Moderators Bravus Posted March 16, 2011 Moderators Posted March 16, 2011 You said "I think, if Japan was a Christian nation, this disaster wouldn t have happened." That's pretty unequivocal. But I agree, we're done here. Quote Truth is important
Guest truthseeker007 Posted March 16, 2011 Posted March 16, 2011 maybe you are in a bible bash mood. I have had those times sometimes too, they are terrible. I hope these dark clouds will disappear and you will be you again. remember that just being a seventh day adventist does not mean you are safe at all times. If you begin to doubt God, that s where satan comes in. Trust God now in this life, and know that in the millenium God will provide you with all the answers. Just trust in God, don t let your own mind deceive you. I hope you know i say this out of love... Quote
Moderators Bravus Posted March 17, 2011 Moderators Posted March 17, 2011 Nope, I trust God implicitly. It's Christians with complete atrophy of the moral sense and empathy that have me furious. It brings God's name into disrepute when people claim he shares their own worst qualities. Quote Truth is important
Administrators Gail Posted March 17, 2011 Administrators Posted March 17, 2011 Okay, how about we cool it before we dig in so deep that things will get regrettable. I have a question: If it is true that countries are bringing calamities upon themselves, 1) How would we even know it (in specific circumstances), and 2) If we are Christian believers, how are we to conduct ourselves in and around them? Isn't that what the Jews did to the blind man's parents in Jesus' day? What did the parents do? (They said, Ask him yourselves) What did Jesus do? (He said that the blindness was not a result of sins, either the young man's or the parents') These disasters may well be a test to those who are believers as well as to those who are not, to those watching them from a distance as well as to those who are smack dab in the middle of them. Personally I think that we all will get a turn. Only when the last plagues fall will God's followers be totally exempt (or that is how I understand prophecy). Quote Isaiah 32:17 And the work of righteousness shall be peace; and the effect of righteousness quietness and assurance for ever.
Woody Posted March 17, 2011 Posted March 17, 2011 Good Post Gail Quote May we be one so that the world may be won. Christian from the cradle to the grave I believe in Hematology. Â
Amelia Posted March 17, 2011 Author Posted March 17, 2011 *gp So why, in all these posts about God fingering countries/people for disasters, don't I see any mention of Satan. Does no one think he has anything to do with disaster? Why do we always blame God? Quote <p><span style="color:#0000FF;"><span style="font-weight:bold;"><span style="font-style:italic;">"Do not use harmful words, but only helpful words, the kind that build up and provide what is needed, so that what you say will do good to those who hear you."</span></span> Eph 4:29</span><br><br><img src="http://banners.wunderground.com/weathersticker/gizmotimetemp_both/US/OR/Fairview.gif" alt="Fairview.gif"> Fairview Or</p>
Woody Posted March 17, 2011 Posted March 17, 2011 Good question Amelia. One answer could be that we think God will take the blame more graciously than Satan would. Quote May we be one so that the world may be won. Christian from the cradle to the grave I believe in Hematology. Â
Dr. Shane Posted March 17, 2011 Posted March 17, 2011 *gp So why, in all these posts about God fingering countries/people for disasters, don't I see any mention of Satan. Does no one think he has anything to do with disaster? Why do we always blame God? I think Adventists have a much better grasp of the great controversy between Christ and Satan than other denominations do. For that reason, Adventists are not so likely to start attributing these disasters to God like many Evangelicals are. What Alex Carpenter got all bent out of shape about is that Sean Boonstra was saying these quakes are a sign of the times. Well, hey, we are Seventh-day Adventists. We believe we are living in the end time. We are suppose to be looking for signs. Quote Pastoral Family Counselor... Find me at www.PostumCafe.com Author of Peculiar Christianity
Woody Posted March 17, 2011 Posted March 17, 2011 Quote: We are suppose to be looking for signs. We have plenty. For sure we don't need any more signs. Quote May we be one so that the world may be won. Christian from the cradle to the grave I believe in Hematology. Â
