The 27, I mean 28 Fundamentals

[Solja247]

Hey all, Im new here. Im 17 years old Adventist all my life and I have wanted to be a minister since I was 10. During the last 7 years of my life I have studied the Bible and what the church teaches extensively. So I will make other threads later on, but the first one I am going to make is the 27, I mean 28 Fundamentals.

To be honest with you, I couldnt think of a more useless system. teaching people the 28 fundamentals DOESNT DO MUCH! I know people who were baptised into the church are now out in the world doing things which is disgusting. I believe only 2 things should be taught before someone becomes a SDA. The Sabbath and having a relationship with Jesus. Out of all the questions I have been asked EVERYONE WANTS TO KNOW HOW TO HAVE A RELATIONSHIP WITH JESUS! No one cares about what we think about tithe. I am sure some of you are saying you are ignorant and havent been around long enough. Pherhaps your problem is you have been around too long and that you still want people to live in the 1950s!

Futher more the 27 fundamentals only came into power, so to speak in 1970. It was not what Ellen White nor anyone else told us to teach. When I become a pastor, before I baptise someone all they nned to know is to have a relationshp with JEsus, The sabbath will be intertwined into it. So yeah can someone please tell me how and what the 28 fundamnetals do? In my understanding they dont do anything but make us look like a cult and are a waste of time.

[John317]

Do you agree with SDA FB #1?

It's this--

1. Holy Scriptures:

The Holy Scriptures, Old and New Testaments, are the written Word of God, given by divine inspiration through holy men of God who spoke and wrote as they were moved by the Holy Spirit. In this Word, God has committed to man the knowledge necessary for salvation. The Holy Scriptures are the infallible revelation of His will. They are the standard of character, the test of experience, the authoritative revealer of doctrines, and the trustworthy record of God's acts in history. (2 Peter 1:20, 21; 2 Tim. 3:16, 17; Ps. 119:105; Prov. 30:5, 6; Isa. 8:20; John 17:17; 1 Thess. 2:13; Heb. 4:12.)

Question: Why do you want to be a Seventh-day Adventist pastor and not the pastor in a different church? There are other churches and groups who keep the Sabbath and believe in Jesus.

[Solja247]

Just because I think teaching people the 28 fundamentals before they are baptised is an abosulte waste of time, does not mean that I do not believe the Adventist church is the most Biblicalest Church. BTW I fully agree with all 28 fundamentals, but I do not understand why a new person to the adventist church has to be beaten over the head with what the church believes when most people dont even know what a relationship with Jesus, explain to me that? Why cant that be our ONLY fundamental? yes sola scripture, soul sleep, Health message etc, that all comes later. In the west we are dying as a church. We need to stop living in the 50s and see what we need to do to bring a lot of people into the church.

[Solja247]

Why does one have to know the 28 fundamentals before becoming an Adventist? Isnt it supposed to be all about Jesus?

[Woody]

Hey Solja ....

I would say that you are correct about what is important before baptizing someone into Christ.

But before voting someone to become a member of the Seventh day Adventist Church .... wouldn't it be important for them to know what Seventh day Adventists believe in?

[Solja247]

I couldnt agree more with what you guys are saying.

But we focus to much on the 'health message' and 'spirit of prophecy' and forget to tell people about having a relationship with Jesus. This is my problem with the 28 fundamentals. Ok there is now one study guide, since the 28th fundamental is relationship with Jesus. But we are litterally beating people over the head with the Bible. Why cant it be a journey for them?

We have so many Bible in the West, but the majority are dust collectors.

Christianity used to be simple, well quite a long time ago. in 28 weeks we are smashing all 'the truth' into them. BTW Alcohol, in Australia is in the adventist church! I go to an adventist school. There is about 6 adventist in my year and only two of us dont drink. Check out what is happening at Avondale, Alcohol again. But yet we still prance around like leprechauns. Showing people how to have a relationship with Jesus, all these problems will go away.

When I become a pastor, I think I will NOT use the 28 fundmentals as a guideline. I will use them as a follow up. Instead I will talk about a relationship with Jesus.

[Solja247]

I go to Macquarie College, about 30mins away from Avondale. If anyone drinks on campus they are suspended or worse. Since the church does not believe in drinking and since underage drinking is illegal. Yeah I am from Australia. I am tossing up between going to Avondale College to do theology or PAU (Papau New Guniea)

A lot of people are laid back on the issue of drinking in the church. It is is quite sad. My sister goes to Avondale College and she says the thing which makes people go to the clubs is boredom. Isnt that sad? we are not trying to counter Australian culture of drinking, instead we are encouraging it.

