GayatfootofCross Posted May 11, 2015 Author Posted May 11, 2015 Dear Gay, Sodomy is NOT the unpardonable sin. Resisting the Spirit until you are numb to God's pleading or leading. THAT is the unpardonable sin. The "rich young ruler" went away sorrowing, because he really WANTED to be "saved". But he was unwilling to part with his "riches". He loved them more, than he wanted God. It's the same with all of our pet sins. That's the battle. We WANT salvation, a relationship with Jesus, a home in the Kingdom, but we also WANT to keep our pet sins. So we rationalize in our minds, that our own pet sin, is not as "bad" as other sins. (It's consensual. We're not hurting anyone. The rich guy didn't need that money I stole. Just a little bit won't hurt me. etc. etc. etc.) We rationalize that Jesus loves us, and died for us, so He won't reject us for His kingdom, even if we intentionally KEEP (stop trying to overcome) our own pet sin. The whole Bible is full of stories about people who KEPT their own pet sin. And in every story - the consequence of that sin finally came back to hurt them terribly. Revelation 2:7 "To him who overcomes I will give to eat from the tree of life, which is in the midst of the Paradise of God."' (NKJ) Revelation 2:11 "He who overcomes shall not be hurt by the second death."' Revelation 2:17 "To him who overcomes I will give some of the hidden manna to eat. And I will give him a white stone, and on the stone a new name written which no one knows except him who receives it."' Revelation 2:26 "And he who overcomes, and keeps My works until the end, to him I will give power over the nations-- " Revelation 3:5 "He who overcomes shall be clothed in white garments, and I will not blot out his name from the Book of Life; but I will confess his name before My Father and before His angels. Revelation 3:12 "He who overcomes, I will make him a pillar in the temple of My God, and he shall go out no more. And I will write on him the name of My God and the name of the city of My God, the New Jerusalem, which comes down out of heaven from My God. And I will write on him My new name." Revelation 3:21 "To him who overcomes I will grant to sit with Me on My throne, as I also overcame and sat down with My Father on His throne." Revelation 21:7 "He who overcomes shall inherit all things1, and I will be his God and he shall be My son." NO - I'm not teaching perfection here. I'm not saying that every person must overcome every shred of self or sin. I'm saying that we must be striving always against those things, in our own lives, that God has named "sin" and instructed us to abandon. HE comes to each individual with conviction concerning our own pet sins. I asked HIM once, what my "greatest sin" was. A word flooded my mind immediately. Impatience! THAT hit hard - I can tell you. A man might even be struggling because he knows that God has "called" him to a special work, and he does not want to leave the life he presently enjoys. (I'm thinking Jonah, and the "rich young ruler".) We "overcome" day by day, little by little, but we keep striving. To overcome, is to not give up the fight. By the way Robert, infants and children cannot "overcome" anything. amen! Quote For all Eternity God waited in anticipation for You to show up to give You a Message - YOUR INCLUDED !!! { a merry dance }?️? " If you tarry 'til you're better You will never come at all " .. "I Will Rise" by the late great saved Glen Campbell If your picture of God is starting to feel too good to be true, you're starting to move in the right direction. "My bounty is as boundless as the sea, My love as deep; the more I give to thee, The more I have, for both are infinite." Romeo and Juliet
B/W Photodude Posted May 11, 2015 Posted May 11, 2015 (edited) By the way Robert, infants and children cannot "overcome" anything. I might be wrong about it, but very young children can overcome the desire to touch hot stoves. Learning starts at a very young age. Edited May 11, 2015 by B/W Photodude brotherly love 1 Quote >>>Texts in blue type are quotes<<< ***************************************************************************** And therefore as a stranger give it welcome. There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy. --Shakespeare from Hamlet ***************************************************************************** Bill Liversidge Seminars The Emergent Church and the Invasion of Spiritualism
