Sometimes

[JoeMo]

Hey Twilight, Gail, et al,

Again, I really appreciate the Christlike attitude shown on this thread. I've been on other threads where things get a little rough as far as judgement, self-righteousness, and condemnation are concerned.

As far as making a habit of tuning in to the Holy Spirit, I truly believe I do; and I hear His voice. I also must say that focusing on the righteousness of my Savior rather rather than my own wretchedness - resting in His grace rather than striving to overcome in my own strength - I no longer feel "stuck". God is truly doing a work in me. But (like I said earlier) He's not finished with me yet; And by His grace I will continue working together with Him as He takes me from glory to glory.

Let me ask you all some questions: Do you feel that He has finished His work in you? Are you assured of your salvation because of your success in continually overcoming all sin in your life? Or are you trusting in His mercy, love, and grace for your salvation while you work together with Him on any sin problems you may have?

[Gail]

The first thing that comes to my brain, and it is not the end-all, is that it's not a working together. It's a total transformation of heart regarding a matter.

As sins are brought to my attention via Bible reading or prayer, I can become aware of it but if I get myself mixed up in it I'm usually a goner. I need to pray for the mind of Jesus in a matter. The heart is the root. If the battle is not won there (and that is the Holy Spirit's territory) I have very little rate of success against "self".

That is how it works with me. It might be different with others. My part may be to give it up, renounce it, but I'm too much like the Israelites of old. Self is too strong. For me, reformation really boils down to re-formation.

For us of ourselves, it is impossible. But for God- that is His joy. The trick is to experience not the reading of the miracle but the doing of it within each of us.

There is a part that the will can do- I've seen that in people. But for me it's too hard to be consistent. God's offer of a changed heart through the life and shed blood of Christ and the indwelling of the Spirit is my hope.

[JoeMo]

Amen, Gail! AMEN! No wonder so many people are your buddies! You are such a blessing!

[Gail]

Amen, Gail! AMEN! No wonder so many people are your buddies! You are such a blessing!

Whoa, JoeMo! That realisation was very hard won! LOL

Whatever blessing I've experienced is available to everyone- the only One with the monopoly on it is Christ. He's the well with the water that quenches the thirst into everlasting life.

We've all got our ups and downs but THIS, the Gospel, just gets better and better. And that has only been dawning on me more and more in the last while.

[phkrause]

Quote:

But we can choose to head towards Gods ideal and intention for us, the perfect new man.

When we place our will in this direction, God makes it a reality.

Marvin Moore calls it, putting ourselves on God's side. I like that! It can be done at any time and sometimes many times a day.

[Twilight II]

Hey Twilight, Gail, et al,

Again, I really appreciate the Christlike attitude shown on this thread. I've been on other threads where things get a little rough as far as judgement, self-righteousness, and condemnation are concerned.

As far as making a habit of tuning in to the Holy Spirit, I truly believe I do; and I hear His voice. I also must say that focusing on the righteousness of my Savior rather rather than my own wretchedness - resting in His grace rather than striving to overcome in my own strength - I no longer feel "stuck". God is truly doing a work in me. But (like I said earlier) He's not finished with me yet; And by His grace I will continue working together with Him as He takes me from glory to glory.

Let me ask you all some questions: Do you feel that He has finished His work in you? Are you assured of your salvation because of your success in continually overcoming all sin in your life? Or are you trusting in His mercy, love, and grace for your salvation while you work together with Him on any sin problems you may have?

Personally, I am in the place where I am born again.

The Holy Spirit is in my heart.

But I am still having to learn to abide in Christ.

It is that turning within and depending on the leading of the Holy Spirit that is key to that.

But as I put my will in the direction of this activity, a will God has given me to exercise that Satan cannot control, my new man grows.

The strength of the new man is in direct proportion to the depth of abiding in Christ.

It is union with God, which we had in Eden, that should be our goal to attain to, when God sees that as our goal, He enables it...

Mark :-)

[Twilight II]

The first thing that comes to my brain, and it is not the end-all, is that it's not a working together. It's a total transformation of heart regarding a matter.

As sins are brought to my attention via Bible reading or prayer, I can become aware of it but if I get myself mixed up in it I'm usually a goner. I need to pray for the mind of Jesus in a matter. The heart is the root. If the battle is not won there (and that is the Holy Spirit's territory) I have very little rate of success against "self".

That is how it works with me. It might be different with others. My part may be to give it up, renounce it, but I'm too much like the Israelites of old. Self is too strong. For me, reformation really boils down to re-formation.

For us of ourselves, it is impossible. But for God- that is His joy. The trick is to experience not the reading of the miracle but the doing of it within each of us.

