My Faith: Why I don't sing the 'Star Spangled Banner'

[Stan]

CNN SOURCE

Mark Schloneger is pastor of Springdale Mennonite Church in Waynesboro, Virginia.

By Mark Schloneger, Special to CNN

I choose to belong to a strange tribe. Goshen College, my alma mater, made national news this month when its board of directors decided that the “Star Spangled Banner” would not be played before athletic events.

As could be expected, the decision was met with confusion and contempt. Wasn’t this just another example of our traditional values being trampled by the unrelenting march of political correctness? What sort of ingrates object to our nation’s anthem, anyway? Fluffy-headed campus philosophers? Lazy latte-sipping liberals?

The decision not to play the national anthem reversed last year’s decision to play it for the first time in Goshen College’s 116-year history. That, too, caught the media’s attention.

It also caused widespread concern and confusion among the college’s students, professors, alumni, supporters and, yes, donors - many of whom felt like playing the anthem compromised the college’s Christian values.

Goshen is a small school in northern Indiana that's owned and operated as a ministry of Mennonite Church USA. I am a Goshen graduate, a longtime member of the Mennonite Church and the pastor of a Mennonite congregation.

Mennonites live in countries all over the world. Though we speak many languages, have different ethnic origins, and express our faith in diverse ways, we all claim the Anabaptists in 16th century Europe as our spiritual ancestors.

The Anabaptists agreed with most of the ideas of the Protestant Reformation but felt that reformers like Martin Luther and John Calvin didn't go far enough. Anabaptists rejected the practice of infant baptism, for instance, believing that water baptism should be reserved for believers who confess a faith in Jesus.

Because they understood the exercise of state power to be inconsistent with the church’s identity and mission, Anabaptists also advocated for the strict separation of church and state. This then-radical stance was prompted by both theology and necessity: Anabaptists had the distinct notoriety of being tortured and killed by both Catholics and Protestants wielding the power of the state against them.

Instead of compromising their core convictions about what it means to follow Jesus, thousands of Anabaptist men and women adhered to their freedom of conscience even as they were mocked by neighbors, burned at stakes and drowned in rivers.

Although there certainly are diverse viewpoints among individual Mennonites today, we continue to advocate for the strict separation of church and state. Most Mennonite churches do not have flags inside them, and many Mennonites are uncomfortable with the ritual embedded in the singing of the national anthem.

That’s because we recognize only one Christian nation, the church, the holy nation that is bound together by a living faith in Jesus rather than by man-made, blood-soaked borders.

To Mennonites, a living faith in Jesus means faithfully living the way of Jesus. Jesus called his disciples to love their enemies and he loved his enemies all the way to the cross and beyond. Following Jesus and the martyrs before us, we testify with our lives that freedom is not a right that is granted or defended with rockets’ red glare and bombs bursting in air. True freedom is given by God, and it is indeed not free. It comes with a cost, and it looks like a cross.

It’s a strange tribe to which I belong, and sometimes it’s hard to be strange. We struggle to be inclusive in our welcome yet passionate in our identity. Our desire for acceptance, for approval, is strong, and we don’t always live up to the convictions that we set before us.

We must repent of that, for the world cannot know of its brokenness and hopelessness without a people who show a holistic way of life. The world cannot know that there is an alternative to violence and war without a people of peace making peace. The world cannot know that the weak and the vulnerable are cared for by God without a people practicing an economy centered on sharing and mutual aid.

The world cannot know the unsurpassable worth of human life without a people who consistently work to protect it - in the fetus, in the convict, in the immigrant, in the soldier, and in the enemy.

These convictions do not reflect ingratitude or hatred for our country. Rather, they reflect a deep love for the church and a passionate desire for the church to be the church.

Mennonite beliefs and practices seem bizarre to some and offensive to others. But it’s life in this strange tribe that keeps me faithful to what I believe. I love my country, but I sing my loyalty and pledge my allegiance to Jesus alone.

The opinions expressed in this commentary are solely those of Mark Schloneger.

[Stan]

Please don't post if you want to turn this political.

[miz3]

1. I don't believe it is possible to have a "separation of church and state". It is impossible!

2. The Constitution of the United States of America does not mandate or even conceptually demand the "separation of church and state".