JoeMo Posted May 12, 2015 Posted May 12, 2015 Could your speaker of acceptance be set too high affecting discernment? Possibly. could your speaker of "discernment" be set too high affecting you acceptance? That being said, at least I think you see my point about temptation vs. sinful action. Quote
brotherly love Posted May 12, 2015 Posted May 12, 2015 (edited) Possibly. could your speaker of "discernment" be set too high affecting you acceptance? That being said, at least I think you see my point about temptation vs. sinful action. I see both your points, and we have to be careful that our speakers are set in harmony with each other. Why is homosexuality a sin? We should start going into that if we are to defend the faith-the only point so far is that it is not healthy Edited May 12, 2015 by brotherly love Quote
8thdaypriest Posted May 12, 2015 Posted May 12, 2015 I see both your points, and we have to be careful that our speakers are set in harmony with each other. Why is homosexuality a sin? We should start going into that if we are to defend the faith-the only point so far is that it is not healthy It is an "abomination" BECAUSE God said so. JoeMo 1 Quote 8thdaypriest
brotherly love Posted May 12, 2015 Posted May 12, 2015 It is an "abomination" BECAUSE God said so. Why did God say so? This is a very crucial question. The bible talks about this subject in terms of giving themselves up-the rise in homosexuality as a culmination of sin. If we dont know why it is a sin, then maybe we are part of the problem Quote
JoeMo Posted May 12, 2015 Posted May 12, 2015 Why did God say so? This is a very crucial question. The bible talks about this subject in terms of giving themselves up-the rise in homosexuality as a culmination of sin. If we dont know why it is a sin, then maybe we are part of the problem I don't think we need to know "why" God says it's wrong. Shouldn't it be enough for Him to say that it is wrong? I once heard someone say "God said it, I believe it, and that settles it for me". I would like to revise that saying to "God said it and that settles it." Why are animals that have split hooves and chew cud clean; while all others are unclean? Why does God request our presence on the 7th Day; rather than any other day or all days? Why is heterosexual fornication wrong? The Law tells us what sin is; it doesn't tell us why it's a sin. The fact that people practice sinning is the problem. Once again, I use the word "practice"; which is different than being tempted.being tempted. Quote
brotherly love Posted May 12, 2015 Posted May 12, 2015 (edited) I don't think we need to know "why" God says it's wrong. Shouldn't it be enough for Him to say that it is wrong? I once heard someone say "God said it, I believe it, and that settles it for me". I would like to revise that saying to "God said it and that settles it." Why are animals that have split hooves and chew cud clean; while all others are unclean? Why does God request our presence on the 7th Day; rather than any other day or all days? Why is heterosexual fornication wrong? The Law tells us what sin is; it doesn't tell us why it's a sin. The fact that people practice sinning is the problem. Once again, I use the word "practice"; which is different than being tempted.being tempted. To just claim God said so is a cop out and does not help people who are gay in their struggles, and it does not help out the faithful present God. Edited May 12, 2015 by brotherly love Quote
JoeMo Posted May 12, 2015 Posted May 12, 2015 (edited) To just claim God said so is a cop out and does not help people who are gay in their struggles, and it does not help out the faithful present God. Do you really think any level of reasoning can stop gays from struggling with temptation? Do you think any level of reasoning will realease anyone from the struggle of besetting sin - no matter what it is? IMO, the answer is "no". Only the empowering grace of God - made possible by the blood of the Lamb - makes it possible for us to overcome. Jesus' advice to the seven churches in Revelation always contains a "to he who overcomes ..."; but He never says how we over come. For that we have to go to Rev. 12:11: "And they overcame him by the blood of the Lamb, and by the word of their testimony; and they loved not their lives unto the death." It says nothing about