Musing from an adventist about adventists....

[Neil D]

Recently, I was invited to attend a committee meeting about putting up a radio for our small town that is rather large for the south west Oregon.

I noted that these committee members have already worked the church, got into the attic and are doing some remodeling. They are going to put up a radio station, broadcasting with 3ABN radio [and they claim, video]....

.....I have listened to 3 ABN....I consider it one of the more conservative, with Amazing Facts even more on the conservative side, adventist entertainment industrys that we have...And mostly, it's lack luster stories and preaching is just plain hokey when trying to present to a world that is dying, a living message.

The problem with this radio station that this church has, is that it wants the gospel message sent out to the community.....The question that I present to them is who want to listen to 3 ABN? Only Adventists are more interested in 3ABN than non-Adventist.. Why are we wasting our hard earned dollars to present something that the world doesn't want to hear?

There are some amazing solo in the music field....but who wants to listen to Jamie George play violin? Who want to listen to Del Decker sing "Amazing Grace"? Sure, they do well....but they can not do well in the world today without Adventist dollars supporting them....Dollars that could be used to evangelize people in some other endevor....

Why do I want to give my expertise in building up a radio station that will entertain adventists rather than bring someone to the gospel.....?

[Woody]

Some very good and appropriate questions Neil. I am glad that you are working on this. I am not aware of a truly evangelistic SDA broadcast if that is what you are wanting. But among the ones we have ... I would suggest Hope over 3ABN. I have noticed that Hope is being much more progressive and timely in their programming. They are much more upbeat and modern. I think they would attract a non-SDA audience better. Not a whole lot better ... but I have much more 'hope' for them than 3ABN. Just a personal observation from one who watches SDA TV quite a bit.

[Liz]

Where ya been, Hoss? Been quiet without ya.

Now to your question, while I agree that SDA's are probably more likely to watch 3 ABN than non-SDA's, it is still important to have for all the SDA's that can't get to church for whatever reason. I think this is one of those situations where you can't throw the baby out with the bath water. Yes, there needs to be more outreach programs to bring in those non-SDA's, however, one can't ignore the SDA's that also need feeding.

[bygjymbo]

After my conversion, I was searching actively for the truth.

God lead me directly to 3ABN. There's no other way to explain it.

We can't change anybody's heart. Only the Holy Spirit can. Our job is to provide the truth.

3ABN does that. I know first-hand.

[bygjymbo]

BTW: I live in Las Vegas where there's a low-power station owned by 3ABN.

There's at least 15 people in my church with the same testimoney.

[LifeHiscost]

The problem with this radio station that this church has, is that it wants the gospel message sent out to the community.....The question that I present to them is who want to listen to 3 ABN? Only Adventists are more interested in 3ABN than non-Adventist.. Why are we wasting our hard earned dollars to present something that the world doesn't want to hear?

Obviously you haven't heard or seen the results of decisions made for Christ with baptism as a direct result of those "hokey" programs. Paul was put to death by the unbelievers of his "hokey" preaching in areas far beyond the borders of the Jewish influence, but he continued preaching in the power of the Spirit, not to mention that numbers yielding to the message of salvation through the blood of Jesus doesn't necessarily equate to "the wrong message being preached".

BTW, 3ABN is broadcasting to 80% of the world's population now and many of the people who are listening and responding, live on dirt floors, barely making enough to keep body and soul together.

"And in them the prophecy of Isaiah is fulfilled, which says: ‘ Hearing you will hear and shall not understand,And seeing you will see and not perceive;" Matthew 13:14 NKJV

"Because you say, ‘I am rich, have become wealthy, and have need of nothing’—and do not know that you are wretched, miserable, poor, blind, and naked—" Revelation 3:17 NKJV

"Because narrow is the gate and difficult is the way which leads to life, and there are few who find it." Matthew 7:14 NKJV

Regards!

[Neil D]

Obviously you haven't heard or seen the results of decisions made for Christ with baptism as a direct result of those "hokey" programs. Paul was put to death by the unbelievers of his "hokey" preaching in areas far beyond the borders of the Jewish influence, but he continued preaching in the power of the Spirit, not to mention that numbers yielding to the message of salvation through the blood of Jesus doesn't necessarily equate to "the wrong message being preached".

