Job

[LifeHiscost]

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Robert said:

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olger said:

Saul had already received a mortal wound from the Philistines (1 Samuel 31:3-5). Falling upon his own sword was an attempt to avoid being captured alive by the Philistines.

gcw

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The point is, however, God didn't kill him!

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[:"red"] "See now that I, even I, am he, and there is no god with me: I kill, and I make alive; I wound, and I heal: neither is there any that can deliver out of my hand." [/] Deuteronomy 32:39 KJV

Your reasoning is leading away from the answer to the statement you made that God does not kill, Robert. The words in the scripture above are from God Himself. Do you believe them?

Unlike man who most often denies responsibility for doing anything that might be cause of another's death, God as Sovereign accepts responsibility as the final Authority of all activity under His care. When a person dies because He chooses to separate himself from God, God accepts that as His own responsibility, no matter what instrument is used to affect the final determined end of a person.

The gift of His Son that we might have eternal life is proof that our Father paid the full price to save all who are worthy of death. However man's choice (freewill granted to all those created in His image) is so important in God's kingdom, He will not take it away from a person, though that person's choice means eternal death.

The fact remains, God can force but will not. When man chooses to leave God's presence, in rebellion to His will, our Father will not force Him to return. If the persuasion of the cross and Jesus' shed blood will not persuade man He is love, no amount of force will affect love in return.

[:"red"] "Wherefore he is able also to save them to the uttermost that come unto God by him, seeing he ever liveth to make intercession for them." [/] Hebrews 7:25 KJV

[:"red"] "The king's heart is in the hand of the LORD, as the rivers of water: he turneth it whithersoever he will" [/] Proverbs 21:1 KJV

There is no inconsistency in the two Scriptures you used to reveal the part Saul played in affecting his own death, and God's acceptance of that fact being His responsibility. God knew Saul would despise living in a perfect kingdom where he would need to submit himself to a Ruler, as would a little child.

[:"red"] "And said, Verily I say unto you, Except ye be converted, and become as little children, ye shall not enter into the kingdom of heaven." [/] Matthew 18:3 KJV

Such is God's counsel to all of His children.

[:"red"] But Jesus said, Suffer little children, and forbid them not, to come unto me: for of such is the kingdom of heaven.[/] Matthew 19:14 KJV

Blessings!!

[Robert]

The two goats - who is to blame?

Some key points:

He [God] assumes the blame until the Day of Atonement.

The issue is, “Which of these two are to blame for sin?” That’s the issue in the Day of Atonement. Who is to blame for sin?

The Lord’s goat is Christ who takes the guilt and the punishment of our sin. Did the cross deal with the issue of blame? The answer is No. The cross did not deal with the blame. Who was to blame for sin? The cross only took our guilt and our punishment. As far as we are concerned, there is an atonement between us and God through the blood of Christ. But the issue now is, “Who is to blame for sin?”

[LifeHiscost]

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Robert said:

But the issue now is, “Who is to blame for sin?”

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My answer is that God is love, therefor could not be to blame, as sin destroys, the antithesis of love.

[:"red"] "For the LORD shall rise up as in mount Perazim, he shall be wroth as in the valley of Gibeon, that he may do his work, his strange work; and bring to pass his act, his strange act.

Now therefore be ye not mockers, lest your bands be made strong: for I have heard from the Lord GOD of hosts a consumption, even determined upon the whole earth." [/] Isaiah 28:21-23 KJV

I have found the blame game a fruitless venture, especially since it allows people to draw negative conclusions about others while having very limited information necessary to draw just determinations.

[:"red"] "But the LORD said unto Samuel,.... the LORD seeth not as man seeth; for man looketh on the outward appearance, but the LORD looketh on the heart." [/]

1 Samuel 16:7 KJV

It is enough for me to know God to be just, therefor His actions while Job was under severe discipline brings to my mind only one question, should similar circumstances be required of me or another I love. "Lord, what would You have me to do now?" Perhaps one more would give me greater stability. "What will You give me that I may bear up and honor you in my trial?"

[:"red"] "It is for discipline that you endure; God deals with you as with sons; for what son is there whom his father does not discipline?

Now if you are exempt from correction and left without discipline in which all [of God's children] share, then you are illegitimate offspring and not true sons [at all]." [/] Hebrews 12:7,8 NASB

Blessings!!

[Robert]

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LifeHiscost said:

It is enough for me to know God to be just, therefore His actions while Job was under severe discipline....

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"His actions"? No, God didn't do this to Job, but man blames God:

"The fire of God fell from the sky and burned up the sheep and the servants....” [Job 1:16]

Even Satan blames God:

Verse 11: But stretch out Your hand and strike everything he has, and he will surely curse you to your face.”

However, it is Satan who is the destroyer:

Verse 12 The LORD said to Satan, “Very well, then, everything he has is in your hands...."

[olger]

Amen

[melvin mccarty]

When people pick apart my post and present snippets out of context I see no point in responding to such. Sorry

mel

[melvin mccarty]

This kind of "argueing" only causes confusion and ridiculous impasses. Ok ok I dont have to be here do I?

mel

[olger]

What happened to your love for God Mel? I care about it, anyway...

gcw

[melvin mccarty]

I have no idea what you mean by that question Olger

mel