How expensive is too expensive?

[phkrause]

Quote:

Winfrey went on to say that, when she went to the boutique in Zurich to look at the $38,000 handbag, her appearance at the time was not indicative of her wealth -- not that she thinks that should have mattered.

I personally heard her interview. In the interview that I heard, she did not say what has been stated above. She said:

1) She went into the store.

2) As she was about to leave she noted the handbag and asked the clerk to show it to her. IOW, she did not go into the store to look at the handbag.

3) At that time, she did not know that it was a $38,000 handbag. IOW, she did not go into the store with the thought of purchasing a $38k handbag.

4) When she learned, from the publicity, that it was a $38,000 handbag, she immediately agreed that it was to expensive for her to purchase. IOW, she would not consider purchasing such a handbag.

I will suggest that there is considerable difference between what I heard Oprah say in a televised interview and what is cited above.

Interesting, thanks for the info

[rudywoofs (Pam)]

Originally Posted By: Gerry Cabalo

No doubt many of those 43 mil really need the help. But how many of them are able-bodied and too lazy to find work or just have no motivation to get an education because they have been raised in a culture of dependency?

Many people who are employed are now on food stamps even though they are working, because wages have been pushed down to the point where they no longer provide a living wage.

and it's very easy to look at someone and think that s/he is "able-bodied," and/or [obviously] is too lazy to find work, or has no motivation... but there are a LOT of people whose disabilities are not apparent.

But it *does* irk me that some women are like rabbits and produce offspring rather voluminously -- and get additional Federal/State monies for each child born. .... seems rather like a "reward" ... :/

[phkrause]

Many people who are employed are now on food stamps even though they are working, because wages have been pushed down to the point where they no longer provide a living wage.

America has sowed the wind with its inequality, and will reap the whirlwind... and blaming the victims is not helping.

Exactly, and to add to that Bravus, there are fewer jobs to go around.

[phkrause]

And with the erosion of benefits in our society today, many more are going to be pushed to the place where they will need help just to live.

Exactly Gregory and if it wasn't for the welfare system in Massachusetts, we would not be able to be foster parents to our grandchildren. They would've been put into someone else's care, we might never have been able to see them again! That God for systems that work and help those that need it.

[Gerr]

Do you think there are 43 million disabled people in the USA?

[phkrause]

Do you think there are 43 million disabled people in the USA?

I don't believe she said that. To qualify for foodstamps you need to make below a certain amount! I know quite a few living in this neighborhood we live in that make way below the line and if not for those stamps would not be able to eat. Many that do work are also using/on food stamps.

[Gerr]

It just occurred to me - if jobs are so scarce, how come there are millions of illegals here looking for or holding jobs?

[cricket]

Quit your current job, then wait for 3 months and then go look for a job--see if you can find one.

[LifeHiscost]

Quote:

Tha(nk)t God for systems that work and help those that need it.

Seems to be the goal of many, to try to solve the problem by making sure the others out there, don't put my personal finances in jeopardy.

"A friend is always loyal, and a brother is born to help in time of need."Proverbs 17:17 NLT

"My dear brothers and sisters, how can you claim to have faith in our glorious Lord Jesus Christ if you favor some people over others?

For example, suppose someone comes into your meeting dressed in fancy clothes and expensive jewelry, and another comes in who is poor and dressed in dirty clothes. If you give special attention and a good seat to the rich person, but you say to the poor one, “You can stand over there, or else sit on the floor”—well, doesn’t this discrimination show that your judgments are guided by evil motives?

Listen to me, dear brothers and sisters. Hasn’t God chosen the poor in this world to be rich in faith? Aren’t they the ones who will inherit the Kingdom he promised to those who love him? But you dishonor the poor! Isn’t it the rich who oppress you and drag you into court? Aren’t they the ones who slander Jesus Christ, whose noble name you bear?

Yes indeed, it is good when you obey the royal law as found in the Scriptures: “Love your neighbor as yourself.”But if you favor some people over others, you are committing a sin. You are guilty of breaking the law.

For the person who keeps all of the laws except one is as guilty as a person who has broken all of God’s laws. For the same God who said, “You must not commit adultery,” also said, “You must not murder.” So if you murder someone but do not commit adultery, you have still broken the law.

So whatever you say or whatever you do, remember that you will be judged by the law that sets you free. There will be no mercy for those who have not shown mercy to others. But if you have been merciful, God will be merciful when he judges you.

What good is it, dear brothers and sisters, if you say you have faith but don’t show it by your actions? Can that kind of faith save anyone? Suppose you see a brother or sister who has no food or clothing, and you say, “Good-bye and have a good day; stay warm and eat well”—but then you don’t give that person any food or clothing. What good does that do?