overcoming by the iron-clad logic of the Divine. On the other hand, Isaiah 1:18 says: "Come now, and let us reason together, saith the Lord: though your sins be as scarlet, they shall be as white as snow; though they be red like crimson, they shall be as wool." So your assertion is reasonable on that level. I don't know if proving (which is beyond claiming) that God says so is a cop-out. When I was a child, if my parents gave me a command, a frequent answer to "Why?" was "Because I said so". I used that with my own kids for many years until they grew up. The analogy fails with the "until they grew up" part. I dunno if we ever "grow up" in this life compared to God. I don't even know if it's possible for us to understand all the "whys". Is. 55:8-9 says "For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, saith the Lord. For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts. How about God saying that certain sins are an abomination, or that those who do "X, Y or Z" will not enter the Kingdom, or that something is an "unnatural desire" is a "why"? Edited May 12, 2015 by JoeMo Quote
8thdaypriest Posted May 12, 2015 Posted May 12, 2015 WHY did God forbid sodomy? 1. Causes injury to anatomy, and can introduce disease. 2. God provided a female, as helpmate for the male. The male NEEDS the female - as his helpmate (not another male) in the process of producing and rearing children. To engage in sodomy is to BREAK the bond between husband and wife. Obviously - a homosexual "union" is sterile. It produces no offspring. Just looking at that aspect, should tell us there is something wrong with it. 3. The female was created as the perfect helper. Her brain chemistry, and her temperament compliment his. A bishop was to be "the husband of one wife". No wife - no pastoral ministry. Because - in a way, the pastor is acting like a father to his flock, so he NEEDED a woman's input and support. 4. Children NEED the rearing of a mother AND a father - ideally. Without BOTH mother and father, God is not represented to the child. Because BOTH male and female represent God, in God's different aspects. BOTH Adam and Eve were "made in the image of God". I sincerely HOPE that women, giving their newborns up for adoption, will be allowed to say whether their child can be adopted by a homosexual "couple". I hope the government doesn't ban their choice in such a matter. We have only had "birth control" for a little over a hundred years. For 5800+ years heterosexual sex usually resulted in offspring. The care and rearing of those offspring is paramount! The one man/ one woman model is God's ideal for the care rearing of children. 5. Because most of the men engaging in homosexual acts were also "married" to women, for the last 5800 years, their sins brought disease into their wives, with all the attendant suffering. Same can be said for heterosexual adultery, especially with loose women. Solomon warned, "Her throat is an open sepulcher". Antibiotics haven't been around that long, in the scheme of things. So - is someone saying that because antibiotics and antivirals exist, we can dally all we want now? Or that homosexual dallying is better BECAUSE it produces no children? phkrause 1 Quote 8thdaypriest
brotherly love Posted May 12, 2015 Posted May 12, 2015 Do you really think any level of reasoning can stop gays from struggling with temptation? Do you think any level of reasoning will realease anyone from the struggle of besetting sin - no matter what it is? IMO, the answer is "no". Only the empowering grace of God - made possible by the blood of the Lamb - makes it possible for us to overcome. Jesus' advice to the seven churches in Revelation always contains a "to he who overcomes ..."; but He never says how we over come. For that we have to go to Rev. 12:11: "And they overcame him by the blood of the Lamb, and by the word of their testimony; and they loved not their lives unto the death." It says nothing about overcoming by the iron-clad logic of the Divine. On the other hand, Isaiah 1:18 says: "Come now, and let us reason together, saith the Lord: though your sins be as scarlet, they shall be as white as snow; though they be red like crimson, they shall be as wool." So your assertion is reasonable on that level. I don't know if proving (which is beyond claiming) that God says so is a cop-out. When I was a child, if my parents gave me