Righteousness by faith explained

[skyblue888]

As to the antediluvians the flood was not a direct act of God upon them anymore than the slaying of Saul was.

The Scriptures declare that "God sent the flood" and that "God slew Saul." 1 Chronicles 10:14.

But Saul killed himself with his own sword. 1 Chronicles 10:4.

sky

[Robert]

Christ's death is ransom for all (1 Tim 2:5,6), no one excluded nor left out. If that death ransomed all from the 2nd death, then no one need suffer the 2nd death anymore.

Our humanity died in Christ. Hence He, as a son of Adam, took the curse of the law, which is the 2nd death.

[Robert]

the ten commandments will be a curse to you if you try to obey them in your own strength.

No one but Christ obeyed the spirit of the law. Therefore to be under the law in any fashion means condemnation:

Gal 3:10 "Cursed is everyone who does not continue to do everything written in the Book of the Law."

Rom 3:10,19 As it is written: "There is none righteous, no, not one...Now we know that whatever the law says, it says to those who are under the law, that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God.

So no matter how much you've experienced righteousness in your life you aren't measuring up to Christ's righteousness. To fail to measure up means you are falling short. The smallest atom of sin the law condemns. So we can never be under law.

Paul sums it up:

Gal 5:13 You, my brothers, were called to be free (see Gal 5:1 - free from under law). But do not use your freedom to indulge the sinful nature; rather, serve one another in love.

Okay, we aren't under law. We can never be under law and make it to heaven. However, if Christ, through the Spirit, is in the heart (mind) we can not condone known sin as a legitimate lifestyle. Those who do can't be converted:

Gal 5:18 if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under law. 19 The acts of the sinful nature are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity and debauchery; 20 idolatry and witchcraft; hatred, discord, jealousy, fits of rage, selfish ambition, dissensions, factions 21 and envy; drunkenness, orgies, and the like. I warn you, as I did before, that those who practice these sins will not inherit the kingdom of God

[Gerr]

Originally Posted By: Gerry Cabalo

Did God commit murder when He wiped out the antediluvians? Will He commit murder when He wipes out the wicked at the final cleansing of the universe from sin?

The case in point is not God doing the killing. I agree that God is above his own Law and can do whatever he wants.

I want to know why it's sin to break the law any other time but when God commands it to be broken it can be done with impunity.

Do you see a difference between a guard killing a prisoner for no reason and the same prisoner being executed after he has been sentenced to death?

[Gerr]

As to the antediluvians the flood was not a direct act of God upon them anymore than the slaying of Saul was.

The Scriptures declare that "God sent the flood" and that "God slew Saul." 1 Chronicles 10:14.

But Saul killed himself with his own sword. 1 Chronicles 10:4.

sky

So who killed the antediluvians? Who will wipe out the wicked after the millenium?

[Samie]

Originally Posted By: Samie

Christ's death is ransom for all (1 Tim 2:5,6), no one excluded nor left out. If that death ransomed all from the 2nd death, then no one need suffer the 2nd death anymore.

Our humanity died in Christ. Hence He, as a son of Adam, took the curse of the law, which is the 2nd death.

And where does it say in the Bible that the curse of the law is the 2nd death, brother? I'm afraid there's none...

[12tribes]

So who killed the antediluvians? Who will wipe out the wicked after the millenium?

I just want to ask what has all this got to do with the subject of righteousness by faith?

[Robert]

And where does it say in the Bible that the curse of the law is the 2nd death, brother? I'm afraid there's none...

“When the chief priests therefore and officers saw Him, they cried out saying: ‘Crucify Him, crucify Him.’ ” And Pilate responded, “Take you Him and crucify Him, for I find no fault in Him” (John 19:5,6).

What he was saying was simply, “As far as Roman law is concerned, this man does not deserve crucifixion.” But the Jews had to give a reason, so they responded: “The Jews answered him, ‘We have a law, and by our law He ought to die, because He made Himself the Son of God’” (John 19:7).

They were referring to the law of blasphemy. It was God who gave them that law through Moses. If Pilate had known the law Christ may not have been crucified. The law does not only condemn a blasphemer to death but it also stipulates how that person should die. In the book of Leviticus we are going to look at the law as God gave it through Moses. Remember that Jesus claimed to be the Son of God. The Jews rejected Him as the Messiah and, therefore, when He claimed to be the Son of God, to them it was blasphemy. This is what the law of blasphemy says: “And he that blasphemeth the name of the Lord, he shall surely be put to death, and all the congregation shall certainly stone him” (Lev 94:16, emphasis mine).

