The Sin Against the Spirit

[MariaS]

Sky, are you still comunicating with the Indonesian woman?

Gerry, Richard do still have MM for a companion but it will not be long before MM has another additional companion.

Gerry and Sky,

God has 1001 ways to fulfilled the desire of our heart. The world is too small to be confined to just our own place. I have travelled to Europe and also the USA..so meeting anyone from the other part of the world is nothing new under the sun.

I was a very skeptical person about meeting someone online because I did not understand the process, the do's and don'ts. I saw my friends who were not able to find the right adventist men here and accepted one from the other part of the world with initial meeting on syberspace are happily married now and serving the Lord together. That changed my entire view and perception.

I will be worried if I met a man on a night club and he is living just next door, whom the following sabbath I notice him going to church. (Living next to each other but meet in a wrong place eventhough profess to be a christian) I would rather want someone living thousands of miles away, especially when our personality is matching and the relationship will bring honor to God and blessings to each other. Its worth the waiting. (I believe though, that there will be lots of trust and sacrifice to be made..chalanges are greater).

The point is, if we believe God has made it possible to lead two to be together, the world is too small and if God can bring spiritual blessings accros the world on syberspace, why can't He does the same for two person to meet with the same channel who had prayed for the right person.

What say you?

[Gerr]

A grape juice toast to both of you and your happiness!!!

[MariaS]

Thank you Gerry,

Blessings to you and family

[skyblue888]

Sky, are you still comunicating with the Indonesian woman?

Gerry, Richard do still have MM for a companion but it will not be long before MM has another additional companion.

Gerry and Sky,

God has 1001 ways to fulfilled the desire of our heart. The world is too small to be confined to just our own place. I have travelled to Europe and also the USA..so meeting anyone from the other part of the world is nothing new under the sun.

I was a very skeptical person about meeting someone online because I did not understand the process, the do's and don'ts. I saw my friends who were not able to find the right adventist men here and accepted one from the other part of the world with initial meeting on syberspace are happily married now and serving the Lord together. That changed my entire view and perception.

I will be worried if I met a man on a night club and he is living just next door, whom the following sabbath I notice him going to church. (Living next to each other but meet in a wrong place eventhough profess to be a christian) I would rather want someone living thousands of miles away, especially when our personality is matching and the relationship will bring honor to God and blessings to each other. Its worth the waiting. (I believe though, that there will be lots of trust and sacrifice to be made..chalanges are greater).

The point is, if we believe God has made it possible to lead two to be together, the world is too small and if God can bring spiritual blessings accros the world on syberspace, why can't He does the same for two person to meet with the same channel who had prayed for the right person.

What say you?

Maria

_________

No I am not communicating with her anymore. I don't know what happened to her. No, I have no problem with the idea of meeting someone online but there are so many formalities involved in case you fall in love with someone and the financial cost is sky high! no pun intended! hehe

So Maria, did you meet with Richard online first or you met him in church when you came to the US?

sky

[Guest]

Why is the finacial cost sky high if you fall in love?

[Woody]

Oh my. That would fill books Richard.

[Tom Wetmore]

Well, I must say that reading through this topic thus far leaves me with the impression of yet another grand adventure in missing the point... Or is it more a willful avoidance of the point?

The quote that is the OP is troubling to me because I think it misses and misapplies the point that Jesus was making by saying, “The sin against the Holy Ghost is the sin of persistent refusal to respond to the invitation to repent.” That would leave one with the mistaken belief that one could exhaust the patience of the Holy Spirit by delaying repentance too long.

Read the text in its full context. The Holy Spirit of God was upon Jesus and he healed many and cast out demons. The Pharisees rejected that the Power manifest in these miracles was from God and condemned them as works of the Devil. That was blasphemy. It was calling the Holy Spirit the Devil. That is what Jesus was talking about. To broaden the concept of sinning against the Holy Spirit beyond that is troubling to me and has caused far too much unnecessary anxiety and undermines our absolute assurance of salvation.

(EGW elsewhere does make this clear - - “What constitutes the sin against the Holy Ghost? It is willfully attributing to Satan the work of the Holy Spirit.” - 5T 634. So perhaps the problem with the OP is that it wasn’t the best answer or choice to speak about the unpardonable sin.)

[MariaS]

Thanks Tom,

This thread is about the Sin Againts the Spirit and not relationship. I suggest we go back to the topic.

My last comment to sky, Indonesian woman are humble and can be a good wife..I am sorry that you lost tract of her. Regarding me and Richard whether we met online, the answer both YES and NO..should you want to know further including how a relationship should not cost a sky high expenses and etc...write me a PM.

