How do we overcome sin?

[LifeHiscost]

How do we abide in Him and Him in us Gerry?

What does that mean?

"As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten: be zealous therefore, and repent.

Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me.

To him that overcometh will I grant to sit with me in my throne, even as I also overcame, and am set down with my Father in his throne."Revelation 3:19-21 KJV

Blessings!

[LifeHiscost]

Are you married? How do you abide with your wife? The Bible often uses the relationship between a husband and wife to illustrate His relationship with His people.

The Bible also uses other metaphors, e.g. to have life, one must eat. "Truly, truly, I say to you, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood, you have no life in you. Whoever feeds on my flesh and drinks my blood has eternal life.......It is the Spirit who gives life; the flesh is of no avail. The WORDS that I have spoken to you are spirit and life." Jn 8:53,54, 63 ESV. "I have stored up your word in my heart, that I might not sin against you." Ps 119:11 ESV.

One of the entreaties as expressed by some on this forum, is the lack of effort on the part of a person that might be considered necessary to find the joyful union with Jesus.

In one sense I agree with that, I do not struggle day by day to be faithful to my wife, in thought or action. OTOH I, as a fallen human being, do discipline myself to avoid that which has a tendency to lead me away from joyful companionship with her.

I am very fortunate to have a spouse who loves Jesus as much or more than I do. Neither of us struggle intensely to keep control. However both of us daily spend time with Jesus in prayer and the Word. Both of us give praise to His name for the victories gained, and ask for repentance for the reality of failure, on a daily basis.

In the end, all our struggle, discipline or effort will not be sufficient to give me entrance to the kingdom of heaven. There is one thing that brings about what we both need for a joyful union together, and with Jesus and our Father along with the Holy Spirit. It is found in these Words.

"And he said unto me, My grace is sufficient for thee: for my strength is made perfect in weakness. Most gladly therefore will I rather glory in my infirmities, that the power of Christ may rest upon me."2 Cor 12:9 KJV

" Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."John 5:39 KJV

Blessings!

P.S. Our actions give not one iota of addition to the reality of our salvation. However each action of good works brings honor and glory to the Father and the Son, which glory will add to the salvation of others who look on and give praise to the One Who can bring about such benefits.

"For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God"

Ephesians 2:8 KJV

Part of the gift that He gives is the gift of being able to live godly lives, apart from sin.

"And such were some of you. But you were washed, but you were sanctified, but you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus and by the Spirit of our God." 1 Corinthians 6:11 NKJV

Sanctified: Set aside for a Holy purpose. Hallelujah!!!!

[Robert]

Our Lord said: "TRULY TRULY, I say to you, everyone who commits sin is a slave to sin. The slave does NOT remain in the house forever, the son remains forever. So if the Son sets you free, you will be free indeed." Jn 8:34-36.

Oh boy...more self-righteousness....

Two words: Self-love.

You are free in Christ, not in yourself. Yes, you are growing (if you have the assurance of salvation), but you are not free from the love of self. Again, 1 John 1:8...in case you forgot.

[Twilight]

Originally Posted By: Gerry Cabalo

Are you married? How do you abide with your wife? The Bible often uses the relationship between a husband and wife to illustrate His relationship with His people.

The Bible also uses other metaphors, e.g. to have life, one must eat. "Truly, truly, I say to you, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood, you have no life in you. Whoever feeds on my flesh and drinks my blood has eternal life.......It is the Spirit who gives life; the flesh is of no avail. The WORDS that I have spoken to you are spirit and life." Jn 8:53,54, 63 ESV. "I have stored up your word in my heart, that I might not sin against you." Ps 119:11 ESV.

One of the entreaties as expressed by some on this forum, is the lack of effort on the part of a person that might be considered necessary to find the joyful union with Jesus.

In one sense I agree with that, I do not struggle day by day to be faithful to my wife, in thought or action. OTOH I, as a fallen human being, do discipline myself to avoid that which has a tendency to lead me away from joyful companionship with her.

I am very fortunate to have a spouse who loves Jesus as much or more than I do. Neither of us struggle intensely to keep control. However both of us daily spend time with Jesus in prayer and the Word. Both of us give praise to His name for the victories gained, and ask for repentance for the reality of failure, on a daily basis.

