Luther on the Antichrist

[Robert]

"The Pope is the Antichrist, because he is against Christ, because he takes liberties with the things of God, because he lords it over the temple of God." [Commentary on the Epistle to the Galatians (1535)by Martin Luther, Chapter 3, pp. 106-135]

"The moment I open my mouth the Pope begins to fume and to rage. It seems we must choose between Christ and the Pope. Let the Pope perish." [Chapter 4, pp. 172-193]

"You would never know the devil could be so gentle, the world so sweet, the Pope so gracious, and the princes so charming. But because we seek the advantage and honor of Christ, they persecute us all around." [Chapter 5, pp. 194-216]

When we call the Pope the Antichrist and his minions an evil brood, we do not slander them. We merely judge them by the touchstone of God's Word recorded in the first chapter of this Epistle: "Though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed." [Chapter 6, pp. 237-251]

[phkrause]

Interesting statements Robert, thanks for sharing these. The first statement really rings a bell. I can remember a pastor that used to say that not just the pope, but all those that oppose Christ are "antiChrists" period. I think that reading the NT we can see that theme being presented.

[Robert]

When we call the Pope the Antichrist and his minions an evil brood, we do not slander them. We merely judge them by the touchstone of God's Word recorded in the first chapter of this Epistle: "Though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed." [Chapter 6, pp. 237-251]

That's the key. The Roman Catholic Church teaches another gospel beside the gospel of the Bible.

The gospel is the birth, life, death & resurrection of Christ as the Son of man and the Son of God. To put it another way the gospel is the truth as it is "in Christ" and nothing more. The gospel is how Christ legally delivered & redeemed the human race from the curse of the law.

If you add anything to Christ's finished work you are teaching/preaching another gospel. Why? Because the gospel is not what Christ, through the Spirit, does in you as a witness. The gospel is what Christ did with no human contribution.

Hence, any person that adds to Christ's perfect work (of which the NT Sabbath symbolizes) is of the spirit of the Antichrist.

1 John 2:18 ...even now are there many antichrists....

[Robert]

And every spirit (person) that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come ; and even now already is it in the world. [1 John 4:3 NKJV]

What does it mean "in the flesh"?

This is how the Catholic Church defines Christ's birth:

By the authority of our Lord Jesus Christ of the blessed apostles Peter and Paul, and by our own authority, we declare, pronounce, and define that the doctrine which holds that the most blessed Virgin Mary, in the first instant of her conception, by a special grace and privilege of Almighty God, in view of the merits of Jesus Christ, the Saviour of mankind, was preserved free from all stain of original sin (our humanity indwelt with sin), has been revealed by God, and therefore is to be firmly and steadfastly believed by all the faithful.

Wherefore, if any shall presume, which may God avert, to think in their heart otherwise then has been defined by us, let them know, and moreover understand, that they are condemned by their own judgment, that they have made shipwreck as regards the faith, and have fallen away from the unity of the Church.—Catholic Belief, page 214.

[Robert]

Jesus Christ, the Saviour of mankind, was preserved free from all stain of original sin (our humanity indwelt with sin)

Is this what the gospel writers taught? No!

What's the problem with this heresy - this false gospel? Does it teach that we must add to what Christ did 2000 years ago? Yes, and more.

Go to Gal 4:4 But when the time had fully come (i.e., the incarnation), God sent his Son, born of a woman, born under law, 5 to redeem those under law, that we might receive the full rights of sons.

Notice that when Christ was made "the son of man" He was "born of a woman" and consequently He was born under the curse of the law.

It's not that Christ as the son of man sinned, but because He assumed our humanity indwelt with iniquity (our bent-to-self) that He came under the curse. Why? The law not only demands a flawless performance in obedience to the law, but a flawless and perfect humanity without our indwelling bent.

So if Christ, as the Roman Church teaches, did not come in our humanity, then what we need to do is emulate Him and in so doing our works can merit us heaven. This, of course, is a perversion of the gospel.

Then how did Christ save us from the curse of the law? The simple answer? By being born of a woman. What does that mean?

[Robert]

Then how did Christ save us from the curse of the law? The simple answer? By being born of a woman. What does that mean?

Again, from what did Christ come to save us?

The standard answer is eternally burning hell. According to Revelation the lake of fire culminates in the 2nd death, but what is the 2nd death? Answer: The curse of the law!

Gal 3:10 "Cursed is everyone who does not continue to do everything written in the Book of the Law....13 Christ redeemed us from the curse of the law by becoming a curse for us...."