CoAspen Posted March 17, 2011 Posted March 17, 2011 So are we looking for signs or looking for Christ? The time of the end started a long time ago, when A & E left the garden I believe. A careful reading of the Bible should convince people that it is not about the 'signs' but about Christ return to stop all the destruction. The 'signs' were to show that Gods word is true and He will return. A reminder, if you will, not on purpose, but natural calamities that show this world choose a different path from Gods original plan. Evangelist have been using natural events forever to excite people. Perhaps Sean B was only following those that came before him with out realizing how his words sounded. His facts were incorrect and have been proven. I would suggest our evangelistic approach should be about the saving grace of God instead being known for the 'gloom and doom' of the past efforts. We have free choice, why should God Scare us into following Him! No, I don't look for signs...I am reminded every day of my mortality! Quote
ClubV12 Posted March 17, 2011 Posted March 17, 2011 I'd rather be scared into heaven than lulled into hell! I know in MY personal experience that "fear" was replaced by "love" as I began to understand the deeper meaning of the plan of salvation. For me, "fear" has been replaced by respect for the awesome power and majesty of God. But it was in fact, raw fear, that started my journey. Recognizing that I was a sinner, doomed to eternal death, without hope, except in Him. Quote
skyblue888 Posted March 17, 2011 Posted March 17, 2011 "I was shown that the jugdments of God would not come directly out from the Lord upon them but in this way--they place themselves beyond His protection." E.G.W. Quote "The merits of His sacrifice are sufficient to present to the Father in our behalf." S.C.36.
Moderators John317 Posted March 17, 2011 Moderators Posted March 17, 2011 I believe that's exactly right. Just like with Job, God allows those things to happen for a purpose. So it's wrong to blame God. People should be, if anything, blaming themselves for placing themselves out of God's protecting care. But it would be wrong to think that these happen without any spiritual purpose. I would say the same thing about catastrophies that occur in the U.S. We're not to think that it is God actively causing bad things to happen to us, but of God allowing us to see how much we need to draw closer to Him. We have many examples of God's doing this throughout sacred history. See, for example, the book of Judges and the many instances of this in the Hebrew prophets. Quote John 3:16-17 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life. [17] For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but in order that the world might be saved through him.
LifeHiscost Posted March 17, 2011 Posted March 17, 2011 It is simply a matter of perception that quakes are more frequent, and of our short attention spans. What will you do with the truth? Quote Lift Jesus up!!
Moderators Bravus Posted March 17, 2011 Moderators Posted March 17, 2011 Lots of cherry-picking and bad data at that site (why 38 year periods, for example?). Here it is straight from the horse's (USGS) mouth: http://earthquake.usgs.gov/learn/faq/?faqID=110 Truth. Quote Truth is important
Moderators Bravus Posted March 17, 2011 Moderators Posted March 17, 2011 I think what he's done is graph the USGS's list of 'earthquakes of historical interest', which does not include all earthquakes. We're more interested in recent history, so the fact that there have been more earthquakes of historical interest recently is unsurprising. The USGS is clear in saying that the frequency of earthquakes is stable or falling, not rising. The truth is important. Quote Truth is important
Woody Posted March 17, 2011 Posted March 17, 2011 So are we looking for signs or looking for Christ? The time of the end started a long time ago, when A & E left the garden I believe. A careful reading of the Bible should convince people that it is not about the 'signs' but about Christ return to stop all the destruction. The 'signs' were to show that Gods word is true and He will return. A reminder, if you will, not on purpose, but natural calamities that show this world choose a different path from Gods original plan. Evangelist have been using natural events forever to excite people. Perhaps Sean B was only following those that came before him with out realizing how his words sounded. His facts were incorrect and have been proven. I would suggest our evangelistic approach should be about the saving grace of God instead being known for the 'gloom and doom' of the past efforts. We have free choice, why should God Scare us into following Him! No, I don't look for signs...I am reminded every day of my mortality! Quote May we be one so that the world may be won. Christian from the cradle to the grave I believe in Hematology. Â
