GayatfootofCross Posted May 6, 2015 Posted May 6, 2015 (edited) Genesis 19 Living Bible (TLB) 19 That evening the two angels came to the entrance of the city of Sodom, and Lot was sitting there as they arrived. When he saw them he stood up to meet them, and welcomed them. 2 “Sirs,” he said, “come to my home as my guests for the night; you can get up as early as you like and be on your way again.” “Oh, no thanks,” they said, “we’ll just stretch out here along the street.” 3 But he was very urgent, until at last they went home with him, and he set a great feast before them, complete with freshly baked unleavened bread. After the meal, 4 as they were preparing to retire for the night, the men of the city—yes, Sodomites, young and old from all over the city—surrounded the house 5 and shouted to Lot, “Bring out those men to us so we can rape them.” 6 Lot stepped outside to talk to them, shutting the door behind him. 7 “Please, fellows,” he begged, “don’t do such a wicked thing. 8 Look—I have two virgin daughters, and I’ll surrender them to you to do with as you wish. But leave these men alone, for they are under my protection.” 9 “Stand back,” they yelled. “Who do you think you are? We let this fellow settle among us and now he tries to tell us what to do! We’ll deal with you far worse than with those other men.” And they lunged at Lot and began breaking down the door. 10 But the two men reached out and pulled Lot in and bolted the door 11 and temporarily blinded the men of Sodom so that they couldn’t find the door................................................................As little children we grew up hearing fond Bible Stories.. Angels and miracles and Prophets and then to our horror as lil children (or older) hear the Story of Sodom and Gomorrah. Eeeks! O my! GOD was so raged and so offended by all the crazy consensual sodomy going on. That HE had to destroy, in the worst way possible, the homosexuals who dared to defile GOD and shirk their responsibility as men to propagate their species. No other town or city ever got that ! What kind of place would get the Wrath of GOD? THE WORST OF THE WORST!!!!!! Now, we as a good christian heterosexuals of the true church believe its our responsibility to rain down fire and brimstone on all homosexuals we meet face to face or (more better) in social media. The way we speak of them and preach and even vote. If not fire and brimstone then at the very least show disapproval backed up by scriptures every time we are free to do so..or dare to. Even when in Club Adventist we must share those scriptures like no LGBTIQQAA has ever heard them before.It is the first order of business of doing our Christian duty. Sadly many of LGBTIQQAA can verify this and not much else they learn from us good Christians. ................................................................................................Well I want to share what I hear when I survey the Wondrous Cross and His supreme love for all of us. You see it in the beginning of the Story here! We see Abraham's heart for GOD in so many things painted in scriptures. We See Abraham having his beloved nephew choose where to split the land for the sake of Harmony between the two families. Lot chose the more fruitful and well watered towards Sodom. Abraham will trust GOD in his submission to Lot. We see Abraham's heart towards GOD when taking up His Beloved Son to sacrifice for GOD! and We see something so beautiful (for this special thread) when Abraham heart intercedes to the point of risking His life for GOD to reconsider destroying a whole city! 50! oops maybe not ok.. how about 40?.. 30? 20? ...uhh ..I was there not long ago and had Bible study and maybe ten showed up? ok? ..10 people LORD?( you see in five chapters back Abraham earned the right to minister unto the Sodomites. have you? ) umm..maybe that was just 10 questions 3 people asked at Lot's house? oops!Too Late! Okay, TEN it is! We all know the story. Anytime and Every time I heard a minister preach about homosexuals in Sodom ..he always left this out? why? why? why?Oh how he can lead the LGBTIQQAA to the CROSS on that alone! well anyhoo.. Moses also did this on behalf of the worst sinners -Exodus 32:32JESUS showed the heart of GOD ..While we were yet sinners Christ died for us! Romans 5:8Such tender regard for us I see in GOD. Of course Abraham spent alot of time with the Sodomites. He may have visited Lot and his Family and had the neighbors by ... then Lot was kidnapped and Abraham and 318 of his house went to war and brought Lot and his and the Sodomite's possessions And the Sodomites went back to the King of Sodom**. Wow! and look of all people to show up out of nowhere and all of the sudden in scriptures ! .. (get ready) .. Is that Priest of God Melchizedek bringing gifts of Bread and Wine (The symbol of JESUS sacrificed Body or just umm bread and wine)!