Stan Posted October 29, 2011 Posted October 29, 2011 I of 5, This is our embed code which supports iPad, iPhone, Flash and beyond. Gordon Pifher from British Columbia Conference on Vimeo. If you receive benefit to being here please help out with expenses. https://www.paypal.me/clubadventist Administrator of a few websites like https://adventistdating.com
Stan Posted October 29, 2011 Author Posted October 29, 2011 2 of 5 If you receive benefit to being here please help out with expenses. https://www.paypal.me/clubadventist Administrator of a few websites like https://adventistdating.com
Stan Posted October 29, 2011 Author Posted October 29, 2011 3 of 5 If you receive benefit to being here please help out with expenses. https://www.paypal.me/clubadventist Administrator of a few websites like https://adventistdating.com
Stan Posted October 29, 2011 Author Posted October 29, 2011 4 of 5 If you receive benefit to being here please help out with expenses. https://www.paypal.me/clubadventist Administrator of a few websites like https://adventistdating.com
Stan Posted October 29, 2011 Author Posted October 29, 2011 If you receive benefit to being here please help out with expenses. https://www.paypal.me/clubadventist Administrator of a few websites like https://adventistdating.com
Stan Posted October 29, 2011 Author Posted October 29, 2011 This clears up, in a good way, why there is no need to celebrate the feast days. What does the Bible say? What did EGW say? Please keep in mind, out attitude here is, if you chose to keep those days, you are still more than welcome here. If you receive benefit to being here please help out with expenses. https://www.paypal.me/clubadventist Administrator of a few websites like https://adventistdating.com
Stan Posted October 29, 2011 Author Posted October 29, 2011 Deals with the questions Did EGW keep the feasts, as claimed? IS the GC hiding information on this? If you receive benefit to being here please help out with expenses. https://www.paypal.me/clubadventist Administrator of a few websites like https://adventistdating.com
Alchemy Posted October 29, 2011 Posted October 29, 2011 Of course not! We are living in the times of the true and authentic Feast Days. We are living in the anti-typical Feast Days. Only God can keep these. Those old shadows from the Old Testament are past and done away with. To keep them now would be showing complete contempt and disrespect for the Cross of Christ. Luke 12:32 NKJV
Windsor Posted October 29, 2011 Posted October 29, 2011 If you're a Jewish Christian, feel free to keep the feast days. "As for the Gentile believers, we have written to them our decision that they should abstain from food sacrificed to idols, from blood, from the meat of strangled animals and from sexual immorality." Acts 21:25. Remember Adventists Online?
Moderators Gerr Posted October 29, 2011 Moderators Posted October 29, 2011 Our rationale for not keeping them has been that they were "shdows" of a greater reality that we say were fulfilled in Christ. But they have not yet ALL been fulfilled. Feast of Trumpets? Tabernacles?
