Prophetic Day=Year Principle - Biblical?

[Lysimachus]

I will now quote Dr. William Shea, Ph.D. from his book "Daniel" on pages 160-162, validating that the Gospel went out to the Gentiles in 34 A.D., and none-other.

• THE END OF THE 70TH WEEK:

  "We have established 457 B.C. as the beginning date for Daniel's seventy weeks. We have seen that the sixty-nine weeks, or 483 years, ended in A.D. 27 with Jesus' baptism. The next questions become: When did the seventy weeks end, and what event marked its termination?

  Seventy prophetic weeks equal 490 prophetic days or literal years. Simple addition tells us that if we add 490 years to 457 B.C. we reach A.D. 34. What happened in A.D. 34 to mark the conclusion of the seventy weeks? This date is too late for the crucifixion and resurrection of Jesus which took place three or four years earlier. Some other event must be considered.

  The stoning of Stephen, described in Acts 7, is an event that has attracted considerable attention as marking the end of the seventy weeks--both for its theological significance as well as its timing. The narrative records no specific date for Stephen's death, but indirect evidence places it in A.D. 34. How do we arrive at this conclusion?

  The estimated date for Stephen's martyrdom is based on the career of the apostle Paul. He was still unconverted at Stephen's death, since he stood by and held the coats of those who stoned him (see Acts 7:58). A short time later, Saul left for Damascus to persecute Christians there. On the way to Damascus he was converted from Saul the Pharisee to Paul the Christian apostle (see Acts 9:1-9). If Paul's conversion can be dated, the stoning of Stephen can also be placed within narrow limits.

  In Galatians 1, Paul gives some biographical details about his career as an apostle, referring especially to his visits to Jerusalem. He made only brief and infrequent visits to Jerusalem, and he gives us some chronological information about them. He says the first visit came 3 years after his conversion (see verse 18); the second occurred 14 years after the first (see Galatians 2:1). Then shortly after his second visit to Jerusalem, Paul left on his second missionary journey which took him to Corinth (see Acts 18). While at Corinth, Paul appeared before the proconsul Gallio (see verse 12). So Paul would have stood before Gallio 17 years following his conversion (14 years between his second and first visit to Jerusalem added to the 3 years between his first Jerusalem visit and his conversion). From an inscription found in Corinth, we know that Gallio's one-year pro-consulship in Corinth occurred in A.D. 51. If the 17 years for Paul's two visits to Jerusalem are subtracted from the date of Paul's appearance before Gallio, then his conversion and Stephen's stoning should be dated to A.D. 34. (51 - 17 = 34). This date, A.D. 34 is the one New Testament scholars commonly favor for Stephen's death and paul's conversion. We can't be so precise to determine the month or day, but it is a close estimate for the year itself.

  Thus this book takes the position that Daniel's seventy weeks came to an end in A.D. 34 with the stoning of Stephen and the conversion of Paul. We already discussed the theological significance of Stephen's death in the context of the last phrase of Daniel 9:24). There we said there were four areas of theological significance related to Stephen's martyrdom: (1) the gruop to whom Stephen gave his final speech--the Sanhedrin, the highest religious body in the land; (2) the form of his speech--a covenant lawsuit speech like those given by Old Testament prophets; (3) the prophetic nature of his experience at the time of his death when he looked up in vision into heaven itself; and (4) the fact that Paul's conversion has its roots in Stephen's death, so that Paul, the apostle to the Gentiles, takes the place of Stephen the powerful preacher to Israel. For these reasons, Stephen's death at the end of the seventy weeks can be seen as a highly significant point of transition from the era of Israel as the elect nation of God to the era of the church." (Dr. William H. Shea, Ph.D., Daniel, pp. 160-162)

Hence we see that the stoning of Stephen marks well the terminus of the 70 weeks.

Adventists have done FAR more laborious tears and sweat to come to these conclusions than most would imagine.

For men like Ron Amns to just come along, all by himself, and TOUT around his private interpretations, and throwing out ALL the vast research that men have produced in the past, is to exercise theological pride, and not come into harmony with the counsel of the brethren.

"In the multitude of counsellors there is safety." (Proverbs 11:14; 24:6)

[Lysimachus]

Quote:

The verb "cut off." The verb used by Gabriel in his first statement about the 70 weeks is a passive (Niphal) form of the root hatak (seventy weeks are determined upon thy people"). This root means either "to cut off" or "to determine, decree." Because this is the only passage in the OT where the word occurs, its meaning here has been disputed.