I have heard rumours that some of theo students do go out clubbing. I will tell you in 2 years if that is true. I am 100% against drinking alcohol. I have been to parties where every one gets drunk, how is that 'having fun'?

BTW happy Sabbath, Feliz sabado! to you all!

[Solja247]

Unfortunately no.

[John317]

When I become a pastor, I think I will NOT use the 28 fundmentals as a guideline. I will use them as a follow up. Instead I will talk about a relationship with Jesus.

Are you telling me that the 28 FB have nothing to do with Jesus?

Can't you study the 28 FB at the same time that you study and teach people to have a relationship with Jesus?

I bet you can teach the 28 FB all from the book of John, the Life and Teaching of Jesus. In fact, I know pastors who do it.

Look at this way:

Let's say you study only the love of Jesus with people and nothing else. Then you baptize them and they join the SDA church.

A few years later you are going to have people coming up to you and asking you why you didn't tell them what the church believes. Some of them will say, "If you had told me the church believes thus and so, I never would have joined." They will feel like you deceived them. People have a right to know the beliefs and practices of the church or organization they are joining, right?

Let's suppose every minister does what you plan to do-- not teach anyone anything about the church's beliefs. What would we have? Would we have unity, with everyone speaking the same truth? No, it would be confusion, even more than it is now-- with everyone saying something different, so the world would never hear the trumpet giving a certain sound. Would people be impressed with this confusion and get ready for Christ's return? No. Why not? Because you won't have taught them that they need to get ready, let alone how to get ready.

I suggest you talk to a few people who have been bringing people to Christ for the last 30 years. Listen as they explain why they do things the way they do.

[Solja247]

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A few years later you are going to have people coming up to you and asking you why you didn't tell them what the church believes. Some of them will say, "If you had told me the church believes thus and so, I never would have joined." They will feel like you deceived them. People have a right to know the beliefs and practices of the church or organization they are joining, right?

The 28 fundamentals SHOULD be a follow up. Yes I think SOME funamentals could be intertwined into the Relationship with Jesus. Bu no. First of all never register to anything if they do not know the terms and conditions. I few friends of mine were quite suprised about the 13 points of Baptism, something like that. So the church still fails.

[Solja247]

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Are you telling me that the 28 FB have nothing to do with Jesus?

No some do, some dont.

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Let's say you study only the love of Jesus with people and nothing else.

I said having a relationship with Jesus.

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Let's suppose every minister does what you plan to do-- not teach anyone anything about the church's beliefs. What would we have?

A church which isnt arrogant and didnt think they were better than most/all denominations

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Would we have unity, with everyone speaking the same truth?

So your alternative to that is to spoon feed 'the truth' to the majority of the church populaton, instead of them finding how awesome God is in the Bible? Through their own study?

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Because you won't have taught them that they need to get ready, let alone how to get ready.

Please show me from scripture what else one need to be ready for Jesus's return other than a relationship with Jesus?

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I suggest you talk to a few people who have been bringing people to Christ for the last 30 years. Listen as they explain why they do things the way they do.

I actually did today. A pastor from Papau New guinea who is the second highest in his conference, he believes that if one is taught to have a relationship with Jesus, the 28 fundamentals will fall into place.

[John317]

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Let's suppose every minister does what you plan to do-- not teach anyone anything about the church's beliefs. What would we have?

A church which isnt arrogant and didnt think they were better than most/all denominations

Maybe this is how you see your beloved Seventh-day Adventist church but I don't see the church in that way.

I certainly do not feel I am better than others, nor do I believe that other SDAs think they are better than others. No doubt some may, however, because it seems to be a human failing.

But simply not teaching the 28 FB is not going to have the effect of making the church not be arrogant. It would be nice if things were that simple. I know people in a lot of different groups who are arrogant and they know absolutely nothing about the FB 28 or even about the SDA church. It is rather a human failing, unconnected to any particular church or group of people.

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JOHN2:17-- Would we have unity, with everyone speaking the same truth?

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SOLJA247---So your alternative to that is to spoon feed 'the truth' to the majority of the church populaton, instead of them finding how awesome God is in the Bible? Through their own study?

No, not at all. As you show love towards others, and as share this knowledge of the Bible with them, they will be growing in the Lord and learning how to study on their own. You stimulate their thirst for Christ and for learning the word of God.

