Human being

[Gerr]

This subject is prompted by a discussion about abortion in another thread.

What is a human being? When do we call the product of pregnancy a human being? That life begins at conception is a given. Should/do we call a fertilized ovum a human being? After birth? Or somewhere in between?

[Neil D]

This subject may go wide of the goal that you might have set your sites for, Gerry...

For example, definitions of human being don't just include the ability to reproduce....or the mental capacity of time....or the spiritual capacity of understanding who God is....It might include all of these things and a whole lot more..

..Are you seeking the origional understanding of what a human being is like from the bible? Is that pre-fall or post fall? [granted, we are far more understanding of a human being post fall]

What about the capacity of thought? Can we include the artistic abilities of what a human being might be defined as?

Or is there some capability of the human that defines it from the Apes as a whole? And then there is the past human beings....If apes are not human because they are not able to determine time, what about the American Indian before the white man came and invaded thier culture? Did they have a concept of time?

Does culture define a human being? Is the ability to create cities something that separates us from Animals?

When does a human really become a human being? Does the few cells in a fertilized egg allow it to be called a human being? Is an infant a human being? Is a child? Is a "32 weeker" pre-gestational fetus a human being?

Good question, gerry...good question...

[phkrause]

This subject is prompted by a discussion about abortion in another thread.

What is a human being? When do we call the product of pregnancy a human being? That life begins at conception is a given. Should/do we call a fertilized ovum a human being? After birth? Or somewhere in between?

Gerry I would think of all of us on the forum you and the other doctors would have a better idea.

Having said that, I recall a statement in the Bible were I believe David mentions that God knew us before we were born? Not sure how that relates, but I thought I'd mention it anyway.

pk

[mrsducky]

This subject is prompted by a discussion about abortion in another thread.

What is a human being? When do we call the product of pregnancy a human being? That life begins at conception is a given. Should/do we call a fertilized ovum a human being? After birth? Or somewhere in between?

If you believe that life begins with the union of sperm and egg then that is the beginning of a human being. If you believe that is somewhere in between, then can you start your human being in the 'somewhere in between' area? Sometimes I think that we as Christians have been stained with the world's view of life and its significanace. Just because a fetus in the earlier stages of development is unable or less likely to be able to support life independently of its mother doesn't mean it is not a human being made in God's image. Abortion is not the same as the delete key on one's computer.

[Neil D]

Originally Posted By: Gerry Cabalo

This subject is prompted by a discussion about abortion in another thread.

What is a human being? When do we call the product of pregnancy a human being? That life begins at conception is a given. Should/do we call a fertilized ovum a human being? After birth? Or somewhere in between?

If you believe that life begins with the union of sperm and egg then that is the beginning of a human being. If you believe that is somewhere in between, then can you start your human being in the 'somewhere in between' area? Sometimes I think that we as Christians have been stained with the world's view of life and its significanace. Just because a fetus in the earlier stages of development is unable or less likely to be able to support life independently of its mother doesn't mean it is not a human being made in God's image. Abortion is not the same as the delete key on one's computer.

Three things...

1] Babys are ugly....that is an opinion that I have quietly held for many a year....I have only now come out of the closet and said it... So, how can they be made in "God's image"?

2] Babys grow into human being and some, if not most, become beautiful....and then, like me, become old and ugly again...

3] No one has mentioned the new birth experience as to when a human being becomes a HUMAN being....or is it a divine being? Duo natured? Good and Evil within a person? IS this when we become truely alive and start making decisions for ourselves??? Is this when we become human BEINGS?

[GreatLakesGramma]

How could it be anything other than human? It certainly isn't any other kind of living thing. The DNA in those few cells is human, not bird, reptile, plant, fungus, or bacteria. The fact that it is not fully formed doesn't make it something else.

[Dottie]

I think that Gramma is right, but I also think that we will not become fully human until after Jesus makes us whole at the Second Coming.

[mrsducky]

Three things...

1] Babys are ugly....that is an opinion that I have quietly held for many a year....I have only now come out of the closet and said it... So, how can they be made in "God's image"?

2] Babys grow into human being and some, if not most, become beautiful....and then, like me, become old and ugly again...

3] No one has mentioned the new birth experience as to when a human being becomes a HUMAN being....or is it a divine being? Duo natured? Good and Evil within a person? IS this when we become truely alive and start making decisions for ourselves??? Is this when we become human BEINGS?

As with our spiritual growth and maturation, it is interesting to watch as babies grow and change as they mature. Even though Satan has perverted human nature by his tactics, it is amazing that we all have some desire to find God. In some way we all have some of His image in us. I am looking forward to the day spoken if in 1 Corinthians 15: 51-53.