Crucifixion was not a Jewish method of execution. The Jews did not practice crucifixion; on the contrary, they detested it. The stipulation in the book of the law was that a blasphemer should be stoned to death by the congregation. Didn’t the Jews know that part of the law? Yes. Were they ignorant about that part? No. If they knew, why did they insist on crucifixion? Were they afraid that Pilate would have said, “No, you can crucify Him but you can’t stone Him”? The answer to that questions is also no. Because crucifixion is a far worse way of dying. It is, in fact, the most painful, the most shameful, the most cruel death that man had ever invented and practised. Pilate would have been happy to say, “You can take Him and stone Him.” Then why did the Jews insist on crucifixion?

I want to make it very clear that the Jews knew what the law said in regard to how a blasphemer should die. In John 10:30, Jesus makes a statement that to the unbelieving Jews was blasphemy: “I and My Father are one.” Listen to what the Jews did in verse 31: “Then the Jews took up stones again to stone Him” (emphasis mine). Look at the word “again.” This was not the first time they had done it. Why did they take up stones to stone Him? In their thinking, they were obeying a law given by God. They thought that what Jesus had said was blasphemy. Why then did they cry out to Pilate, “Crucify Him. Crucify Him”? Why were they adamant about His crucifixion, especially when we realize crucifixion was not the Jewish method of execution? There was a reason and it is important that we know that reason.

We will find the reason in Deuteronomy 21. The Jews did not want Jesus just to die, when they insisted that he be crucified. They had something worse for Him than simply dying on a Roman cross. And they had this passage from Deuteronomy 21:22, 23 in mind when they cried out, “Crucify Him.” What does this text say? “And if a man have committed a sin worthy of death, (and blasphemy is one of them) and he is to be put to death, and thou hang him on a tree: his body shall not remain all night upon the tree, but thou shalt in any wise bury him that day (for he that is hanged is accursed of God).”

Do you know what that meant to the Jew, that statement in brackets? If a Jew had committed a crime worthy of death and the judge sentenced him to death, that man still could go on his knees before he died and say, “God, Jehovah, please forgive me for what I have done.” He would have forgiveness and hope. But if the judge said, “After you die you are to be hung on a tree,” that meant to the Jews the irrevocable curse of God, which to us would be the unpardonable sin or the second death, “good-bye” to life forever.

some will argue, “How could Christ die the second death? He predicted His resurrection, and He actually rose the third day. How could He experience it?” First of all, the Bible says so. Heb. 2:9: “He tasted death for all men.” It could not be the first death because believers who accept Christ still have to die the first death. Then look at what Paul says in 2 Tim. 1:7-10. He says that Christ, through the cross, has “abolished death.” If He abolished death why do Christians die? Because He abolished only the second death, not the first death. Rev. 20:6 tells us that those who have part in the first resurrection, i.e., the believers, on such the second death has no power. Why? Because there was One who was willing to go through it for us, to taste it.

The thing that we need to realize is what we call in theology, “the kenosis doctrine,” based on Phil. 2:6-8. When Christ became a man in the incarnation He had to give up not His divinity, but His divine prerogatives, in other words, the independent use of His divinity. Even His God-consciousness had to be given up. Jesus discovered He was God only by revelation. He was not God-conscious as a baby. He had to grow up in knowledge. He had to grow up in everything because He had given up the independent use of His divinity and was made in all things like unto us (Heb. 2:17).

Therefore, He was totally God-dependent all through His earthly ministry. John 5:30 says, “I can do nothing of myself.” John 6:57 says, “I live by the Father.” See also John 8:28 and John 14:10. All these texts state very clearly that Christ was totally God-dependent. Then read Rom 6:4; Acts 2:24, 32; Eph. 1:20. All of these texts clearly tell us that it was the Father who raised Christ from the dead. Keep these two things in mind: Christ was God-dependent, and He was dependent on the Father for the resurrection. Don’t ask me what happened to His divine consciousness when He was in the grave. Where was His divine life? I don’t know. It’s a mystery. We will spend eternity studying that, but I do know one thing, it was the Father He was depending on for the resurrection just like everything else.

Do you know what the Father did on the cross? Christ cried out: “Father, Father why have you forsaken me?” What He meant is not “Why are you leaving me for three days?” but, “Why have You abandoned Me?” Do you know what that meant to Christ? It meant that the hope of the resurrection went with that abandonment. When the Father forsook Him in terms of Christ’s feeling, then the hope of the resurrection went with it. Jesus was now “treading the winepress alone.” He could no longer look on the Father with hope and assurance as far as His feelings were concerned. He felt the agony of God-abandonment, exactly what the wicked will feel when mercy no longer pleads with the guilty race.

[Woody]

Excellent Post Robert. Thanks. What a blessing to read.