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JOHN 3:17-- Because you won't have taught them that they need to get ready, let alone how to get ready.

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SOLJA247-- Please show me from scripture what else one need to be ready for Jesus's return other than a relationship with Jesus?

A faith-based relationship with Jesus Christ is the basis of everything. But a relationship that is not leading to ever increasing love and deeper commitment to Christ will fail in the end.

Just wondering if you understand and believe in the Investigative Judgment-- FB 24. Do you see the relationship between this FB and having a personal relationship with Christ?

Look at these texts:

2 Peter 3: 10-13

2 Peter 1: 5-11(notice conditional "if"s)

Rev. 16: 15

Rev. 22: 11, 12, 14

Rev. 14: 6-12

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JOHN3:17-- I suggest you talk to a few people who have been bringing people to Christ for the last 30 years. Listen as they explain why they do things the way they do.

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SOLJA247-- I actually did today. A pastor from Papau New guinea who is the second highest in his conference, he believes that if one is taught to have a relationship with Jesus, the 28 fundamentals will fall into place.

They won't unless someone teaches the 28 FB, and they aren't likely to think they're important enough to allow them to "fall into place" if their leaders don't think they're important enough to even mention them. People have to know the 28 FB exist if they are going to "fall into place."

Question: Have the 28 FB "fallen into place" in your personal experience? How is that working for you?

[Solja247]

My friend, I dont know what adventist church you have seen but I will breifly tell you what I have seen.

I have seen leaders in the North New South Wales Conference be so racist, they made a black and a white sabbath school. (This truly did happen)

I am in a church has back stabbed my parents in quite a few churches.

I am in a church, where a pastor told my younger brother to aspire to be like Jesus.

I am in a church where my church was told it doesnt pay enough tithe, thus not going to get a pastor or anyone funds for the church which was sooooooo broken down

I am in a church where I cant even remember the last time A pastor visited my family. (I lie i remember very well, I was 6ish)

I am in a church that the pastor who gave my brother baptisimal studies would and did not even congratulate.

I am in a church, where if you dont like what the pastor is doing you send them nasty text messages.

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I certainly do not feel I am better than others, nor do I believe that other SDAs think they are better than others. No doubt some may, however, because it seems to be a human failing.

There are too many Adventists who believe they are better than a pentecostal etc, we think we are so good that we call them devils because they speak in tounges!

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Just wondering if you understand and believe in the Investigative Judgment-- FB 24. Do you see the relationship between this FB and having a personal relationship with Christ?

To be honest with you I dont believe the Investigative Judgement is Biblical. Paul not even Jesus hints it. I tend to avoid debates about the Investigative judgement.

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Question: Have the 28 FB "fallen into place" in your personal experience? How is that working for you?

Yes it has. Suprisingly. I havent had many people in the church to help me. Either we were moving or people were being vultures in the church. God has been there for me. Not the church. The church has thrown a lot of discouragement, which has made me stronger, that is about all the church has done for me. So yes the 28 fundamentals do fall in place.

[Robert]

Well, just remember that the church is full of sinners....Some are more mature then others, but at the end of the day you can't look to any of them. You must look to the love of Christ to get you through the day.

People will let you down because none of them are totally free of the sin nature. Sin, the love of self, still has a grip on the best of us. Not I'm not denying growth, but I am denying perfection.

As my friend Jack says, "where you have self you have sin"....The day the church manifests the agape love of God that day you'll have harmony. Until then....

[Woody]

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I have seen leaders in the North New South Wales Conference be so racist, they made a black and a white sabbath school. (This truly did happen)

I am in a church has back stabbed my parents in quite a few churches.

I am in a church, where a pastor told my younger brother to aspire to be like Jesus.

I am in a church where my church was told it doesnt pay enough tithe, thus not going to get a pastor or anyone funds for the church which was sooooooo broken down

I am in a church where I cant even remember the last time A pastor visited my family. (I lie i remember very well, I was 6ish)

I am in a church that the pastor who gave my brother baptisimal studies would and did not even congratulate.

I am in a church, where if you dont like what the pastor is doing you send them nasty text messages.

Sure see a lot of 'I' s.

A lot of poor 'me's'

Perhaps if you were to put all those I's to work instead of criticIzing ... the church would be a much better place. Go out and make a difference.

As it stands now .... it sure doesn't sound like you are happy in the SDA church. Are you sure you are in the right place?