[phkrause]

So why don't you start your own TV station and show them how to really tell the message the way God would have it done. I would say that more non SDA's watch 3ABN than SDA's. But than it seems to me that God would never be blessing 3 ABN or AF, It Is Written, etc if they were that weak. Like someone else has mentioned the many testimony's of non sda's is rather large. I for one an not at all a conservative adventist but rather a liberal and/or rebel and I find 3abn to have something for all different kinds of people. My 2 cents worth.

pk

[Neil D]

So why don't you start your own TV station and show them how to really tell the message the way God would have it done. I would say that more non SDA's watch 3ABN than SDA's. But than it seems to me that God would never be blessing 3 ABN or AF, It Is Written, etc if they were that weak. Like someone else has mentioned the many testimony's of non sda's is rather large. I for one an not at all a conservative adventist but rather a liberal and/or rebel and I find 3abn to have something for all different kinds of people. My 2 cents worth.

pk

Where are you gettting your messages that says that these guys are bringing people in to the church?

By the way you are speaking, there should be a few people comeing to your church who are new EVERY WEEK....Is that true?

Are they doing it such that there are NEW people every week who want to study at YOUR CHURCH?

If you answer in the negitive, I have to ask 'Why is that not the case?" If you are going to tell me that they are bringing people into the church from distant countrys, you are comparing apples to oranges....WHERE ARE THE NON-SDA PEOPLE IN YOUR CHURCH FROM 3ABN???

Look, I am not saying that there are not people coming in. I am saying that there are not the constant few that are coming to YOUR church...nor MY church on a weekly basis...

And as for the crack about starting my own TV station, I wasn't talking about TV. I was talking about consulting with the local SDA church, piping in 3ABN audio to "preach the message". AND IN MY HUMBLE OPINION, that is NOT sucessful radio....Successful SDA radio station IS KTSY. Anything else is nothing more than easing the SDA consciouse and pandering to SDA culture.

And as I understnd the gospel message, it is not bring EGW, nor SDA culture to the world.

[John317]

We need to be able to communicate the Three Angels Messages to the modern, contemporary world but without changing the Messages. God raised up the Seventh-day Adventist church in order to proclaim those 3 messages to the world. So we have to expect that the content of an SDA station is going to be a lot different from other Christian radio and TV stations. The Three Angels Messages include the everlasting gospel, but it is in the context of the Pre-Advent Judgment, the unchanging law of God, the Sabbath, the claims of false religion, the mark of the beast, and the soon coming of Jesus.

How would you like to see these messages communicated on the radio and TV stations in your area?

[Neil D]

We need to be able to communicate the Three Angels Messages to the modern, contemporary world but without changing the Messages. God raised up the Seventh-day Adventist church in order to proclaim those 3 messages to the world. So we have to expect that the content of an SDA station is going to be a lot different from other Christian radio and TV stations. The Three Angels Messages include the everlasting gospel, but it is in the context of the Pre-Advent Judgment, the unchanging law of God, the Sabbath, the claims of false religion, the mark of the beast, and the soon coming of Jesus.

How would you like to see these messages communicated on the radio and TV stations in your area?

By using a medium that understands the message in a far simplier way than what you just explained it, John...

While I don't have an answer, I do believe you might find that answer in John 3:16....

of course, everyone can recite the words....but there are only two real questions that need answering....do you really understand them? If so, do they reflect in what you do?

[Woody]

[Woody]

[John317]

I do believe you might find that answer in John 3:16....

16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life

[Neil D]

Yes, you recite them well, John....but now comes the two questions....do you understand them for you, and does your action reflect that understanding?

[John317]

Originally Posted By: John317

We need to be able to communicate the Three Angels Messages to the modern, contemporary world but without changing the Messages. God raised up the Seventh-day Adventist church in order to proclaim those 3 messages to the world. So we have to expect that the content of an SDA station is going to be a lot different from other Christian radio and TV stations. The Three Angels Messages include the everlasting gospel, but it is in the context of the Pre-Advent Judgment, the unchanging law of God, the Sabbath, the claims of false religion, the mark of the beast, and the soon coming of Jesus.

How would you like to see these messages communicated on the radio and TV stations in your area?

By using a medium that understands the message in a far simplier way than what you just explained it, John...

Yes, of course.

What I am asking you is how would you communicate those same messages to non-SDA?

John 3: 16 is central but people can misunderstand what it means to say that God loves them. Have you ever talked to people who thought it means they can do whatever they want without consequences? It depends on the idea they have about "love." Some picture in their minds eye a grandfatherly figure who will never call them into judgment or destroy the wicked.