The meaning of "determine, decree" has been derived from Mishnaic Hebrew that dates a millennium later than Daniel's time. However, even in Mishnaic writings the term was more commonly used with the meaning of "cut off."

It is a recognized principle of Semitic philology that the extended meaning of Semitic verbs develop rom concrete meanings in the direction of abstract concepts. Thus, it is sound to infer that the root meaning of this word involved the concrete idea of cutting. The abstract ideas of determining or decreeing are the later development from this root idea. In Daniel's time, therefore, this word already meant "to cut." Whether the extended meaning of "decree, determine" had developed by then, cannot be determined at present due to a lack of comparative evidence.

The only significant comparative material, from Ugaritic Canaanite of the thirteenth century B.C., lends some support to the idea that this root's basic verbal notion was that of cutting, not decreeing or determining. Thus, these three lines of evidence--(1) root meaning over extended meaning, (2) the case of a Ugaritic cognate, and (3) the predominant meaning in later Mishnaic sources--all favor (but do not fully prove) that this verb should be translated "cut off" here. Its apparent meaning emphasizes the idea that the 70 weeks were understood to be cut off from the 2300 days mentioned in the preceding prophecy. (70 Weeks, Leviticus, Nature of Prophecy, The Prophecy of Daniel 9:24-27 William H. Shea, p. 107)

[phkrause]

I will now quote Dr. William Shea, Ph.D. from his book "Daniel" on pages 160-162, validating that the Gospel went out to the Gentiles in 34 A.D., and none-other.

• THE END OF THE 70TH WEEK:

  "We have established 457 B.C. as the beginning date for Daniel's seventy weeks. We have seen that the sixty-nine weeks, or 483 years, ended in A.D. 27 with Jesus' baptism. The next questions become: When did the seventy weeks end, and what event marked its termination?

  Seventy prophetic weeks equal 490 prophetic days or literal years. Simple addition tells us that if we add 490 years to 457 B.C. we reach A.D. 34. What happened in A.D. 34 to mark the conclusion of the seventy weeks? This date is too late for the crucifixion and resurrection of Jesus which took place three or four years earlier. Some other event must be considered.

  The stoning of Stephen, described in Acts 7, is an event that has attracted considerable attention as marking the end of the seventy weeks--both for its theological significance as well as its timing. The narrative records no specific date for Stephen's death, but indirect evidence places it in A.D. 34. How do we arrive at this conclusion?

  The estimated date for Stephen's martyrdom is based on the career of the apostle Paul. He was still unconverted at Stephen's death, since he stood by and held the coats of those who stoned him (see Acts 7:58). A short time later, Saul left for Damascus to persecute Christians there. On the way to Damascus he was converted from Saul the Pharisee to Paul the Christian apostle (see Acts 9:1-9). If Paul's conversion can be dated, the stoning of Stephen can also be placed within narrow limits.

  In Galatians 1, Paul gives some biographical details about his career as an apostle, referring especially to his visits to Jerusalem. He made only brief and infrequent visits to Jerusalem, and he gives us some chronological information about them. He says the first visit came 3 years after his conversion (see verse 18); the second occurred 14 years after the first (see Galatians 2:1). Then shortly after his second visit to Jerusalem, Paul left on his second missionary journey which took him to Corinth (see Acts 18). While at Corinth, Paul appeared before the proconsul Gallio (see verse 12). So Paul would have stood before Gallio 17 years following his conversion (14 years between his second and first visit to Jerusalem added to the 3 years between his first Jerusalem visit and his conversion). From an inscription found in Corinth, we know that Gallio's one-year pro-consulship in Corinth occurred in A.D. 51. If the 17 years for Paul's two visits to Jerusalem are subtracted from the date of Paul's appearance before Gallio, then his conversion and Stephen's stoning should be dated to A.D. 34. (51 - 17 = 34). This date, A.D. 34 is the one New Testament scholars commonly favor for Stephen's death and paul's conversion. We can't be so precise to determine the month or day, but it is a close estimate for the year itself.