[Dr. Rich]

Here is the thing: If a person graduated from High School and then went to College and only was taught the same thing they were taught in High School for the next four years of College, how many do you suppose would continue going to school? Dah? It does not take a brain surgeon to understand the problem in our SDA Church.

Isn’t this the reason why entertainment is used in so many ‘modern’ celebration churches attempt to retain members? When was the last time you heard a sermon on the words of Jesus given to us by ONLY His eyewitnesses? Never? I wonder why? Could it be that the GC is afraid of losing members (money) if they had their teachers and pastors teaching the words of Jesus?

What we do find though are the words of Paul being preached because they are nice words—soothing to the soul—all one has to do is believe (?) that they have a personal relationship and are saved by grace thru faith. How sweet! (And what deception!)

IF you don’t believe me, check out all of the major churches today. Show me anywhere that respect and obeying God by keeping the commandments is not only important, but the ONLY thing that Jesus said would save one from damnation. (Rev. 12:17)

Dr. Rich (SDA)

[Woody]

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IF you don’t believe me, check out all of the major churches today. Show me anywhere that respect and obeying God by keeping the commandments is not only important, but the ONLY thing that Jesus said would save one from damnation. (Rev. 12:17)

Keeping the commandments is the only way to avoid the curse of the law .... this is true. Some try to make it happen in their life. Others of us depend upon what Jesus did on this earth to take our place. It is by HIS life and death that I am saved .... not by my own keeping of the law. He did it for me.

Praise God.

[John317]

To be honest with you I dont believe the Investigative Judgement is Biblical. Paul not even Jesus hints it. I tend to avoid debates about the Investigative judgement.

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JOHN3:17--Question: Have the 28 FB "fallen into place" in your personal experience? How is that working for you?

Yes it has. Suprisingly. I havent had many people in the church to help me. Either we were moving or people were being vultures in the church. God has been there for me. Not the church. The church has thrown a lot of discouragement, which has made me stronger, that is about all the church has done for me. So yes the 28 fundamentals do fall in place.

Your post doesn't sound at all like the 28 are falling into place, my friend. You say you do not believe in the Investigative Judgment, yet of course that this one of the 28, so in what way are the 28 "falling into place"?

[John317]

My friend, I dont know what adventist church you have seen but I will breifly tell you what I have seen.

I have seen leaders in the North New South Wales Conference be so racist, they made a black and a white sabbath school. (This truly did happen)

I am in a church has back stabbed my parents in quite a few churches.

I am in a church, where a pastor told my younger brother to aspire to be like Jesus.

I am in a church where my church was told it doesnt pay enough tithe, thus not going to get a pastor or anyone funds for the church which was sooooooo broken down

I am in a church where I cant even remember the last time A pastor visited my family. (I lie i remember very well, I was 6ish)

I am in a church that the pastor who gave my brother baptisimal studies would and did not even congratulate.

I am in a church, where if you dont like what the pastor is doing you send them nasty text messages.

I live in the United States and have been well acquainted with the Seventh-day Adventist church for over 50 years. I've attended SDA churches in Europe as well as all over the USA. I went to SDA schools from kindergarten through college. I live in a town where about 40 % of the population are SDA.

I must say that I don't know much about the SDA church in Australia, except the SDA church there seems to have a lot of severe problems if what you say is true. I can't even imagine it. I'm sorry to hear about your problems. If I saw it the way you do, I am sure I wouldn't be an SDA today. My experience in the SDA church has been beautiful.

I left the church for many years because I wanted to experience "the world," but my good memories of the church was one of the reasons I came back to Christ and to the church.

I'm so very sorry to hear about your troubles.

If you send me by PM the address of your church and the name of the pastor and the elder, and give me their phone numbers, I will do what I can to see that the problems you speak of will get the attention they deserve.

In the meantime I'll be praying for you and your church and the situation in Australia, and I'll ask others to pray along with me.

[Woody]

No matter what we do or want others to do for us .... people will always fail. We all are sinners. Yes, even the pastor is a sinner and will fail you.

If one looks to people for hope or encouragement .... they will be found wanting. We must focus on Jesus only. All others will fail us. But Jesus will always come on top.

Look unto Jesus ...

And the fruit of looking unto Jesus will be that we will be focused on helping others rather having others helping us.

[TreeOfLife]

God Bless You, Solja!