Is the law bad - is it sinful? No, the law is good, the law is holy, but for sinners the law condemns - it demands life - the 2nd death.

Why? Look around of what the love of self (sin) has produced over the last 6000 thousand years! Wars, murder, deceit, rape, slavery, just to name a few. And according to the law "there is none righteous, no, not even one" because if you break one commandment, you've broken the whole law. Why? Anything outside agape love is sin and agape is the fulfillment of the law.

So Christ came to save us from the curse of the law. How did He do it? The answer is the gospel!

[Gibs]

I agree it is a gravely flawed antichrist system and of course it is not near the end of all antichrists of men. We know too of course that Satan is the father of them all.

Many are of their father the devil and each is an antichrist after him and many don't realize it but surely some do I would think. But deception runs so deep they may not.

1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

[Robert]

So Christ came to save us from the curse of the law. How did He do it? The answer is the gospel!

Now I'm going to turn it over to all the folks on CA. Here's a question (and it's very, very important):

How can God justify the ungodly [Romans 4:5] and still maintain His integrity to His holy law which condemns sinners [Galatians 3:10]? According to the Bible itself no law will allow an innocent person to die for the crime of a guilty one!

I'll tell you what the Roman Church teaches (and some SDA): That God actually makes you Holy and therefore you are accepted before God's law. That, is not the gospel, that's legalism...that's heresy by "the man of sin". So please, keep your answer specifically to the question in red. No off topic grace vs works.

[Gibs]

Take it however you like it Robert and run with it. I pass. Someday all will see.

1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

[Robert]

I pass. Someday all will see.

How are SDA suppose to preach the gospel to the world (the three angel's message) if they don't know the gospel?

Again, "How can God justify the ungodly [Romans 4:5] and still maintain His integrity to His holy law which condemns sinners [Galatians 3:10]?"

SDA should know this above all! Could many Adventist be Roman Catholic at heart? Please guys, this was the issue in the 1888 GC. Surely we understand the gospel? But then again I hear there are a least five versions of the gospel within the 7th day Adventist Church. See the book "Who's Got the Truth?" See the book

[Robert]

"How can God justify the ungodly [Romans 4:5] and still maintain His integrity to His holy law which condemns sinners [Galatians 3:10]?"

How important is the gospel?

"The sacrifice of Christ as an atonement for sin is the great truth around which all other truths cluster. In order to be rightly understood and appreciated, every truth in the Word of God, from Genesis to Revelation, must be studied in the light that streams from the cross of Calvary. I present before you the great, grand monument of mercy and regeneration, salvation and redemption--the Son of God uplifted on the cross" (Gospel Workers, p. 315.)

[BobRyan]

How important - the "everlasting Gospel" to be preached to the Whole World in the first Angel's message? (Rev14:6-7) -- it appears to be "very important.

notice that the "everlasting Gospel" of Rev 14:6-7 includes the same future judgment as do Paul's gospel in Romans 2:13-16.

in Christ,

Bob

[BobRyan]

Surely we understand the gospel? But then again I hear there are a least five versions of the gospel within the 7th day Adventist Church. See the book "Who's Got the Truth?" See the book

Certainly we have some evidence of the progressive-SDA Gospel, the Liberal SDA gospel, the marry-the-bible-to-evolutionism Gospel...and then there is the Gospel that we find in the Bible and that is accepted by the Seventh-day Adventist Church in session as a world body of Believers.

It is the same "everlasting Gospel" that we find in Rev 14:6-7.

It includes the same future judgment that Paul says he has included in his Gospel - Romans 2:13-16.

in Christ,

Bob

[BobRyan]

Now for the real reason I came to this thread -

I was looking for a place where Ellen White refers to the Pope as "antichrist" and all I am finding is places where she quotes Martin Luther saying that HE thought the Pope was antichrist.

I know she speaks of the "man of sin" of 2Thess 2 as being the "Papacy" and this is also true of the little horn of Dan 7 and 8.

But what about the term "Antichrist"?

in Christ,

Bob

[Gibs]

Satan is THE antichrist, all others are AN antichrist after their father the devil. The pope and all others that are, are an antichrist. There is only one THE antichrist. That is is father of them all.

1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

[John317]

Yes, you are right about that, Satan is THE original and primary antichrist, but the point needs to be kept in mind, too, that the "little-horn power" of Daniel 7, "the man of sin [lawlessness]" of 2 Thess. 2: 3 and the "sea-beast" of Rev. 13, are fulfilled in the papal system.