3. The Star Spangled Banner is a cultural, political, etc. ritual of support for our United States Government and the community which it comprises. Its a "ritual".

4. I believe the government should be extremely limited in its ability to impose on the "church", "religion", etc. It is impossible to make this zero but it should be a low intrusive value.

5. The United States of America was founded and formed on the general basis of Protestant Christian Standards as found in the Bible. As such this affects the way the government does its business. This should always be the basis of our government.

6. No church or religious body should be mandated to engage in what I would term "governmental rituals" such as the playing of the Star Spangled Banner at events. Thus, the Mennonites should not be castigated as NOT PATRIOTIC because they do not play the National Anthem. As long as they do not do anything illegal they are perfectly free to NOT PLAY THE ANTHEM! Whether you play it or not is not a legal matter.

7. The government should not impose itself on anyone or any group from saying a prayer even if that prayer is made on "public property"!

I have more to say but this is my start!

[Gordon1]

Anabaptists have Sabbath-keeping in their roots.

[rudywoofs (Pam)]

Very interesting about Goshen College. I'll have to ask my cousin. He's a professor there.

[Stan]

It was Mennonites who first challenged me on where my Citizenship is at, and if we server two masters..

New International Version (©1984)

But our citizenship is in heaven. And we eagerly await a Saviour from there, the Lord Jesus Christ

http://bible.cc/philippians/3-20.htm

Please keep politics out of this. This principal of this is not about the US Anthem and more than it is about the Zaire Anthem.

[John317]

The Mennonites and the Jehovah's Witnesses would be in agreement on this. The JW won't even pledge allegience to the American flag.

I don't agree with them-- I am glad to pledge allegience to my flag and to sing the Star Spangled Banner-- but I respect their right to make the decision they made. I am glad our government does not have the power to compel people to sing the national anthem or to pledge allegience to the flag or vote.

Yes, our citizenship is in heaven, but as Romans 13 teaches, we are also to be good citizens of the nations in which we live. And I consider the Mennonites and the Jehovah's Witnesses to be good citizens.

[Gerr]

I fail to see how singing the national anthem violates ANY of the 10 commandments.

[John317]

This principal of this is not about the US Anthem and more than it is about the Zaire Anthem.

What's the Zaire Anthem?

[rudywoofs (Pam)]

There is no Zaire anymore..

[phkrause]

What's the Zaire Anthem?

As rudywoofs mentioned it no longer exists. I think they changed its name? But it was a country in Africa.

[Dr. Rich]

It was Mennonites who first challenged me on where my Citizenship is at, and if we server two masters..

New International Version (©1984)

But our citizenship is in heaven. And we eagerly await a Saviour from there, the Lord Jesus Christ

http://bible.cc/philippians/3-20.htm

Please keep politics out of this. This principal of this is not about the US Anthem and more than it is about the Zaire Anthem.

Stan, and they had a right to challenge you on this issue. I have been mocked by many for my educated opinon and understanding of what truth is, but so be it. I too have stayed seated while everyone stood for the anthem as also the pledge of allagence. I totally agree with what what written here, both the inital post and how hard it is to keep politics out of religion.

Jesus said that His Kingdom is not of this 'realm' and we can't serve two masters. I agree with both. Rev. 13 says that ALL of the world will follow after the beast. What is missing are those who are NOT of this world. They are the few who belong in the Kingdom of Heaven.

[miz3]

Daniel did a pretty good job of "serving God" and also "serving the King of Babylon"!

Its all there in the Book of Daniel you know the one that has all those SDA prophecies.

Daniel gave and spoke allegiance to God and also to the Babylonian Kingdom!

I believe Daniel was Prime Minister? Hmmm!

I don't think those that don't sing the American National Anthem and who don't Pledge Allegiance to the Flag are any more Godly, or more Christian, or more Saved, or are more Holy than those of us who do sing and pledge.

Jesus Christ Himself, told the healed lepers to go to the proper Jewish Authorities in order make their healing legal!

Jesus Christ told the people they must obey the Jewish Authorities and be good Jews even though those Jewish Leaders were hypocrites. He also told the people not to be hypocrites like the Jewish Leaders.