There is a part that the will can do- I've seen that in people. But for me it's too hard to be consistent. God's offer of a changed heart through the life and shed blood of Christ and the indwelling of the Spirit is my hope.

You comprehend the gospel Sister. :-)

But rest assurred, God has given you a will that is strong enough to turn to Him and depend on Him continually.

A will that can turn from the flesh, the old man and turn to God.

You can have victory sister, that is what the new man is, total victory...

[JoeMo]

"We've all got our ups and downs but THIS, the Gospel, just gets better and better. And that has only been dawning on me more and more in the last while." - Quote from Gail (I haven't figured out how to put the quotes in fancy boxes yet)

I agree - there seems to be something in the air in the realm of the supernatural. More and more people are wanting more out of their spiritual life than a Sabbath Day's rest and law keeping - they want an abiding, intimate relationship with the King of kings and His Father. People want to hear God's voice; they want to have the baptism of the Holy Spirit. There are 30 - 40 people in our church that get together weekly to pray for intimacy with God - to "see" Him and "hear" Him. Verses in the Bible that I never understood have become amazing revelations. Journalling has become a two-way conversation with God rather than just a list of prayers. Much more time is spent in worship and praise rather than petition. Lifelong habitual sins seem to be falling off of people like leaves from a tree. People who had completely given up on religion are coming back to God on spiripual steroids. There is much more encouragement and lifting up of people rather than judgement or condemnation. Sometimes, God's presence at church or small group feels like living in the book of Acts.

Ain't it great?!

[Twilight II]

^^Small groups is definitely one of the keys...

[Gail]

^^Small groups is definitely one of the keys...

Prayer, too!

I'm afraid that for a while church members (in general, not only our denomination) were lacking in practical knowledge or application in spiritual practises. That is probably why there is so much cry now against the "spiritual formation" movement that is risen. People NEEDED something, they had a void.

But yes, I have seen prayer groups rising up in my area- it's SO COOL to witness!

[Twilight II]

Small groups and intimicay, go hand in hand with prayer, real prayer beyond formal sabbath worship prayer.

I think all of these things are a good and healthy sign in a church. :-)

[Gail]

Small groups and intimicay, go hand in hand with prayer, real prayer beyond formal sabbath worship prayer.

I think all of these things are a good and healthy sign in a church. :-)

[JoeMo]

Another thing that has been a real catalyst in both our church at large and in small groups has been "Testimony Time". When we forst started about 5 years ago, Testimony Time was usually 3 - 5 minutes of awkward silence. Now we have so many really amazing testimonies that sometimes there isn't time for a lesson or a sermon! We have even had a few of what I would consider verifiable healing miracles. I'm not talking relief from a headache or a minor boo-boo; I'm talking about healing of a broken neck and a severe "female" injury, and missing teeth replaced, for a couple examples. These testimonies have reinforced faith and facilitated positive moral and spiritual change more than anything in our church. This is what I was talking about in an earlier post about "living in the Book of Acts".

[Gail]

Amen! The testimony idea is in Gospel Workers. I can see that as a faith-building tool!

[LifeHiscost]

Quote:

There is a part that the will can do- I've seen that in people. But for me it's too hard to be consistent. God's offer of a changed heart through the life and shed blood of Christ and the indwelling of the Spirit is my hope.

If there is a point of victory for the weak and defenseless, for my own self it is found to be a couple, at least one of which I hear a lot of denial, which is why I believe it is not experienced by some.

"For my yoke is easy to bear, and the burden I give you is light.”"Matthew 11:30 NLT

It stands to reason, since God's Word cannot be broken, if I am fulfilling the Word for the most part by white knuckling it or the gritting of teeth, I have obviously a lack of understanding of where to acquire what He has promised to be true.

No matter where one is in their journey of faith, even we as Christians need to admit, there is much more that we do not know than what we do know.

Which leads this disciple to flee to these two promises.

"And Jesus said, Father, forgive them; for they know not what they do."Luke 23:34 ASV

"My dear children, I am writing this to you so that you will not sin. But if anyone does sin, we have an advocate who pleads our case before the Father. He is Jesus Christ, the one who is truly righteous."1 John 2:2 NLT

Not to mention this one.

"...being confident of this very thing, that He who has begun a good work in you will complete it until the day of Jesus Christ;"Philippians 1:6 NKJV

God blesses!

[Twilight II]

Quote:

There is a part that the will can do- I've seen that in people. But for me it's too hard to be consistent. God's offer of a changed heart through the life and shed blood of Christ and the indwelling of the Spirit is my hope.

If there is a point of victory for the weak and defenseless, for my own self it is found to be a couple, at least one of which I hear a lot of denial, which is why I believe it is not experienced by some.