a command, a frequent answer to "Why?" was "Because I said so". I used that with my own kids for many years until they grew up. The analogy fails with the "until they grew up" part. I dunno if we ever "grow up" in this life compared to God. I don't even know if it's possible for us to understand all the "whys". Is. 55:8-9 says "For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, saith the Lord. For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts. How about God saying that certain sins are an abomination, or that those who do "X, Y or Z" will not enter the Kingdom, or that something is an "unnatural desire" is a "why"? With your own reasoning then-the bible could have just contained the 10 commandments, or 613 commandments in relation to sin, and that is it. This is not what we see though, we see the bible giving the wisdom of God in order to understand ""For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, saith the Lord" homosexuality is referred to as the culmination of peoples sin-like Sodom for example. Romans 1 tells us that a people who have a form of righteousness and knowledge of God would be part of the problem-I dont think we are totally there yet, but we are in the middle of the wave...and the responses I have seen show that most dont know why it is a sin because we are in the middle of the wave. i bring it up and you are opposed to even searching the bible as to why it is a sin Quote
Moderators Gregory Matthews Posted May 12, 2015 Moderators Posted May 12, 2015 Why is X a sin? Is it only a sin because God said it so? Do we need to find a rational reason for everything se call sin? All good questions. In our human reasoning we will probably never find a rational reason for everything that God says is sin. Therefore, we may only be able to say that something is a sin because God says it is. But, there is another aspect to this. God only charges us with sin when we have rejected the leading of the Holy Spirit. IF the HS has not convicted us on something, we are not charged with sin. In our human condition, none of us can know all of God's will for us. IOW, all of us have additional spiritual knowledge to learn under the leading of the HS. Until we are convicted on a point, and rebel, we will not be charged with sin on that point. Quote Gregory
JoeMo Posted May 12, 2015 Posted May 12, 2015 With your own reasoning then-the bible could have just contained the 10 commandments, or 613 commandments in relation to sin, and that is it. This is not what we see though, we see the bible giving the wisdom of God in order to understand ""For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, saith the Lord" homosexuality is referred to as the culmination of peoples sin-like Sodom for example. Romans 1 tells us that a people who have a form of righteousness and knowledge of God would be part of the problem-I dont think we are totally there yet, but we are in the middle of the wave...and the responses I have seen show that most dont know why it is a sin because we are in the middle of the wave. i bring it up and you are opposed to even searching the bible as to why it is a sin No; you are exagerating what I said - kind of entrapment. I am NOT opposed to searching scripture for the why's. I'm saying that maybe we can never find all of the "why's in scripture. If I were so disposed, I could consider this a personal attack. Quote
JoeMo Posted May 12, 2015 Posted May 12, 2015 (edited) Rachel, I agree with everything in your previus post; thanks for your great input. But I don't understand your last question (That's why I didn't hit the "LIKE" button). Again, I don't think anyone here is saying homosexual activity is not sinful (in fact I think all parties agree that it is sinful) ; they are (at least I am) saying that having homosexual desires (without the activity) is temptation - not sin. There is no excuse for "dallying" in homosexual or any other sinful activity. There is no excuse for habitual sinful activity, period. Yet, we all remain sinful... There is also no excuse for passing judgement or condemnation on anyone - gay, drug addict, "Madventist", "Badventist" or whatever - when they are seeking Christ. That's God's job. Edited May 12, 2015 by JoeMo GayatfootofCross 1 Quote