- Standing next to the King of Sodom**himself. Melchizedek is The Priest (and often here throughout our church a symbol in the OT of JESUS our High Priest!) of Salem later called Jerusalem -City of Peace. Melchizedek pronounced blessings in front of all “The blessing of the supreme God, Creator of heaven and earth, be upon you, Abram; and blessed be God, who has delivered your enemies over to you.” Ooo I get goosebumps! You notice God was also there rescuing the Sodomites! All I see is God's goodness in that pronouncement.Abraham even gave Tithes to Him In front of the King of Sodom** ? The King of Sodom**just wanted His Sodomites back " You can keep All the treasures, I just want my beautiful Sodomites back!"Oh the stuff we can gleam from this alone.Talk about a witness! Talk about Melchizedek maybe witnessing and loving and representing JESUS to the Sodomites. That they may be saved before its too late!Oh what unutterable love!Could there have been a feast with the Bread and wine? The King of Sodom** looking so sodomitish maybe wearing manscara and a little rouge (not that anyone noticed) right next to the Representative of JESUS, The Priest! And Abraham sitting there having a heart for sinners as reflected in GOD! Just like Jesus eating and drinking with the worst of sinners? I see The CROSS in all this! Look deeper into the Story!!!! The Bible really goes out of the way Answering the question the real sins regarding Sodom doesn't even mention homosexuality by namewhy?Ezekiel 16: 49.50 49 She and her daughters were proud because they had plenty to eat and lived in peace and quiet, but they did not take care of the poor and the underprivileged. 50 They were proud and stubborn and did the things that I hate, so I destroyed them, as you well know. uhh.. take care of the poor is on the list? not sodomy? The Bible shares what things God hates God hates- They are called abominations. Proverbs 6 Yes, seven are an abomination to Him: A proud look, A lying tongue, Hands that shed innocent blood, A heart that devises wicked plans, Feet that are swift in running to evil, A false witness who speaks lies, And one who sows discord among brethren. It is how we treat each other and the First abomination is how we look upon people! And St. Peter was later told to never call any man common or unclean (another word for Abominations) So many Christians who I love and adore love to break that Comandment. Even we find in the paraphrase THE CLEAR WORD (some call the SDA Bible) by Jack Blanco (whom I love and saw at Soquel CampMeeting) describes the event in Sodom as an invitation to a ' Homosexual Party! ' .. Genesis 19:5 *Don't be tarday for the partay! Some people think of forced sex as sex when in actuality it is rape and rape is an act of violence to humiliate and violate another person not consensual sex.A criminal act against one another. If this is how all the visitors get treated by all the men it is No wonder God had to step inGOD did set the stage for Stepping in. Thank GOD! God is more concerned how you treat people.It was in the flood and later almost promised to NinevehWe see two things God says about the antediluvians! Every thought in their heart was evil continually Genesis 6:5 and violence(murder rape mugging ) ruled the land Genesis 6:11. Yep sounds like Sodom.The scriptures explains itself! I realize to my chagrin that my church and macho culture since antiquity has turned us against a whole group of people.It is our job to rain down fire and brimstone on all homosexuals we meet in our little ways!right? I'm a glad i studied further into the matter. Now I must say something so no one will try to say something I am not saying. One of the definitions of sin is missing the mark.The Garden of Eden shows the entire Human Race the ideal. Before sin we had the Sabbath and a Sacred Marriage.One Husband and One Wife for Life! One Husband to love and love on the Wife as Christ loves the Church. As Symbolized As JESUS our Groom and we (yes both men and women) are the Bride! Every sexual way outside that Holy Matrimony described above misses the Mark entirely. A sin. So what does Jesus do with us all who missed the Mark? So many marks we all miss. The list is long in the Bible alone and God stillworks toward them to trust HIM and love HIM more! I want the LGBTIQQAA to see the heart of Abraham/Moses/JESUS when we mention them here and there.They are watching!BTW most of LGBTIQQAA have heard the