Seventh Gay Adventist

[M. T. Cross]

Yes, it does concern me that gay couples will give sex toys to their youngsters to play with

I was going to bow out of this thread because its the same circle that I have run around way to many times on this board and its simply pointless.

But this one line quoted above........

Really?

WOW!

[ClubV12]

I'm sure some Budhists are very happy with their relationship with their god. So were the Phillistines. So were those who sacraficed their children on an alter to please their god. Likewise those who cut themselves. Every false diety offers something for it's worshippers.

M.T. you cannot expect Christians to stand by and tell them everything will be OK. This is not what Christians have been told to do. We are told to tell the world, to warn the world about false gods, false worship, fales dietys. It's what we do, what we are called to do. Expect nothing less! It will not be OK for those who refuse to worship Jesus and Him alone. Worshipping false gods and dietys is a road to eternal death, period. No matter how good it may feel getting there.

There is ONE name under heaven, given among men, whereby men can be saved, ONE. Jesus Christ and Him crucified.

[LifeHiscost]

Quote:

Worldly is am interesting term in ways. I am indeed of this world, its where I live, as do you and as far as I can tell everyone else on this board.

There's no doubt there is wordliness to some extent, in all of us. One is not lost because they don't measure up, at least at this point of time. It is the cherishing of that which the Creator knows, if allowed to continue unabated, would make it impossible for any eternal good to survive, that seals one's fate to oblivion.

I'm planning, based on the promises our Father in heaven gives all those who accept His sovereignty, to be where He's going to be.

"Jesus answered, “My kingdom is not of this world. If My kingdom were of this world, My servants would fight, so that I should not be delivered to the Jews; but now My kingdom is not from here.”"John 18:36 NKJV

"“Do not let your heart be troubled; believe in God, believe also in Me. In My Father’s house are many dwelling places; if it were not so, I would have told you; for I go to prepare a place for you. If I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again and receive you to Myself, that where I am, there you may be also."John 14:1-3 NASB

You have some 32,000.000,000 molecules, more or less (haven't counted them recently), all making every effort they can to keep you alive, and you don't put your faith in His efforts for you.

As to being just another god, He knows it's a deadend, but He gives you the right to follow who you're determined to follow, whatever your reasoning. But He warns us clearly of the dangers, sometimes in the strongest of terms.

"...then I will establish the throne of your dynasty over Israel forever. For I made this promise to your father, David: ‘One of your descendants will always sit on the throne of Israel.’

“But if you or your descendants abandon me and disobey the commands and decrees I have given you, and if you serve and worship other gods, then I will uproot Israel from this land that I have given them. I will reject this Temple that I have made holy to honor my name. I will make Israel an object of mockery and ridicule among the nations."

1 Kings 9:5-7 NLT

That reveals a principle that still exists today.

" There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.

And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise."Galatians 3:28-29 KJV

Since He is Love, one is foolhardy to choose any other course.

God cares! Jesus saves!

[Gibs]

Yes for sure, we are in this world but thank the Lord He made it so we don't have to be part of it and so be of it.

I find we need each and everyone of us to come to the same place Jesus Christ did when He stated, - Joh 14:30 Hereafter I will not talk much with you: for the prince of this world cometh, and hath nothing in me.

We must come to hate sin and be of no part with it and so if the prince of this world does have anything in us then he is another master and we cannot serve two.

Mt 6:24 No man can serve two masters: for either he will hate the one, and love the other; or else he will hold to the one, and despise the other. Ye cannot serve God and mammon.

The time is pressing that our consecration must be 100% and that involves making only Him the soul and sole Master in our minds hearts and souls.

It is a must as only the overcomer will be in the kingdom! Truly He has made that easy for us to accomplish!

1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

[LifeHiscost]

There is ONE name under heaven, given among men, whereby men can be saved, ONE. Jesus Christ and Him crucified.

And I'm grateful for those so inclined as to remind me.