  Thus this book takes the position that Daniel's seventy weeks came to an end in A.D. 34 with the stoning of Stephen and the conversion of Paul. We already discussed the theological significance of Stephen's death in the context of the last phrase of Daniel 9:24). There we said there were four areas of theological significance related to Stephen's martyrdom: (1) the gruop to whom Stephen gave his final speech--the Sanhedrin, the highest religious body in the land; (2) the form of his speech--a covenant lawsuit speech like those given by Old Testament prophets; (3) the prophetic nature of his experience at the time of his death when he looked up in vision into heaven itself; and (4) the fact that Paul's conversion has its roots in Stephen's death, so that Paul, the apostle to the Gentiles, takes the place of Stephen the powerful preacher to Israel. For these reasons, Stephen's death at the end of the seventy weeks can be seen as a highly significant point of transition from the era of Israel as the elect nation of God to the era of the church." (Dr. William H. Shea, Ph.D., Daniel, pp. 160-162)

Hence we see that the stoning of Stephen marks well the terminus of the 70 weeks.

Adventists have done FAR more laborious tears and sweat to come to these conclusions than most would imagine.

"In the multitude of counsellors there is safety." (Proverbs 11:14; 24:6)

[Lysimachus]

We believe the 70 weeks of Daniel 9:24-27 begin in 457 B.C. and end in 34 A.D. The “1 week” is from 27 A.D. at the baptism of Christ to 34 A.D. at the stoning of Stephen and the commencing of the proclamation of the gospel to the gentiles. Christ was crucified in 31 A.D., in the “midst” of the week.

We believe this is one of multiple reasons why the 70th week cannot be “detached” and thrown into the future.

As Adventist Historicists, we reject the Dispensational/Futurist “lunar-calendar reckoning” of 360 days to a year for the 70 weeks. We compute this timing using regular Solar years, or 365 days. After exhaustively weighing all the research and evidence, we do not believe Dispensationalists have any sound basis for using Lunar years. Our rejection of the Lunar reckoning for the 70 weeks is not only based on historical research of the Lunar year usage, but also on sound mathematical principles using astronomical calendar calculations. Both Anderson’s and Hoehner’s Lunar calculations are seriously flawed, and Solar reckoning is the only possible way to “make the numbers work out”.

The 70 weeks are in alignment with the sabbatical cycles, which in-turn is based on Solar years, not Lunar. To summarize, we believe that the historical and biblical evidence demands the first 69 weeks (483 years) to have commenced at the decree of Artaxerxes’ 7th year in 457 B.C. for Ezra to build and restore Jerusalem (Ezra 7; 9:9, as well as ancient accounts testify to this), not Artaxerxes’ 20th year in 444 or 445 B.C.

Counting 483 regular Solar years from this date brings us to 27 A.D. What happened in 27 A.D.? The Messiah, Jesus Christ, was Baptized and anointed by the Holy Spirit (See Luke 3:21,22; 4:18; Acts 10:37,38)..

We know that Christ's baptism was in 27 A.D. simply for the fact that Luke 3:1 informs us that His baptism was in the 15th year of the reign of Tiberius, and the 15th year of the reign of Tiberius was 27 A.D. That leaves 1 week left. Adding 7 years to 27 A.D. brings us to the year 34 A.D. Christ's ministry lasted for 3 1/2 years, and is reasoned by accounting the number of Passovers that transpired during Christ’s ministry in the gospel accounts. According to Daniel 9:27, "he" (meaning Christ, not Antichrist) would bring an end to the spiritual significance of the sacrificial system by His death on the cross. Christ was "cut off" and crucified in the "midst" of the week in the year 31 A.D. For 3 1/2 more years the disciples continued to preach to the Jews.

At the end of the 70 weeks (or 490 years), we finally arrive at the year 34 A.D. when the last prophet was sent to Israel, Stephen. In 34 A.D. is when Stephen was stoned by the Sanhedrin, the leaders of the Jewish nation. This was national Israel's final sin. This was the year that Saul was converted and became Paul. This was the year that Peter received the vision of the net to go preach to the gentiles. This year was also practically about the time Phillip baptized the Ethiopian eunuch. This was the year that the Gospel went out to the Gentiles. This was the year when probation closed for the Jews as a nation (not as individuals). This was the END of the 70th week!! So the 70 weeks prophecy meets an EXACT fulfillment between 457 B.C. and 34 A.D.

[phkrause]

[Ron Amnsn]

The problem is, according to Maccabees, Antiochus desecrated the temple for exactly 3 years to the day, or 1095 days.