scriptures against them and their lifestyles(or whatever) and not a lot of GODS great Love for them as they are and where they sit right now no matter what. It is my sincere Hope that will change. Oh if our Church can study deeper! P.S. the term 'sodomy' is widely used since antiquity regarding what kind of sex Sodom was guilty of (rape is not consensual sex) as described in Genesis 19 and maybe that's why God had to set the record straight in Ezekiel many years later for all of to see. Still the term 'Sodomy' for thousands of years hung on much like the term 'Indians"has hung 400 years around even though they figured out long ago Columbus didn't land in India. Poor analogy ,i know ,but I think you got the picture. ................................................. *Most homosexual parties don't include rape.** I can just shudder to think what one has to do to be called The King Of SODOM! Edited May 6, 2015 by GayatfootofCross bad typing JoeMo 1 Quote For all Eternity God waited in anticipation for You to show up to give You a Message - YOUR INCLUDED !!! { a merry dance }?️? " If you tarry 'til you're better You will never come at all " .. "I Will Rise" by the late great saved Glen Campbell If your picture of God is starting to feel too good to be true, you're starting to move in the right direction. "My bounty is as boundless as the sea, My love as deep; the more I give to thee, The more I have, for both are infinite." Romeo and Juliet
Aliensanctuary Posted May 6, 2015 Posted May 6, 2015 If the LORD has given us a list of prohibited behaviors, we should pay attention if we wish to join his Kingdom. We can try to pass ourselves off as Christians, but the LORD reads our minds and is not fooled by arguments that attempt to justify or excuse our transgressions. What others do or don't do is not so much our business, rather, it's our personal responsibility to study the LORD's commandments in order to resist transgressing them and promote the behaviors that will please him. Jesus was tough on himself, but sympathetic with suffering humans, a good example for all of us. Sojourner, Naomi and JoeMo 3 Quote The Parable of the Lamb and the Pigpen https://www.createspace.com/3401451
GayatfootofCross Posted May 6, 2015 Author Posted May 6, 2015 (edited) If the LORD has given us a list of prohibited behaviors, we should pay attention if we wish to join his Kingdom. We can try to pass ourselves off as Christians, but the LORD reads our minds and is not fooled by arguments that attempt to justify or excuse our transgressions. What others do or don't do is not so much our business, rather, it's our personal responsibility to study the LORD's commandments in order to resist transgressing them and promote the behaviors that will please him. Jesus was tough on himself, but sympathetic with suffering humans, a good example for all of us. AMEN, Aliensanctuary to everything you said! Interesting name! Though ...I never thought as Jesus tough on Himself. Maybe our minds go in different directions to that term 'tough on Himself ' and amen Very sympathetic with suffering humans! The OP addresses that richly! but feebly as a poor wordsmith Thank you for your kind words. God Bless you Aliensanctuary! Edited May 6, 2015 by GayatfootofCross Quote For all Eternity God waited in anticipation for You to show up to give You a Message - YOUR INCLUDED !!! { a merry dance }?️? " If you tarry 'til you're better You will never come at all " .. "I Will Rise" by the late great saved Glen Campbell If your picture of God is starting to feel too good to be true, you're starting to move in the right direction. "My bounty is as boundless as the sea, My love as deep; the more I give to thee, The more I have, for both are infinite." Romeo and Juliet
Administrators Gail Posted May 6, 2015 Administrators Posted May 6, 2015 Gay, the points you brought up have been discussed here before from time to time. People cling on to the sin of sodomy because it is the fact that one sees with a light reading of the text. But as you pointed out elsewhere in the Bible it has been noted that the people's neglect of the poor was another reason. I am thinking that their sins likely included narcissism and violence (rape). Because they lived a life of relative ease they filled their time with evil. People condemn God for destroying whole civilisations in Old Testament times. But we need to remember that the nations of Canaan did detestable things that would shock us if we saw them in the news today. JoeMo, Naomi, Kevin H and 1 other 4 Quote Isaiah 32:17 And the work of righteousness shall be peace; and the effect of righteousness quietness and assurance for ever.