God cares! God saves!

[LifeHiscost]

Quote:

So, suffice it to say, M.T. Cross is probably more spiritually aware than a lot of people... it's not nice to judge others..

As to the underlined, you couldn't be more correct. In fact this instruction inspired by Someone Who probably suffered more than anyone before or since by those who judged Him, is always appropriate.

"Therefore you have no excuse, everyone of you who passes judgment, for in that which you judge another, you condemn yourself; for you who judge practice the same things."Romans 2:2 NASB

And it is also worthy of note that it is not necessarily the one who fails to live up to all the expectations and requirements for those who will inherit the kingdom, who will miss out on that privilege, but the one who does not know the Owner of that Kingdom.

"...as You have given Him authority over all flesh, that He should give eternal life to as many as You have given Him. And this is eternal life, that they may know You, the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom You have sent. I have glorified You on the earth. I have finished the work which You have given Me to do. "John 17:2-4 NKJV

God cares! Jesus Saves!

[LifeHiscost]

Quote:

I believe the God of the Bible is there for everyone and just shakes His head when He sees the people He created, sitting themselves up as superior over another human being.

Having observed many of your posts over a period of time, it appears you need to see all those who post to be self deprecating, and if they make it plain that God has given victory in their life, it is necessary to point out they have no superiority over anyone else.

The person who finds victory in claiming the promises of God for themselves, of which I have not yet found that same victory, in one sense of the Word has found a superior experience over mine. To act as if it isn't true gives false witness to God's power, and that can prove to be misleading for anyone who has a tendency to look at people, other than Jesus, as their mentor.

God cares! Jesus saves!

[Gail]

Originally Posted By: Gus Foster

Yes, it does concern me that gay couples will give sex toys to their youngsters to play with

I was going to bow out of this thread because its the same circle that I have run around way to many times on this board and its simply pointless.

But this one line quoted above........

Really?

WOW!

I have a hard time with that statement, too... What evidence have you got for that, Gus?

[ClubV12]

If we don't "judge" then we have no standards for Church membership. We are obligated, even commanded by the bible to "judge". What we CAN'T judge is the heart, but we MUST judge the actions.

An openly gay, unrepentant, bold lifestyle is not compatible with Church membership. The Church must judge this and take action as may be required. Lest the standard of Christianity and the standards of the Church be lowered to the very dust. A Pastor who comes to Church obviously drunk, should not be allowed to preach the sermon. Someone has to make a judgment call on how to deal with that.

As it concerns A.T. Jones, his sermons, writings and thoughts took a dark turn after he left the Church. I certainly make a judgment based on this knowledge before I read or study his work. I look at the dates, if it is something he wrote or preached AFTER he left the Church, I generally don't even want to read it. To much chance for subtle error and even overt error. The same could be said for Wagonner. Certainly it applies to Dr. Kellogg and many other "good" men.

Great men, who did great works for God, who lost their way, judgment is required in such a case.

[Gibs]

Well all I can say of that Club is that I am very glad my salvation does not depend on my membership in the SDA denomination or any other denomination of the world.

If that were the case it is men determining my salvation and I know far better than that.

Of what value is it to be a member of any church structure spiritually. Does that have a value with God or is it not the heart and soul and mind of the person with God?

"I saw that many were fair in their profession, but within is corruption. Deceive not yourselves, false-hearted professors. God looks at the heart. "Out of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaketh." The world, I saw, was in the heart of such, but the religion of Jesus is not there. If the professed christian loves Jesus better than the world, he will love to speak of him, his best friend in whom his highest affections are centered". {2SG 259.1}

Many revel in their high position in the church structure they have chosen, and strut it.

Mt 11:29 Take my yoke upon you, and learn of me; for I am meek and lowly in heart: and ye shall find rest unto your souls.

Mt 11:29 Take my yoke upon you, and learn of me; for I am meek and lowly in heart: and ye shall find rest unto your souls.

