Could Paul had Homosexual Orientation?

[Dr. Shane]

While in college I ran a gay-outreach ministry. This was before Hollywood began to promote the gay-rights movement - before Ellen Degeneres came out of the closet on screen. I felt called to this ministry by an episode of the 700 Club interviewing members of Exodus International.

I have considered, at times, that the Apostle Paul may have had a same-sex orientation. I am not suggesting that he ever acted on any desires. He condemns homosexuality in both Romans 1:26, 27 and 1 Corinthians 6:9. However there is something powerful in verse 11 of 1 Corinthians 6. "And such were some of you..." Paul stated that the Corinthian church had former gays in it. This is a verse that Homosexuals Anonymous often touts. I am posting a link to the article I came across when I googled this idea.

If Paul had a gay orientation, far from justifying the gay lifestyle, it is evidence that a person with a gay orientation can live a satisfying life of celibacy acceptable to God. That is an option suggested in an APA report published August 6, 2009 in USA Today.

*************************************************************

Nothing about Paul was moderate. He was tightly drawn, passionately emotional, filled with enormous feelings of self-negativity, seeking to deal with those feelings in the timehonored way of external controls, unflagging religious zeal, and rigid discipline. He could not, however, master the passions that consumed him.

What were these passions? There is no doubt in my mind that they were sexual in nature, but what kind of sexual passions were they? Searching once again through the writings of Paul, some conclusions begin to emerge that startle and surprise the reader. Paul's passions seemed to be incapable of being relieved. Why was that? Paul himself had written that if one "could not exercise self-control" that person should marry. "For it is better to marry than to be aflame with passion" (1 Cor. 7:9). But we have no evidence from any source that Paul ever married. Indeed, he exhorts widows and the unmarried to "remain single as I do" (1 Cor. 7:8). A primary purpose of sexual activity in marriage, according to Paul, was to keep Satan from tempting people "through lack of self-control" (1 Cor. 7:5). Why, when Paul seemed to be so consumed with a passion he could not control, would he not take his own advice and alleviate that passion in marriage? He did write that marriage was an acceptable, if not ideal, way of life. Still, however, marriage never seemed to loom for him as a possibility.

Paul has been perceived as basically negative toward women. He did write that "it is well for a man not to touch a woman" (1 Cor. 7:1). The passion that burned so deeply in Paul did not seem to be related to the desire for union with a woman. Why would that desire create such negativity in Paul, anyway? Marriage, married love, and married sexual desire were not thought to be evil or loathsome. Paul's sexual passions do not fit comfortably into this explanatory pattern. But what does?

Obviously there is no way to know for certain the cause of Paul's anxiety prior to that moment of final revelation in the Kingdom of Heaven. But that does not stop speculation. The value of speculation in this case comes when a theory is tested by assuming for a moment that it is correct and then reading Paul in the light of that theory. Sometimes one finds in this way the key that unlocks the hidden messages that are present in the text. Once unlocked, these messages not only cease to be hidden but they become obvious, glaring at the reader, who wonders why such obvious meanings had not been seen before.

Some have suggested that that Paul was plagued by homosexual fears. This is not a new idea, and yet until recent years, when homosexuality began to shed some of its negative connotations, it was an idea so repulsive to Christian people that it could not be breathed in official circles. This is not to say that our cultural homophobia has disappeared. It is still lethal and dwells in high places in the life of the Christian church, and it is a subject about which ecclesiastical figures are deeply dishonest, saying one thing publicly and acting another way privately. The prejudice, however, is fading slowly but surely. With the softening of that homophobic stance we might consider the hypothesis that Paul may have been a gay male. We might test that theory by assuming it for a moment as we read Paul. When I did this for the first time, I was startled to see how much of Paul was unlocked and how deeply I could understand the power of the gospel that literally saved Paul's life.