JoeMo Posted May 6, 2015 Posted May 6, 2015 People condemn God for destroying whole civilisations in Old Testament times. But we need to remember that the nations of Canaan did detestable things that would shock us if we saw them in the news today. ...as did the Jews and just about every other Middle Eastern civilization of that era. Gay - I never even considered the things that you brought up about Sodom. The abomination was rape - an act of violence; the best way to beat up and humiliate someone; an effective way of showing one's total dominance over another? A newl idea (to me at least) - worth serious consideration. And I never paid attention to the presence of the King of Sodom when Melchizedek met with Abraham. That was a great Bible study! In another thread I raised the possibility that the sin of Sodom and Gomorrah was sex with angels rather than same-gender sex. Gay's study shows that might be irrelevant if the issue is violence and subjection (rape). I learn more every day! Kevin H 1 Quote
JoeMo Posted May 6, 2015 Posted May 6, 2015 The other thread is the one about Gay Marriage being considered in the Supreme Court. How it morphed into a discussion about Sodom and Gomorrah is a long story ... Quote
8thdaypriest Posted May 6, 2015 Posted May 6, 2015 Is not attacking a business owner, taking away her business, livelihood, and even her home thru monetary penalties, a TYPE of violent subjugation? The gay movement in this country is not content with tolerance. They DEMAND acceptance on every level, with threats of lawsuits, or worse, violent demonstrations. They DEMAND children be taught that consensual homosexual acts are NOT WRONG in any way. Gays would remove from Scripture every reference describing sin of any kind (not just sodomy) and would leave only love, love, love. But it is not loving, to tell a child continually that they are "loved" and at the same time, to let them do whatever they want, and not guide them, or restrain them in some way from harmful practices. The LORD gave commandments and laws for His people, so they would NOT BE LIKE the Egyptians or Babylonians, or other peoples. He commanded that they "drive out" or destroy all of the Canaanites, lest they be infected with their practices, which included child sex slavery (at their temples), child sacrifice, adult fertility sex rites, and homosexual practices. brotherly love 1 Quote 8thdaypriest
JoeMo Posted May 6, 2015 Posted May 6, 2015 Rachel, What you say may be true about certain gay activist groups, but it is certainly not the universal view of all LGBTs. Gay is an example of one who does not fit the mold you portray. Most of the LGBT crowd I know (my millennial kids' friends) is against pushing the gay agenda because they don't want to endure the backlash. They just want to live their lives in peace. There is a difference between being gay (having an attraction to the same gender) and participating in gay activity (like - well - you know). I agree with you that the gay activist backlash against faith-based businesses is also prejudiced and economically violent. Getting back to the topic; what do you think of Gay's analysis of Sodom City? Yours is an opinion that I (as well as others here) value greatly. Gay - What does LBGTIQQAA stand for? I get the LGBT part; but the rest of it is a mystery to me. Quote
GayatfootofCross Posted May 6, 2015 Author Posted May 6, 2015 Hi JoeMoe! Nice to see you here. There is a plush comfy couch in here to sit on.. as well as a giant vat of steamy Pero to sip! One straw per person. Thanks to Stan.We now have some new window treatment. ..Tiger print! It was donated by ZSA ZSA ..I think. :/ LGBTBIQQAA means LESBIAN GAY BISEXUAL TRANSGENDER INTERSEX QUEER QUESTIONING ASEXUAL ALLIES The list might get longer.before Christ comes. Gay - What does LBGTIQQAA stand for? I get the LGBT part; but the rest of it is a mystery to me. And God loves everyone of them and us. And that love from Him to us will automatically spill all over to all those precious souls ..militant or not,active or not and ,churched or not. It can't help itself! Thank you for asking JoeMo. God bless you more!. JoeMo 1 Quote For all Eternity God waited in anticipation for You to show up to give You a Message - YOUR INCLUDED !!! { a merry dance }?️? " If you tarry 'til you're better You will never come at all " .. "I Will Rise" by the late great saved Glen Campbell If your picture of God is starting to feel too good to be true, you're starting to move in the right direction. "My bounty is as boundless as the sea, My love as deep; the more I give to thee, The more I have, for both are infinite." Romeo and Juliet
B/W Photodude Posted May 6, 2015 Posted May 6, 2015 (edited) LGBTBIQQAA means LESBIAN GAY BISEXUAL TRANSGENDER INTERSEX QUEER QUESTIONING ASEXUAL ALLIES The list might get longer.before Christ comes. That is sad. The list might get longer. Of course it will, many have already "prophesied" that it will. And one post I made regarding where it is going got deleted. But one thing has me curious (not questioning! You may understand this) is why you need queer in that list when you have already listed gay and lesbian. What is different about "your" queer? Edited May 6, 2015 by B/W Photodude Quote >>>Texts in blue type are quotes<<< ***************************************************************************** And therefore as a stranger give it welcome. There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy. --Shakespeare from Hamlet ***************************************************************************** Bill Liversidge Seminars The Emergent Church and the Invasion of Spiritualism