Hey all, Im new here. Im 17 years old Adventist all my life and I have wanted to be a minister since I was 10. During the last 7 years of my life I have studied the Bible and what the church teaches extensively. So I will make other threads later on, but the first one I am going to make is the 27, I mean 28 Fundamentals.

To be honest with you, I couldnt think of a more useless system. teaching people the 28 fundamentals DOESNT DO MUCH! I know people who were baptised into the church are now out in the world doing things which is disgusting. I believe only 2 things should be taught before someone becomes a SDA. The Sabbath and having a relationship with Jesus. Out of all the questions I have been asked EVERYONE WANTS TO KNOW HOW TO HAVE A RELATIONSHIP WITH JESUS! No one cares about what we think about tithe. I am sure some of you are saying you are ignorant and havent been around long enough. Pherhaps your problem is you have been around too long and that you still want people to live in the 1950s!

Futher more the 27 fundamentals only came into power, so to speak in 1970. It was not what Ellen White nor anyone else told us to teach. When I become a pastor, before I baptise someone all they nned to know is to have a relationshp with JEsus, The sabbath will be intertwined into it. So yeah can someone please tell me how and what the 28 fundamnetals do? In my understanding they dont do anything but make us look like a cult and are a waste of time.

[Gerr]

Solja,

God often uses marriage to illustrate His relationship with His people. A relationship with Jesus without doctrines (doctrine means teaching) is like having an open-ended relationship/marriage, i.e. shacking up with someone. Doctrine gives flesh and bones to that relationship. It defines the boundaries. Without those boundaries, then that relationsip may very well include others. This the Bible calls spiritual adultery.

A relationship with Jesus includes a relationship with the Father and the Holy Spirit. That is why we have the doctrine of the trinity.

A relationship with Jesus is meaningless if we bow to idols, profess His name and live as though we do not know Him. That's why we teach as doctrine the first table of the 10 commandments. The 4th teaches us who created us; we did not evolve.

How we relation to others reflects our vertical relationship with Jesus. The latter is a sham if we can't love a brother or sister that we can see while professing to love Jesus whom we cannot see. Thus we teach the last 6 of the 10c as defining that horizontal relationsip.

I could go on and on about the rest of the 28 fundamentals. It is tragic when someone learns about the doctrines but never learns about the Person that these doctrines point to. But that should not be surprising since a lot of people know what they pledged when they entered into a marital covenant yet fail to live up to them.

[wayfinder]

Did you know that the covenant of marriage is the only covenant which is made by two people because they love each other. Is it any wonder that God uses the marriage covenant to base His connection with His kingdom upon. The covenant of love is the Ten Commandments which were kept in the Ark of the Covenant in the Most Holy Place in the Sanctuary.

[Solja247]

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Sure see a lot of 'I' s.

A lot of poor 'me's'

Perhaps if you were to put all those I's to work instead of criticIzing ... the church would be a much better place. Go out and make a difference.

As it stands now .... it sure doesn't sound like you are happy in the SDA church. Are you sure you are in the right place?

Let me explain 'the work' my family has done.

When I was in grade 8, I only had one friend who was black. Someone comes to my church and gets up the front and talks about helping the Sudanese (Australia brings in many refugees into it country) My mum and I decided to help. We talked to this lady (who later back stabbed us) and she gave us a family to go and visit. It was very interesting lol. Anyways we get to the point where are helping 9 families +. MOST of the Suddanese community went to my church. So there was now about 70 suddanese going to the church. The church I went to is massive. A million dollar building, where the only expected black people are rich ones. Anyways im gona cut this short.My sabbath school (Which I LOVED) the leader had conflicts with my mum. My mum thought the Suddanese could go for free to some of these actitivties the sabbath school was holding. but teacher thought other wise. etc. Many rumours were going around, like the little kids were peeing in the hand basin. (These hand bassins are very tall! Kids cant get to them) A meeting with the sabbath school leaders. One was a suddanese theo student. They said to his face that the suddanese were making too much noise. (it was both the black and the white) so they SEPERATED the sabbath school depending upon race. What the pastor do? He wanted to be professional about it so he did nothing. They stopped the luncheons there because the black people were eating too much food. This fully angered me out I did not respect the sabbath school or the church. I was 14. When they conducted a survey. I told them basically they were all racist and one of the questions was who do you want to teach you? I wrote something like not someone who is racist. The survey was actually conducted so the black people who were underage had to go to Junior sabbath school and couldnt hang with their mates. I thought that was disgusting so when one of the leaders took them back I was basically abusing her calling her racist saying it was disgusting etc. She made the stupid mistake to say if I didnt stop she would talk to mum! My mum was devastated what they had done. So lol she got told! this happened a few times. Till someone else gave me a lecture then they got told off by my mum. I think what happenede in that church was the most evilest thing one could do. They damwel deserved to be told off. They made one of the leaders a security guard to make sure my mum would not come back. We left soon after that. Someone close to us got murdered MOST of the suddanese community back stabbed us because of rumours and they were jealous. etc. It goes on and on and on. (BTW we have done a lot more than that )