Dr. Rich Posted March 17, 2011 Posted March 17, 2011 Yes, the truth IS important. So buckle up and hold on because you have not seen anything yet as this earth's history is about to wind down to it's end. If you think God's grace is sufficent then you have not read the words of Jesus yet. You don't have to be one of the 5 foolish--but then it IS your own choice. Quote
Moderators John317 Posted March 17, 2011 Moderators Posted March 17, 2011 So are we looking for signs or looking for Christ? The time of the end started a long time ago, when A & E left the garden I believe. There is no biblical basis at all for believing that the time of end started when Adam and Eve left the garden. Christ Himself told us to pay attention to the signs of the times. Jesus gave those signs for a good reason: we're to "watch." See especially Matt. 24. Many more signs are found in Daniel, Revelation, and Paul's letters to the churches. If a loved one went away for a along time and told his family that certain things would be signs of his return, wouldn't it be natural for those who love him to pay atttention to those signs? Wouldn't they be excited at the propsect of his coming in the door and wouldn't their anticipation cause them to be attentive to those signs which show that he is almost home? On the other hand, what about the ones who say, "What do you keep looking out the window for? Are you still looking at those old signs?" Quote John 3:16-17 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life. [17] For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but in order that the world might be saved through him.
skyblue888 Posted March 17, 2011 Posted March 17, 2011 Originally Posted By: CoAspen So are we looking for signs or looking for Christ? The time of the end started a long time ago, when A & E left the garden I believe. There is no biblical basis at all for believing that the time of end started when Adam and Eve left the garden. Christ Himself told us to pay attention to the signs of the times. Jesus gave those signs for a good reason: we're to "watch." See especially Matt. 24. Many more signs are found in Daniel, Revelation, and Paul's letters to the churches. If a loved one went away for a along time and told his family that certain things would be signs of his return, wouldn't it be natural for those who love him to pay atttention to those signs? Wouldn't they be excited at the propsect of his coming in the door and wouldn't their anticipation cause them to be attentive to those signs which show that he is almost home? On the other hand, what about the ones who say, "What do you keep looking out the window for? Are you still looking at those old signs?" ] Well said, John, sky Quote "The merits of His sacrifice are sufficient to present to the Father in our behalf." S.C.36.
CoAspen Posted March 17, 2011 Posted March 17, 2011 The earth was doomed from the moment sin entered....since sin equals death...the process started then. That would be Biblical, at least in my Bible!! Question avoided....looking for signs or looking or Christ? Quote
Dr. Shane Posted March 17, 2011 Posted March 17, 2011 Evangelist have been using natural events forever to excite people. Would the fact that the Bible lists natural disasters as a sign of the end explain why evangelists have been using them "forever" to excite people? All that tells me is the evangelists have been reading their Bibles "forever". Quote Pastoral Family Counselor... Find me at www.PostumCafe.com Author of Peculiar Christianity
Dr. Shane Posted March 17, 2011 Posted March 17, 2011 The USGS is clear in saying that the frequency of earthquakes is stable or falling, not rising. Perception becomes reality. The sign isn't so much that natural disasters or wars increase but that we hear about them. Jesus, when identifying these things as signs in Matthew 24 starts out with "ye shall hear of wars and rumors of wars..." This, taken with the prophecy in Daniel about knowledge increasing makes it all add up. Television, radio, internet and more advanced science now keeps us more informed than ever before. We are "hearing" about wars and natural disasters like never before. The world has become very small. Quote Pastoral Family Counselor... Find me at www.PostumCafe.com Author of Peculiar Christianity
Moderators Bravus Posted March 17, 2011 Moderators Posted March 17, 2011 I keep on hoping, but it never happens: one day, in my dreams, someone here will say "I was wrong. I must have been misinformed. The claim that I made so confidently is factually incorrect. Know I know the truth about it." Never happens, though. The ground gets shifted or the issue dropped. The truth is important. Quote Truth is important
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.