[Dottie]

Neil - -

I'm so sorry that you think that babies are ugly. My mother thought they all looked like Winston Churchill!

But I did foster care for ten years, mostly all either newborns or a little older. Most of them were beautiful. They came in all shades. A few were ugly, but that usually came with their behavior, and yes, newborns can have a temper. But usually, I think babies are beautiful, even when they are eight weeks premature and haven't filled out their skin yet.

[Gerr]

Originally Posted By: Gerry Cabalo

This subject is prompted by a discussion about abortion in another thread.

What is a human being? When do we call the product of pregnancy a human being? That life begins at conception is a given. Should/do we call a fertilized ovum a human being? After birth? Or somewhere in between?

Gerry I would think of all of us on the forum you and the other doctors would have a better idea.

Having said that, I recall a statement in the Bible were I believe David mentions that God knew us before we were born? Not sure how that relates, but I thought I'd mention it anyway.

pk

This issue involves not just doctors but theologians, ethicists, educators, and scientists, but should also involve lay people as well.

[doug yowell]

[]

This issue involves not just doctors but theologians, ethicists, educators, and scientists, but should also involve lay people as well.

Do lay people qualify as human beings? It takes one to know one???

[Guest]

Yep

[doug yowell]

[

1] Babys are ugly....that is an opinion that I have quietly held for many a year....I have only now come out of the closet and said it... So, how can they be made in "God's image"?

2] Babys grow into human being and some, if not most, become beautiful....and then, like me, become old and ugly again...

3] No one has mentioned the new birth experience as to when a human being becomes a HUMAN being....or is it a divine being? Duo natured? Good and Evil within a person? IS this when we become truely alive and start making decisions for ourselves??? Is this when we become human BEINGS?

1)Babies are ugly or newborn babies are ugly? 2) Neil, If you're old and ugly like a baby, How can it be that you (or many of the rest of us) are made in God's image? 3)How many decisions does a two day old newborn make for itself? 4) Ugly newborns (I agree) get very cute very fast. 5)Why do mothers lovingly commit themselves so fully to something that ugly? 6) Using your new birth example; "While we were YET SINNERS Christ died for the ungodly."(human being) "...you may be partakers of the divine nature." (divinity)

[Overaged]

Originally Posted By: Gerry Cabalo

[]

This issue involves not just doctors but theologians, ethicists, educators, and scientists, but should also involve lay people as well.

Do lay people qualify as human beings? It takes one to know one???

I only "lay" down at night.

[Overaged]

I think that Gramma is right, but I also think that we will not become fully human until after Jesus makes us whole at the Second Coming.

Human Being:"Any living or extinct member of the family Hominidae characterized by superior intelligence, articulate speech, and erect carriage" - Word Web Dictionary

[doug yowell]

[

Do lay people qualify as human beings? It takes one to know one???

I only "lay" down at night.

[doug yowell]

Originally Posted By: Dottie

I think that Gramma is right, but I also think that we will not become fully human until after Jesus makes us whole at the Second Coming.

Human Being:"Any living or extinct member of the family Hominidae characterized by superior intelligence, articulate speech, and erect carriage" - Word Web Dictionary

Well, I guess that leaves me out.

[doug yowell]

Is it too simplistic to identify a human being by just accepting the normal definition of the words,human being? It's human and it exists.

[Guest]

Well Doug, some need to have it broken down for them before they can really grasp it. Others have a need to break it down so that the rest of us can understand it.

I remember when I was a little boy, it used to crack my older sister up when I would say "Human Bean".

[rudywoofs (Pam)]

Was Adam a human being before God breathed the breath of life into him?

[Guest]

No. He was just dust of the ground until after.

Gen 2:7 And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.

[rudywoofs (Pam)]

a fertilized ovum is not breathing

[Guest]

That doesn't matter. After God breathed the breath of life into him he became a real human being. And all that came after him (them) was human also. Even before it was breathing, because it was part of them.

[Guest]

[Gerr]

How could it be anything other than human? It certainly isn't any other kind of living thing. The DNA in those few cells is human, not bird, reptile, plant, fungus, or bacteria. The fact that it is not fully formed doesn't make it something else.

When you buy a fertilized egg, you are buying NOT a chicken, but a POTENTIAL chicken. Is an acorn an oak? NO! It's a POTENTIAL oak. Ditto, a fertilized ovum is NOT a human being. It is a POTENTIAL human being.