Mt 5:5 Blessed are the meek: for they shall inherit the earth.

1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

[ClubV12]

"Many do not realize the sacredness of church relationship and are loath to submit to restraint and discipline. Their course of action shows that they exalt their own judgment above that of the united church, and they are not careful to guard themselves lest they encourage a spirit of opposition to its voice. Those who hold responsible positions in the church may have faults in common with other people and may err in their decisions; but notwithstanding this, the church of Christ on earth has given to them an authority that cannot be lightly esteemed. Christ, after His resurrection, delegated power unto His church, saying: "Whosesoever sins ye remit, they are remitted unto them; and whosesoever sins ye retain, they are retained."

4T.17, 18

It is a sacred thing to be joined to the Church and this privilege should not be lightly esteemed. God forbid one would choose to exile himself!

[Gibs]

That was to "HIS" Church though Bro.

Mt 16:18 And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.

I assure you and all, it never was prevailed against by the gates of hell and I assure all of another truth, Only He God could build God a Church!

I have explained that before but if I must I will latter, now I must run.

1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

[ClubV12]

It wasn't posted for your sake Gibs, I know you have no intention of rejoining the Adventist Church. It was posted that SOME might see why membership in the visible, organized, official Seventh-day Adventist Church is a privilege. This visible Church is in fact the very Church of which Ellen White speaks. Membership in that Church is not to be lightly esteemed or removed as many have done.

[Gibs]

Every one is free to make his own choice and freedom of speech and I would not take that from anyone.

Jesus didn't coerce any to come and be in His Church, they were to do that of free will mind and spirit. I don't either nor do I coerce any not to be in any denominational church structure as each to choose right or wrong.

It is a wonderful privilege that is soon to be removed as Satan would not have us free moral agents as God always has from get go.

1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

[LifeHiscost]

BTW, does anyone have biblical evidence that Solomon repented of his misbehavior, that would indicate he'll be in the Kingdom? And it seems evident that if 300 wives and 600 concubines, or thereabouts, is enough to risk losing our salvation, maybe the counsel from the Word on men and woman using themselves for perverted conduct is true also.

"Do not let any part of your body become an instrument of evil to serve sin. Instead, give yourselves completely to God, for you were dead, but now you have new life. So use your whole body as an instrument to do what is right for the glory of God." Romans 6:13 NLT

God cares! Jesus saves!

[Gibs]

It is for sure Solomon must not be our protégé'. It would not be a safe bet!

Our Choice is the one who showed us the way and ask us to ,- Joh 12:26 If any man serve me, let him follow me; and where I am, there shall also my servant be: if any man serve me, him will my Father honour.

That sounds like the way to me,

Joh 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me

1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

[Gibs]

Of Solomon EGW states,

"The nation, of which he had been the pride, followed his leading. Though he afterward repented, his repentance did not prevent the fruition of the evil he had sown. The discipline and training that God appointed for Israel would cause them, in all their ways of life, to differ from the people of other nations. This peculiarity, which should have been regarded as a special privilege and blessing, was to them unwelcome. The simplicity and self-restraint essential to the highest development they sought to exchange for the pomp and self-indulgence of heathen peoples. To be "like all the nations" (1 Samuel 8:5) was their ambition. God's plan of education was set aside, His authority disowned." {Ed 49.1}

1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

[Gus Foster]

I should tell you that my trip to Oxford this Spring is exactly to tell the world that the Papacy is totally in charge today and that EVERY FINANCIAL institution if not controlled by them is manipulated by them. The Vatican is in control of every economic climate on the planet and will fulfill Rev 13, 17 & 18 right in front of our eyes.

One needs to do an in depth study of the European, Asian and African people in charge to understand this fully. Putin kissed the Pope's hand last week -- and on and on and on--

As my friend Hal Mayer (Keep the Faith) says-- they got it all.