In the end, all our struggle, discipline or effort will not be sufficient to give me entrance to the kingdom of heaven. There is one thing that brings about what we both need for a joyful union together, and with Jesus and our Father along with the Holy Spirit. It is found in these Words.

"And he said unto me, My grace is sufficient for thee: for my strength is made perfect in weakness. Most gladly therefore will I rather glory in my infirmities, that the power of Christ may rest upon me."2 Cor 12:9 KJV

" Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."John 5:39 KJV

Blessings!

P.S. Our actions give not one iota of addition to the reality of our salvation. However each action of good works brings honor and glory to the Father and the Son, which glory will add to the salvation of others who look on and give praise to the One Who can bring about such benefits.

"For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God"

Ephesians 2:8 KJV

Part of the gift that He gives is the gift of being able to live godly lives, apart from sin.

"And such were some of you. But you were washed, but you were sanctified, but you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus and by the Spirit of our God." 1 Corinthians 6:11 NKJV

Sanctified: Set aside for a Holy purpose. Hallelujah!!!!

Amen my friend :-)

There is a lot of good stuff in there.

Mark

[Twilight]

Thy Way is in the Sanctuary...

Gods end time people were given the Sanctuary message, it is the key to many of our beliefs.

But let us look at how the Sanctuary and how the understanding of it aids our opens up the way for us to be sanctified.

If we want to know the ways of God:

Psa 77:13 Thy way, O God, [is] in the sanctuary: who [is so] great a God as [our] God?

We are taken here to the idea that we are "hid" in the pavillion/tabernacle or as we see later the "sanctuary".

Psa 27:5 For in the time of trouble he shall hide me in his pavilion: in the secret of his tabernacle shall he hide me; he shall set me up upon a rock.

Here is the language that links the tabernacle and sanctuary, showing us they refer to the same thing:

Hbr 9:2 For there was a tabernacle made; the first, wherein [was] the candlestick, and the table, and the shewbread; which is called the sanctuary.

Hbr 9:3 And after the second veil, the tabernacle which is called the Holiest of all;

Now Jesus said He was the way:

Jhn 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

That He was the gate:

Luk 13:24 Strive to enter in at the strait gate: for many, I say unto you, will seek to enter in, and shall not be able.

That He was the door:

Jhn 10:7 Then said Jesus unto them again, Verily, verily, I say unto you, I am the door of the sheep.

Jhn 10:9 I am the door: by me if any man enter in, he shall be saved, and shall go in and out, and find pasture.

So we see that Jesus is the way, the gate and the door.

But to what?

Why, He is the living way into the Sanctuary...

Let us explore this.

He became all of these things beginning at this point in the history of the universe:

Mar 15:25 And it was the third hour, and they crucified him.

Luk 23:46 And when Jesus had cried with a loud voice, he said, Father, into thy hands I commend my spirit: and having said thus, he gave up the ghost.

Now we have to take careful note of what it was about Him that was so important, that gave Him the right to be the "way":

His Blood (the merits of the shed blood), did many things in our behalf, please note them:

Rom 3:25 Whom God hath set forth [to be] a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God;

Rom 5:9 Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him.

Eph 1:7 In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace;

Eph 2:13 But now in Christ Jesus ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ.

Hbr 13:12 Wherefore Jesus also, that he might sanctify the people with his own blood, suffered without the gate.

These all talk of the gifts of the merits of Christs blood[/b], and what they have merited, but please note what else the blood also did:

He entered into the Holiest, by His blood:

Hbr 9:12 Neither by the blood of goats and calves, but by his own blood he entered in once into the holy place, having obtained eternal redemption [for us].

But not only that, He opened up the way for us to enter into the Holiest place, by faith, read these next verses carefully:

Hbr 10:19 Having therefore, brethren, boldness to enter into the holiest by the blood of Jesus,

He was the veil, the divider between us and God, by the shedding of His blood and the tearing of His flesh, we are invited into the Holy Place:

Hbr 10:20 By a new and living way, which he hath consecrated for us, through the veil, that is to say, his flesh;

So that we can come into the Holy Place and present our needs directly to the Father:

Hbr 4:16 Let us therefore come boldly unto the throne of grace, that we may obtain mercy, and find grace to help in time of need.

