Sonny Posted May 27, 2011 Author Posted May 27, 2011 Going back to the title of this thread - what are the issues? 1. Obedience - either obey God or man. 2. RE: Sanctification - either accept God as the ONLY One who can make a sinner holy, or work it on your own. 3. Worship - God or somebody else. 4. Accept God as Creator or spontaneous generation. The Sabbath isn't about worship. The NC Sabbath is a sign just like Circumcision was a sign to Abraham. Keep in mind Abraham wanted to help God keep His promise in giving Abraham a child. Instead Abraham tries to help God by getting with Hagar. Because of this act of unbelief God had Abraham's male family members cut away their foreskin. This symbolized the removal of unbelief and trusting God to keep His promise. The Sabbath is like circumcision. Keep in mind the Jews perverted both these symbols - they made them legalistic. In the NT the Sabbath is a symbol of justification by faith. It's a sign of faith to those who understand it. It's linked to the gospel, not the law. Quote
Sonny Posted May 27, 2011 Author Posted May 27, 2011 ESV | Re 14:7 And he said with a loud voice, “Fear God and give him glory, because the hour of his judgment has come, and worship him who made heaven and earth, the sea and the springs of water.” Sorry, the context isn't about the Sabbath. Acts chapter 17 gives a clearer view: 16 While Paul was waiting for them in Athens, he was greatly distressed to see that the city was full of idols. 17 So he reasoned in the synagogue with the Jews and the God-fearing Greeks, as well as in the marketplace day by day with those who happened to be there. 18 A group of Epicurean and Stoic philosophers began to dispute with him. Some of them asked, "What is this babbler trying to say?" Others remarked, "He seems to be advocating foreign gods." They said this because Paul was preaching the good news about Jesus and the resurrection. 19 Then they took him and brought him to a meeting of the Areopagus, where they said to him, "May we know what this new teaching is that you are presenting? 20 You are bringing some strange ideas to our ears, and we want to know what they mean." 21 (All the Athenians and the foreigners who lived there spent their time doing nothing but talking about and listening to the latest ideas.) 22 Paul then stood up in the meeting of the Areopagus and said: "Men of Athens! I see that in every way you are very religious. 23 For as I walked around and looked carefully at your objects of worship, I even found an altar with this inscription: to an unknown god. Now what you worship as something unknown I am going to proclaim to you. 24 "The God who made the world and everything in it is the Lord of heaven and earth and does not live in temples built by hands. 25 And he is not served by human hands, as if he needed anything, because he himself gives all men life and breath and everything else. 26 From one man he made every nation of men, that they should inhabit the whole earth; and he determined the times set for them and the exact places where they should live. 27 God did this so that men would seek him and perhaps reach out for him and find him, though he is not far from each one of us. 28 'For in him we live and move and have our being.' As some of your own poets have said, 'We are his offspring.' 29 "Therefore since we are God's offspring, we should not think that the divine being is like gold or silver or stone--an image made by man's design and skill. 30 In the past God overlooked such ignorance, but now he commands all people everywhere to repent. 31 For he has set a day when he will judge the world with justice by the man he has appointed. He has given proof of this to all men by raising him from the dead." This is dealing with Idolatry, not the Sabbath. The same with your quote. Turn from all false gods to the One real God - the same One who created this world in the beginning. Quote
Sonny Posted May 27, 2011 Author Posted May 27, 2011 And I say it does! What you state means nothing unless you back with the Bible using the immediate context! Quote
Sonny Posted May 27, 2011 Author Posted May 27, 2011 That's your opinion. It is written: ESV | Re 14:7 And he said with a loud voice, “Fear God and give him glory, because the hour of his judgment has come, and worship him who made heaven and earth, the sea and the springs of water.” First you went to a highly symbolic book. Secondly you interpreted it out of context. In other word you are forcing it to say what it does not. The call is to the true God - the one who created the earth originally. It's not a call to rest as God rested. It's a call to turn from Babylon and it's false gospel and false Christ. Quote
Moderators Gerr Posted May 28, 2011 Moderators Posted May 28, 2011 Revelation may be a highly symbolic book, but there is no mistaking about the call to worship the Creator, no matter what context you want to put it in. The 4th commandment is to "Remember the Sabbath day to keep it holy,... FOR/BECAUSE in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that is in them, and rested on the seventh day. Therefore the LORD blessed the Sabbath day and made it holy." ESV. Not only did He command it, He also set it apart. People have come up with all kinds of phony reasons to ignore this command, but disregard it at your own risk. Quote
Sonny Posted May 28, 2011 Author Posted May 28, 2011 The 4th commandment is to "Remember the Sabbath day to keep it holy,... FOR/BECAUSE in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that is in them, and rested on the seventh day. Therefore the LORD blessed the Sabbath day and made it holy." ESV. Right, and that's the 4th commandment of the law from Sinai. What you quoted [Rev 14] doesn't speak of the Sabbath, it speaks of the God-creator. It says turn to Him. It's not talking about the Sabbath. I showed you that Acts chapter 17 is using the same language, but it wasn't speaking of the Sabbath either. Quote
Moderators Gerr Posted May 28, 2011 Moderators Posted May 28, 2011 So then, if the 4th commandment from Sinai is no longer meaningful, does that apply to the other 9 also? I noticed that you haven't answered miz3's question about the other 9. Quote
Sonny Posted May 28, 2011 Author Posted May 28, 2011 So then, if the 4th commandment from Sinai is no longer meaningful, does that apply to the other 9 also? It's no longer meaningful as it point's to God's rest from a perfect creation, but wasn't His redemption in Christ perfect? Quote
Sonny Posted May 28, 2011 Author Posted May 28, 2011 I noticed that you haven't answered miz3's question about the other 9. I'm getting to it.... Keep in mind the giving of the law was, 1] To point out sin. It was never given as a means of salvation. That's OC. 2] The law written on stone is brief. There's a lot more to the law than 10 rules. The law is spiritual. Quote
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