8thdaypriest Posted May 12, 2015 Posted May 12, 2015 Agree Joe. I was just saying that IF one decided the only reason for the prohibition against X was a health reason, they might feel free to do X, (now that we have "cures" and "preventives") not realizing that God's reasons may be many more than we can "understand" presently. I've heard some folks here in East Texas say that pork is "safe" to eat now, because it's inspected, and we cook it at high temperatures that we can monitor more accurately, and because it's "grain fed" now. I think they are foolish. Science will probably identify even more reasons WHY we should NOT eat scavengers, carnivores, or bottom feeders. Quote 8thdaypriest
8thdaypriest Posted May 12, 2015 Posted May 12, 2015 Our dieing bodies are NOT the only source of our temptations. Even if we got new flesh, that doesn't mean we would never sin again. Lucifer "sinned" in Heaven, where things were perfect. My personal opinion is that we will finally CHOOSE not to sin again, BECAUSE we understand that it would wound our God terribly. And BECAUSE we have seen the devastation brought by sin, and we have each felt the pain. We won't want to go through THAT again - ever. Satan was let loose - from that tree. So - in this life - he is free to tempt humans. Sometimes directly, and sometimes indirectly, through others. Sometimes he just tempts us to resent God because of the body we inherited, or because of things that we crave, or because of things that have happened to us. We are tempted to blame God, because He created Lucifer in the first place. And of course, Satan is free to spread his lies. Hanging on - to faith (in God's ultimate goodness and victory), despite chronic cravings, or chronic pain - IS THE TEST we face. Homosexuals to "give in" to their craving. Or - like Job - to "curse God and die". "Greater is HE that is in you, than he that is in the world" (1Jn 4:4). "For this is the victory that overcometh the world - even our faith." (1Jn 5:4). We "hold on" BECAUSE we believe that HE will ultimately set all things right. Quote 8thdaypriest
brotherly love Posted May 12, 2015 Posted May 12, 2015 No; you are exagerating what I said - kind of entrapment. I am NOT opposed to searching scripture for the why's. I'm saying that maybe we can never find all of the "why's in scripture. If I were so disposed, I could consider this a personal attack. The original question i posed was about why does God consider homosexuality a sin, and you responded with a general statement that we will never know why God calls all sin a sin. The question was not about why God considers all sin as sin, it was specific to homosexuality To make this into a general statement is deflecting from the question from which the bible gives answers. If there are some sins the Bible does not give answers for, that does not mean that the bible does not give answers to other questions. This would be a cop out. It is vital to know why God considers something as a sin. This can arm those who oppose God and influence those who want to accept the light of Jesus. Our answers to questions can be a one shot deal which can arm the critics, or disarm the critics, and attract or deflect the light of Jesus to those listening. The Apostle Paul was very effective at this. Quote
Members rudywoofs (Pam) Posted May 12, 2015 Members Posted May 12, 2015 It is vital to know why God considers something as a sin. not necessarily... God isn't required to give reasons or justification for anything... If He *has* given reasons in the past, it was because He thought it necessary for His people to know. But I don't think it's particularly useful to engage in speculation as to God's reasoning when He hasn't given a specific reason... that's where people can fall into the "it doesn't follow the nature of creation" trap. There are a lot of things done today that are "unnatural." Flying in airplanes comes to mind... There's nothing wrong with people asking questions. And there's nothing wrong with saying, "I don't know." There IS an issue, however, when some pose "unanswerable" questions with the intent of entrapment or arguing for argument's sake.... i.e., "can God create a stone He can't lift?" 8thdaypriest, JoeMo and GayatfootofCross 3 Quote Pam Meddle Not In the Affairs of Dragons; for You Are Crunchy and Taste Good with Ketchup. If we all sang the same note in the choir, there'd never be any harmony. Funny, isn't it, how we accept Grace for ourselves and demand justice for others?