This entrance is continually available and is the basis for our sanctification:

Hbr 7:25 Wherefore he is able also to save them to the uttermost that come unto God by him, seeing he ever liveth to make intercession for them.

Now notice the secret of Christian Joy, which is in Gods presence:

Psa 16:11 Thou wilt shew me the path of life: in thy presence [is] fulness of joy; at thy right hand [there are] pleasures for evermore.

Now notice that being hid in Gods presence and the temple of God are the same thing:

Psa 31:20 Thou shalt hide them in the secret of thy presence from the pride of man: thou shalt keep them secretly in a pavilion from the strife of tongues.

So once we have by faith entered into the Holy Place, we need to understand how sanctification is given to us (more on this later), but whilst there, let us praise Him as our sole gift offering:

Psa 27:6 And now shall mine head be lifted up above mine enemies round about me: therefore will I offer in his tabernacle sacrifices of joy; I will sing, yea, I will sing praises unto the LORD.

So let us offer praise of joy to the Lord.

God bless,

Mark

[Robert]

Personally we need to get our eyes on Christ and off buildings....

Rob

[Gerr]

Yeah, I know of at least one who says that he will continue to willfully sin until he dies or until Jesus comes.

[Guest WilloMar]

Temptation is not sin ---- except if we dwell on the thought, then we’re committing that sin in our hearts. So, how can we have victory over those sinful thoughts?

Was Jesus tempted? Of course! What is temptation but the desire to act upon which we are tempted? Yes, Jesus most certainly was tempted! He wanted, at that moment, to sin. E. G. White said that He didn’t use any power that is not freely offered to us. In other words, He didn’t have an advantage over us. What a wonderful God: “For we have not an High Priest which cannot be touched with the feeling of our infirmities; but was in all points tempted like as we are, yet without sin (sinning).” Heb. 4:15. He didn’t surrender to sin in the least. When the thought came, He immediately, with absolutely no hesitation, rejected it. Therefore He didn’t even sin in thought. This is where we get our liberty. When we are being tempted, our High Priest is being tempted (through the Holy Spirit) with the same desire, but He overcomes it every time. And so can we if we diligently keep our eyes upon Him.

Let’s keep our eyes upon Jesus!

[Gerr]

Originally Posted By: Gerry Cabalo

Our Lord said: "TRULY TRULY, I say to you, everyone who commits sin is a slave to sin. The slave does NOT remain in the house forever, the son remains forever. So if the Son sets you free, you will be free indeed." Jn 8:34-36.

Oh boy...more self-righteousness....

Two words: Self-love.

You are free in Christ, not in yourself. Yes, you are growing (if you have the assurance of salvation), but you are not free from the love of self. Again, 1 John 1:8...in case you forgot.

Free in Christ but a slave of Satan? Innnnnnnnteresssssssssssssstingggggggggggg!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Robert]

Originally Posted By: Robert

Oh boy...more self-righteousness....

Two words: Self-love.

You are free in Christ, not in yourself. Yes, you are growing (if you have the assurance of salvation), but you are not free from the love of self. Again, 1 John 1:8...in case you forgot. [/quote']

Free in Christ but a slave of Satan? Innnnnnnnteresssssssssssssstingggggggggggg!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Again, two words: Self-love

"The law of self-serving is the law of self-destruction."

"Self-renunciation is the great law of self-preservation, and self-preservation is the law of self-destruction."

"Self-love, self-interest, must perish. And the law of self-sacrifice is the law of self-preservation."

Of the 144,000 it is said, “Their earthliness [worldliness] must be removed that the image of Christ may be perfectly reflected.” [4SP 438]

What is worldliness? 1 John 2:16 For everything [where?] in the world--the desires of sinful man, the lust of his eyes and the boasting of what he has and does--comes not from the Father but from the world.

Using man as his tool, Satan has developed a kingdom that is based entirely on the principle of self and which is in complete opposition and contradiction to the “kingdom of heaven.” Everything, therefore, that goes to make up this worldly system (kosmos) — nationalism, tribalism, politics, education, commerce, recreation, sports, social clubs, technology, etc. — is founded upon the principle of love of self, even though at times this principle may not be obvious. According to 1 John2:16, “all that is in the world” (i.e., without exception) is based or founded upon lust (i.e., love of self).