God Bess

[Woody]

Hmmm.

I'm confused.

(but then that happens frequently so don't be alarmed)

[MariaS]

You do always confuse Woody,

wake up bro..

[Woody]

You do always confuse Woody,

wake up bro..

Sorry. It's not time to wake up. It's time to go to bed.

Good night.

[MariaS]

well, go to sleep than and wake up tomorrow renewed in mind and behave well..you are off the beat sometimes.

[MariaS]

Mat 24:13 But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.

Amen!!!!

[Guest]

Conscience is the voice of God, heard amid the conflict of human passions; when it is resisted, the Spirit of God is grieved.

Men have the power to quench the Spirit of God; the power of choosing is left with them. They are allowed freedom of action. They may be obedient through the name and grace of our Redeemer, or they may be disobedient, and realize the consequences.

The sin of blasphemy against the Holy Spirit does not lie in any sudden word or deed; it is the firm, determined resistance of truth and evidence. {FLB 58}

It is not necessary that anyone should yield to the temptations of Satan and thus violate his conscience and grieve the Holy Spirit. Every provision has been made in the Word of God whereby all may have divine help in their endeavors to overcome. {AG 81.3}

[MariaS]

Conscience is the voice of God, heard amid the conflict of human passions; when it is resisted, the Spirit of God is grieved.

Men have the power to quench the Spirit of God; the power of choosing is left with them. They are allowed freedom of action. They may be obedient through the name and grace of our Redeemer, or they may be disobedient, and realize the consequences.

The sin of blasphemy against the Holy Spirit does not lie in any sudden word or deed; it is the firm, determined resistance of truth and evidence. {FLB 58}

It is not necessary that anyone should yield to the temptations of Satan and thus violate his conscience and grieve the Holy Spirit. Every provision has been made in the Word of God whereby all may have divine help in their endeavors to overcome. {AG 81.3}

Amen to this sweetheart..especially the second paragraph (RED). Thank you for sharing it here!!!

[doug yowell]

Conscience is the voice of God, heard amid the conflict of human passions; when it is resisted, the Spirit of God is grieved.

This is simply an incredibly profound description of the everyday battle between what we tell ourselves we are and what God says we can and should be. Those who resist the call of God thru their conscience will become more of what they are and "condemned already". We discussed this in last week's SS lesson on guilt. Guilt is a spiritual nerve ending that indicates that there is still life left in the conscience. This should give the guilty hope for a cure.Choosing to ignore the pain indicators will eventually have irreversible results.

[Guest]

Choosing to ignore the pain indicators will eventually have irreversible results.

You are absolutely right Doug. Very well put also!

[Musicman1228]

Conscience is the voice of God, heard amid the conflict of human passions; when it is resisted, the Spirit of God is grieved.

Men have the power to quench the Spirit of God; the power of choosing is left with them. They are allowed freedom of action. They may be obedient through the name and grace of our Redeemer, or they may be disobedient, and realize the consequences.

The sin of blasphemy against the Holy Spirit does not lie in any sudden word or deed; it is the firm, determined resistance of truth and evidence. {FLB 58}

It is not necessary that anyone should yield to the temptations of Satan and thus violate his conscience and grieve the Holy Spirit. Every provision has been made in the Word of God whereby all may have divine help in their endeavors to overcome. {AG 81.3}

Nicely put, Richard, and all true. But there is more. I asked myself, "Why would Jesus get so upset over someone blaspheming the Holy Spirit, and yet not be upset if someone disagreed with what He was saying?"

I believe the answer lays in the relationship that exists between the family members of the Godhead. Jesus knew who He was-the Son of God. He knew who is Father and Mother were-The Most High and the Holy Spirit (Luke 1:35). As with most sons Jesus had a special relationship with His Mother; after all it is she that taught Him about who He was and what He had been sent to earth to accomplish (Jesus did not learn this from Mary).

I think the reason that Jesus said what He did about blaspheming the Holy Spirit stems from this intimate relationship, because Jesus knew that when He left earth He would send the Holy Spirit to act in His place in teaching His brothers and sisters the truth (Rev.12:17). When someone 'claims' that information and inspiration comes from the Holy Spirit and that information is false, then what they are doing is saying that the Holy Spirit gave them false or misleading information. God does not give information based in any way shape or form on lies or deceit, He deals only in TRUTH. So if someone makes a statement that the Holy Spirit taught them 'this', or showed them 'that', and 'this or that' turns out to be a lie, and persist in this belief, it is THEN that they have grieved the Holy Spirit away.