brotherly love Posted May 12, 2015 Posted May 12, 2015 (edited) not necessarily... God isn't required to give reasons or justification for anything... If He *has* given reasons in the past, it was because He thought it necessary for His people to know. But I don't think it's particularly useful to engage in speculation as to God's reasoning when He hasn't given a specific reason... that's where people can fall into the "it doesn't follow the nature of creation" trap. There are a lot of things done today that are "unnatural." Flying in airplanes comes to mind... There's nothing wrong with people asking questions. And there's nothing wrong with saying, "I don't know." There IS an issue, however, when some pose "unanswerable" questions with the intent of entrapment or arguing for argument's sake.... i.e., "can God create a stone He can't lift?" Can you quote me where I said God has to give reasons or justification? I believe in a reasonable God who freely and willingly supplies his reasons in the Word of God In my question I asked "why God declares homosexuality as sin" I did not ask why rudywoofs considers it a sin. This would be a theological answer to a question. This is why you brought up theological propositions like "flying in an airplane" and "can God create a stone He cant lift" The only way you can consider this an unanswerable question is if you are relying on yourself and not immersing yourself in the text. This is where you will find the answers to the question. I am not trying to trap anyone, I am trying to push you to read and let the pages of the bible wash over you. It is not an unanswerable question if you are willin gto spend the time in scripture Edited May 12, 2015 by brotherly love Quote
brotherly love Posted May 13, 2015 Posted May 13, 2015 (edited) WHY did God forbid sodomy? 1. Causes injury to anatomy, and can introduce disease. 2. God provided a female, as helpmate for the male. The male NEEDS the female - as his helpmate (not another male) in the process of producing and rearing children. To engage in sodomy is to BREAK the bond between husband and wife. Obviously - a homosexual "union" is sterile. It produces no offspring. Just looking at that aspect, should tell us there is something wrong with it. 3. The female was created as the perfect helper. Her brain chemistry, and her temperament compliment his. A bishop was to be "the husband of one wife". No wife - no pastoral ministry. Because - in a way, the pastor is acting like a father to his flock, so he NEEDED a woman's input and support. 4. Children NEED the rearing of a mother AND a father - ideally. Without BOTH mother and father, God is not represented to the child. Because BOTH male and female represent God, in God's different aspects. BOTH Adam and Eve were "made in the image of God". I sincerely HOPE that women, giving their newborns up for adoption, will be allowed to say whether their child can be adopted by a homosexual "couple". I hope the government doesn't ban their choice in such a matter. We have only had "birth control" for a little over a hundred years. For 5800+ years heterosexual sex usually resulted in offspring. The care and rearing of those offspring is paramount! The one man/ one woman model is God's ideal for the care rearing of children. 5. Because most of the men engaging in homosexual acts were also "married" to women, for the last 5800 years, their sins brought disease into their wives, with all the attendant suffering. Same can be said for heterosexual adultery, especially with loose women. Solomon warned, "Her throat is an open sepulcher". Antibiotics haven't been around that long, in the scheme of things. So - is someone saying that because antibiotics and antivirals exist, we can dally all we want now? Or that homosexual dallying is better BECAUSE it produces no children? I do thank you for responding without strawman arguments, or ad hominem remarks. It is a breath of fresh air. you have made some great points-would you like to discuss God's reasons from the pages of the bible? This topic will lead and unfold many topics at once Edited May 13, 2015 by brotherly love Quote
8thdaypriest Posted May 13, 2015 Posted May 13, 2015 (edited) I do thank you for responding without strawman arguments, or ad hominem remarks. It is a breath of fresh air. you have made some great points-would you like to discuss God's reasons from the pages of the bible? This topic will lead and unfold many topics at once brotherlylove, It sounds (to me) from your post, like you feel you have some special insight into the WHY for God's prohibition of homosexual acts. That's fine. Share it. You may or may not understand the Word of God more fully than I do, but your question, "Would I like to discuss God's reasons from the pages of the Bible?" - THAT was condescending. Most of us are HERE, at this forum, because we want to understand more deeply the Word of God. We WANT to grow stronger, as defenders of the Word. I may THINK that I have a deeper insight into something, and may want to share that insight with those who come here, but I have learned - very quickly - that my insight will be TESTED here, and will either be strengthened or shown to be without basis. We come here to learn, and we come here to be tested. If you come here only to teach, I fear you will be greatly frustrated. Edited May 13, 2015 by 8thdaypriest JoeMo 1 Quote 8thdaypriest
