Why did Job repent?

[Robert]

Job 32:1 So these three men stopped answering Job, because he was righteous in his own eyes. 2 But Elihu son of Barakel the Buzite, of the family of Ram, became very angry with Job for justifying himself rather than God

In the judgement do you want to justify yourself before God's law or do you want Jesus to justify you by His perfect life. The latter, I hope, but not Job. He was blatantly justifying his righteousness.

Elihu brings to the front Job's problem. Job isn't guilty of gross sin; Job's guilty of presenting his righteousness before a Holy God.

You see all our righteousness is filthy rags because it is missing the key ingredient of agape.

Once both Elihu and God bring this to Job's attention, Job repents:

Job 40:3 Then Job answered the LORD, and said , 4 Behold, I am vile ; what shall I answer thee? I will lay mine hand upon my mouth. 5 Once have I spoken ; but I will not answer : yea, twice; but I will proceed no further . ...Job 42:6 Wherefore I abhor myself, and repent in dust and ashes....

Q: What things did Job state in the early chapters that he had to take back in the later chapters?

[Robert]

But Elihu son of Barakel the Buzite, of the family of Ram, became very angry with Job for justifying himself rather than God

Luke 18:10 "Two men went up to the temple to pray, one a Pharisee and the other a tax collector. 11 The Pharisee stood up and prayed about himself: 'God, I thank you that I am not like other men--robbers, evildoers, adulterers--or even like this tax collector. 12 I fast twice a week and give a tenth of all I get.' 13 "But the tax collector stood at a distance. He would not even look up to heaven, but beat his breast and said, 'God, have mercy on me, a sinner.' 14 "I tell you that this man, rather than the other, went home justified before God. For everyone who exalts himself will be humbled, and he who humbles himself will be exalted."

Who left just before God's law?

1] The sinner

2] The Pharisee

Answer: 1

The Pharisee justified his righteousness before God. He was doing the same thing Job did. Was Job exalted or humbled? Humbled. Only when Job repented was he exalted.

[skyblue888]

Job did not have to take back anything.

He vindicated himself before his friends but he did no such thing before God. This proves that he had the right attitude for no righteous man will seek to vindicate himself before God. His repentance was of the right order before God for before Him we are ever to acknowledge ourselves as erring, helpless, and condemned sinners for "At every advanced step in Christian experience our repentance will deepen." C.O.L.160.

"Are you in Christ? Not if you do not acknowledge yourselves erring, helpless, condemned sinners." EGW, 1893 General Conference Bulletin, p.178.

At the end of his life of walking with God the apostle Paul acknowledge himself to be the chief of sinners.

Job and Paul were led by the same Spirit.

sky

[Robert]

At the end of his life of walking with God the apostle Paul acknowledge himself to be the chief of sinners.

Phil 3:12 Not that I have already obtained all this, or have already been made perfect, but I press on to take hold of that for which Christ Jesus took hold of me.

So Paul never claimed perfection after his Damascus experience, but as a Pharisee he did:

Phil 3:5 as to the Law, a Pharisee ; 6 as to zeal, a persecutor of the church ; as to the righteousness which is in the Law, found blameless

Did Job do this?

Job 12:4 GNTA Even my friends laugh at me now; they laugh, although I am righteous and blameless...

[Woody]

Excellent observation Robert.

[skyblue888]

It has been shown already on the other thread where this was discussed that Job was a righteous man to the satisfaction of God Himself, both from the Scriptures and the SoP.

If we interpret the book of Job differently, we need to be corrected, not inspiration.

sky

[Robert]

Job was a righteous man to the satisfaction of God Himself

God didn't say that Job was righteous to His satisfaction. He says, "Have you considered my servant Job? There is no one on earth like him; he is blameless and upright, a man who fears God and shuns evil."

Now, if you read the whole book of Job, you'll have to ask yourself a question:

Is it God's view that Job is indeed a blameless & upright man or is God presenting Job as Job presents himself before God? Keep in mind the 4th man, Elihu, states that the later was Job's problem.

[skyblue888]

The Lord has already spoken on this matter so clearly that there is no need for speculation.

sky

[skyblue888]

"Job was not understood by his friends. He flings back upon them their reproaches. He shows them that if they are defending God by avowing their faith in Him and their consciousness of sin, he has a more deep and thorough knowledge of it than they ever had. 'Miserable comforters are ye all,' is the answer he makes to their criticism and censures. 'I also,' says Job, 'could speak as you do; if your soul were in my soul's stead, I could heap up words against you, and shake mine head at you.' But he declares that he would not do this. 'I,' he says, 'would strengthen you with my mouth, and the moving of my lips should assuage your grief...

"Some shortsighted, short experienced friends cannot, with their narrow vision, appreciate the feelings of one who has been in close harmony with the soul of Christ in connection with the salvation of others. His motives are misunderstood and his actions misconstrued by those who would be his friends, until, like Job, he sends forth the earnest prayer: Save me from my friends. God takes the case of Job in hand Himself. His patience has been severely taxed; but when God speaks, all his pettish feelings are changed. The self-justification which he felt was necessary to withstand the condemnation of his friends is not necessary toward God." Testimonies, Vol.3,509.

"Job's professed friends were miserable comforters making his case more bitter and unbearable, and Job was not guilty as they supposed." Testimonies to Ministers,350.

So if, according to God Himself, these were wrong about Job, how could Elihu demonstrate against the testimony of God Himself any otherwise?

sky

[M. T. Cross]

Job 40:3 Then Job answered the LORD, and said , 4 Behold, I am vile Job 42:6 Wherefore I abhor myself, and repent in dust and ashes....