Lysimachus Posted October 29, 2011 Posted October 29, 2011 Since the shedding of Christ's blood, we have been living in the Antitypical age. Hence, all feast days are experienced antitypically. We are no longer to keep any feast days physically, save for Communion and Baptism. Those videos look interesting, and I look forward to watching them. I've discussed this subject in the past, and have a lot to share, but I'l have to wait till I get back home. Thanks Stan! Blessings ~Lysimachus (Marcos S.) Author of article, Vindicating the Year-Day Principle of Prophetic Interpretation (see attachment for article) Currently writing a book, Vindicating the Historical School of Prophetic Interpretation Founder of the largest and fastest SDA Apologetics Group on Facebook, Seventh-Day Adventism - Defending the Pillars of the Faith Writer and apologetics contributor at Adventist Defense League Vindicating the Year-Day Principle of Prophetic Interpretation.pdf
Moderators Gerr Posted October 29, 2011 Moderators Posted October 29, 2011 They have not yet all met their antitypycal fulfillment. The Feast of Tabernacles was not only commemorative but typical. It not only pointed back to the wilderness sojourn, but, as the feast of harvest, it celebrated the ingathering of the fruits of the earth, and pointed forward to the great day of final ingathering, when the Lord of the harvest shall send forth His reapers to gather the tares together in bundles for the fire, and to gather the wheat into His garner. At that time the wicked will all be destroyed. They will become "as though they had not been." Obadiah 16. White, E. G. (1890; 2002). The Story of Patriarchs and Prophets as Illustrated in the Lives of Holy Men of Old; Conflict of the Ages Series, Volume 1; Patriarchs and Prophets (541). Pacific Press Publishing Association. It was typical of the preaching of the gospel, by which joyful sound souls were to be called in to serve God and keep a spiritual feast to him. The conversion of the nations to the faith of Christ is said to be by the blowing of a great trumpet, Isa. 27:13. Henry, M. (1996). Matthew Henry's commentary on the whole Bible : Complete and unabridged in one volume (Le 23:23–32). Peabody: Hendrickson. IV. THE LAST DAY OF THIS DISPENSATION. The day draws on when the “trump of God” shall sound, summoning the dead to life, calling the living and the dead to judgment and award (see 1 Cor. 15:52; 1 Thess. 4:16). At any hour of our life, but especially on any anniversary, when we are reminded of the passage of our probationary life and the oncoming of the day of his appearing, we may well hear the summons of God to prepare for that great day. The Pulpit Commentary: Leviticus. 2004 (H. D. M. Spence-Jones, Ed.) (366). Bellingham, WA: Logos Research Systems, Inc.
Alchemy Posted October 30, 2011 Posted October 30, 2011 Our rationale for not keeping them has been that they were "shdows" of a greater reality that we say were fulfilled in Christ. But they have not yet ALL been fulfilled. Feast of Trumpets? Tabernacles? You statement is not quite accurate. Only God CAN keep the authentic and anti-typical Feast Days. They are not all fulfilled at this time, but, God will take care of all of them in His time. And this goes for all Christians, even those of Jewish ancestry. They are a stumbling block to Jews, and all other Christians of course, ever since the destruction of Jerusalem. Luke 12:32 NKJV
Moderators Gerr Posted October 30, 2011 Moderators Posted October 30, 2011 You statement is not quite accurate. Only God CAN keep the authentic and anti-typical Feast Days. They are not all fulfilled at this time, but, God will take care of all of them in His time. If only God can keep them (playing semantics?), why were the Israelites required to celebrate them? And if they have not yet been fulfilled, why are we not celebrating them?
Dr. Rich Posted October 30, 2011 Posted October 30, 2011 Deals with the questions Did EGW keep the feasts, as claimed? IS the GC hiding information on this? When in a new contry/nation one must keep THEIR laws, but when that country ceases to be-(gone), so do all of the laws it had. This is what happened to the regulations, rules and codes (and feast days) that belonged only to Israel and it's country/nation. I might add, that the covenant, it being the ten commandments, is much like a marriage contract where there is NO penalty associated with it--except that God can't be anyone's God unless they agree and do keep ALL of the conditions found in the covenant.
Ron Amnsn Posted October 31, 2011 Posted October 31, 2011 When in a new contry/nation one must keep THEIR laws, but when that country ceases to be-(gone), so do all of the laws it had. This is what happened to the regulations, rules and codes (and feast days) that belonged only to Israel and it's country/nation. That would be a nice sounding rationalization, if the feast days had actually belonged to Israel. Leviticus 23 says the Biblical feasts are God's appointed times (not Israel's).