[LifeHiscost]

Amen my friend :-)

There is a lot of good stuff in there.

Mark

Thank you, friend.

"Therefore judge nothing before the appointed time; wait till the Lord comes. He will bring to light what is hidden in darkness and will expose the motives of men's hearts. At that time each will receive his praise from God."

1 Corinthians 4:5 NIV

The true disciple may not get many accolades on this earth, from even his brothers and sisters in the faith. When they come it's somewhat like a foretaste of what will happen all the time in the kingdom.

Blessings!

[LifeHiscost]

His Blood (the merits of the shed blood), did many things in our behalf, please note them:

Rom 3:25 Whom God hath set forth [to be] a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God;

Rom 5:9 Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him.

Eph 1:7 In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace;

Eph 2:13 But now in Christ Jesus ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ.

Hbr 13:12 Wherefore Jesus also, that he might sanctify the people with his own blood, suffered without the gate.

These all talk of the gifts of the merits of Christs blood, and what they have merited, but please note what else the blood also did:

He entered into the Holiest, by His blood:

Hbr 9:12 Neither by the blood of goats and calves, but by his own blood he entered in once into the holy place, having obtained eternal redemption [for us].

Mark

"And they overcame him by the blood of the Lamb" Revelation 12:11 KJV

Blessings!

[Twilight]

Personally we need to get our eyes on Christ and off buildings....

Rob

This says so much Robert.

If Jesus did not want us to understand the ministery going on in the Sanctuary, then He would not have emphasised it in Hebrews.

Do you think the sanctuary is unimportant to Christians?

Mark

[Robert]

Originally Posted By: Robert

Personally we need to get our eyes on Christ and off buildings....

Rob

Do you think the sanctuary is unimportant to Christians?

Mark

Here's what you need to know:

Hebrews 10:9 Therefore, brothers, since we have confidence to enter the Most Holy Place by the blood of Jesus [His life laid down in death], 20 by a new and living way opened for us through the curtain, that is, his body,

"In Christ" we are in the holy place...heaven itself. We stand perfect before God's law in Christ Jesus.

Eph 2:6 And God raised us up with Christ and seated us with him in the heavenly realms in Christ Jesus,

Col 1:13 He has rescued us from the power of darkness [this world] and transferred us into the kingdom of his beloved Son, 14 in whom we have redemption, the forgiveness of sins.

[Gerr]

No agape-love for self = no agape-love for others.

That's agape 101. The sooner you learn it, the sooner your relationships will improve. Think about it.

[Gerr]

Personally we need to get our eyes on Christ and off buildings....

Rob

In case you have forgotten, of the sanctuary on earth God said, "Let them make me a sanctuary that I may dwell with them."

If you enter the sanctuary, you will find that everything about it has something to say about God and His plan and His way to save you. The sacrifice, the basin of water, the curtain, the lamp, the bread, the altar of incense, the curtain again. And if you go into the holiest of all, you will find enshrined there, underneath the shekinah, the foundation of God's gov't, yeah, the law that you so much despise!

And if you go to the sanctuary in heaven, it is there that Christ is doing His priestly ministry on your behalf, applying what He did 2000 yrs ago to believers HERE AND NOW.

[Lutz13]

Originally Posted By: Robert

Personally we need to get our eyes on Christ and off buildings....

Rob

In case you have forgotten, of the sanctuary on earth God said, "Let them make me a sanctuary that I may dwell with them."

If you enter the sanctuary, you will find that everything about it has something to say about God and His plan and His way to save you. The sacrifice, the basin of water, the curtain, the lamp, the bread, the altar of incense, the curtain again. And if you go into the holiest of all, you will find enshrined there, underneath the shekinah, the foundation of God's gov't, yeah, the law that you so much despise!

And if you go to the sanctuary in heaven, it is there that Christ is doing His priestly ministry on your behalf, applying what He did 2000 yrs ago to believers HERE AND NOW.

"God, who made the world and everything in it, since He is Lord of heaven and earth, does not dwell in temples made with hands"(Acts 17:24) God dwells in the heart, not some building that says Adventist Church out front.