As far as Ellen White's view of "Antichrist" is concerned, she used the word and concept in its biblical sense, such as in the following sentences:

Quote:

Christ is our example. The determination of Antichrist to carry out the rebellion he began in heaven will continue to work on the children of disobedience.

Quote:

Those who become confused in their understanding of the Word, who fail to see the meaning of antichrist, will surely place themselves on the side of antichrist. There is no time now for us to assimilate with the world. Daniel is standing in his lot and in his place. The prophecies of Daniel and of John are to be understood. They interpret each other. They give to the world truths which every one should understand. These prophecies are to be witnesses in the world. By their fulfillment in these last days they will explain themselves. {7BC 949.6}

[Gibs]

John317,

There is something to realize with the verse, -

2Th 2:8 And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:

That is "Wicked" in caps is "anomos", the greek and means alpha lawless one since it is in the negative. If it weren't negative it would mean first lawful.

Then the next verse tells us, that Christ whose coming is after that "Wicked" and calls him Satan there. So it then is seen we don't need to even go to the Greek to learn who the "Wicked" is if we read more careful.

Th 2:9 Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders,

I don't want to take a thing from the Papacy, but again the Papacy is only the 6'th head of the great beast system. There is 6 other heads and 10 horns and now for us in Rev 13: the heads now have the crowns, King Power. In chapter 12 in the old world order before 1798 the crowns were on the heads, the religious systems of the world.

Satan began a new order of working to rule the world after the deadly wound was inflicted to that sixth head. 5 of those systems had already many yrs ago proven to be false religions when the Christian Religion proved it had a saviour and eternal life salvation.

There was but six heads at the time John wrote and He tells the seventh was yet to come and remain but a short space. That was protestantism, rose out of the reformation with many denominations each with a little reform. Then the greatest reform movement was SDAdventism and it went the furthest but after a time ceased to continue in reform.

Now low and behold, true protestantism is dead. It lasted in the area of 500 yrs. Yes Adventism is clasping hands with what once she came out of. It got heavy with "emerging church". It all comes gradually and incrementally and like a frog in cool water and the tub gradually heated he don't jump out but remains to be cooked. Adventism is being cooked, where is the one big enough to reach down and shut off the fire among men?

Is God going to do it? Doubtful as He instructed John to write, it would but continue a short space. Then John tells us an eighth that was and is not. That one is Satan and He will soon come now and personate Jesus Christ and will the great majority be deceived? I am sure so. Not so many SDA's as we've been schooled to know of this deception.

Yes it is Satan come forth to be with his 10 kings and they will be made actually kings by Satan for one hour says the Word. The read is Rev 17:7-18.

Yes THE antichrist's coming is not far distant!

1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

[Gibs]

Here is a bit on "THE" antichrist, by Sister White. After you read this and note she quotes Re 13:13-17, take your Bible in hand and see if you can separate any of the text from this from Re 13:11 trough 18. I'm telling you now you cannot.

What's the point? The point is she is pointing out Satan is the beast of Re 13:11 on to the end. Read it and learn!

"In Revelation we read concerning Satan: "And he doeth great wonders, so that he maketh fire come down from heaven on the earth in the sight of men, and deceiveth them that dwell on the earth by the means of those miracles which he had power to do in the sight of the beast; saying to them that dwell on the earth, that they should make an image to the beast, which had the wound by a sword, and did live. And he had power to give life unto the image of the beast, that the image of the beast should both speak, and cause that as many as would not worship the image of the beast should be killed. And he causeth all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond, to receive a mark in their right hand, or in their foreheads: and that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name" (Revelation 13:13-17). . . . {3SM 393.1}

It is wake up time!

1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

[John317]

Gibs, I certainly do agree with you that it is time to wake up.

But are you saying that the earth-beast of Rev. 13 which has lamb-like horns is Satan himself?

What Ellen White's quote is pointing out is that these earthly powers are instruments, or agents, of Satan. He is the REAL POWER behind both the sea-beast and the earth-beast, in the same way that THE antichrist is primarily Satan and secondarily pagan and papal Rome.

3 SM 393.1 does not contradict what she wrote in GC 579.

There she clearly says that the sea-beast which receives the mortal wound is the papacy. She also says that the "man of sin" is a symbol of the papacy.