Its funny out of all that one thing I learnt. the Suddanese Chrstians were so horrible to us but the Liberans who Muslims treatede us as family? Isnt that funny.

So before you go and say you are just having a pity party. I am not. I am telling you my experience is with the Adventist church.

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Well, just remember that the church is full of sinners....Some are more mature then others, but at the end of the day you can't look to any of them. You must look to the love of Christ to get you through the day.

If they have 'issues' like with racism, they shouldnt be a leader in the church. end of story.

The Adventist church has shown me NOT what to become, a typical Adventist.

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Here is the thing: If a person graduated from High School and then went to College and only was taught the same thing they were taught in High School for the next four years of College, how many do you suppose would continue going to school? Dah? It does not take a brain surgeon to understand the problem in our SDA Church.

Here is the thing. I have studied the Bible for myself since I was 10, im 17 now. Read the Bible twice all the way through. I am still learning so much about God and the Bible. I am nearly finished reading Jeremiah and it shows how loving God was. That God did not destroy them because they did not follow Him but because they were unrightoues and evil.

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IF you don’t believe me, check out all of the major churches today. Show me anywhere that respect and obeying God by keeping the commandments is not only important, but the ONLY thing that Jesus said would save one from damnation. (Rev. 12:17)

If God only lets the commandment keepers, (only a few adventists). Not with those people who are more holy than us. (Mother Terrasa etc) I will be the first to willingly have my salvation be taken away from me.

[Solja247]

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Keeping the commandments is the only way to avoid the curse of the law .... this is true. Some try to make it happen in their life. Others of us depend upon what Jesus did on this earth to take our place. It is by HIS life and death that I am saved .... not by my own keeping of the law. He did it for me.

Preach it!

Romans 6:23

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Your post doesn't sound at all like the 28 are falling into place, my friend. You say you do not believe in the Investigative Judgment, yet of course that this one of the 28, so in what way are the 28 "falling into place"?

Ok only THAT fundamental. I have read the Bible. looked at prophecy I cant see how that is Biblical. We should believe what the disciples and Jesus believed not try to make up stuff.

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If I saw it the way you do, I am sure I wouldn't be an SDA today. My experience in the SDA church has been beautiful.

I am an Adventist today because I have studied the Bible it is the most Biblicalest denomination.

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In the meantime I'll be praying for you and your church and the situation in Australia, and I'll ask others to pray along with me.

Thank you very much.

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If you send me by PM the address of your church and the name of the pastor and the elder, and give me their phone numbers, I will do what I can to see that the problems you speak of will get the attention they deserve.

It happened a few years ago. I dont go to that church anymore. They are going to have to answer before God.

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Lastly, please recognize always that 1) baptism, and 2) formal acceptance as a member of a church, are two entirely different things! The two do not need to be tied together…

Great story. I couldnt agree more with you.

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Making someone else’s creed your own is not much better than worshiping at the feet of the one who is baselessly claiming the title VICARIVS FILII DEI. Relying upon someone else’s creed is much the same as remaining in a self satisfied State of having delegated one’s own relationship with the Savior to another. It is much the same as being a citizen of a State where most everything is characterized by various levels of imperfection, that is, by the numbers 600, 60, and/or 6 (cf. Strong’s #G5516.)

I believe that it is about having a relationship with Jesus which needs to be taught, sola scripture does not save, but a relationship does.

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I could go on and on about the rest of the 28 fundamentals. It is tragic when someone learns about the doctrines but never learns about the Person that these doctrines point to. But that should not be surprising since a lot of people know what they pledged when they entered into a marital covenant yet fail to live up to them.

You dont need to know the 28 fundamentals to be saved, ALL YOU NEED IS A RELATIONSHIP WITH JESUS to be saved.

Do we want 'adventists' or brothers and sisters who will make it to heaven?