Are Jack Sequeira's teachings Biblicial?

[Robert]

So Jesus does not have eternal life? Is that what you are saying?

Well, this will spin into another subject. Keep in mind Jesus was/is God, but at the incarnation God the Father joined Christ's Deity to our fallen humanity in the womb of Mary. The humanity that was in Mary's womb was our humanity indwelt by sin. Hence it was a condemned humanity (See Gal 3:13/4:4). That fallen humanity never came back to life. It died forever. In the resurrection God raised up Christ's Deity with a glorified humanity free from mortality and indwelling sin.

[Stan]

could this have a worse title?

[Robert]

.... loathe myself?

The opposite of self-love is not self-hate. It's agape. Agape is never preoccupied with self - rather it lives to serve others. Here's Ellen White's definition:

"In heaven none will think of self, nor seek their own pleasure but all, from pure, genuine love [agape], will seek the happiness of the heavenly beings around them." [2T 132]

[Robert]

could this have a worse title?

Well, that's what I was told...that Jack's theology was a lie.

If you wish change the title.

Rob

[Stan]

I have viewed lies as a planned purposeful intent to deceive. The person who packaged it that statement that you are responding to may lack in other basic social skills as well.

As this is theology I will move it to that section as well

Thanks for your explanation Robert.

[M. T. Cross]

Originally Posted By: EmptyCross

.... loathe myself?

The opposite of self-love is not self-hate. It's agape. Agape is never preoccupied with self - rather it lives to serve others. Here's Ellen White's definition:

"In heaven none will think of self, nor seek their own pleasure but all, from pure, genuine love [agape], will seek the happiness of the heavenly beings around them." [2T 132]

See you are confusing self love as well. There is a self centered, self obsessed, ego driven love of self and I would agree that is destructive.

However there is a self love that simply means that you enjoy being you, you treasure your life and all the joy and opportunity it brings. It does not mean putting self before others.

And if you want to save your fingers the work out - EGW quotes are totally wasted on me.

[Tom Wetmore]

Originally Posted By: Tom Wetmore

Vance Ferrell is most definitely not a reliable source.

And relying on him is contrary to the basic premise identified at the onset of this discussion. Critique Jack's own words without filtering it through the opinions and distortions of others.

Can you show some of the things that Vance Ferrell is wrong about in his critique of Jack Sequeira?

I was commenting about his reliability generally and not about anything he has said about Sequeira. I do not know enough of what Sequeira teaches on anything to do what you asked. But what I do know is that Ferrell would be the last place I would look for such information. Relying on Ferrell for anything accurate or authoritative would be like using the National Enquirer for your source for all things scientific. Why even go there?

[Robert]

It does not mean putting self before others.

But you do....You are preoccupied with yourself & your immediate family's wealth. That's our human condition! You are bent-to-self and all that you do, without Christ, is for your gain.

[Robert]

Here's Jack on our sin condition:

Using man as his tool, Satan has developed a kingdom (the Bible refers to it as “the kingdom of this world”) that is based entirely on the principle of self and which is in complete opposition and contradiction to the “kingdom of heaven.” Everything, therefore, that goes to make up this worldly system (kosmos) — nationalism, tribalism, politics, education, commerce, recreation, sports, social clubs, technology, etc. — is founded upon the principle of love of self, even though at times this principle may not be obvious. According to 1 John2:16, “all that is in the world” (i.e., without exception) is based or founded upon lust (i.e., love of self).

[Twilight II]

Here's Jack on our sin condition:

Using man as his tool, Satan has developed a kingdom (the Bible refers to it as “the kingdom of this world”) that is based entirely on the principle of self and which is in complete opposition and contradiction to the “kingdom of heaven.” Everything, therefore, that goes to make up this worldly system (kosmos) — nationalism, tribalism, politics, education, commerce, recreation, sports, social clubs, technology, etc. — is founded upon the principle of love of self, even though at times this principle may not be obvious. According to 1 John2:16, “all that is in the world” (i.e., without exception) is based or founded upon lust (i.e., love of self).

The love of the carnal nature is not the same as the self respect that a born again Christian has for the character God has placed in them...

Confusing the two will cause miscommunication. :-)

[Robert]

Did Christ receive an education? Yes. For what motive, purpose? As a tool to live for others, not Himself.

Now read Ellen White:

At such a time as this, what is the trend of the education given? To what motive is appeal most often made? To self-seeking. Much of the education given is a perversion of the name. In true education the selfish ambition, the greed for power, the disregard for the rights and needs of humanity, that are the curse of our world, find a counterinfluence.

"There is an education which is essentially worldly. Its aim is success in the world, the gratification of selfish ambition”

[Twilight II]

Did Christ receive an education? Yes. For what motive, purpose? As a tool to live for others, not Himself.

Now read Ellen White:

At such a time as this, what is the trend of the education given? To what motive is appeal most often made? To self-seeking. Much of the education given is a perversion of the name. In true education the selfish ambition, the greed for power, the disregard for the rights and needs of humanity, that are the curse of our world, find a counterinfluence.

