Can religion be categorized as a form of "delusional thinking?"

[abelisle]

Check out this animated feature that speaks about some of the downsides of positive thinking. Do we sometimes let ourselves be deluded to think in unrealistic ways about things for which we have no control?

[M. T. Cross]

That was a great piece.

I think to a degree religion could be categorized as a form of "delusional thinking?"

Simply based on the fact that it is not something that can be proved, and is based on an unseen force that we can't explain.

[ClubV12]

I don't do well with all this "philosophy" stuff. What this video presents is found in the Testimonies and in much more of Ellen Whites work. I prefer to go to the source for counsel and advice. For those who reject the Lords messenger's work, or find it to difficult to understand, there are various substitutes, books by other authors and philosophers or neat little videos. All other sources, those not directly from the throne of God or the bible, may or may not contain 100% truth. Often they are a mix of truth and error. Good luck sorting it all out....

[Igakusei]

Virtually everything is truth mixed with error, and religious texts are no exception. Sorting it all out is why critical thinking is so important.

[ClubV12]

While it is truth MOST things are a mixture of truth and error, "critical thinking" as a method of "sorting it out" is just another philosophical lie.

Spiritual things are spiritually discerned, critical thinking will ultimately fail without sincere spiritual thinking.

[M. T. Cross]

Thats why you have to use critical spiritual thinking.

[Gibs]

A lot of religion is delusional thinking even in the Christian religion as men want to be saved THEIR way and coble another way. All religions except for the TRUE Christian religion is delussional and a cobbling of a structure that is a house of cards. Anything that is outside of truth is delusional. There is only one sourc of Truth and that is the PURE Word of God. I would choose the KJV for that. The others are just books, they are copyrighted, requires many changes.

True positive thinking is following Him and finding His true way and knowing all else is folly and that if we gained this whole wicked world and lost our soul, the fact is we have lost all.

1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

[ClubV12]

The problem with the bible is interpreting the message and the verses as to their meaning. This is why we have a 1,000 plus Christian churches, each with their own unique interpretation on key verses.

Why should I accept Gibs interpretation over Emptycrosses interpretation? Or Socratees interpretation? Or like some have declared, God through His Holy Spirit speaks to them directly, they have no need of ANY outside counsel. That they, all be themselves, are capable of finding truth.

The very REASON God raised up a prophet for our time was to break through all this confusion and get it straight. He HAS a chosen people, to whom He HAS given prophetic insight that we might be able to correctly intepret scripture. This was not given to anyone man, the Holy Spirit does not work that way. Careful searching of the scriptures is still fundamental, correct interpretation is STILL subject to counseling with the brethren. That could be in person, in books or from sources you would least expect it, but I gaurentee you it will not come to you and you alone, as if some how you are more special than any other human on earth. As if you alone are a prophet.

So how do Adventists come to their understanding of any given verse? FIRST through a counsel of the brethren, setting aside any preconceived ideas and with much prayer working TOGETHER to study Gods word with an open and sincere heart. Various men and women, VARIOUS, not ONE, were given divine instruction through visions and dreams to help establish the Adventist church along the way. To KEEP the correct interpretations from leading down the wrong path into Babylon. Which is what we see so much of in the world AND on this forum!!! Multiple interpretations, ideas, philosophies, voices crying out, "Here, I have the truth"!

How will we know? The Lord in His mercy has sent to the people of this time a messenger working closely with the counsel of the brethren that we might understand, be different than, come out of the worlds churches. HERE are they that actually KEEP the commandments of God AND have the Spirit of Prophecy.

[M. T. Cross]

I agree in part with what you say there Club. Except about EGW.

I think that in order to get to the heart of any matter spiritually it needs to be discussed and it needs to be looked at with preconcieved notions put aside.

I also agree that anyone claiming to have the TRUTH is dangerous - and for the record never misconstrue anything I say as claiming that.

[ClubV12]

There are some fundamental truths you can build upon, these are your foundation as sure as bedrock.

God lives. His law has always been, always will be.

[Igakusei]

While it is truth MOST things are a mixture of truth and error, "critical thinking" as a method of "sorting it out" is just another philosophical lie.

Spiritual things are spiritually discerned, critical thinking will ultimately fail without sincere spiritual thinking.

Right, and that's why we have more than 30,000 Christian denominations.

[Stan]

NON-religion can also be classified as delusional thinking...

[Stan]

NON-religion can also be classified as delusional thinking...

and really.... non-religion is a religion...

[M. T. Cross]

I was curious as to what on-religion was, but then I realized you may be having a delusional moment

[ClubV12]

An interesting observation Stan.

Among those 30,000 or so Christian denominations God has many sheep who will hear His voice and continue to follow Him into more and more truth when the time comes for them. But there remains one true church upon whom God has bestowed a special message for these end times. A people that will proclaim His commandments, all of them, including the fourth one. Fear God and give glory to Him for the hour of His judgment has come.