So you see, faith by itself isn’t enough. Unless it produces good deeds, it is dead and useless.

Now someone may argue, “Some people have faith; others have good deeds.” But I say, “How can you show me your faith if you don’t have good deeds? I will show you my faith by my good deeds.”"James 2:14-16 NASB

It does seem important to remember these instructions are primarily addressed to members of the body of Christ or those who are drawn to the same Lord.

God cares!

[joeb]

Do you think there are 43 million disabled people in the USA?

When, as a physician, was the last time you had to go job hunting because your last job just evaporated out from underneath you? That still doesn't really address the issue either because the health care sector of the economy still has a good job market.

To make it fair, go get training in a field where hard physical work is required, plus a couple of years of training, and then go look for work. You'll be a newbie hunting a job in a market where the real unemployment rate is close 20%. IOW's, you'll be at a major disadvantage in finding a job for everyone you'll be competing with will have more experience than you will, plus, you'll have absolutely no background in hard physical labor for the last couple of decades.

Think you'll have an easy time finding a job? And no fair using all the contacts you've made in the business world during your time as doctor. Cold call everything. See how long it takes you to find a job. Could very well be quite a few years, and when you do find a job it won't pay your bills.

In this day and age unless you know someone, or have experience, getting to an interview is tough. Everything is done through the unemployment office, or private employment agencies who screen applications. Thus, there's no talking your way into a job like a person used to be able to do. You can't talk to the person who will be your supervisor unless you make it through the screening process, which will drop your application to bottom of pile, or more probably, the round file, due to lack of experience.

My wife lost her job. She has 20+ years of office manager experience and a stable work history. She looked for work for more than a year. The job she finally found, that someone else recommended her for not knowing what the boss was like, was part time for a very abusive boss. Nobody has lasted more than 6 months in the position my wife took. They either walk off or get fired.

Her 20+ years of experience? Basically worthless any more. Almost every office manager job now requires a degree. Without a degree your resume gets dumped right away.

If she hadn't been recommended for the job she got she would still be unemployed and it would be over 2 years of unemployment now. And now she's getting dumped again by a nutso boss. Who knows how many years will take to find another position....

This is a job market I've never seen in my life time, and I'm 60. Wages have been compressed down to the point of not sustaining basic needs unless a person is in the top 5% or so. The average person is just out of luck in finding something permanent or full-time.

[LifeHiscost]

Quote:

My brother, my sister, and myself all went to SDA colleges. As you well know, they are not inexpensive. We took longer to finish college than most who graduated in 4 years because we worked.

I appreciate you and your siblings work ethic, Gerry.

One of the political misnomers of this society is that we (the U.S.A. or certain politicians) believe we can solve problems just by spreading the wealth around. America in the beginning brought with it when coming from other continents, a strong work ethic. Now people come from other countries, largely to receive the largess of a country that's already made it, financially, not recognizing that if a person or peoples are here only to receive, without giving back in kind, impoverishes.

"Even while we were with you, we gave you this command: “Those unwilling to work will not get to eat.”"2 Thessalonians 3:10 NLT

Being a retired person, I cannot be entirely unbiased re: taking without receiving. However when younger, the work force put into the treasury regularly, a percentage of the income earned, long before it would be needed as one declined in ability to earn. That was a purse that was meant to be reserved for the express purpose originally designed for those who paid for it. That agreement was changed and Peter was borrowed from to pay Paul.

If one cannot trust a nation to keep its' commitments but compromises for that which is expedient, what can we expect of the constituency.

"For our citizenship is in heaven, from which also we eagerly wait for a Savior, the Lord Jesus Christ;"Philippians 3:20 NASB

"“Ho! Every one who thirsts, come to the waters;

And you who have no money come, buy and eat.

Come, buy wine and milk

Without money and without cost."Isaiah 55:1 NASB

God cares!

[Bravus]

Quote:

Now people come from other countries, largely to receive the largess of a country that's already made it, financially, not recognizing that if a person or peoples are here only to receive, without giving back in kind, impoverishes.

Such nonsense. Why are there illegals in America? Because they will do the work Americans won't. It is far more likely to be the native-born than immigrants, if anyone, who consider themselves entitled to take without giving.

*Some* link with reality would be an ideal feature in all such ruminations - *especially* when they have the potential to inflame xenophobia.

[Gerr]

Such nonsense. Why are there illegals in America? Because they will do the work Americans won't. It is far more likely to be the native-born than immigrants, if anyone, who consider themselves entitled to take without giving.

Exactly! I recall reading about a guy who had a landscaping business while we were still living in S. Cal. He advertised his need for help preferring Americans at something like $20/hr and that was years ago. The only takers were the illegals or immigrants. The excuses he got from Americans was that it was too hot for that kind of money!