When I suggest the possibility that Paul was a homosexual person, I do not mean to be salacious or titillating or even to suggest something that many would consider scandalous. I see no evidence to suggest that Paul ever acted out his sexual desires and passions. He lived in an age and among a people that cloaked the way he would have viewed this reality with layer after layer of condemnation. But for a moment assume the possibility that this theory is correct and look with me again at the writings of Paul and, more important, at the meaning of Christ, resurrection, and grace in the life of this foundational Christian.

Paul felt tremendous guilt and shame, which produced in him self-loathing. The presence of homosexuality would have created this response among Jewish people in that period of history. Nothing else, in my opinion, could account for Paul's self-judging rhetoric, his negative feeling toward his own body, and his sense of being controlled by something he had no power to change. The war that went on between what he desired with his mind and what he desired with his body, his drivenness to a legalistic religion of control, his fear when that system was threatened, his attitude toward women, his refusal to seek marriage .as an outlet for his passion-nothing else accounts for this data as well as the possibility that Paul was a gay male.

Paul's religious tradition would clearly regard gay males as aberrant, distorted, evil, and depraved. When discovered, gay males were quite often executed. The Law stated: "You shall not lie with a man as with a woman; it is an abomination" (Lev. 18:22). Do not defile yourself by these things, the Torah continued, for God will cast out those who defile themselves. God will punish, promised the Law, and the land will vomit out those who are thus defiled (Lev. 18:24ff). To do these things is to be cut off from the people of Israel (Lev. 18:29). Later in the Torah death is called for as the penalty for homosexuality. "If a man lies with a man as with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination; they shall be put to death" (Lev. 20:13).

Paul was a student of the Law. If homosexuality was his condition, he knew well that by that Law he stood condemned. His body was a body in which death reigned. He lived under that death sentence. What Paul knew himself to be, the people to whom he belonged and the Law to which he adhered called abominable, and Paul felt it to be beyond redemption. Is it not possible, even probable, that this was the inner source of his deep self-negativity, his inner turmoil, his self-rejection, his superhuman zeal for a perfection he could never achieve? Could this also be his thorn in the flesh, about which he wrote so plaintively? With this possibility in mind, listen once more to Paul's words: "And to help me keep from being too elated by the abundance of revelation, a thorn was given me in the flesh, a messenger of Satan, to harass me, to keep me from being too elated. Three times I sought the Lord about this, that it should leave me; but he said to me 'My grace is sufficient for you, for my power is made perfect in weakness' " (2 Cor. 12:7-9).

On another and perhaps earlier occasion, Paul had written, "You know it was because of a bodily ailment that I preached the gospel to you at first; and though my condition was a trial to you, you did not scorn or despise me but received me as an angel of God, as Christ Jesus" (Gal. 4:13). The word angel can also be translated messenger. Paul is the possessor of a condition that he believes to be incurable. It is a condition for which people might scorn or despise him. I have heard and read of commentators who suggested that this physical condition was some kind of chronic eye problem. This is based, I suspect, on Paul's words to the Galatians that they would have "plucked out their eyes and given them" to Paul (Gal. 4:15). But chronic eye problems do not normally bring scorn or the activity of despairing, and through the eye, which Paul called "the window of the body," life and beauty as well as death and pain enter the human experience. Paul, in these words to the Galatians, told them that he had now "become as they are," one in whom "Christ has been formed," and assured them that they "did him no wrong" (Gal. 4:12, 19). That refers to an inner healing not an external healing.

Others have suggested that epilepsy was the condition from which he was not free. Epilepsy was thought of as demon possession, but it was a periodic sense of being possessed by an alien spirit, not a constant malady. Also, in the biblical narrative the epileptic elicited a sense of pity, or at times fear, but seldom did it elicit despising or loathing. Epilepsy does not appear to me to account for the intensity of the feelings that Paul expressed. The realization that he was a homosexual male does. It is a hypothesis that makes sense of the data and accounts for the tone, the fear, the passion, and the behavior.