Some people forget the phrase, "whosoever believes in Him." Others forget the part about "perishing" if we don't believe in Him.

So while John 3: 16 is a central text, it needs to be seen in the context of the plan of salvation.

[Woody]

[Woody]

I just don't get this mantra that people think they can do whatever they want. Of all the Christians I have met in many different communities ... I have never met a Christian that felt he was free to go out and do as he pleased.

I think if Christians actually felt this that there would be many more murders.

This old mantra must be unique to ultra conservative Adventists. I just don't see it in my community.

[Woody]

Quote:

Have you ever talked to people who thought it means they can do whatever they want without consequences?

NEVER! A red herring!!! Even an agnostic knows and believes there is consequences to wrong decisions. It is about time that such an atrocious reading of the Bible stops! Lets stop with this belittling of what Christ did by his death. I find the very idea of SDA Christians continuously trying to take away the supreme beauty of the text....well it angers me!! It is not up to me, you or anyone else to question the basic simpleness of that text and the hope, yes the assurance, it brings to mankind!

Get behind me!!

[Woody]

Quote:

Others forget the part about "perishing" if we don't believe in Him.

Some people just love them there 'Hell fire and brimstone' sermons. Neil. Perhaps that could be the theme of your radio broadcasts ....

The 'should not perish' is good news. Let's not pervert it.

[Neil D]

What I am asking you is how would you communicate those same messages to non-SDA?

[John317]

Quote:

Have you ever talked to people who thought it means they can do whatever they want without consequences?

NEVER! A red herring!!! Even an agnostic knows and believes there is consequences to wrong decisions. It is about time that such an atrocious reading of the Bible stops! Lets stop with this belittling of what Christ did by his death. I find the very idea of SDA Christians continuing trying to take away the supreme beauty of the text....well it angers me!! It is not up to me, you or anyone else to question the basic simpleness of that text and the hope, yes the assurance, it brings to mankind!

Get behind me!!

I talk to people all the time who don't think there will be consequences to sinning. If you witness for Christ on the street or from door to door, or in the parks, etc., you often talk to people who don't believe they will be held accountable for their sins. Many people think God is too kind to hold them responsible for sinning. Others don't believe the Bible means what it says when it teaches that Satan and his followers will be destroyed.

It is not taking away the beauty of John 3: 16 to talk about consequences to rejecting Christ. The verse itself says that the only way to salvation is by putting one's faith in Christ. Otherwise, apart from Christ, people perish. That is part of the Bible's message. But we know that God's enemy would like people not to consider this.

Ellen White wrote:

Quote:

Through the love of God the treasures of the grace of Christ have been laid open before the church and the world. "God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in Him should not perish, but have everlasting life." [John 3:16.] What marvelous, unfathomable love, which led Christ to die for us while we were yet sinners! And what a loss the soul suffers who, understanding the strong claims of the law, fails to acknowledge that where sin abounds, the grace of Christ does much more abound! Gospel Workers (1915), page 157, paragraph 1

[Taylor]

Personally I don't think we need to divorce the distinctive teachings of the SDA church from God's incredible love and forgiveness. I don't think it is an either/or situation. I think we desperately need both. Our message is nothing to be ashamed of. Rightly presented and understood it shows God's love and his watch care, his forgiveness and the incredible lengths he is willing to go to save each human being. It would bother me if a station just preached on things like prophecy or just had no teachings on the blessings of the Sabbath and other incredible truths.

I have given many Bible studies both in person and online in my life. Interestingly the topic that got the most positive response was the topic on death. People are so angry at God for "taking away their relatives". When they understood the truth on this they again found a God to love.

I have also found many who, when presented the Sabbath said that they were now far less stressed as they were experiencing God's rest on his day.

Why keep our blesings to ourselves? Just because some SDA's don't get jazzed over the state of the dead or are counting the hours till sundown on Sabbath, doesn't mean that others don't find an incredible blessing in the Bible teachings.

The doctrines, rightly understood present a very long God.

We also need to have programming that focuses on the family and how to resolve conflict, heal past hurts, and be a blessing to others.

[Woody]

Thank you Neil ... for all that you have said. I do appreciate it very much.

I used to listen to KLUV . What a great blessing for a community. And they were very gracious to have us from the Seventh day Adventist Church get free access to their radio with announcements. I contacted them many times to have free advertizing about our Evangelistic Meetings and outreach programs that we had coming up. They were always kind and helpful.

[Woody]

There is an order of things though I feel. And the obey or die ... is not the first step.