Now if you do NOT want to sing or pledge that is your privilege. You have every legal right to choose that. What you do NOT have the right to do is:

TO PAINT THE REST OF US WHO DO AS SOMEHOW BEING DISLOYAL TO GOD IN ANY WAY, SHAPE, OR FORM! NOR DO YOU HAVE THE RIGHT TO CLAIM YOU ARE MORE HOLY, MORE SAVED, MORE LOYAL THAN THE REST OF HUMANITY!

[miz3]

Again, Daniel did not keep His Religion and His Politics SEPARATE!

No true Christian keeps his Religion and Politics separate! Like Daniel True Christians live their Religion and Politics in harmony!

John the Baptist did too. He lost his head because he mixed religion with his politics!

Jesus Christ mixed religion and politics! Read the Gospels it is all over the place.

I know Dr. Rich does not like Paul, but Paul mixed his religion with politics.

You see it is not possible to "separate church and state". Why? Because everyone has a "religion" of some kind even if they deny it is so. Their "religion" will always and I mean always dictate what their politics will be.

Sorry about that! It is just a fact of human existence!

Whether you want to or not "religion and politics" are married for the entire life of human existence both as "individuals" and as "groups".

You can't say, "I won't participate"! Why? Because the very essence of your "non participation" is in itself a participation in the mixing of "religion and politics"!

[miz3]

The only thing to dicker about is what the configuration of the religion and politics will be!

For example:

Some pledge and sing!

Others DO NOT pledge and sing!

Regardless of which configuration you are you still are mixing religion and politics. Or more precisely, mixing "church and state"!

The "church" does not have to be formalized or organized to be a church!

[rudywoofs (Pam)]

Daniel did a pretty good job of "serving God" and also "serving the King of Babylon"!

Its all there in the Book of Daniel you know the one that has all those SDA prophecies.

Daniel gave and spoke allegiance to God and also to the Babylonian Kingdom!

I believe Daniel was Prime Minister? Hmmm!

I don't think those that don't sing the American National Anthem and who don't Pledge Allegiance to the Flag are any more Godly, or more Christian, or more Saved, or are more Holy than those of us who do sing and pledge.

Jesus Christ Himself, told the healed lepers to go to the proper Jewish Authorities in order make their healing legal!

Jesus Christ told the people they must obey the Jewish Authorities and be good Jews even though those Jewish Leaders were hypocrites. He also told the people not to be hypocrites like the Jewish Leaders.

Now if you do NOT want to sing or pledge that is your privilege. You have every legal right to choose that. What you do NOT have the right to do is:

TO PAINT THE REST OF US WHO DO AS SOMEHOW BEING DISLOYAL TO GOD IN ANY WAY, SHAPE, OR FORM! NOR DO YOU HAVE THE RIGHT TO CLAIM YOU ARE MORE HOLY, MORE SAVED, MORE LOYAL THAN THE REST OF HUMANITY!

perhaps the light has not dawned on them yet

[cricket]

The question that boggles the mind: Why, then, does this college accept federal aid in the form of tuition/room/board payments from students?

[miz3]

cricket,

Now that little fact is interesting!

[miz3]

Goshen College indeed does receive Federal Financial Aid.

Here is the proof:

http://www.goshen.edu/financialaid/#estimator

I guess cricket you question is a good one.

SDA believe in "separation of church and state" and their Colleges and Universities also receive Federal Financial Aid. However, SDA do fly the flag in their churches, on their educational institutions and in many of those same sites sing the National Anthem and recite the Pledge of Allegiance.

[Dr. Rich]

Goshen College indeed does receive Federal Financial Aid.

Here is the proof:

http://www.goshen.edu/financialaid/#estimator

I guess cricket you question is a good one.

SDA believe in "separation of church and state" and their Colleges and Universities also receive Federal Financial Aid. However, SDA do fly the flag in their churches, on their educational institutions and in many of those same sites sing the National Anthem and recite the Pledge of Allegiance.

Miz3, that does not prove that the college has received REAL government aid as I have investigated this myself and the so called Federal aid is PRIVATE money and has absolutly no government funds involved.

A student loan from a 'Federal Student Lone' is also from a private source and does NOT involve any Federal Government money at all!