If this hypothesis is correct, it also illumines in powerful ways Paul's experience of conversion, his understanding of Jesus, his view of resurrection, and his move toward universalism. Furthermore, it provides us with a means to step into Christ as Paul did and to see the Christ experience outside the context of limited words and in the context of a universal human experience. It thus becomes for us a point of entry into a universal spirituality inaugurated by Christ that may endure into the unlimited future in a way that the narrow and brittle religious forms from our Christian past no longer seem capable of doing.

source: Beliefnet

[olger]

Of course Paul wasn't homosexual.

Thanks for exposing the extremes that the homosexual agenda will go to - to try and validate their deviant behaviors.

Rejoice always!

G

[Naomi]

[olger]

Yes, it was completely foreign to reality.

`G

[phkrause]

However there is something powerful in verse 11 of 1 Corinthians 6. "And such were some of you..." Paul stated that the Corinthian church had former gays in it. This is a verse that Homosexuals Anonymous often touts. I am posting a link to the article I came across when I googled this idea.

I read that verse in context with the rest of the chapter and it definitely doesn't come close to suggesting that Paul had any gay orientation. It could be others did. So not sure how you can get this from that passage. I don't see it.

[Dr. Shane]

Friend, 1 Corinthians 6:11 doesn't suggest Paul had a homosexual orientation. It suggests that some of the members of the Corinthian church had been homosexuals. That is important for those struggling with that lifestyle to understand. It is hope. It testifies that Christ has been delivering homosexuals from their lifestyle since the first century church.

Neither the author nor I have suggested that Paul was homosexual. Having a homosexual orientation doesn't make a person homosexual. Acting on the orientation is what makes a person homosexual. A liar isn't a liar until he or she lies. A thief isn't a thief until he or she steals. An alcoholic isn't an alcoholic until they drink alcohol - and lose control of it. The idea that Paul could have struggled with a same-sex attraction does not diminish him at all. Nor does it in any way justify homosexuality. In fact, if the author of over half the New Testament struggled with a same-sex attraction yet didn't act on it, and even condemned it, that itself would be a strong rebuke of those who want to argue that the lifestyle is acceptable.

Grace be with you.

[Gerr]

"To one who has a hammer, everything looks like a nail."

[Naomi]

Yes, it was completely foreign to reality.

`G

[Gibs]

NO man of God is a homo. That is an utterly disgusting lifestyle to him, as it was to Jesus.

Ro 1:26 For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature:

Ro 1:27 And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet.

Ro 1:28 And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient;

Ro 1:29 Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers,

Ro 1:30 Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents,

Ro 1:31 Without understanding, covenantbreakers, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful:

Ro 1:32 Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them.

1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

1Jo 4:5 They are of the world: therefore speak they of the world, and the world heareth them.

1Jo 4:6 We are of God: he that knoweth God heareth us; he that is not of God heareth not us. Hereby know we the spirit of truth, and the spirit of error.

[cricket]

Gibs, you are speaking of the lifestyle and not of the orientation, correct?

[Gibs]

Cricket, I am of the persuasion that a man of God is of the Godly orientation.

1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

1Jo 4:5 They are of the world: therefore speak they of the world, and the world heareth them.

1Jo 4:6 We are of God: he that knoweth God heareth us; he that is not of God heareth not us. Hereby know we the spirit of truth, and the spirit of error.

[skyblue888]

I believe, rather, that Paul's thorn in the flesh

had something to do with his eyesight.

"For I bear you witness that,

if it had been possible, you would have

plucked out your eyes, and have given them

to me." Gal.4;15.

And I believe, if I am not mistaken,

the SoP states the same.

sky

[joeb]

I just can't believe the stuff people come up with to justify what they want to justify.

Quote:

IICorinthians 12:7 And lest I should be exalted above measure through the abundance of the revelations, there was given to me a thorn in the flesh, the messenger of Satan to buffet me, lest I should be exalted above measure.

So Paul was given homosexual leanings to keep him humble? This is so far out of the realm of believability it's not even funny. But then, who really believes scripture any more when someone wants to make a point about something? It's much easier and more palatable to many to slip into fantasy land.

