Can religion be categorized as a form of "delusional thinking?"

[doug yowell]

Semester 2: All religions are correct about some things. No religion is correct about all things.

Which things did Jesus get wrong?

[M. T. Cross]

Originally Posted By: EmptyCross

Semester 2: All religions are correct about some things. No religion is correct about all things.

Which things did Jesus get wrong?

Did I say Jesus got anything wrong?

I think Christians get a whole lot of things wrong.

[olger]

Originally Posted By: olger

There is much that unites us.

We like mexican food, for instance.

Oh so do I!!!

You also disdain Political correctness, as DO I. See... All kinds of agreement. :)

[phkrause]

Did I say Jesus got anything wrong?

I think Christians get a whole lot of things wrong.

I do agree that Christians get a lot of things wrong. Even SDAs. LOL! I would say many Christians follow the OT much more than they do the NT. Many don't even bother with the OT altogether. But I would bet that you'll find that SDAs follow the Bible much closer to the words of Jesus than others.

[M. T. Cross]

There is much that unites us.

We like mexican food, for instance.

[M. T. Cross]

Originally Posted By: EmptyCross

Did I say Jesus got anything wrong?

I think Christians get a whole lot of things wrong.

I do agree that Christians get a lot of things wrong. Even SDAs. LOL! I would say many Christians follow the OT much more than they do the NT. Many don't even bother with the OT altogether. But I would bet that you'll find that SDAs follow the Bible much closer to the words of Jesus than others.

I am totally in agreement. Well almost totally. I think SDA's follow the teachings of Christ as it is interpreted by the church very closely

However so do others.

What I would love to see sometime is Christians of different denominations sit down together and have a totally civil study of the Bible together.

[ClubV12]

Emptycross says,

"What I would love to see sometime is Christians of different denominations sit down together and have a totally civil study of the Bible together."

It's not that fundamentally different than doing that right here on this web site. I have those kinds of conversations in "real life" several times a week. In fact, just TODAY, with a fundamentalist man that has been attending church for many weeks now. I've offered to study with him at his house or mine but he's not ready for that yet. So we do emails and phone calls when he comes up with questions. TODAY between Sabbath school and church we got into discussion about his theory of creation taking place over thousands of years, instead of six literal 24 hour days. A discussion we've seen before on this web site and others of course.

My point to him was that science and the bible DON'T have to be in disagreement on every point. There is much that each could learn from the other. As it concerns creation, the INSTANT the newly created "thing" was made the scientists could have measured "how old it was" with all their various techniques and I'm thinking they would confirm it was "X number of years" old. When in fact, it didn't even exist 1 minute ago! Thats just MY scientific theory on that, but all he's got is a theory as well. I ended with this thought: When the science absolutely, no room to come together, disagree's with the bible, I'll stay with the bible. Regardless of his "over whelming" evidence that says different.

[doug yowell]

Semester 2: All religions are correct about some things. No religion is correct about all things Which things did Jesus get wrong?

Did I say Jesus got anything wrong?

I think Christians get a whole lot of things wrong.

[M. T. Cross]

Semester 2: All religions are correct about some things. No religion is correct about all things Which things did Jesus get wrong?

[doug yowell]

.

I just see a lot of Christian behaviour filled with hatred and anger. The very opposite of Jesus.

Is the behavior determined by the religion or is the religion determined by the behavior? Are we talking about the religion itself or those who claim to be it's followers whole violating it's teachings? Did Jesus adhere to a particular religion and practice it or did He claim to believe in something He violated in practice?

[M. T. Cross]

Originally Posted By: EmptyCross

.

I just see a lot of Christian behaviour filled with hatred and anger. The very opposite of Jesus.

Is the behavior determined by the religion or is the religion determined by the behavior? Are we talking about the religion itself or those who claim to be it's followers whole violating it's teachings? Did Jesus adhere to a particular religion and practice it or did He claim to believe in something He violated in practice?

Here is what I see. Christians for the most part tend to jump on board the elitist wagon. That they are followers of the Bible God and therefore better than others.

I see more of them adhering to the damnation and death parts of the message than the love, judge not, cast the first stone part of it.

Is that the message? No.

But think of it this way. Jesus came with a message. Humans created Christianity. They created it and abused it. To this day it is often used as a political ploy, a power trip and a way to manipulate others.

To quote Ghandi. I like your Christ, I don't like your Christians.

I must say that being here at CA has both enhanced my negative view of Christians and it has also supplied me with some very pleasant surprises. Sadly it leans a lot more to the former than the latter.

[phkrause]

What I would love to see sometime is Christians of different denominations sit down together and have a totally civil study of the Bible together.

They have, as far as I know they've been doing this for a number of years. Most other protestian denominations are actually reverting to what they were before the reformation. There rejoining with the RCC, or I should say agreeing with them on things that they originally left. And its not the RCC that's doing any consessions, its all the protestian churches that are.

