Mark Lowry Recovering Fundamentalist - Interesting

[doug yowell]

However, you are targetting a specific person, and twisting his message into something "unbalanced,"

No, not exactly correct. I'm targeting a specific message given by specific person.

[doug yowell]

The trouble with sitting in criticism of ML's ministry is that we look for him to be without fault in his presentation,

What justifies the leap in concluding that criticism of a specific presentation is tantamount to critizing an entire ministry? Sometimes presentations need adjustments in order to not convey that which was never intended to be conveyed.This may add to the overall effectiveness of the whole ministry.

[LifeHiscost]

AT THE SAME time that we need to make Church a safe place for 'them' to go, we have to make it a safe place for our Children and members to go.

How do you balance that?

Good question. My answer! I don't know. But I do have a suggestion. If one has a burden to protect the children from the society they invite into the body of believers, spending a lot of time in prayer, laying before the Lord the dilemma, the answer will come.

From experience, if I had been held out of the church until I was without spot so as to make all in the church safe, my entrance into heaven would never have been with the body of believers, and the body would not have been aiding and abetting the Lord's will to be done.

"Let us think of ways to motivate one another to acts of love and good works. And let us not neglect our meeting together, as some people do, but encourage one another, especially now that the day of his return is drawing near.

Dear friends, if we deliberately continue sinning after we have received knowledge of the truth, there is no longer any sacrifice that will cover these sins."

Hebrews 10:24-26 NLT

God blesses!

[doug yowell]

But the problem was that I had my really grubby drywall taping clothes on...

A drywaller? No wonder you needed to go in for prayer!

[Overaged]

quote=Overaged] However, you are targetting a specific person, and twisting his message into something "unbalanced,"/quote] No, not exactly correct. I'm targeting a specific message given by specific person.

I really iked LHC's last post here. He is right on with everything he said. I'm sorry Doug, if you disagree with what I said; but you are taking the man's message and saying "what it really means." There is no way to avoid attacking the man personally when you do this. You said that "Tom says words have meanings;" and that you "supply the meanings." I didn't know Jesuits and Moonies worked together; now I just have to figure which is which. Shouldn't be too hard to do after a few more posts..(LOL)

You are doing to his message, what you say I am doing to your posts.

[Overaged]

Originally Posted By: Overaged

But the problem was that I had my really grubby drywall taping clothes on...

A drywaller? No wonder you needed to go in for prayer!

Ya, well if a certain elder had been there that night; I would have gotten chased out on the end of her broom stick.

[Overaged]

Originally Posted By: John317

then I realize that saying this wouldn't have gotten as many laughs.

Therefore would have lost perhaps 75% of the audience he was trying to reach. One of the characteristics of the Bill Gaither group is the bouyancy of their programs, which often includes humor, of which Mark Lowry is the salt that brings out the savour of that kind of ministry.

The trouble with sitting in criticism of ML's ministry is that we look for him to be without fault in his presentation, IOW, absolutely without fault. Once I tried that tack, until I found the only one left to hear my voice was me. And then when I came to the place that I found I wasn't absolute, I found I could come to one of two decisions. Either stop preaching entirely, because I had no audience, or take what I knew to be right and reveal by my actions that Jesus came to seek and to save that which was lost.

I heard a maxim, of which I agree. Jesus doesn't call the qualified to follow Him. He promises to qualify the called.

If one is so certain that Mark's ministry is without redeeming value, then please, reveal the solution that will reach the same audience he is reaching, with just as much success.

Mark lifted up Jesus in his ministry. And at the end of his time in the spotlight, it was clear he adores and worships his Master. If we cannot see that, maybe we ought to lift Mark up to Jesus in prayer and ask Him to give him the dressing down we think he deserves.

"The time for judging this world has come, when Satan, the ruler of this world, will be cast out. And when I am lifted up...., I will draw everyone to myself."John 12:31-33 Underlined bold Mine LHC

"When it is in the heart to obey God, when efforts are put forth to this end, Jesus accepts this disposition and effort as man’s best service, and He makes up for the deficiency with His own divine merit. "

Faith and Works, Page 50 EGW

"For the Son of Man came to seek and save those who are lost.”"Luke 19:10 NLT

"Jesus says, “If any man will come after Me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow Me"

Matthew 16:24

God blesses!

[doug yowell]

You are doing to his message, what you say I am doing to your posts.

Well, I will belabor the point no more. You shall be consigned to misunderstand me forever, I'm afraid.

PS. Who do you think controls the Moonies (and everything else)anyway?

[doug yowell]

Ya, well if a certain elder had been there that night; I would have gotten chased out on the end of her broom stick.

Those prayer meetings can be really dangerous places to go sometimes.------See what ya get for electing a woman elder?

[Overaged]

quote=Overaged]You are doing to his message, what you say I am doing to your posts./quote]Well, I will belabor the point no more. You shall be consigned to misunderstand me forever, I'm afraid.

PS. Who do you think controls the Moonies (and everything else)anyway?

I do not take offence to your remarks here; I have been "consigned" before. Actually, it's not so bad...

Say; your question re the Moonies would be a great and exciting new topic! LOL, Oh, that would be fun!

[Overaged]

Originally Posted By: Overaged

Ya, well if a certain elder had been there that night; I would have gotten chased out on the end of her broom stick.

Those prayer meetings can be really dangerous places to go sometimes.------See what ya get for electing a woman elder?

I didn't elect her...but I would have. She is actually a very nice lady - just likes to keep the sanctuary clean and free of drywall mud, crumbs and rubble. Thats not unreasonable.

[M. T. Cross]

What did we ever do before the Emerging Church/post modernist ideas come along for us to blame all the ills of the church on?!?!

Then it was the devil, he made it all happen.

Human nature is one that will always find some outside source to blame everything bad on.

Honesty however looks within first, to take responsibility for your own actions. I like that bit - you hate your sins, I'll hate mine and we will love each other. That is Wisdom, Self Honesty, Self Responsibility and Love all in one package deal there.

[Overaged]

Originally Posted By: Tom Wetmore

What did we ever do before the Emerging Church/post modernist ideas come along for us to blame all the ills of the church on?!?!

Then it was the devil, he made it all happen.

Human nature is one that will always find some outside source to blame everything bad on.

Honesty however looks within first, to take responsibility for your own actions. I like that bit - you hate your sins, I'll hate mine and we will love each other. That is Wisdom, Self Honesty, Self Responsibility and Love all in one package deal there.

[John317]

...Human nature is one that will always find some outside source to blame everything bad on.

Honesty however looks within first, to take responsibility for your own actions. I like that bit - you hate your sins, I'll hate mine and we will love each other. That is Wisdom, Self Honesty, Self Responsibility and Love all in one package deal there.

So true!

The last part is especially true if we can't separate the sin from the person who is doing the sin. If hating the sin makes us hate the person, we don't yet have the mind of Christ.