Ron Amnsn Posted October 31, 2011 Posted October 31, 2011 Those old shadows from the Old Testament are past and done away with. To keep them now would be showing complete contempt and disrespect for the Cross of Christ. If we repeat these lies enough times people will believe them. But they will still be untrue. Colossians 2:16-17 says the festivals and Sabbaths are (present tense) a shadow (which gives an outline) of things pertaining to Christ that are still in the future. What the verse actually says disagrees with the theology of the Bible translators so lots of the English versions of the Bible have taken liberties with verse 17 by adding words like "mere" or by changing the present and future tenses to the past tense. The notion that keeping the feasts that Christ kept would be showing contempt or disrespect for Christ or for his death is a totally man-made tradition without any support in Scripture.
Ron Lambert Posted October 31, 2011 Posted October 31, 2011 Ron Amnsn, of course God appointed the times of the feasts. The question is for whom did He appoint them. The Feast of trumpets was a preparation for the Day of Atonement (Judgment). Since we now live in the Day of Atonement (Judgment), there is no point in holding a Feast of Trumpets, unless you want to count our evangelistic meetings that sound the Judgment Hour message of Revelation 14:7-11 as a sounding of trumpets, and a feasting in God's Word. The Feast of Tabernacles was a type or shadow of the time when we have been delivered from this sinful world, and are privileged to live in Heaven, in the new dwellings which Christ has prepared for us to spend the Millennium in Heaven, and in the homes we will have in the New Earth after the Millennium. There is no obligation for us today to keep this feast since it was ordained for ancient Israel, which no longer exists. (The government of the modern state of Israel has stated that they are not the same as that nation that existed before the Roman conquest of Judea. They did this in response to requests from Christians that they issue a decree exonerating Jesus Christ of all charges.) There probably is no real harm in keeping some sort of Feast of Tabernacles, since it does point toward something still future. But it has been suggested that the widespread Seventh-day Adventist practice of holding "Campmeetings" each year is a reasonable modern equivalent to a Feast of Tabernacles. It does not make anyone a better Christian or a better Adventist to keep the Feast of Tablernacles. It does not show that you are more faithful and obedient to God if you do this. There is no special blessing offered to anyone who does this, since God never required it of anyone but the members of the ancient nation of Israel. Remember, Paul said that anyone who keeps any point of the Mosiac law is obligated to keep all of the Mosaic law. "For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse; for it is written, 'Cursed is everyone who does not continue in all things which are written in the book of the law, to do them.'" (Galatians 3:10) Notice that Paul here refers to the BOOK of the law, not to the Ten Commandments.
Dr. Rich Posted October 31, 2011 Posted October 31, 2011 Thanks Ron for the great reply. Yes, God was the 'king of the Kingdom of Israel' and made the rules and regulations for them. Problem is, Jesus provided testimoney (Matthew 21:43 for one) that the 'house of Israel' has (past tense) become desolate--meaning that God was no longer their King and the Nation or 'kingdom' no longer existed and its regulations and statutes are therefor moot.
Alchemy Posted October 31, 2011 Posted October 31, 2011 Originally Posted By: Alchemy You statement is not quite accurate. Only God CAN keep the authentic and anti-typical Feast Days. They are not all fulfilled at this time, but, God will take care of all of them in His time. If only God can keep them (playing semantics?), why were the Israelites required to celebrate them? And if they have not yet been fulfilled, why are we not celebrating them? In all honesty, your questions don't make sense. The Feast Days were always meant for God. The shadows were to teach God's people what God was going to do to seal their salvation! It was never anything man could do for himself. I hope I answered your questions. Luke 12:32 NKJV