"For my yoke is easy to bear, and the burden I give you is light.”"Matthew 11:30 NLT

It stands to reason, since God's Word cannot be broken, if I am fulfilling the Word for the most part by white knuckling it or the gritting of teeth, I have obviously a lack of understanding of where to acquire what He has promised to be true.

No matter where one is in their journey of faith, even we as Christians need to admit, there is much more that we do not know than what we do know.

Which leads this disciple to flee to these two promises.

"And Jesus said, Father, forgive them; for they know not what they do."Luke 23:34 ASV

"My dear children, I am writing this to you so that you will not sin. But if anyone does sin, we have an advocate who pleads our case before the Father. He is Jesus Christ, the one who is truly righteous."1 John 2:2 NLT

Not to mention this one.

"...being confident of this very thing, that He who has begun a good work in you will complete it until the day of Jesus Christ;"Philippians 1:6 NKJV

God blesses!

Amen.

[Gail]

Amen x2!!!

AND His commandments are not grievous!

[LifeHiscost]

Amen x2!!!

AND His commandments are not grievous!

I was reminded by some one on TV last evening, of a comment by Jesus to His disciples, when He was alive on this earth after His ressurection.

"...and he ate it as they watched.

Then he said, “When I was with you before, I told you that everything written about me in the law of Moses and the prophets and in the Psalms must be fulfilled.” Then he opened their minds to understand the Scriptures."

Luke 24:43-45 NLT

Now if Jesus would take of the only Scriptures that were available when He was alive here on this earth, to teach His disciples of Himself through those same Scriptures, should it seem a strange thing for us today to arrive at a more clear picture of Him by yoking a revelatio0n of Him through the same source, as well as the New Testament?

Not to mention this instruction.

"If you obey My teaching, you will live in My love. In this way, I have obeyed My Father’s teaching and live in His love. "John 15:10 NLV

Just asking.

God blesses!

[GreatLakesGramma]

Originally Posted By: Tallmark

I'd hate for a tattooed person accused of something have me on the jury. I'd like to say that I would be fair, but I wouldn't be unless God works a miracle in me.

Why? Seriously, why? What difference does the fact that he or she has tattoos make?

For some of us older ones here, when we were young, tattoos, earrings and other jewelry on men, worn along with beards and leather jackets, were the hallmark of rebellion and violence, most memorably manifested in criminal motorcycle gangs such as the Hell's Angels. Such persons were to be feared and avoided at all costs, especially by girls and young women. They had no respect for the law or for the lives or rights of others. A close personal encounter with them could result in death or worse.

So don't blame us if our first reaction to the sight of a person with multiple tattoos and piercings is negative. We were conditioned to that at an early age. And if we see someone like that on trial for some kind of crime, it isn't going to be easy to shake the gut feeling that they are probably guilty. It's only been a relatively short part of our lives in which decent people have considered it acceptable to adorn themselves in such a manner.

[phkrause]

Originally Posted By: Tallmark

I'd hate for a tattooed person accused of something have me on the jury. I'd like to say that I would be fair, but I wouldn't be unless God works a miracle in me.

Why? Seriously, why? What difference does the fact that he or she has tattoos make?

Not to sound to pious myself, I can understand Tallmark saying that. We are all different. Some have a lower tolerance for that and some have a higher one. I know for myself I do have a higher tolerance because when younger I used to grow my longer and also have a beard and many in the church really had a problem with that. It never bothered me what people had to say, but it did my Mom.

[phkrause]

For some of us older ones here, when we were young, tattoos, earrings and other jewelry on men, worn along with beards and leather jackets, were the hallmark of rebellion and violence, most memorably manifested in criminal motorcycle gangs such as the Hell's Angels. Such persons were to be feared and avoided at all costs, especially by girls and young women. They had no respect for the law or for the lives or rights of others. A close personal encounter with them could result in death or worse.

So don't blame us if our first reaction to the sight of a person with multiple tattoos and piercings is negative. We were conditioned to that at an early age. And if we see someone like that on trial for some kind of crime, it isn't going to be easy to shake the gut feeling that they are probably guilty. It's only been a relatively short part of our lives in which decent people have considered it acceptable to adorn themselves in such a manner.

I don't so much have a problem with tatoos, long hair, etc. I do though have a problem with some of the holes people poke in there bodies or should I say where they put the holes in there bodies.

[GreatLakesGramma]

I agree with that, pk. I think a ring in somebody's tongue looks disgusting. And I've heard some even wear them in their genitals. I can't imagine why on earth someone would do such a thing. To me, it seems downright idiotic.

No offense meant to anybody here who things differently, just being honest about my own thoughts.

[olger]

I reckon so

[kailooa]

Thank you, JoeMo, I needed to hear that today. Blessings to you too!

[M. T. Cross]

In light of not judging and all..........

My latest