Walter Vieth in his 'Total Onslaught' 36 DVD's covered much of this.

It might be stealth now -- wait until this time next year!

[Gibs]

I can tell you Gus that at one time the Pope and Papacy were Satan's right hand man but not since 1798, there was a change in the players on the field.

Now you would be surprised who the Pope bows to.

1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world

[LifeHiscost]

Ever since Reagan was president, most heads of state have either been kissing his ring or bowing in deference. I'm dying (not literally) to know about who I would be surprised to hear who he bows to.

God cares! Jesus saves.

[Gibs]

It just takes a little thought and you should get it. The Papacy's hay day was up to 1798 remember.

Sure kissy, kissy goes on as it is well for the politicians to kiss up to the one so many hold in esteem, the duped and Satan has many duped through others also.

1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

[Gus Foster]

Rather interesting since this one that had his time up in 1798 was reborn, brought back to life == in what form?

[Gibs]

Not reborn, Gus, but healed, but you must note, ONE head was wounded, it has six more and 10 horns which now sport the crowns, have the power as kings.

The heads now are deficit of having the crowns, note in Rev 13:1,

Re 13:1 ¶ And I stood upon the sand of the sea, and saw a beast rise up out of the sea, having seven heads and ten horns, and upon his horns ten crowns, and upon his heads the name of blasphemy.

So we see the heads have lost power as kings as the sixth one, the Papacy no longer are kings!

"I saw that the two-horned beast had a dragon's mouth, and that his power was in his head, and that the decree would go out of his mouth. Then I saw the Mother of Harlots; that the mother was not the daughters, but separate and distinct from them. She has had her day, and it is past, and her daughters, the Protestant sects, were the next to come on the stage and act out the same mind that the mother had when she persecuted the saints. I saw that as the mother has been declining in power, the daughters had been growing, and soon they will exercise the power once exercised by the mother. {SpM 1.4}

The deadly wound ended Martyrdom and the king power was switched from the heads to the horns,

Re 12:3 And there appeared another wonder in heaven; and behold a great red dragon, having seven heads and ten horns, and seven crowns upon his heads.

The great red dragon ruled through the heads before 1798 we see, the Papal head the chief one just as one of the horns is chief today!

1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

[JoeMo]

Pam and M.T. -

I agree totally with what you are saying. Those who say Pam is speaking of gods who can't speak listen or feel she is talking about idols of wood and stone have obviously never encountered supernatural beings. The real pagan gods are not wood and stone - they are every bit as alive as angels and demons. (as a Christian, I hesitiate to say they are as alive as Yawheh or Jesus). But they are real - I have had experiences with them in the past. Pam and MT speak from experience; not second-hand propoganda. Idols of wood and stone don't manifest - Real spirit beings DO manifest. In the Bible satan is called the "god of the air". He's real, trust me; and he is more than willing to manifest himself - sometimes in physical form. The demon who manifested as Samuel to King Saul was real - not stone or wood. He spoke and heard.

One thing I must say - since giving up on the "mean and scary" version of God and focused on Him as a loving Father, and on jesus as a loving big Brother; since I quit trying to impress Him with my "goodness" and simply started trusting His grace and mercy, I feel I have a relationship with Him - I talk to Him and He talks back. Taling to God as a friend in a dialogue is a much more satisfying form of prayer than a monologue requesting my 3 wishes to some omnipotent genie out there.

I won't even get into the "being gay" vs "living a gay lifestyle". It never leads anywhere except to argument and condemnation. Suffice it to say that I agree more with M.T. on this subject (and most other subjects) than I do Club.

[JoeMo]

Quote:

Membership in that Church is not to be lightly esteemed or removed as many have done.

Hey Club, are you saved by the SDA Church or the grace of Jesus Christ? If I lose or give up my SDA membersship, am I also losing or giving up salvation? Will the only people who are saved after 1844 be SDA's?

My answers - grace of Jesus, no, and no.