[LifeHiscost]

*Some* link with reality would be an ideal feature in all such ruminations - *especially* when they have the potential to inflame xenophobia.

Evidently you are of the opinion that Paul wasn't inspired when he wrote these words.

"For even when we were with you, we used to give you this order: if anyone is not willing to work, then he is not to eat, either."2 Thessalonians 3:10 NASB

And you appear to feel that the U.S. became successful as a result of slave labor? I do admit that had something to do with part of the history of this country, and there is no doubt it is only opinion that the acquisition of possessions is indicative of success. Plus true wealth is a result of the grace of God. The complexity of problems residing in the U.S. is far more than just a lack of work ethic.

No one is without guilt in the stability of a nation, and that doesn't exclude any.

"Great peace have they which love thy law: and nothing shall offend them."Psalm 119:165 KJV

God cares!

[cricket]

Reality is in the eye of the beholder; usually it is painted by their experiences.

In our experience, there are many Americans who are willing to work hard and who are willing to put in the hours necessary to receive the education needed for employment. The jobs are not available.

[Bravus]

Absolutely: apologies if my very quick sketch gave an impression opposite to that. Plenty of stories *right here* of Americans who are willing to work hard but can't.

[phkrause]

Such nonsense. Why are there illegals in America? Because they will do the work Americans won't. It is far more likely to be the native-born than immigrants, if anyone, who consider themselves entitled to take without giving.

Exactly, I remember when on the unemployment line, many rejected working at McDonalds, either because the money was to low orthey didn't want to flip burgers, wash tables, etc., or reference's to the job being to much benenth(sp) them.

[Gerr]

When, as a physician, was the last time you had to go job hunting because your last job just evaporated out from underneath you? That still doesn't really address the issue either because the health care sector of the economy still has a good job market.

I've worked as a janitor and odd maintenance work, picked strawberries(hardest work I've ever done). I even joined the Navy because I had trouble finding a job as a college dropout. I sold books as a colporteur during the summer after I went back to school, worked at the McKee Baking Co. while in Collegedale. I do my own yard work. Our house in S. Cal was on a hill. I put the concrete block retaining walls myself with the help of an immigrant - in the heat of summer.

I've been retired from medicine now for 3 years, but recently I decided on another career just so I could contribute more to the church and to charity. So I've been going to school to learn a trade. I've met quite a number of middle-aged and retired people at the school learning the same trade.

Quote:

This is a job market I've never seen in my life time, and I'm 60. Wages have been compressed down to the point of not sustaining basic needs unless a person is in the top 5% or so. The average person is just out of luck in finding something permanent or full-time.

Yes, it's a tough job market, and I can sympathize with that, but the immigrants don't seem to have trouble finding work because they keep coming. Let's be frank. It's beneath most Americans to do the work the immigrants are doing. Granted these are not high paying jobs. But how much incentive would I have to do low-paying hard physical labor if I can get assitance without working? There was a member in our church in S. Cal who had computer expertise but refused to work for <$70k/yr. The church was always helping them. I had an Uncle (since deceased) who worked 3 jobs, one full and two part time. I don't think it ever occurred to him to get assistance. Maybe it wasn't available in Hawaii then.

While it's not appropriate to use one's experiences as the standard for everybody else, one cannot totally ignore them either. I try to put myself in other people's shoes. The first generation Filipinos (which I am) who came to this country did all the kinds of work that the immigrants and illegals are now doing. With this background, I find it very difficult to listen to the victim tune because this is still the land of opportunity.

[Gerr]

Quit your current job, then wait for 3 months and then go look for a job--see if you can find one.

I did. I retired. But after 3 years of retirement, I decided on another career.

[cricket]

My apologies, Gerry. I only have our own personal experiences to draw on. And from our experiences, the job market is rough--even for those who are willing to work hard.

[Gerr]

I think most people would like to help the less fortunate, but as my brother likes to say, teach a person how to fish and you will never to give him fish again. So I'm all for programs that teach people how to fish, even giving them the fishing pole. What rankles is when you have to provide the fish day after day, year after year, and even to the next generation.

[cricket]

Shouldn't a good and faithful servant have the patience to give fishing lessons as long as it takes?

[phkrause]

Yes, it's a tough job market, and I can sympathize with that, but the immigrants don't seem to have trouble finding work because they keep coming. Let's be frank. It's beneath most Americans to do the work the immigrants are doing.

[Gerr]

No apologies needed, Cricket. We are all products of our own experiences.

[Gerr]

Shouldn't a good and faithful servant have the patience to give fishing lessons as long as it takes?

That's a tough question. And the social policy-makers can't agree on that. Imho, if a person hasn't learned the lesson after 10 years for an adult and 15-20 years for someone younger, I doubt they will ever learn. Is there a place for tough love?