Please see the following:

Quote:

The line of prophecy in which these symbols are found begins with Revelation 12, with the dragon that sought to destroy Christ at His birth. The dragon is said to be Satan (Revelation 12:9); he it was that moved upon Herod to put the Saviour to death. But the chief agent of Satan in making war upon Christ and His people during the first centuries of the Christian Era was the Roman Empire, in which paganism was the prevailing religion. Thus while the dragon, primarily, represents Satan, it is, in a secondary sense, a symbol of pagan Rome.

439

{GC 438.2}

In chapter 13 (verses 1-10) is described another beast, "like unto a leopard," to which the dragon gave "his power, and his seat, and great authority." This symbol, as most Protestants have believed, represents the papacy, which succeeded to the power and seat and authority once held by the ancient Roman empire. Of the leopardlike beast it is declared: "There was given unto him a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies. . . . And he opened his mouth in blasphemy against God, to blaspheme His name, and His tabernacle, and them that dwell in heaven. And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations." This prophecy, which is nearly identical with the description of the little horn of Daniel 7, unquestionably points to the papacy. {GC 439.1}

Also:

Quote:

The prophecy of Revelation 13 declares that the power represented by the beast with lamblike horns shall cause "the earth and them which dwell therein" to worship the papacy—there symbolized by the beast "like unto a leopard." The beast with two horns is also to say "to them that dwell on the earth, that they should make an image to the beast;" and, furthermore, it is to command all, "both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond," to receive the mark of the beast. Revelation 13:11-16. It has been shown that the United States is the power represented by the beast with lamblike horns, and that this prophecy will be fulfilled when the United States shall enforce Sunday observance, which Rome claims as the special acknowledgment of her supremacy. But in this homage to the papacy the United States will not be alone. The influence of Rome in the countries that once acknowledged her dominion is still far from being destroyed. And prophecy foretells a restoration of her power. "I saw one of his heads as it were wounded to death; and his deadly wound was healed: and all the world wondered after the beast." Verse 3. The infliction of the deadly wound points to the downfall of the papacy in 1798. After this, says the prophet, "his deadly wound was healed: and all the world wondered after the beast." Paul states plainly that the "man of sin" will continue until the second advent. 2 Thessalonians 2:3-8. To the very close of time he will carry forward the work of deception. And the revelator declares, also referring to the papacy: "All that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life." Revelation 13:8. In both the Old and the New World, the papacy will receive homage in the honor paid to the Sunday institution, that rests solely upon the authority of the Roman Church. {GC 578, 579} {DD 27.1}

[Gibs]

I have to disagree John but you may take it as you see it and that is fine as it is not a salvation issue.

I understand she had problesms with U Smith on his put of prophecy and I used to be able to get it on the disc but they have taken it off the newer ones. She stated to U S in one of her letters to him that he got his ideas from Gibbon the Skeptic.

Also when you read the account in GC she always stated "IT" has been shown the beast of Re 13:11 on is the USA. Well she knew better than that and a carefull read of the chapter tells one so too.

Being GC president and Editor of the review he had his way and she was second fiddle.

Notice,

Re 13:2 And the beast which I saw was like unto a leopard, and his feet were as the feet of a bear, and his mouth as the mouth of a lion: and the dragon gave him his power, and his seat, and great authority.

It is the dragon, Satan who gives this first beast HIS POWER, HIS SEAT and GREAT AUTHORITY. This is Satan's "image" beast, it too has 7 heads and 10 horns like himself.

To identify the dragon,

Re 12:3 And there appeared another wonder in heaven; and behold a great red dragon, having seven heads and ten horns, and seven crowns upon his heads.

Then see the dragon who has given his seat, power and authority,

Re 13:15 And he had power to give life unto the image of the beast, that the image of the beast should both speak, and cause that as many as would not worship the image of the beast should be killed.

Re 13:12 And he exerciseth all the power of the first beast before him, and causeth the earth and them which dwell therein to worship the first beast, whose deadly wound was healed.

We have been taught and indoctrinated that the Papacy is the first beast of the chapter. The Papacy does not have seven heads and ten horns. The Papacy isn't a beast, but is one of the religious systems of the world. How about Zionism and Islam and you name them, are they beasts too. All would destroy true Christianity.

No, the "image" beast is Satan's New World Order system rising up out of the sea of peoples since 1798. This evil system has seven heads of which the Papacy is one plus it has 10 horns that we see Satan will make Kings one hour with himself and then it is over. Notice the horns have crowns, only kings have crowns.