GayatfootofCross Posted May 6, 2015 Author Posted May 6, 2015 That is sad. The list might get longer. Of course it will, many have already "prophesied" that it will. And one post I made regarding where it is going got deleted. But one thing has me curious (not questioning! You may understand this) is why you need queer in that list when you have already listed gay and lesbian. What is different about "your" queer? I didn't make the list i was reporting the list My guess is that the community took back that word QUEER- so people cant use that to hurt anymore. There has been so much hurt for thousands of years toward people who did not choose to be that way. Jesus totally gets that! HE has put his Face/Personhood on the marginalized parts of humanity Matt 25:40. And oh yes QUEER also means peculiar and/or different. Hey! we might have have one or more QUEERS here (going by that definition alone)! Quote For all Eternity God waited in anticipation for You to show up to give You a Message - YOUR INCLUDED !!! { a merry dance }?️? " If you tarry 'til you're better You will never come at all " .. "I Will Rise" by the late great saved Glen Campbell If your picture of God is starting to feel too good to be true, you're starting to move in the right direction. "My bounty is as boundless as the sea, My love as deep; the more I give to thee, The more I have, for both are infinite." Romeo and Juliet
GayatfootofCross Posted May 6, 2015 Author Posted May 6, 2015 (edited) Gay, the points you brought up have been discussed here before from time to time. People cling on to the sin of sodomy because it is the fact that one sees with a light reading of the text. But as you pointed out elsewhere in the Bible it has been noted that the people's neglect of the poor was another reason. I am thinking that their sins likely included narcissism and violence (rape). Because they lived a life of relative ease they filled their time with evil. People condemn God for destroying whole civilisations in Old Testament times. But we need to remember that the nations of Canaan did detestable things that would shock us if we saw them in the news today. Oh Yes Definitely, I couldn't bear even hearing what was done. It was out of Mercy God stepped in! GOD will be judged for all to see and be found Righteous! . There is evidence of Narcissism in some gay men that drives them further down. Edited May 6, 2015 by GayatfootofCross Quote For all Eternity God waited in anticipation for You to show up to give You a Message - YOUR INCLUDED !!! { a merry dance }?️? " If you tarry 'til you're better You will never come at all " .. "I Will Rise" by the late great saved Glen Campbell If your picture of God is starting to feel too good to be true, you're starting to move in the right direction. "My bounty is as boundless as the sea, My love as deep; the more I give to thee, The more I have, for both are infinite." Romeo and Juliet
8thdaypriest Posted May 6, 2015 Posted May 6, 2015 No one is saying that God does not love LGBTs. He loves every human being. But He CANNOT receive into His kingdom those who continue to practice sodomy - without sorrow or repentance. Back when I used to administer anesthesia, we would have some lively "discussions" over the either screen. One surgeon I remember, used to love to corner me on different religious issues. He brought up homosexual behavior one day. I looked straight at him and said, "Do you believe THAT orifice was intended by our Creator, for THAT purpose." You could see him blush (He's black). He admitted, "No". I can cause all sorts of hearth problems. "But what if they can't help themselves, because they were born that way?" I asked him, "Have you EVER desired a woman other than your wife, since you were married?" (He blushed again.) "But you did not follow your natural physical desire. Did you?" So - it IS possible to resist a natural physical desire. The WILL is stronger than the desire. If God has clearly said, "No!" Then you must choose between your desire, and God's command. Our physical desires do not always align with God's will. Not in this world. Not until we receive our new spiritual body. Someday - they will. I long for that day. I feel genuinely sorrowful for LGBTs. Far as I have read, there is no "proof" that homosexuality IS an inherited trait, though it certainly has all the characteristics (short of DNA evidence). Who would WANT to inherit such a trait ? No one. JoeMo, phkrause and joeb 3 Quote 8thdaypriest
B/W Photodude Posted May 6, 2015 Posted May 6, 2015 (edited) And oh yes QUEER also means peculiar and/or different. Hey! we might have have one or more QUEERS here (going by that definition alone)! OK, I get it! Kind of like all the rappers that took back the "N" word and use it over and over again in their lyrics. How is that not hurting anyone working out! Edited May 6, 2015 by B/W Photodude Quote >>>Texts in blue type are quotes<<< ***************************************************************************** And therefore as a stranger give it welcome. There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy. --Shakespeare from Hamlet ***************************************************************************** Bill Liversidge Seminars The Emergent Church and the Invasion of Spiritualism