Q: What things did Job state in the early chapters that he had to take back in the later chapters?

Q: Why would a loving creator and merciful God demand that a person fully devoted to him, to the point where this God uses him as an example to the most evil creature in the universe, ask that this person say these types of things about themselves in repentance? Why would he demand this kind of degrading and humiliating type of repentance?

[skyblue888]

He did not demand that of Job. Before God Job had a deep sense of his unworthiness just as the 144,000 will. See E.W.272.

sky

[Robert]

Why would he demand this kind of degrading and humiliating type of repentance?

He doesn't demand it, Job freely expressed himself....Paul did the same: "I know that in me, that is in my flesh, dwells nothing good."

[Robert]

The self-justification which he (Job) felt was necessary to withstand the condemnation of his friends is not necessary toward God." Testimonies, Vol.3,509.

That's Elihu's point in a nutshell:

Job 32:3 Elihu son of Barakel the Buzite, of the family of Ram, became very angry with Job for justifying himself rather than God. 3 He was also angry with the three friends, because they had found no way to refute Job, and yet had condemned him.

Job's three friends had condemned Job for sin, but yet they couldn't prove any sin.

Elihu, on the other hand, points to Job's sin - the spirit of self-justification or self-righteousness.

[Robert]

So if, according to God Himself, these were wrong about Job, how could Elihu demonstrate against the testimony of God Himself any otherwise?

Because God never included Elihu with the other three:

Job 42:7 After the LORD had said these things to Job, he said to Eliphaz the Temanite, "I am angry with you and your two friends (1 + 2 = 3), because you have not spoken of me what is right, as my servant Job has. 8 So now take seven bulls and seven rams and go to my servant Job and sacrifice a burnt offering for yourselves. My servant Job will pray for you, and I will accept his prayer and not deal with you according to your folly. You have not spoken of me what is right, as my servant Job has." 9 So Eliphaz the Temanite (1), Bildad the Shuhite (2) and Zophar the Naamathite (3) did what the LORD told them; and the LORD accepted Job's prayer.

[M. T. Cross]

Originally Posted By: EmptyCross

Why would he demand this kind of degrading and humiliating type of repentance?

He doesn't demand it, Job freely expressed himself....Paul did the same: "I know that in me, that is in my flesh, dwells nothing good."

And it is not their relationship with or the presence of their God that brought them to that train of thought?

Again, why would one worship a being that makes one feel that way?

[Robert]

Again, why would one worship a being that makes one feel that way?

Because with God there's no self-love....He loves you more than Himself. He lives to serve.

[M. T. Cross]

So by calling yourself vile etc is like saying you are unworthy of his love. Thats kind of an insult to him I would think.

[Robert]

So by calling yourself vile etc is like saying you are unworthy of his love.

No, rather you realize that human love doesn't even come close to God's agape.

[Windsor]

So by calling yourself vile etc is like saying you are unworthy of his love. Thats kind of an insult to him I would think.

What exactly makes you worthy of His love? Or what makes any child worthy of the love of their parent when they're first born?

[Gail]

Re: Job

His fate turned when he prayed for his friends. Maybe it's because his friends were really his opponents that made his prayer for them so outstanding.

[doug yowell]

Job can be a very confusing and contradictory book if one doesn't spend the time to examine it closely. God injects Himself into the verbal fray by replying to Job's questioning in Person. Job 38:1-3 is God's answer to Job's misunderstanding of His justice not necessarily of Job's claiming to have reached a sinless point of Christian growth.This book seems to be the first actual explanation of the purpose of suffering among the righteous. The OP question is one that I often asked myself particularly in the light of what God concludes about Job's character and His final verdict at the end.

[skyblue888]

Originally Posted By: EmptyCross

So by calling yourself vile etc is like saying you are unworthy of his love. Thats kind of an insult to him I would think.

What exactly makes you worthy of His love? Or what makes any child worthy of the love of their parent when they're first born?

What makes us worthy of His love?

The MERITS of the blood of a crucified and risen Saviour.

The merits of the blood that is of value beyond estimate are placed upon us as we appropriate them by faith, by claiming them as it is our privilege to do so. See T.M.93.

Hence we read: "He was treated as we deserve that we might be treated as He deserves." D.A.25.

sky

[skyblue888]

Re: Job

His fate turned when he prayed for his friends. Maybe it's because his friends were really his opponents that made his prayer for them so outstanding.

Thank you Gail for reminding us of how he prayed for his friends who were miserable comforters. But I am not sure what you mean when you say that his fate turned when he did that... can you elaborate on that a little please?

sky

[M. T. Cross]

Originally Posted By: EmptyCross

So by calling yourself vile etc is like saying you are unworthy of his love. Thats kind of an insult to him I would think.

What exactly makes you worthy of His love? Or what makes any child worthy of the love of their parent when they're first born?

The fact that they simply exist! I know I had a deep consuming unconditional love for my kids before they were even born.. If you are not prepared to love your creation you maybe should rethink your plan to create it.

[phkrause]

The fact that they simply exist! I know I had a deep consuming unconditional love for my kids before they were even born.. If you are not prepared to love your creation you maybe should rethink your plan to create it.

That's just it EC, he did. There was a plan in place, Jesus came down here to die for all of us because he loved his children so much. He doesn't want to see any of us die. So when you look at your children and see how much you love them, just think how much more God loves them than you do! Not only that, do you love your neighbors children like you love your? Well God does.