Remember, Fanny May is a private corporation, so is Federal Express and the Federal Reserve System/Bank.

[Dr. Rich]

Daniel was taken as a slave and slaves are NOT free to choose. Daniel proves a point in that Daniel chose to obey God rather than the government. Sure, Daniel got promoted because of the King's choice, not because Daniel's alliegence to the king or the country he was taken to.

No, Daniel would not have sung the anthum or say the pledge.

As for Paul, he would have done what ever he could to appease the government and save his skin. He even admitted this very thing in 1Cor.9:19-23. ("I have become all things to all men..") No wonder he wrote all of those false words in Romans 13!

Many of you who will be living in the last generation will have to choose to accept the Mark and because of what Paul wrote in Romans 13 it will be an easy choice for you to make to accept it. How sad!

[cricket]

Dr. Rich, I would like to know more about where the funding for federal aid comes from. I'm particularly interested in Pell Grants. Do you have a reference that I can use to look this information up for myself? A magazine article? News story?

I would like to share this information with my husband and our local high school guidance counselors.

Thanks for any further information you can give me.

[miz3]

Dr. Rich,

I was a Financial Aid Officer at an SDA College/University for ten years.

If you read the website they require you to fill out the FAFSA!

That can only mean the actual use of real Federal Government Funds! Such as Loans Direct from the Federal Government (not private Banks). It also means Grants of Federal Money such as the PELL Grant, the SEOG grant, Work Study, etc., as well as any State grants from the State Government.

Dr. Rich this is not private money. Most of it is actual Government Money, both State and Federal.

It does not mean some Private monies are not also used but the requirement to have a FAFSA is for the disbursement of Federal and State Financial Aid!

Like I said the Federal Student Loan program used to be from private banks and guaranteed by the Federal Government. However, the Interest on these loans was actually paid by the Federal Government while the student remained in School. That interest is Federal Aid to the institution even if in only an indirect way.

However, the CURRENT STUDENT LOAN PROGRAM has been taken away from the Private Banks and all Loans are NOW borrowed Direct from the Federal Government. I believe this was an Obama mandate.

As a result of participating in Federal Financial Aid a school must conduct itself according to the mandates of the Federal Government. This is a clear mixing of the "Church and State" when we are talking about Religious Private Institutions like Goshen College or any of the SDA Schools.

This Federal Government can shut down any school participating in the Program for noncompliance! This rarely happens but it has happened. You usually get lesser sanctions first before any shutdown. Again, this is a clear mixing of "Church and State"!

In addition the School is required to annually keep the Government (the State) updated on all its Financial, Academic, and other required information. In other words the State knows all about you as a School and an Organization.

[miz3]

Daniel was taken as a slave and slaves are NOT free to choose. Daniel proves a point in that Daniel chose to obey God rather than the government. Sure, Daniel got promoted because of the King's choice, not because Daniel's alliegence to the king or the country he was taken to.

You obviously have not read the Book of Daniel carefully. Daniel was loyal to Nebuchadnezzar and to Darius. Daniel's words to both show his loyalty to them and to their Kingdom.

However, when the Kingdom's interests conflicted with God's interests Daniel always chose God.

Thus, the situation is not as you state it!

[Dr. Rich]

Originally Posted By: Dr.Rich

Daniel was taken as a slave and slaves are NOT free to choose. Daniel proves a point in that Daniel chose to obey God rather than the government. Sure, Daniel got promoted because of the King's choice, not because Daniel's alliegence to the king or the country he was taken to.

You obviously have not read the Book of Daniel carefully. Daniel was loyal to Nebuchadnezzar and to Darius. Daniel's words to both show his loyalty to them and to their Kingdom.

However, when the Kingdom's interests conflicted with God's interests Daniel always chose God.

Thus, the situation is not as you state it!

Daniel was RESPECTFUL! Just as Jesus Christ was! Daniel was a slave in a foriegn land. He was a Hebrew. He had been reading from the words of Jeremiah and saw that the time for their captivity was over. What don't you understand about that? I have studied it for over 20 years my friend!

Been in prison lately? If you don't show respect you don't get anywhere! We in the United States are prisoners of the government. If you don't understand read the law called "trading with the enemy".