8thdaypriest Posted May 6, 2015 Posted May 6, 2015 Yes, it is obvious that the "King of Sodom" was present at the victory celebration in "the Valley of the Kings" (probably a central meeting place). The kings of the other cities were probably there also. Abram refused to take anything of the spoils, because he did not want to owe anything to the "King of Sodom". The "cup was not full" for Sodom, when Abram rescued Lot. We are not told how many of the residents of Sodom and of the other 4 cities practiced rape sodomy. We are not told whether the authorities tolerated the practice, or engaged in the practice. But at some point, the "cup was full". Incidentally, I remember a case years ago. A woman of about 40, who was a brittle diabetic. She ended up in ICU with a severe pelvic infection after her husband engaged in sodomy with her. I KNEW this woman! She was from my church. Sodomy is not just between homosexual men. It is a dangerous thing to engage in - period. Quote 8thdaypriest
B/W Photodude Posted May 6, 2015 Posted May 6, 2015 (edited) While we debate about the event at Lot's house, it seems that it is forgotten that the decision to destroy Sodom and Gomorrah had already been made as evidenced by Abrahams bartering for the lives of the citizens of S & G. I am not sure exactly why this story was included in the Genesis account other than being one story that demonstrated the morals of the people of S & G. What we have in this story is an attempted gang-rape of men by a group of men and these men persisted in their desire even after being offered by Lot his two daughters. I have always found this strange that he was willing to give up his daughters to protect these "men." Either he valued his daughters very poorly or he had some knowledge about these men beyond what was evident in story of being travelers. And why did Lot find it necessary to sit at the gate of the city watching for strangers who he then made an effort to protect? Unfortunately, as repugnant as we find the behavior of these men of Sodom to be, it is a behavior that frequently is approved of in this society as a fitting punishment for those who are the most outcast of this society. Criminals are frequently spoken of by many in society as needing to be put with the worst of society in prison where we all know what is going to happen to them. There is a kind of tacit understanding that this is an approved behavior and an acceptable punishment for those thought to be guilty of heinous crimes. In a real way, much of this society is no better than those men of Sodom. Edited May 6, 2015 by B/W Photodude Quote >>>Texts in blue type are quotes<<< ***************************************************************************** And therefore as a stranger give it welcome. There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy. --Shakespeare from Hamlet ***************************************************************************** Bill Liversidge Seminars The Emergent Church and the Invasion of Spiritualism
GayatfootofCross Posted May 6, 2015 Author Posted May 6, 2015 It really shows how women are devalued since antiquity! or shows Lot's(called Righteous in the New Testament) desperation knowing these men are indeed Angelic on a mission of Mercy! And as JoeMo hinted, maybe the men of Sodom were really turned on by Violently Dominating Strange flesh! We may disagree on the Theology it proves or disproves regarding the people of the Sodom. That is not what it is about for me While we debate about the event at Lot's house, it seems that it is forgotten that the decision to destroy Sodom and Gomorrah had already been made as evidenced by Abrahams bartering for the lives of the citizens of S & G. I am not sure exactly why this story was included in the Genesis account other than being one story that demonstrated the morals of the people of S & G. But what I come away with is God's heart in all this! As seen in Abraham bartering! God is so good. No one is saying that God does not love LGBTs. I have tons of horror stories shared by way too many that disagree with that. I am glad you haven't seen that in your walk. I have learned to lean in and listen very very carefully when Christians talk among each other when very candid. It is amazing to be considered part of the group when others letting their hair down. I will be hopefully addressing that issue on another day coming from a different place. To shine the Light onto the hearts here. It takes a lot out of me to extract my mind into type. I am not a writer. I am very verbal. Quote For all Eternity God waited in anticipation for You to show up to give You a Message - YOUR INCLUDED !!! { a merry dance }?️? " If you tarry 'til you're better You will never come at all " .. "I Will Rise" by the late great saved Glen Campbell If your picture of God is starting to feel too good to be true, you're starting to move in the right direction. "My bounty is as boundless as the sea, My love as deep; the more I give to thee, The more I have, for both are infinite." Romeo and Juliet