You seem to be assuming 365-day years. 1095 = 365 + 365 + 365

A year in the Jewish or Biblical calendar never has 365 days. A Biblical year has 12 or 13 lunar months, depending on when the new year is declared. A lunar month has 29 or 30 days, depending on when the new moon is sighted. Thus a Biblical year can have 353, 354, or 355 days when there are 12 months in the year, and 382, 383, 384, or 385 when there are 13 months in the year.

For a three-year period to have 1150 days would require three 13-month years in a row. That would indeed be extraordinary. Does God ever do extraordinary things to fulfill prophecy?

[cheddar]

'Give me that old time religion'

'Give me that old time religion'

'It was good for our mother Ellen'

'It was good for our father James'

'and it's good enough for me'

[Gerr]

Thanks for that, Mark.

[Gerr]

'Give me that old time religion'

'Give me that old time religion'

'It was good for our mother Ellen'

'It was good for our father James'

'and it's good enough for me'

Ridicule is an old, cheap, technique used when one can't refute the evidence.

[doug yowell]

Originally Posted By: cheddar

'Give me that old time religion'

'Give me that old time religion'

'It was good for our mother Ellen'

'It was good for our father James'

'and it's good enough for me'

Ridicule is an old, cheap, technique used when one can't refute the evidence.

And a self-condemning exercise if those it ridicules here were in the right. (Jer.6:16)

[cheddar]

Ridicule is an old, cheap, technique used when one can't refute the evidence.

[Gustave]

No, it's NOT Biblical.

Was Christ in the tomb for 3 years?

Genesis 7,4

For yet seven days, and I will cause it to rain upon the earth forty days and forty nights; and every living substance that I have made will I destroy from off the face of the earth.

Did it take 7 years for the flood to come upon the area?

...Did it ran for 40 years?

You can do the same thing will all kinds of prophecies...

...SDA's, in keeping with Ellen White's Arianiam were required to apply this rubric to Daniel.

...To insure that Christ was kept in "creature status".

[Gerr]

Surely, you recognize that apocalyptic prophecies are different from regular or classical prophecies?

[Gibs]

Gustave,

The proof of the 70 wks allotted to the Jews being perfectly fulfilled is astounding. It was fulfilled perfectly. The covenant was confirmed to them that 70'th wk and Jesus died exactly the middle yr of that wk.

This also proves the 2300 yrs reckoning to be right as this 70 or 490 yrs is determined, cut off the 2300 leaving 1810 more yrs to go to 1844.

Yes and the Sanctuary was cleansed at that time of all the cases from ADam to the living and then Jesus continues there ministering the daily there and will soon be taken away.

The length of time of this vision troubled Dan very much, read chap 10.

1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

[Gustave]

Surely, you recognize that apocalyptic prophecies are different from regular or classical prophecies?

When a prophecy is made ( at least a real one ) it's simply knowing WHAT will happen at a later time.

[Gustave]

Gustave,

The proof of the 70 wks allotted to the Jews being perfectly fulfilled is astounding. It was fulfilled perfectly. The covenant was confirmed to them that 70'th wk and Jesus died exactly the middle yr of that wk.

This also proves the 2300 yrs reckoning to be right as this 70 or 490 yrs is determined, cut off the 2300 leaving 1810 more yrs to go to 1844.

Yes and the Sanctuary was cleansed at that time of all the cases from ADam to the living and then Jesus continues there ministering the daily there and will soon be taken away.

The length of time of this vision troubled Dan very much, read chap 10.

1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

If you are right it only proves that Jesus wasn't the Christ...

...A point I will soon demonstrate.

[Ron Amnsn]

In order to try and prove that Daniel was not a prophet, it was Porphyry, according to Jerome and Bishop Thomas Newman, who originated the view that Antiochus was the Little Horn of Daniel 8.

Are you asking us to believe that the Jews living under Greek rule during the persecution of Antiochus could read what it says about Greece in Daniel 8 without any of them taking the view that Antiochus Epiphenes was the little horn of Daniel 8?

[Ron Amnsn]

And since 2300 literal days = 6.4 years, and Antiochus only desecrated the temple for 3 years, we have no choice but to apply the 2300 evening-mornings to years,

No other choice? There seems to be a fallacy here.