brotherly love Posted May 13, 2015 Posted May 13, 2015 (edited) brotherlylove, It sounds (to me) from your post, like you feel you have some special insight into the WHY for God's prohibition of homosexual acts. That's fine. Share it. You may or may not understand the Word of God more fully than I do, but your question, "Would I like to discuss God's reasons from the pages of the Bible?" - THAT was condescending. Most of us are HERE, at this forum, because we want to understand more deeply the Word of God. We WANT to grow stronger, as defenders of the Word. I may THINK that I have a deeper insight into something, and may want to share that insight with those who come here, but I have learned - very quickly - that my insight will be TESTED here, and will either be strengthened or shown to be without basis. We come here to learn, and we come here to be tested. If you come here only to teach, I fear you will be greatly frustrated. It would not be right to discuss the Bible under such pretenses that I have "I have special insight". This shows that it would not be a discussion and would only be a tug of war...before it even started. This would not be a healthy way to study the Word. You took my words towards you as condescending even though I complimented you-both of us have not used any bible verses in our response to each other on our exchange-so it would be very fitting to ask if you want to want to discuss this from the pages of the Bible. This is not teaching, but inviting another person to study scripture. The other posters who have responded have already committed themselves to believing in some way that the bible does not give answers to this question as why God views same sex sexuality as a sin. Every angle was given except for scripture, and the assumption was given that there are no answers time and time again. This is real to those who hold this view for whatever reason. It would be futile to even attempt to discuss it I wish you the best in your studies and walk with God. Edited May 13, 2015 by brotherly love Quote
brotherly love Posted May 13, 2015 Posted May 13, 2015 (edited) Well, actually it did come across as condescending, as does also the response above. - joe How about this? If you or anyone else is interested in discussing the Bible in relation to Sodom and homosexuality-void of emotional responses, strawman arguments and ad hominems-I am very willing to go further. This is obviously an emotional topic for many, but we still can stick to scripture and discuss it-this is a choice I am am not willing to respond to anything but biblical responses. If some dont like my responses, then correct it with scripture. Edited May 13, 2015 by brotherly love Quote
GayatfootofCross Posted May 13, 2015 Author Posted May 13, 2015 (edited) I must explain the heart of Jesus as seen in Abraham. I wish I was a wordsmith to flesh out the beauty of Jesus heart towards the people of Sodom. I can not find the post regarding Abraham not accepting gifts from thee King of Sodom. And I already pointed out the different circumstances regarding accepting gifts. I believe Abraham looked upon the King of Sodom with unsurpassable worth. A candidate for the Kingdom of God. At that point in time it was not too late. Before GOD sends judgement He sends a Witness/message.. a way out!. You see that in all of Scriptures. God is so good to us. He sends rain and sunshine on both the just and the unjust.Abraham is sharing Jesus during the battle and after the Win and when all are together with the King of Sodom and Melchizedek and Lot and Family and the people of Sodom! you all know what it is to be bring Jesus to a family or business get together! (if your in)http://clubadventist.com/forums/topic/59883-are-you-in-or-out/ with people who are unsaved there! It is powerful! Knowing and understanding this GOD makes me give more to HIM It will do the same for all here! Edited May 13, 2015 by GayatfootofCross Quote For all Eternity God waited in anticipation for You to show up to give You a Message - YOUR INCLUDED !!! { a merry dance }?️? " If you tarry 'til you're better You will never come at all " .. "I Will Rise" by the late great saved Glen Campbell If your picture of God is starting to feel too good to be true, you're starting to move in the right direction. "My bounty is as boundless as the sea, My love as deep; the more I give to thee, The more I have, for both are infinite." Romeo and Juliet
8thdaypriest Posted May 13, 2015 Posted May 13, 2015 (edited) How about this? If you or anyone else is interested in discussing the Bible in relation to Sodom and homosexuality-void of emotional responses, strawman arguments and ad hominems-I am very willing to go further. This is obviously an emotional topic for many, but we still can stick to scripture and discuss it-this is a choice I am am not willing to respond to anything but biblical responses. If some dont like my responses, then correct it with scripture. Brotherly love, We ARE here for study of the Word, and discussion. You don't have to ask whether we would like to hear your explanations of the "WHY" from the Word. Just go ahead and share. It's like you're asking, "Can I say something?". OF COURSE you can. It's a forum. Edited May 13, 2015 by 8thdaypriest Quote 8thdaypriest
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