[Dr. Shane]

I believe, rather, that Paul's thorn in the flesh

had something to do with his eyesight.

"For I bear you witness that,

if it had been possible, you would have

plucked out your eyes, and have given them

to me." Gal.4;15.

And I believe, if I am not mistaken,

the SoP states the same.

sky

[Dr. Shane]

So Paul was given homosexual leanings to keep him humble?

Thanks for this intriguing question.

That really does seem hard to believe by a 21st century Christian. Most Christians today have been looking down on homosexuals for so long they cannot even consider for a moment that the author of over half the New Testament could have struggled with same-sex attraction. However in first-century Rome, homosexuality was commonly practiced and part of some pagan religions so it is not outside the realm of possibility.

I have struggled with alcoholism for many years. The best cure for alcoholism has been shown to be humility. Prior to homosexuality being removed as a mental disorder by the APA, alcoholics and homosexuals were considered to be cousins of sorts. Both of them struggle with extreme selfishness. While I cannot claim to have ever struggled with same-sex attraction, I have struggled with alcoholism and drug addiction and believe the struggle is very similar. The answer is humility. The famous 12 Steps are nothing more than a path of baby steps to humility.

I don't know how having a problem with my eyes would make me humble. Are there no proud blind men?

[JoeMo]

Hey Shane,

I found your posts most interesting. Although I have never considered that Paul may have had gay tendancies, I don't dismiss it as entirely impossible. You made the important distiction that he may have had gay tendancies, but he never acted on them (at least after his conversion). I know some people here on CA and in my own congregation who led a gay life style prior to coming to Christ. They still admit their attraction to others of the same gender; but by the grace of God THEY now have His power to overcome the temptations. I admire such people for their faith and commitment. If a gay orientation was indeed Paul's "thorn in the flesh" (I also think eyesight is a more likely candidate), more power to him as an example of being an overcomer!

[M. T. Cross]

I find some of the negative comments in this thread astounding. The point is made over and over on this site that your God hates the act of homosexuality, but through him a person can overcome this "affliction" and serve him as a "whole" person. But dare suggest that he may have done that for the most famous (and vile imo) characters in the Bible and everyone is up in arms.

Is it that you really don't think it was possible that an extremely homophobic man (and there is a lot of thought to homophobes being repressed gays) could have done your Gods work, or is it that you don't really think that your God could have helped him overcome?

[joeb]

Originally Posted By: joeb

So Paul was given homosexual leanings to keep him humble?

Thanks for this intriguing question.

That really does seem hard to believe by a 21st century Christian. Most Christians today have been looking down on homosexuals for so long they cannot even consider for a moment that the author of over half the New Testament could have struggled with same-sex attraction. However in first-century Rome, homosexuality was commonly practiced and part of some pagan religions so it is not outside the realm of possibility.

I have struggled with alcoholism for many years. The best cure for alcoholism has been shown to be humility. Prior to homosexuality being removed as a mental disorder by the APA, alcoholics and homosexuals were considered to be cousins of sorts. Both of them struggle with extreme selfishness. While I cannot claim to have ever struggled with same-sex attraction, I have struggled with alcoholism and drug addiction and believe the struggle is very similar. The answer is humility. The famous 12 Steps are nothing more than a path of baby steps to humility.

I don't know how having a problem with my eyes would make me humble. Are there no proud blind men?

Oh, brother, Shane. Paul was given a thorn in his flesh, during his ministry, to keep him humble because of the extraordinary insights he was given by God. This isn't something he was born with. Read the verse. You're forcing your interpretation on it.

Your interpretation would mean, given your example of alcoholism, that Paul, a teetotaler, would have suddenly developed a strong desire to get drunk and then lived with that desire and weakness for the rest of his life. It makes no sense at all.

But, I guess you can find a way to justify anything if you try hard enough.

