inches. j/k

Whoops. I've got a 48 inch. I guess that puts me over the top and makes me a sinner.

[Dr. Shane]

Please define how big is big for big screens. I enjoy my 'big' screen.

I would say that if it has to be financed, we shouldn't be buying it. That goes for jewelry, boats, ATVs, campers, TVs, motorcycles and in most cases even cars.

[Outta Here]

Neckties function subliminally: They draw attention to the wearer. Just as necklaces are designed to draw attention to a woman's bosom, a tie is designed to draw attention to where the necktie points.

And that's all I'm gonna say on that...

[Gerr]

Hmmmmmmmmmmmm. I never thought of THAT!

[Woody]

Now Now. This is a family channel.

[phkrause]

Neckties function subliminally: They draw attention to the wearer. Just as necklaces are designed to draw attention to a woman's bosom, a tie is designed to draw attention to where the necktie points.

And that's all I'm gonna say on that...

oy vey, I don't think that I'll touch that one!

pk

[Guest]

I always wear my jacket so they can't tell where the tie is pointing.

[Woody]

I wear a bolo tie and it flares out and point in two directions ... towards each leg.

[Dr. Shane]

I prefer to wear my bow tie but my wife likes it better when I wear a regular tie. I have many decorative ties. Some for Christmas, Patriotic holidays, Thanksgiving, Loony Tunes, Spider-man and of course construction ties. [tic] I wear them because they draw attention to me and make me look much more handsome than I do without them.