"There is an education which is essentially worldly. Its aim is success in the world, the gratification of selfish ambition”

The new nature is one of service, I agree.

But there is also implied a non-selfish service of the born again self that is incumbent on those that receive that precious gift of life from God.

[M. T. Cross]

Originally Posted By: EmptyCross

It does not mean putting self before others.

But you do....You are preoccupied with yourself & your immediate family's wealth. That's our human condition! You are bent-to-self and all that you do, without Christ, is for your gain.

Robert if I was preoccupied with wealth I would be wealthy. I am very curious as to how you came to this conclusion

[Robert]

So everything, in this world, is polluted with Lucifer's love of self, which is simply self-seeking. Hence all we do, without Christ, is polluted with our self-seeking.

That's why the spirit of law demands us to "love your neighbors as you love yourself". Self-love is a given! It's our inheritance because of father Adam. We are born with self-love.

Keep in mind (and I've stated this many times) that there is only one commandment, not two. The law doesn't say,

1] love your neighbor

2] and love yourself

You see if you are loving yourself you can't love your neighbor.

We can see this in the life of Christ:

As He hung on the cross experiencing God’s curse for our sins, Jesus had to make a choice. He could not save Himself and the world at the same time. And He did make the supreme choice. He chose to die eternally that you and I may live in His place. ...In other words, the supreme sacrifice is that Jesus was willing to accept our curse and give us His life in exchange. It was not a question of saving Himself and the world. He could not do that. He had to make a choice between the world and Himself. Do you know what Christ was saying on the cross? I hope you will never forget this; He was saying that He loves us more than Himself. That is God’s agape. [Jack Sequeira]

[Robert]

Robert if I was preoccupied with wealth I would be wealthy.

Not true....You have competition. It's a dog eat dog world. Others want to be number one.

In fact to get where you are you had to compete. That's self-love. All educational systems are based on self-seeking - who is the smartest (greatest).

[Robert]

The new nature is Christ's....it's not ours. He illuminates our mind, but our humanity remains unchanged. We still have sin dwelling in us.

[M. T. Cross]

Originally Posted By: EmptyCross

Robert if I was preoccupied with wealth I would be wealthy.

Not true....You have competition. It's a dog eat dog world. Others want to be number one.

Yes it is. If I was preoccupied with wealth I would happily be the dog that eats the other dog. I certainly would have more than zero saving, would not have lost my home, and in my current job I have missed out on promotions because of my unwillingness to screw other people over. People, for the record that I really don't like, but my moral code does not allow me to walk on others to get something for myself.

[Just*]

Okay, let's explore the following video:

Click here for viewing

An excellent statement of the Gospel. My friends have translated all these sermons on Russian.

[Robert]

I certainly would have more than zero saving, would not have lost my home, and in my current job I have missed out on promotions because of my unwillingness to screw other people over.

You have no saving because of Capitalism (one of Lucifer's systems), which is based on gain & self-seeking. Those who have the advantage out did you and you got left with what? No savings, etc. That's because of self-love & competition. In fact there are others way worse off than you. That's why Jesus said you will always have the poor. Those in power in this world always exploit those under them and many times they do it in the name of religion. Such religion belongs to Babylon.

[Robert]

Originally Posted By: Robert

Okay, let's explore the following video:

Click here for viewing

An excellent statement of the Gospel. My friends have translated all these sermons on Russian.

[Robert]

....my moral code does not allow me to walk on others to get something for myself.

Are you a Christian? I ask this because you say that you are a "Resident Pagan".

[M. T. Cross]

Originally Posted By: EmptyCross

I certainly would have more than zero saving, would not have lost my home, and in my current job I have missed out on promotions because of my unwillingness to screw other people over.

You have no saving because of Capitalism (one of Lucifer's systems), which is based on gain & self-seeking. Those who have the advantage out did you and you got left with what? No savings, etc. That's because of self-love & competition. In fact there are others way worse off than you. That's why Jesus said you will always have the poor. Those in power in this world always exploit those under them and many times they do it in the name of religion. Such religion belongs to Babylon.

I love the way you can make blanket statements on others lives when you have never met them and don't really know anything about them other than what you have read on a message board. Maybe you are a prophet Robert

[M. T. Cross]

Originally Posted By: EmptyCross

....my moral code does not allow me to walk on others to get something for myself.

Are you a Christian? I ask this because you say that you are a "Resident Pagan".

I have been posting here for two years and you just figured this out now? Seriously this has been addressed in multiple conversations I have had with you......

I am not a Christian, I am a pagan.

[Robert]

Under law to under grace

view video

[Robert]

Maybe you are a prophet Robert

No, but I know of one...his name is Paul, and he says, "Now we know that whatever the law says, it says to those who are under the law, that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God. 20 Therefore by the deeds of the law no flesh will be justified in His sight, for by the law is the knowledge of sin."

The law states your condition....You are a sinner and you need the righteousness of Christ. Don't deceive yourself that you are good. Everything you do, without Christ, is for your gain. Be honest with yourself. You get something back, maybe only recognition, etc. If you are not clothed with the righteousness of Christ there's no hope for you.