[Lutz13]

Quote:

No agape-love for self = no agape-love for others.

That's agape 101. The sooner you learn it, the sooner your relationships will improve. Think about it.

I don't buy it. God has more love for us than for Himself.

[Gerr]

Quote:

No agape-love for self = no agape-love for others.

That's agape 101. The sooner you learn it, the sooner your relationships will improve. Think about it.

I don't buy it. God has more love for us than for Himself.

"You shall love your neighbor as you love yourself."

That's not for sale; it's a command.

[Gerr]

Originally Posted By: Gerry Cabalo

In case you have forgotten' date=' of the sanctuary on earth God said, "Let them make me a sanctuary that I may dwell with them."

If you enter the sanctuary, you will find that everything about it has something to say about God and His plan and His way to save you. The sacrifice, the basin of water, the curtain, the lamp, the bread, the altar of incense, the curtain again. And if you go into the holiest of all, you will find enshrined there, underneath the shekinah, the foundation of God's gov't, yeah, the law that you so much despise!

And if you go to the sanctuary in heaven, it is there that Christ is doing His priestly ministry on your behalf, applying what He did 2000 yrs ago to believers HERE AND NOW.

[/quote']

"God, who made the world and everything in it, since He is Lord of heaven and earth, does not dwell in temples made with hands"(Acts 17:24) God dwells in the heart, not some building that says Adventist Church out front.

So God was not telling the Israelites the truth?

[Lutz13]

Quote:

"You shall love your neighbor as you love yourself."

That's not for sale; it's a command.

You naturally love yourself so it is easy to serve yourself. He was merely saying. Take the love that you have of yourself, and use it for your neighbor instead.

[Lutz13]

Quote:

So God was not telling the Israelites the truth?

So was Paul lying to the Athenians?

"For where two or three are gathered together in My name, I am there in the midst of them"(Matthew 18:20)

People put too much faith in their religion. Put it in Christ where it needs to be.

[Robert]

No agape-love for self = no agape-love for others.

That's agape 101. The sooner you learn it, the sooner your relationships will improve. Think about it.

No....And my nature is not driving me when I say this: This teaching comes from Satan. That's why God didn't allow Lucifer to remain in heaven or it would have ended up like our world.

There's no thoughts of self in agape. There's no self-interest...self-seeking, etc.

Now look at your life, Gerry. Everything you've done has been centered in self, especially at the motive level. This is iniquity, that bent towards self.

Again:

You will have that love which seeks not her own, but another's wealth. [DA 439]

Note, there's no self in the above love. You live, not for your own needs, but the wealth of another.

"In heaven none will think of self .... but all, from pure, genuine love [agape], will seek the happiness of the heavenly beings around them." [2T 132]

Again, note..."None will think of self"

How many times did I think of myself today....My money...my this my that? I love myself and what proves it is my thoughts. I'm totally wrapped in myself. My home, my car, what I can get....You too doc...it took a lot of self-love and hard work to get your degree. What did you do with it? Did you live for others only (like Christ). No, you served yourself.

That won't go on in heaven. Why?

I won't have my nature.

[Robert]

Originally Posted By: Lutz13

Quote:

No agape-love for self = no agape-love for others.

That's agape 101. The sooner you learn it, the sooner your relationships will improve. Think about it.

I don't buy it. God has more love for us than for Himself.

"You shall love your neighbor as you love yourself."

That's not for sale; it's a command.

How many commands?

Gerry, there's only one command: Love your neighbor! How? as you love self! Where did you get that self-love from? Mom!

Surely I [David] was sinful at birth, sinful from the time my mother conceived me.

Iniquity

[Robert]

"You shall love your neighbor as you love yourself."

it's a command

One command: Love your neighbor. In other words take that self-love and instead of living for your pleasures, live for your neighbor.

James 4:1 What causes fights and quarrels among you? Don't they come from your desires that battle within you? 2 You want something but don't get it. You kill [worse case] and covet, but you cannot have what you want. You quarrel and fight. You do not have, because you do not ask God. 3 When you ask, you do not receive, because you ask with wrong motives, [how?] that you may spend what you get on your pleasures.