[Ron Amnsn]

The phrase “weeks of years” is an understood concept, although the phrase “weeks of years” does not exist in Daniel 9:24. It is just “shabuam”, meaning “weeks”. In order to get around this, Futurists say this word means “sevens”, not “weeks” to get “off the hook” of having to employ the day-for-year principle to the 70 weeks (because if they did acknowledge that the day-for-year principle is applicable to the 70 weeks, in order to be consistent, they would have to employ it also with the 1260 days/42 months/time, times, half a time of Daniel 7 and Revelation 11, 12 and 13!). But scholars have refuted this, and have proven that “shabuam” can only mean “weeks”, not “sevens”. Now of course, there is no doubt that the word “week” itself does mean 7, but it is a word being employed to mean “7 days”.

The Jewish scholars who translated the Septuagint did not understand this the way you explain it. They translated "Shabuim" into Greek as hemdomades which they only used in Daniel 9:24,25 and in one other place, where the word obviously refers to groups of seven years (not weeks of days): Leviticus 25:8 "You are also to count off seven sabbaths of years for yourself, seven times seven years, so that you have the time of the seven sabbaths of years, namely, forty-nine years."

[Ron Amnsn]

We believe that in prophetic language, especially where symbolism is employed, the day-for-year principle must be sacredly recognized and guarded. This is ABSOLUTELY essential if we are gong to come to correct interpretations of eschatology and avoid theological shipwreck.

This type of talk raises red flags and sets off alarm bells for a student of Scripture. It reveals that the motive for study is not to learn what Scripture itself teaches, but rather to protect doctrines and traditions that are already held sacred.

[Gibs]

Originally Posted By: Gibs

Gustave,

The proof of the 70 wks allotted to the Jews being perfectly fulfilled is astounding. It was fulfilled perfectly. The covenant was confirmed to them that 70'th wk and Jesus died exactly the middle yr of that wk.

This also proves the 2300 yrs reckoning to be right as this 70 or 490 yrs is determined, cut off the 2300 leaving 1810 more yrs to go to 1844.

Yes and the Sanctuary was cleansed at that time of all the cases from ADam to the living and then Jesus continues there ministering the daily there and will soon be taken away.

The length of time of this vision troubled Dan very much, read chap 10.

1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

If you are right it only proves that Jesus wasn't the Christ...

...A point I will soon demonstrate.

It proves just the absolute oposite Gustave. It proves He is the one to come and when and He did spot on time. During His ministry to them He made their apostasy clear to them. They had fulfilled their time and their house was left unto them desolate.

To prove it the great thick temple veil was torn in half from top to bottom as God departed it. A far beyond human feat!

Mt 27:51 And, behold, the veil of the temple was rent in twain from the top to the bottom; and the earth did quake, and the rocks rent;

1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

[JoeMo]

I must concede this discussion to the theologians on this thread. You guys are getting way over my head. All I know is what makes sense to me. I hope all Christians are not expected to dive this deeply into these topics. I find them interesting to discuss; but I doubt if they are salvational issues. Regardless of the "truth" about the prophetic days in the books of Daniel and Revelation, I believe Jesus is coming soon.

Anyways, I'm gone from this discussion. It was fun. Thanks, Gerry, for introducing it. Adios.

[Lysimachus]

Originally Posted By: Lysimachus

In order to try and prove that Daniel was not a prophet, it was Porphyry, according to Jerome and Bishop Thomas Newman, who originated the view that Antiochus was the Little Horn of Daniel 8.

Are you asking us to believe that the Jews living under Greek rule during the persecution of Antiochus could read what it says about Greece in Daniel 8 without any of them taking the view that Antiochus Epiphenes was the little horn of Daniel 8?

Do you mean Maccabees? An uninspired book? Are you basing your doctrine off of an uninspired book Ron?

The Jews had every right to perhaps believe that there was an application of Daniel 8 to them. And for them, it may have. Nonetheless, the primary target of Daniel 8 was not the Jews, but the people of God, and the vertical attack against Heaven's Sanctuary.

But as we have already demonstrated, no matter which calendar you use, whether it be the Lunar, Jewish, or Solar calendar, you will never be able to get 2300 evening-mornings to fit one single historical event revolving Antiochus.

According to 1 Maccabees 1:54-59 and 4:52-54, the length of time Antiochus desecrates the Jewish temple is demonstrated. Chapter 1:54 says:

"On the fifteenth day of the month Chislev, in the year one hundred and forty five,

the king erected the horrible abomination upon the alter of holocausts, and in the

surrounding cities of Judah they built pagan altars.”

desecrations ended:

“Early in the morning on the twenty-fifth day of the ninth month, that

is, the month of Chislev, in the year one hundred and forty-eight.”