[Igakusei]

They have, as far as I know they've been doing this for a number of years. Most other protestian denominations are actually reverting to what they were before the reformation. There rejoining with the RCC, or I should say agreeing with them on things that they originally left. And its not the RCC that's doing any consessions, its all the protestian churches that are.

From what I can tell, the RCC has been the most open-minded about the true origins of the Bible for awhile now, and if I were to guess why it would be because it was never bogged down with the sola scriptura assumption that the Bible is inerrant/infallible or at least nearly so. Now that a lot of the other protestant denominations have begun to give up that pretense, it's not surprising that they've begun to converge a little bit theologically.

[M. T. Cross]

Sorry - I have no idea what the RCC is.

[Igakusei]

Roman Catholic Church. The "bad guys."

[ClubV12]

...and "GC" is generally the Great Controversy...

But it COULD mean, the General Conference. Check the context.

I went to church today, "I just see a lot of Christian behaviour filled with love and warmth." It was a wonderful experience and I was blessed.

[olger]

Same here, CV

[CoAspen]

Quote:

Roman Catholic Church. The "bad guys."

[M. T. Cross]

I really don't want to sound like negative Nancy here but I will anyway.

Its easy to see all the good side on Sabbath (or sunday as I was generalizing Christians).

You all are in church, you are all being reminded of what you believe and you are feeling the passion of it. Thats great - it really is.

But by Monday is that same spirit still there? Or are they looking at the sinners judging them and feeling smug in their rightessness? I would wager - based on my experience - that the majority are doing the latter. Some of course are not. Some are trying to live that fabled Christlike life. But most aren't.

The same goes for most religions mind you. I am just picking on Christians because well, thats the subject here.

[Dr. Shane]

Some people decide what they are going to do by what feels good.

[ClubV12]

I don't know what those other folks are thinking on Monday Emptycross, I quit looking to them and quit worrying about them in that regard sometime ago.

Looking for fault in others is one of four ways the devil takes your eyes off Jesus. It happens not only to those who have become discouraged with the church it is also common with those who are apparently very sincere with high standards of Christianity and solid members of the church.

The devil knows what works and this is one of his very special "one size" fits all wrenches he can draw from his toolbox of despair.

[M. T. Cross]

Club, I see your point I really do - but. As I have said before one way to guage a message is to look at the way it changes other people. I see very few good changes in most Christians. My point is the "religion" vs the "message".

I generally don't give a hoot tho. I really don't care what they do in church or what they do by Monday - until they get in my face with it. When that happens its now my business and I feel free to form an opinion. Very few have ever made me think the "religion" has anything to do with the "message"

[Dr. Shane]

I'll make it very simple for you, Shane. Define God.

Myself, I like the classic good-orderly-direction definition. That means, basically, that whatever provides us our direction we have made into a god (lower case "g"). As easy to grasp as that is, one will probably not find it in many dictionaries.

The dictionary does define god as: one of several deities presiding over some portion of worldly affairs. Obviously that definition allows for someone to make a god out of self or out or reason. When I allow my reason, or that of another human, to direct my affairs, that becomes my god.

[fccool]

Quote:

Myself, I like the classic good-orderly-direction definition. That means, basically, that whatever provides us our direction we have made into a god (lower case "g"). As easy to grasp as that is, one will probably not find it in many dictionaries.

LOL. I'm not laughing to be deragatory or condescending. I really find this definition funny in light of what you are trying to do, and how it backfires on you. Because in that case your preacher is your god, your quarterly or devotional is your god, your bible is your god, the bible writers are your gods, your teachers and politicians are your gods, your job is your god, your GPS is your god, your parents are your gods, the commercials on TV are your gods, and the internet articles are your gods, your desires are your gods, your doctors are your gods, your financial advisers are your gods, your friends are your gods, and your own logic is your god.

I don't know if the thought evades you, but your redefining what god is ... is intellectually dishonest, especially when you claim that people worship reason as god. It makes no sense at all. Reason is a logical process. It's an abstract name for computations in your brain that all of us (but insane) rely on for direction... no exceptions (except for insane). Telling people that they worship Reason, is like telling them that they worship Fun, or that they worship Fear. It's abstract, and somewhat meaningless metaphor, if we try to apply it to reality.

When we say to someone that ____ is your god, we don't literally mean that they worship it. For example, we can say the god of consumerism. People don't literally get together and make up dogmas, descriptions and etc. It should be a common sense to you as to why we choose to use such word sequence. It describes unbalanced priorities.

What you are trying to do, is to climb out of certain logical dead-ends by making up the straw men, and burning these. It's dishonest, although I have to admit... it is amusing.

Hint. you have to follow the direction of your own logic to come to this "reason is your god" conclusion. Thus, your judgement is your god :)

[Igakusei]

LOL. I'm not laughing to be deragatory or condescending. I really find this definition funny in light of what you are trying to do, and how it backfires on you.

He's just trying to argue that everyone else is just as irrational as he is. At least Shane's use of this argument indicates that he understands that forsaking his own brain is inherently irrational. Maybe there's hope for him yet.