joeb Posted May 6, 2015 Posted May 6, 2015 I look at this thread and wonder why. Why should I give preference to one sin over another? Should there be a LAD group that advocates for liars and decievers? Should we be condemned for not accepting that kind of behavior too? What about a SOK group? That's the Stealing is OK advocacy group that says we should accept theives as just another group of people who have been discriminated against. How about a K&M advocacy group? Thats the Killers & Murderers group that insists we must accept their sin as just normal behavior too? Sin is sin. The Bible says lying lips are an abomination. Is that hate speech? The Bible also says that a murder defiles the land and only the blood of murderer can cleanse the land. Is that hate speech against murderers? We're all sinners. What makes one group of people who have an inclination for one certain sin special? If we break one of the laws of God we are guilty of breaking them all. Aren't we all in the same boat together? Why should I promote one sin and say all the others are evil? Is that Biblical? I don't think so as I can find nothing in the Bible that tells me to do such a thing. Gail and phkrause 2 Quote Liberty cannot be established without morality, nor morality without faith.Alexis de Tocqueville
GayatfootofCross Posted May 7, 2015 Author Posted May 7, 2015 I look at this thread and wonder why. Why should I give preference to one sin over another? Should there be a LAD group that advocates for liars and decievers? Should we be condemned for not accepting that kind of behavior too? What about a SOK group? That's the Stealing is OK advocacy group that says we should accept theives as just another group of people who have been discriminated against. How about a K&M advocacy group? Thats the Killers & Murderers group that insists we must accept their sin as just normal behavior too? Sin is sin. The Bible says lying lips are an abomination. Is that hate speech? The Bible also says that a murder defiles the land and only the blood of murderer can cleanse the land. Is that hate speech against murderers? We're all sinners. What makes one group of people who have an inclination for one certain sin special? If we break one of the laws of God we are guilty of breaking them all. Aren't we all in the same boat together? Why should I promote one sin and say all the others are evil? Is that Biblical? I don't think so as I can find nothing in the Bible that tells me to do such a thing. Amen! Quote For all Eternity God waited in anticipation for You to show up to give You a Message - YOUR INCLUDED !!! { a merry dance }?️? " If you tarry 'til you're better You will never come at all " .. "I Will Rise" by the late great saved Glen Campbell If your picture of God is starting to feel too good to be true, you're starting to move in the right direction. "My bounty is as boundless as the sea, My love as deep; the more I give to thee, The more I have, for both are infinite." Romeo and Juliet
Sojourner Posted May 7, 2015 Posted May 7, 2015 Gay, Just a question bro, - would you consider it sinful for three lesbian women to seek marriage in a poly marriage? Would it not be sinful if it were only two, or would G-d approve and endorse both relatioships? Quote
bonnie Posted May 7, 2015 Posted May 7, 2015 Gay, Just a question bro, - would you consider it sinful for three lesbian women to seek marriage in a poly marriage? Would it not be sinful if it were only two, or would G-d approve and endorse both relatioships? As long as there is no longer a traditional meaning to marriage in a civil situation why can't they marry. If they all love each other should they be denied the right to live as a married threesome and enjoy the benefits? Servant 1 Quote Everything you do is based on the choices you make. It's not your parents, your past relationships, your job, the economy, the weather, an argument, or your age that is to blame. You and only you are responsible for every decision and choice you make, period ... ... Wish more people would realize this. Quotes by Susan Gottesman
GayatfootofCross Posted May 7, 2015 Author Posted May 7, 2015 Gay, Just a question bro, - would you consider it sinful for three lesbian women to seek marriage in a poly marriage? Would it not be sinful if it were only two, or would G-d approve and endorse both relatioships? Wow! I never thought of that. Three Lesbians! All together! ummm.. lol ok my mind goes blank. I did not get a visual. Now I must say something so no one will try to say something I am not saying. One of the definitions of sin is missing the mark.The Garden of Eden shows the entire Human Race the ideal. Before sin we had the Sabbath and a Sacred Marriage.One Husband and One Wife for Life! One Husband to love and love on the Wife as Christ loves the Church. As Symbolized As JESUS our Groom and we (yes both men and women) are the Bride! Every sexual way outside that Holy Matrimony described above misses the Mark entirely. A sin. So what does Jesus do with us all who missed the Mark? So many marks we all miss. The list is long in the Bible alone and God still works toward them to trust HIM and love HIM more! Quote For all Eternity God waited in anticipation for You to show up to give You a Message - YOUR INCLUDED !!! { a merry dance }?️? " If you tarry 'til you're better You will never come at all " .. "I Will Rise" by the late great saved Glen Campbell If your picture of God is starting to feel too good to be true, you're starting to move in the right direction. "My bounty is as boundless as the sea, My love as deep; the more I give to thee, The more I have, for both are infinite." Romeo and Juliet