Now, let's divide 2300 evening-mornings into 1150 (even though doing this is sheer foolishness in light of the fact that "evening-mornings" is expressed beginning with the evening, and not morning sacrifices).

Solar Reckoning:

3 years and 10 days = 365.2422 x 3 = 1095 days + 10 days = 1105 days.

= 45 DAYS SHORT of 1150!

Lunar Reckoning:

3 years and 10 days = 354.367056 x 3 = 1063 days + 10 days = 1073 days.

= 77 DAYS SHORT of 1150!

I may be a bit off in the way I'm calculating this math here in the sense of how I'm comparing the Jewish months to these numbers, but this only demonstrates how no matter how you cut it, the math will be far off from 2300 days or 1150 days. So avoid the nit-picking, and grab the overall picture here.

Seeing the critics have failed miserably with the above, the venture to find new ways of applying this time period:

Reckoning from the fifteenth day of the month Cisleu, in the year 145 of the Selucidae, in which Antiochus set up the abomination of desolation upon the altar (1 Maccabees 1:59), to the victory obtained over Nicanor by Judas, on the 13th day of the month Adar, Anno 151, they claim are 2300 days. You see, the Jews kept an annual feast on the 13th of Adar, in commemoration of the victory! THERE WE GO!! 2300 DAYS!!

...Ohhh....DRAT!!! "WAIT!"

"NOW WHAT??..." *echoes another*

I just realized realized that Kislev 15, 148 to Adar 13, 151 = 6 Jewish years + 3 Jewish months - 2 days = 74 or 75 months + 3 months - 2 days = 77 or 78 Jewish months - 2 days

78 x 29.530588 days = 2303.4. less 2 days = 2301.4 days.

CLOSE! But still don't work, as God's time tables are PRECISE! Besides, why would Nicanor's defeat be equated to the cleansing of the sanctuary, especially when it was more than 3 years after the restoration of the temple services? Thanks to Mr. Pickle for pointing this out to us...*embarrassed look on the faces of those desperate poor souls trying to scrounge around and grab on anything possible that will deliver them from that...oh...dreadful onlooking eye of God, or any possibility that we're in a time of judgment! Ohh ma! oh ma!!*

Wait a minute, but I got a BETTER IDEA!!*yells another*, REALLY??

YEAH!

What's that??

Let's continue so we have ENOUGH room to REALLY PROVE OUR POINT!! *giggles*(as the listeners have a disenchanted small ray of hope that they might be salvaged from that pesky Adventism that makes us think we have to keep the law)...

(Cont.)

[Lysimachus]

Alright, let's CONTINIA!

So you say you have a better solution! You BET I DOOO!

And here it is fellas....

To save our sorry cases, we can start the period began with the defection of the people from the pure religion by the Jewish high priest Menelaus, on the 6th day of the 6th month of Anno 141. According to Josephus, Menelaus went "to Antiochus, and informed him, that they were desirous to leave the laws of their country, and the Jewish way of living according to them, and to follow the king's laws, and the Grecian way of living." (Antiquities, bk. 7, ch. 5.1) The period ended on the twenty-fifth day of Cisleu in the year 148, when the Jews offered the daily sacrifice on the new altar of burnt offerings (1 Maccabees 4:52). This is a total of 2300 days.

REALLY??

I... I... I think SO!!

Ohhhh...DRAT!!!*NOOO!! NOW WHAT??*

I just realized, where did 6th month 6th day come from? Where is the historical support for that date? Sounds like I'm gettin this from John Gill *BURP*. Gill is citing others' views, and does not say where those others came up with that date from.

6th month 6th day, 141 to Kislev 25, 148. Assuming a fall to fall calendar: 6 Jewish years + 3 Jewish months + 19 days = 74 or 75 months + 3 months + 19 days = 77 or 78 Jewish months + 19 days

That doesn't equal 2300 days.

Besides, there is no possibility that Menelaus could be likened to a horn from one of the four winds. >.< *BURPS again in*

*OH NO! Now WHAT are we gonna do??*

Hmm...

[Lysimachus]

Conclusion:

I guess the Adventist reckoning of the 2300 days is the ONLY last resort that FITS THE BILL!