[Gerr]

Originally Posted By: Gerry Cabalo

So who killed the antediluvians? Who will wipe out the wicked after the millenium?

I just want to ask what has all this got to do with the subject of righteousness by faith?

None. Just responding to a comment like I am doing to yours.

[Gerr]

Our humanity died in Christ. Hence He, as a son of Adam, took the curse of the law, which is the 2nd death.

And where does it say in the Bible that the curse of the law is the 2nd death, brother? I'm afraid there's none...

‎ESV ‎‎Ro 6:23 For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.

‎ESV ‎‎Re 21:8 But as for the cowardly, the faithless, the detestable, as for murderers, the sexually immoral, sorcerers, idolaters, and all liars, their portion will be in the lake that burns with fire and sulfur, which is the second death.”

[Robert]

Here is a key passage from Desire of Ages, by E.G. White, p 753: “He could not see through the portals of the tomb. Hope did not present to Him the coming forth from the grave a conqueror or tell Him of the Father’s acceptance of the sacrifice. He feared that sin was so offensive to God that their separation was to be eternal.”

Do you realize what Christ was tempted to do on the cross as He hung there? The Father had forsaken Him. But remember, He was still God. He could have taken hold of His divinity independent of the Father, against the Father’s wishes, and come down from the cross to save Himself.

That is exactly what the devil tried to get Him to do. In Luke 23:35-39, at least three times the devil approached Christ—once through the Roman soldiers, once through the priests, and once through the thief on the left-hand side. Then, in Matt. 27:35-46, the people also added to that temptation. The temptation was the same, “Come down from the cross and save yourself.” Can you imagine what that temptation was like? We can’t. I’m glad Desire of Ages makes that clear:

“The temptation that Christ experienced can never be fully understood by men.... The withdrawal of the Divine Countenance from the Savior in this hour of supreme anguish pierced His heart with a sorrow that can never be fully understood by man.” Ibid.

Do you know why? Because there has been no human being in this world who has really, fully, experienced the wrath of God as Christ did. He is the only man who has experienced the fullness of God-abandonment, which is the equivalent of the second death. Christ was tempted to come down from the cross and save Himself. Can you understand the temptation? The issue He faced was not to screw up His will power and say, “I’ll hold on for a few hours or for three days.” That is no sacrifice for a God who lives in eternity. The issue was good-bye to life forever, never again to see His Father, never again to go back to heaven. It meant to give up His glory, to give up His life. That was the issue. That is the curse of God.

[Woody]

Thanks Robert. Excellent.

[Robert]

I just want to ask what has all this got to do with the subject of righteousness by faith?

Well, the 2nd death is connected to RBF. Christ came to save humanity not from hell (the lake of fire), but from "the curse of the law" - which is ultimately God's abandonment of those who have fully rejected Him.

Here's Paul:

Gal 3:16 The promises were spoken to Abraham and to his seed (keep in mind Abraham was promised heaven by faith). The Scripture does not say "and to seeds," meaning many people, but "and to your seed," meaning one person, who is Christ. 17 What I mean is this: The law, introduced 430 years later, does not set aside the covenant previously established by God and thus do away with the promise.

In other words the OC was never a means to an end. It was given to turn sin into transgression. It was given to make matters worse so that fallen humans could see their need of Christ and His deliverance from under the law's jurisdiction.

18 For if the inheritance depends on the law, then it no longer depends on a promise; but God in his grace gave it to Abraham through a promise. 19 What, then, was the purpose of the law? It was added in order to create transgressions (to expose sin) (CJB) until the Seed to whom the promise referred had come. The law was put into effect through angels by a mediator. 20 A mediator, however, does not represent just one party; but God is one. 21 Is the law, therefore, opposed to the promises of God? Absolutely not! For if a law had been given that could impart life, then righteousness would certainly have come by the law. 22 But the Scripture declares that the whole world is a prisoner of sin, so that what was promised, being given through faith in Jesus Christ, might be given to those who believe. 23 Before the faith came (Christ), we were held prisoners by the law, locked up until faith should be revealed. 24 So the law was put in charge until Christ that we might be justified by faith. 25 Now that faith has come, we are no longer under the jurisdiction of the law.

Christ came to remove us from under law. Not that the law is bad, but because we are sinners. We are sinners because of our past...we are sinners because even now we are falling short of Christ's life - a life that answered the law in every detail.

Does that mean because we are not under law that we should live for the flesh as a lifestyle? No! But that's another subject.

[Robert]

23 Before the faith came (Christ), we were held prisoners by the law, locked up until faith should be revealed. 24 So the law was put in charge to until Christ that we might be justified by faith. 25 Now that faith has come, we are no longer under the jurisdiction of the law.