Alchemy Posted October 31, 2011 Posted October 31, 2011 Originally Posted By: Alchemy Those old shadows from the Old Testament are past and done away with. To keep them now would be showing complete contempt and disrespect for the Cross of Christ. If we repeat these lies enough times people will believe them. But they will still be untrue. Colossians 2:16-17 says the festivals and Sabbaths are (present tense) a shadow (which gives an outline) of things pertaining to Christ that are still in the future. What the verse actually says disagrees with the theology of the Bible translators so lots of the English versions of the Bible have taken liberties with verse 17 by adding words like "mere" or by changing the present and future tenses to the past tense. The notion that keeping the feasts that Christ kept would be showing contempt or disrespect for Christ or for his death is a totally man-made tradition without any support in Scripture. No, it is not at all man made or tradition! You might notice the Temple is missing. God said it would be destroyed and it is. So, keeping the feast days now would be a man made tradition. Once Christ died on the cross, the veil was torn from top to bottom in the Temple. This meant the typical feasts ended and the anti-typical feasts began. Just as the typical sanctuary service started with the sacrifice, so did the anti-typical services. Luke 12:32 NKJV
Moderators Kevin H Posted October 31, 2011 Moderators Posted October 31, 2011 While Christians have too much ignored the feasts, there are a lot of lessons in them, we need to also remember that they were the feasts of the land and tied very much to the geography of the land. They are the same feasts that the Canaanites who were living before the Hebrews kept. The Sabbath was seen as universal and was kept when the sun set Friday where ever God's people lived. Those who were in Babylon kept Sabbath from the time the sun set in Babel, and those who were in Egypt kept the Sabbath from the time the sun set in Egypt. Same with any other Hebrews living further west or east. However the feasts of the land were kept when the feast was in Jerusalem and there was a chain of smoke signals to notify those in Babel and Egypt when the feast was in Jerusalem. For us of gentile background, not living in that piece of geography these feasts do not have the same meaning and no matter how much we want to make them have the same meaning we do not have the physical or emotional ties to the land that those who are not actually connected to the land has.
Alchemy Posted October 31, 2011 Posted October 31, 2011 I agree there are a lot of lessons to learn from the feast days and the sanctuary service. This is exactly why God had mankind perform the rituals that He did. As far as the cultural connection, which is what I thought you were mentioning, I believe that makes it worse. I believe us that are removed from that connection have the better understanding, generally. Luke 12:32 NKJV
Moderators Gerr Posted October 31, 2011 Moderators Posted October 31, 2011 The Feast of Tabernacles was a type or shadow of the time when we have been delivered from this sinful world, and are privileged to live in Heaven, in the new dwellings which Christ has prepared for us to spend the Millennium in Heaven, and in the homes we will have in the New Earth after the Millennium. There is no obligation for us today to keep this feast since it was ordained for ancient Israel, which no longer exists. "...ordained for ancient Israel", you are using the same argument Jawge is using to nullify the 4th commandment - ordained only for the Jews. "If you are Christ's, then you are Abraham's seed." [Gal] "The REAL Jew is not one inwardly.." [Rom]. Every believer IS part of Israel! Quote: It does not make anyone a better Christian or a better Adventist to keep the Feast of Tablernacles. It does not show that you are more faithful and obedient to God if you do this. There is no special blessing offered to anyone who does this, since God never required it of anyone but the members of the ancient nation of Israel. Does baptism or the footwashing make one a better Christian? Symbols may not be the real thing, nevertheless, they are powerful representations of ultimate reality.
Ron Lambert Posted October 31, 2011 Posted October 31, 2011 Gerry, just because someone uses an argument against any obligation to keep the feast days as an argument against keeping the Sabbath, does not invalidate that argument. Poor scholarship by some is no excuse for everyone showing poor scholarship. Please do not overlook the clear point that in Galatians 3:10, Paul explicitly said he was talking about THE BOOK of the Law: "For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse; for it is written, 'Cursed is everyone who does not continue in all things which are written in the BOOK of the law, to do them.'" (Galatians 3:10) Baptism and footwashing were instituted by Christ's example, and had nothing to do with the ordinances of ancient Israel. Metaphors and analogies are of great value, but only if we learn to apply them properly. Those who have studied the nature of intelligence often say that one of the key features of intelligence, is the ability to appreciate and rightly apply analogies. Just because some Bible truth may be set forth by use of metaphor and analogy, does not at all mean that the passages in question could mean anything; that would mean that they mean nothing.
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