[joeb]

I find some of the negative comments in this thread astounding. The point is made over and over on this site that your God hates the act of homosexuality, but through him a person can overcome this "affliction" and serve him as a "whole" person. But dare suggest that he may have done that for the most famous (and vile imo) characters in the Bible and everyone is up in arms.

Is it that you really don't think it was possible that an extremely homophobic man (and there is a lot of thought to homophobes being repressed gays) could have done your Gods work, or is it that you don't really think that your God could have helped him overcome?

You really don't understand. God tempts no man, and Paul explicitly says he was given this thorn in the flesh during his ministry to keep him humble.

Read the verse yourself.

7 And lest I should be exalted above measure through the abundance of the revelations, there was given to me a thorn in the flesh, the messenger of Satan to buffet me, lest I should be exalted above measure.

My objection has nothing to do homosexual leanings. It has to do with the explicit wording of the text. It doesn't make sense that this was a pre-existing condition, given the wording of the text. You want to ignore that, go ahead.

[JoeMo]

Quote:

I don't know how having a problem with my eyes would make me humble. Are there no proud blind men?

Excellent point, Shane.

I want to again emphasize to some who seem to be outraged by your suggestion that being attracted to members of the same gender and acting on those attractions and the associated behavior are two different things. Nonetheless, I think suffering constantly with the attraction and putting forth the effort to resist (or constantly submitting to the grace to resist) would be enough to keep any God-fearing man humble. By the same token, I see lots of women every day that I am attracted to; but I don't act on those attractions nor carry out any of the temptations associated with that attraction. Temptation is NOT sin or perversion; it is just temptation until one give in to it. It is called "victory" when we do overcome temptation. I say the more bitter the battle, the sweeter the victory.

For the record - I am not condemning gay tendencies (or even gay behavior) here. I may not be gay, but I have plenty of other issues that God and I are still dealing with. I've got too many of my own sins to judge or condemn anyone else.

[o2bwise]

Quote:

I find some of the negative comments in this thread astounding.

I agree.

Shane was quite clear in differentiating between the desire and submission to the desire.

We already know Paul was a murderer.

Maybe that is more acceptable a desire; who knows?

Tony

[Gibs]

Paul, was on the wrong side for some time, but Christ knew that his heart was right and was an honestly deceived man and the turn around on the road to Damascus and He even then become more zealous for right and God gave him more insight and understanding than about any.

His teachings to the Gentiles is a wonder and many things are there from him for the true child of God.

Don't get me wrong, each Apostle each had a great piece also to add to our development as true Christians.

He gave Paul a great insight here that is profound, yes that many don't comprehend,

1Co 15:24 Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power.

1Co 15:25 For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet.

1Co 15:26 The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death.

1Co 15:27 For he hath put all things under his feet. But when he saith, all things are put under him, it is manifest that he is excepted, which did put all things under him.

1Co 15:28 And when all things shall be subdued unto him, then shall the Son also himself be subject unto him that put all things under him, that God may be all in all.

One of the greatest prophecies of His Word to us!

1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

1Jo 4:5 They are of the world: therefore speak they of the world, and the world heareth them.

1Jo 4:6 We are of God: he that knoweth God heareth us; he that is not of God heareth not us. Hereby know we the spirit of truth, and the spirit of error.

[LynnDel]

I recently came across a new idea about Paul. The suggestion is that he may have been made into a eunuch at some point. We know that in order to become a Pharisee, he had to have offspring, so he most likely had a wife. No mention of them is ever made that I know of. That he might have been made a eunuch has very little proof (1 Cor. 7:8 being the "proof text"), and it certainly could align with his having a "thorn in the flesh," -- so maybe there is just a touch more evidence for him having been castrated than that he may have had homosexual leanings.

For me it is all guess work, and I wonder why it is important at all.

LD

[Naomi]

Quote:

For me it is all guess work, and I wonder why it is important at all.

I agree...I believe there are more productive things we could research in our Bible study than this issue.

[olger]

Forsooth.