It is much more common than people imagine, because people are gullible and many will believe anything they are told by someone that claims to be of God. Jesus spoke directly to His disciples about this, and we should take what He said to heart so we will not be deceived:

And Jesus answered them, “See that no one leads you astray. For many will come in my name, saying, ‘I am the Christ,’ (stating that Jesus is the Christ) and they will lead many astray. Matt.24:4-5.

[doug yowell]

How in the world does that fit in with what the sin against the (mother of Jesus??!!!)Spirit is,MM?

[Guest]

Nicely put, Richard, and all true. But there is more. I asked myself, "Why would Jesus get so upset over someone blaspheming the Holy Spirit, and yet not be upset if someone disagreed with what He was saying?"

He never said it upset Him. He just told what would happen. It doesn't matter whether you reject the Holy Spirit, or reject Jesus. The result is the same.

[Musicman1228]

I am not surprised that you don't see a connection between Jesus and the Holy Spirit that would cause Jesus to say what He did. Jesus did not teach in 'sound bites'. You have to consider how He presented the whole topic and not just rely on one verse to give His theology.

Jesus identified the issues that led up to the 'blaspheme against the Holy Spirit' quote very clearly as being in response to the Pharisees accusing Him of casting out demons by using demons. Jesus knew that when He cast out demons it was by the power of the Holy Spirit; so this essentially meant that the Pharisees were saying that the Holy Spirit was in fact a demon that was responsible for casting out evil spirits. This was expressed by Jesus in saying "A kingdom divided against itself cannot stand", and "A kingdom divided against itself is laid waste." And then Jesus told them directly who it was that provided Him with the power to cast out demons; "But if it is by the Spirit of God that I cast out demons, then the kingdom of God has come upon you." (Matt.12:28).

"Or how can someone enter a strong man's house and plunder his goods, unless he first binds the strong man? Then indeed he may plunder his house. Whoever is not with me is against me, and whoever does not gather with me scatters." Matt.12:29-30.

Even thought Jesus didn't say He was upset about this in so many words it is readily apparent (at least to me) that this slight, this accusation against the Holy Spirit irked Him, so much so that He stated clearly that making this unfounded accusation against the Holy Spirit would not be tolerated AT ALL by God. In fact, saying that the Holy Spirit was demonic in nature and this allow Jesus to cast out demons was about as bad as it could get as far as Jesus was concerned.

[karl]

Quote:

He knew who is Father and Mother were-The Most High and the Holy Spirit (Luke 1:35).....I think the reason that Jesus said what He did about blaspheming the Holy Spirit stems from this intimate relationship,

I think Jesus said what He did because He was alerting us to a profound need which MUST be met in order for each individual to be saved. We MUST be convicted of our sinful nature and of our need for Holy Spirit Power to combat it. We MUST filled with the Holy Spirit.

Not by might, nor by power, but by My Spirit saith the Lord.

God alone can transform us. Christ breathed on His disciples, and said, "Receive ye the Holy Ghost" (John 20:22). This is the great gift of heaven. Christ imparted to them through the Spirit His own sanctification.

[Musicman1228]

Quote:

He knew who is Father and Mother were-The Most High and the Holy Spirit (Luke 1:35).....I think the reason that Jesus said what He did about blaspheming the Holy Spirit stems from this intimate relationship,

I think Jesus said what He did because He was alerting us to a profound need which MUST be met in order for each individual to be saved. We MUST be convicted of our sinful nature and of our need for Holy Spirit Power to combat it. We MUST filled with the Holy Spirit.

Not by might, nor by power, but by My Spirit saith the Lord.

God alone can transform us. Christ breathed on His disciples, and said, "Receive ye the Holy Ghost" (John 20:22). This is the great gift of heaven. Christ imparted to them through the Spirit His own sanctification.

Jesus also said, "Sanctify them with the truth, Your words are truth." John 17:17.

Jesus DID NOT say, "Sanctify them with My sanctification." Yet this is what most Christians believe. Sad.

[karl]

Jesus also said, "Sanctify them with the truth, Your words are truth." John 17:17.

Jesus DID NOT say, "Sanctify them with My sanctification." Yet this is what most Christians believe. Sad.

How would having the Mind of Christ be any different from having His sanctification? Let this mind be in you, which was also in Jesus Christ.

God's Words are the expression of His Mind, so I can certainly see a parallel between being sanctified with the Words of Christ and being sanctified by the Mind of Christ.

Jesus said two things that shed light on this:

1. And for their sakes I sanctify myself, that they also might be sanctified through the truth.

2. I am the Way, the Truth and the Life.

[Guest]

Amen karl!! Where you been?