Keep in mind the 1888 GC settled the issue of what the law in Galatians actually was.... The majority of the SDA claimed it was the Ceremonial law that Paul was writing about, but Ellen White disagreed:

“The law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith” (Galatians 3:24). In this scripture, the Holy Spirit through the apostle is speaking especially of the moral law. The law reveals sin to us, and causes us to feel our need of Christ and to flee unto Him for pardon and peace by exercising repentance toward God and faith toward our Lord Jesus Christ. 1SM 234.5

An unwillingness to yield up preconceived opinions, and to accept this truth, lay at the foundation of a large share of the opposition manifested at Minneapolis against the Lord’s message through Brethren [E.J.] Waggoner and [A.T.] Jones. By exciting that opposition Satan succeeded... 1SM 234.6

[Woody]

Quote:

An unwillingness to yield up preconceived opinions, and to accept this truth, lay at the foundation of a large share of the opposition manifested at Minneapolis against the Lord’s message through Brethren [E.J.] Waggoner and [A.T.] Jones. By exciting that opposition Satan succeeded... 1SM 234.6

This still remains the issue.

[Robert]

Christ came to remove us from under law. Not that the law is bad, but because we are sinners.

Rom 7:1 Do you not know, brothers--for I am speaking to men who know the law (the Jews)--that the law has authority (dominion) over a man only as long as he lives?

God never did away with the law. If God did away with the law then fallen men wouldn't see their need of Christ. The minute we are born as sons and daughters of Adam that minute the law places us in jail awaiting execution.

Bottom line is that the law justly demands our eternal death! That's the 2nd death - goodbye to life forever!

4 So, my brothers, you also died to the law through the body of Christ, that you might belong to another, to him who was raised from the dead, in order that we might bear fruit to God.

Did you get that? Our humanity that we received from Adam, indwelt with our bent to self (sin), died in Christ 2000 years ago. Hence the justice of the law, the 2nd death, has been answered in the doing and dying of Christ. If, by faith, we accept Christ as our Savior then we can claim that we died in Him and therefore the law has no authority over us any longer. As far as the law is concerned we are dead, as in the 2nd death because of our position in Christ.

Notice, however, just because we aren't under law doesn't mean we can't bear fruit that is in harmony with the law, but that comes after our justification by faith. It's called sanctification by faith or growing in grace.

6 But now, by dying to what once bound us (the law), we have been released from the law so that we serve in the new way of the Spirit, and not in the old way of the written code.

Again, as far as the law in concerned, we are dead. Now, as a practical application, we considered ourselves dead to sin and alive to God.

[12tribes]

As I mentioned before the book 'Steps to Christ' written by Ellen White just after 1888 is righteousness except put much better.

[Robert]

Quote:

An unwillingness to yield up preconceived opinions, and to accept this truth, lay at the foundation of a large share of the opposition manifested at Minneapolis against the Lord’s message through Brethren [E.J.] Waggoner and [A.T.] Jones. By exciting that opposition Satan succeeded... 1SM 234.6

This still remains the issue.

Yes, because of this a subtle form of legalism has crept into the SDA church. But don't think for one minute it's just in the Adventist church...it's everywhere the gospel is distorted.

It will be the SDA church that restores the gospel and preaches it.

[12tribes]

We are made righteous by faith we are not made righteous by keeping the Law.

Romans 6:16

(16) Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?

By surrender to God we become servants of righteousness. When we are tempted we are to surrender to God and He will work in us.

Philippians 2:13

(13) For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure.

[Woody]

Quote:

Yes, because of this a subtle form of legalism has crept into the SDA church. But don't think for one minute it's just in the Adventist church...it's everywhere the gospel is distorted.

It will be the SDA church that restores the gospel and preaches it.

[Samie]

...

Well, the 2nd death is connected to RBF. Christ came to save humanity not from hell (the lake of fire), but from "the curse of the law" - which is ultimately God's abandonment of those who have fully rejected Him.

...

[Samie]

Yes, because of this a subtle form of legalism has crept into the SDA church. But don't think for one minute it's just in the Adventist church...it's everywhere the gospel is distorted.

[Gerr]

Three pages and the explanation of what righteousness by faith is still going on.

The simplest explanation for me is this:

‎NIV84 ‎‎Ro 3:21 But now a righteousness from God, apart from law, has been made known, to which the Law and the Prophets testify. ‎‎22 This righteousness from God comes through faith in Jesus Christ to all who believe. There is no difference,23 for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God,

Man is a sinner. Not only that, he will forever be falling short of God's righteousness IN THIS LIFE. The ONLY way he can attain to righteousness is to receive the gift of righteousness that is from God by faith.

[Robert]