brotherly love Posted May 7, 2015 Posted May 7, 2015 P.S. the term 'sodomy' is widely used since antiquity regarding what kind of sex Sodom was guilty of (rape is not consensual sex) as described in Genesis 19 and maybe that's why God had to set the record straight in Ezekiel many years later for all of to see. Still the term 'Sodomy' for thousands of years hung on much like the term 'Indians"has hung 400 years around even though they figured out long ago Columbus didn't land in India. Poor analogy ,i know ,but I think you got the picture. ................................................. *Most homosexual parties don't include rape.** I can just shudder to think what one has to do to be called The King Of SODOM! The first mistake you make is to claim that Ezekiel set the record straight. This is a false pretense that it is an either/or claim. Ezekiel is giving details of additional sins of the region of Sodom. You keep repeating Sodom, but there were 5 towns that were going to be destroyed because of their sin. Their sin reached its height before the confrontation with Lot. Genesis 18:20 Then the Lord said, “The outcry against Sodom and Gomorrah is so great and their sin so grievous The notion that homosexuality itself was tolerated by God, and it was really rape, or inhospitable rape does not meet the context of scripture. 1. The message is that the people in the region were sexually deprived. They were en mass practicing homosexuals. That is why they devolved to the point of homosexual rape. This was not a one time same sex encounter, they were homosexuals who devolved to rape. 2. The notion that this was really about inhospitable homosexual rape does not meet the criteria of context. There are a number of indicators that make it clear that homosexuality was the issue. The gay agenda would like you to believe that God did not destroy the region for loving same sex relationships, but because of homosexual rape. If rape was the main issue, then why did Lot offer his daughters to be raped instead of the men? The sin of rape would have been the same regardless. Nowhere does the text indicate or even hint that this was really about loving same sex unions and rape was the issue. The fact is Lot was concerned with same sex relations, or he could have offered himself instead of his daughters. The protection of the visitors would also have been a concern, but the context clearly shows that the same sex activities was the evidence used to destroy the region. 3.This is why the crowds reacted to Lot judging them. Lot was judging them because of their homosexual activities. He dangled his daughters and the visitors protection as bait, but they refused the women and desired the men. “Get out of our way,” they replied. “This fellow came here as a foreigner, and now he wants to play the judge! We’ll treat you worse than them.” 4. The Law of Moses prescribed the death penalty for those who practiced homosexuality. Leviticus 20:13 13 “‘If a man has sexual relations with a man as one does with a woman, both of them have done what is detestable. They are to be put to death; their blood will be on their own heads. If the message of the sin of the region of sodom was not homosexuality but homosexual rape, this creates a conflict with the Law of Moses. A person should note that both people who consent to homosexual acts are to be put to death, The death penalty does not apply to the non consenting victim. This destroys the notion of a tolerated same sex union. This is the message of Sodom, their evil culminated in same sex relations being commonplace, and this was not good enough, they needed new flesh to satisfy them. Sojourner 1 Quote
GayatfootofCross Posted May 7, 2015 Author Posted May 7, 2015 You keep repeating Sodom, but there were 5 towns that were going to be destroyed because of their sin. Hello brotherly love Thank you for pointing that out.Did you see the name of my thread? You have already stated you know all about my life and my standing before God many times. I believe a root of bitterness has settled in your heart about me and therefore in your eyes everything I share is wrong.Even when I only talk about Sodom. I wish you nothing but blessings. And ask for your forgiveness I have offended you. God Bless you again,brotherly love Quote For all Eternity God waited in anticipation for You to show up to give You a Message - YOUR INCLUDED !!! { a merry dance }?️? " If you tarry 'til you're better You will never come at all " .. "I Will Rise" by the late great saved Glen Campbell If your picture of God is starting to feel too good to be true, you're starting to move in the right direction. "My bounty is as boundless as the sea, My love as deep; the more I give to thee, The more I have, for both are infinite." Romeo and Juliet
Members phkrause Posted May 7, 2015 Members Posted May 7, 2015 Hello brotherly love Thank you for pointing that out.Did you see the name of my thread? You have already stated you know all about my life and my standing before God many times. I believe a root of bitterness has settled in your heart about me and therefore in your eyes everything I share is wrong.Even when I only talk about Sodom. I wish you nothing but blessings. And ask for your forgiveness I have offended you. God Bless you again,brotherly love Sorry Gay, but I don't see that at all!! Quote phkrause When the righteous are in authority, the people rejoice; But when a wicked man rules, the people groan. Proverbs 29;2
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