[abelisle]

NON-religion can also be classified as delusional thinking...

and really.... non-religion is a religion...

If we can use as a working definition of religion that it is a belief in a preternatural being who is both intangible and ineffable, then by not believing in such a being, would that be a religion or simply unbelief?

[Igakusei]

NON-religion can also be classified as delusional thinking...

and really.... non-religion is a religion...

Can you define non-religion for me?

[Igakusei]

ClubV12 says that "critical thinking" is a philosophical lie, and that we can only rely on spiritual insight.

Why, then, do people who rely exclusively on critical thinking generally converge on the same sets of beliefs (see: science) while people who largely reject critical thinking in favor of spiritual insight often find themselves killing each other over their differences in opinion?

[Gibs]

ClubV12,

The Bible interprets it's self. Most don't know it well enough for that and it wouldn't suit them if they did. So they go about cobbling what seems the easy way for them without any change from their old ways and or ideas.

These verses are truly for these last days,

2Ti 4:3 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears;

2Ti 4:4 And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables.

It is demanded, "preach unto me smooth things" and that is what they get to help them to stay settled on their "lees".

The Word of God says what it means, and means what it says. It don't take a theologian through the schools of today to understand the plain thus saith the Lord. Them fellers is the ones best at wresting it and perverting the truth of it.

Many here love EGW, 3'rd grade education, did she have trouble with the Word or need one of the worlds so called great theologians? She was above them all. God was her teacher and He is my choice also.

1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

[Igakusei]

ClubV12,

The Bible interprets it's self. Most don't know it well enough for that and it wouldn't suit them if they did. So they go about cobbling what seems the easy way for them without any change from their old ways and or ideas.

[ClubV12]

Igakusei, there is a lot of truth in your comment about studying the bible and coming away more confused or discouraged or whatever you want to call it, than when you started. As spiritual things are spiritually understood reading the bible without prayer and belief can be a dangerous thing. One could do lots of reading and studying and yet never come to an understanding of the truth.

It's better not to read it all unless you are drawn to it through the Holy Spirit. The devils read it, believe it and tremble.

[Igakusei]

Igakusei, there is a lot of truth in your comment about studying the bible and coming away more confused or discouraged or whatever you want to call it, than when you started. As spiritual things are spiritually understood reading the bible without prayer and belief can be a dangerous thing. One could do lots of reading and studying and yet never come to an understanding of the truth.

It's better not to read it all unless you are drawn to it through the Holy Spirit. The devils read it, believe it and tremble.

But that's demonstrably wrong. I've met a large number of good, honest people who, in earnest contemplation while praying and seeking guidance from the holy spirit (I used to be one of them), come to radically different and often opposing understandings of what they're reading. If there really was a God who cared about us enough to give us the knowledge we were seeking (as you would expect given advice like "ask and you shall receive."), then all of the good, honest truth-seekers of the world would be converging on God's true plan, not scattering in a million contradictory directions. That's a deal-breaker for me.

A good analogy is people climbing a mountain. If there really is a mountain and they're all looking for the same summit, it doesn't matter where they start... they're eventually all going to arrive at the same point. That's what happens when we use the scientific method and critical thinking, and it's the exact opposite of what happens when you pray to God and try to extract knowledge directly from the Bible or any other religious text.

[ClubV12]

I stand on my above comment. I question those who read the bible and come away with a view that opposes God as being, "sincere, with earnest contemplation and seeking guidance from the Holy Spirit".

In order to receive new light, new understanding, we must be willing to accept and live up to the light we have already received. If your asking God for some miracle in your life and you are secretly harboring something in your life that you KNOW is wrong, you will only find deception and delusion. Your prayers will go no higher than the ceiling. The evil doer will be there to apparently "answer" your prayer instead.

The Red Sea did not part it's waters until somebody took that first step, in faith.

[Igakusei]

Igakusei, there is a lot of truth in your comment about studying the bible and coming away more confused or discouraged or whatever you want to call it, than when you started. As spiritual things are spiritually understood reading the bible without prayer and belief can be a dangerous thing. One could do lots of reading and studying and yet never come to an understanding of the truth.

It's better not to read it all unless you are drawn to it through the Holy Spirit. The devils read it, believe it and tremble.

I also want to point out the gross hypocrisy in this worldview.

You think you understand the Torah better than the Jews.

You think you understand the Koran better than the Muslims.

You think you understand the Bhagavad Gita better than the Hindus.

And so on, for any other holy book and any other religion. This is implicit in your belief that the Bible is the true word of God, and the others are all false. But when anyone else tries to delve into the Bible, "No, spiritual things are spiritually understood. We're the only ones that can comment on it with any understanding and accuracy."

Do you see the double standard here?

[ClubV12]

There is only one God, Buddah is a lie, all other religions who do not worship the living God of the bible are a lie. There is no double standard, there is only one standard, the Creator of all things, the great "I am".