Another notable presentation is made also one must catch. It is the fact in Re 13: the crowns, king power is on the horns and no longer on the heads as before in Satan's Old World Order system before 1798, go back up and read Re 12:3.

It wasn't time yet for our pioneers to see these things, they had to make a finish of the prophecies because of thinking it all would end at 1844. It didn't and no rescind on prophecy never was done.

As the scroll is unrolled and it is time to be understood then and only then will the Spirit lead to the proper interpretation.

I know many who see this this way and you may or may not but I invite you to wrestle with it.

And may all be blessed who do.

1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

[Robert]

So please, keep your answer specifically to the question in red. No off topic grace vs works.

Well, you gentlemen didn't get into grace vs works ditch, but you are still a bit off topic!

You see the Anti-Christ system attacked the gospel. They taught that Mary was preserved from what we inherited by birth - a humanity indwelt with iniquity - and therefore Christ (as the Son of Man) was born like Adam before the fall.

The problem with this is that the law condemns not the sinless Adam, but the sinful Adam after the fall. If Christ assumed our humanity before the fall then He can be only our example, not our redeemer. Hence we must obey the law in order to be saved. That's what Roman teaches.

So I ask the question, "How can God justify the ungodly [Romans 4:5] and still maintain His integrity to His holy law which condemns sinners [Galatians 3:10]?" According to the Bible itself no law will allow an innocent person to die for the crime of a guilty one!

[Gibs]

Originally Posted By: Robert

"So please, keep your answer specifically to the question in red. No off topic grace vs works."

Please then Robert you do the same, your last post we can't answer unless we do.

1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

[John317]

...I understand she had problesms with U Smith on his put of prophecy ....

Uriah Smith didn't write the book, Great Controversy. Ellen White wrote it and she enthusiastically supported the publication and the distribution of all editions, including the 1911 edition. He wasn't even alive at that time (1911).

(U Smith was a great man and an important leader in the early SDA Church, but he wasn't a prophet and he never claimed to be. He was wrong on many things but he was also right on many things.)

Originally Posted By: Gibs

Also when you read the account in GC she always stated "IT" has been shown the beast of Re 13:11 on is the USA. Well she knew better than that and a carefull read of the chapter tells one so too.

If what you say is true here, it would mean that Ellen White wrote things and had them widely distributed when she knew they were false.

The following statement by Ellen White clearly shows that she believed the prophecy of the second beast of Rev. 13 refers to the United States of America:

Quote:

But the beast with lamblike horns was seen "coming up out of the earth." Instead of overthrowing other powers to establish itself, the nation thus represented must arise in territory previously unoccupied and grow up gradually and peacefully. It could not, then, arise among the crowded and struggling nationalities of the Old World--that turbulent sea of "peoples, and multitudes, and nations, and tongues." It must be sought in the Western Continent.

What nation of the New World was in 1798 rising into power, giving promise of strength and greatness, and attracting the attention of the world? The application of the symbol admits of no question. One nation, and only one, meets the specifications of this prophecy; it points unmistakably to the United States of America. {GC 440.1, 2}

[John317]

...You see the Anti-Christ system attacked the gospel. They taught that Mary was preserved from what we inherited by birth - a humanity indwelt with iniquity - and therefore Christ (as the Son of Man) was born like Adam before the fall.

The problem with this is that the law condemns not the sinless Adam, but the sinful Adam after the fall. If Christ assumed our humanity before the fall then He can be only our example, not our redeemer. Hence we must obey the law in order to be saved. That's what Roman teaches.

I agree with everything here except your statement that "if Christ assumed our humanity before the Fall, then He can only be our example..." If Christ assumed our pre-Fall nature, then He can't be our example, because people with a post-Fall nature have no chance of doing what He did.

Rome teaches that Jesus is not our example (certainly not in the way that SDAs believe) but that He is our Redeemer and Savior. Roman Catholics would be mystified by your assertion that they don't believe Christ is our Redeemer.

[John317]

.... we must obey the law in order to be saved. That's what Roman teaches.

So I ask the question, "How can God justify the ungodly [Romans 4:5] and still maintain His integrity to His holy law which condemns sinners [Galatians 3:10]?" According to the Bible itself no law will allow an innocent person to die for the crime of a guilty one!

Galatians 3:10

For all who rely on works of the law are under a curse; for it is written, "Cursed be everyone who does not abide by all things written in the Book of the Law, and do them."

Jesus Christ became sin for us. God laid all the sins of the whole world upon Christ so that He really was guilty of all those crimes. It was not make-believe.