Samie Posted November 18, 2015 Author Posted November 18, 2015 To overcome the evil of unbelief in truth. Quote
pnattmbtc Posted November 18, 2015 Posted November 18, 2015 That's just saying the same thing in other words. How does believing the truth help them? Why does God want us to believe the truth? Simply because it overcomes unbelief? Or is there something else to it? Quote Christ exalted the character of God, attributing to him the praise, and giving to him the credit, of the whole purpose of his own mission on earth,--to set men right through the revelation of God.
pnattmbtc Posted November 18, 2015 Posted November 18, 2015 Just now, Samie said: What do you think? Do you mean what do I think personally? Or what do I think you think? Quote Christ exalted the character of God, attributing to him the praise, and giving to him the credit, of the whole purpose of his own mission on earth,--to set men right through the revelation of God.
pnattmbtc Posted November 18, 2015 Posted November 18, 2015 2 minutes ago, Samie said: The first option. I'll answer later, but would prefer you answered first. To be clear what I'm asking, it is if there is something positive about believing the truth which helps unbelievers, or is it only important to believe the truth so were not believing lies? Or I could ask the question this way: Why is believing lies so bad? (i.e., the types of lies we're talking about, not any old lie). Quote Christ exalted the character of God, attributing to him the praise, and giving to him the credit, of the whole purpose of his own mission on earth,--to set men right through the revelation of God.
Wingnut Posted November 18, 2015 Posted November 18, 2015 12 minutes ago, Samie said: Because they chose to believe in lies instead of truth. They are non-overcomers, having been overcome by the evil of unbelief in truth. But they are deceived? Right? Their heart has deceived them? Now that they are non-overcomers they have a heart which is deceitful above all things and desperately wicked? Right? Quote
Samie Posted November 18, 2015 Author Posted November 18, 2015 Just now, Wingnut said: But they are deceived? Right? Right. Their heart has deceived them? No. The deceiver has. Now that they are non-overcomers they have a heart which is deceitful above all things and desperately wicked? No. Right? No. Not yet hopeless while still alive. It’s at death when one is judged whether he is an overcomer or not. Quote
Wingnut Posted November 18, 2015 Posted November 18, 2015 15 minutes ago, Samie said: Every person on earth believes different and opposite things. To me that speaks to a heart which is deceitful above all things and desperately wicked. But one area which they all agree on is this - they all believe they are right. Quote
Samie Posted November 18, 2015 Author Posted November 18, 2015 1 minute ago, Wingnut said: Every person on earth believes different and opposite things. To me that speaks to a heart which is deceitful above all things and desperately wicked. To believe of hearts as being desperately wicked is to not believe that God through Christ has made us all holy and perfect on the cross. What a contrast: All with hearts desperately wicked, as against, all made holy and perfect. Quote
Samie Posted November 18, 2015 Author Posted November 18, 2015 And one cannot be holy and perfect yet with heart desperately wicked. Quote
pnattmbtc Posted November 18, 2015 Posted November 18, 2015 What do you think Jeremiah had in mind when he said our hearts are desperately wicked? Do you believe human beings have a fallen nature? That this nature necessitates our being converted? Quote Christ exalted the character of God, attributing to him the praise, and giving to him the credit, of the whole purpose of his own mission on earth,--to set men right through the revelation of God.
Samie Posted November 18, 2015 Author Posted November 18, 2015 1 minute ago, Samie said: And one cannot be holy and perfect yet with heart desperately wicked. It's either the one or the other. I opt to believe that God through Christ has made us all holy and perfect on the cross. Quote
pnattmbtc Posted November 18, 2015 Posted November 18, 2015 2 minutes ago, Samie said: And one cannot be holy and perfect yet with heart desperately wicked. Why not? What you are talking about in being holy happens, supposedly, when we don't exist. But being desperately wicked happens when we actually exist, and is seen every day through child abuse and other horrible things. You could only assert that people are not desperately wicked by hiding your head in the sand (I heard this somewhere, can't remember where). Quote Christ exalted the character of God, attributing to him the praise, and giving to him the credit, of the whole purpose of his own mission on earth,--to set men right through the revelation of God.
pnattmbtc Posted November 18, 2015 Posted November 18, 2015 When I asked why it is important to believe the truth, you (Samie) answered, "to overcome the evil of unbelief in truth", which is not a satisfactory answer, since it adds no new content; it's just repeating the question. Are you able to answer this questions in a meaningful way? If you can, please do so. Jesus said, "You shall know the truth, and the truth shall set you free." I believe it's vitally important that we understand how this works, what Jesus is getting at. Quote Christ exalted the character of God, attributing to him the praise, and giving to him the credit, of the whole purpose of his own mission on earth,--to set men right through the revelation of God.
Samie Posted November 18, 2015 Author Posted November 18, 2015 We were made holy and perfect on the cross. Scriptures say so. And I believe it. I am just amazed how preachers who emphasize faith can't believe this. Quote
Wingnut Posted November 18, 2015 Posted November 18, 2015 3 minutes ago, pnattmbtc said: Why not? What you are talking about in being holy happens, supposedly, when we don't exist. But being desperately wicked happens when we actually exist, and is seen every day through child abuse and other horrible things. You could only assert that people are not desperately wicked by hiding your head in the sand (I heard this somewhere, can't remember where). Exactly. Seeing is believing. Quote
Wingnut Posted November 18, 2015 Posted November 18, 2015 2 minutes ago, Samie said: We were made holy and perfect on the cross. Scriptures say so. And I believe it. I am just amazed how preachers who emphasize faith can't believe this. We may be, but THEY are not. ("They" meaning those not in Christ). And THEY are known by their murders, lies, abuse, theft, ... Quote
Samie Posted November 18, 2015 Author Posted November 18, 2015 "Seeing is believing" comes short of faith which is the evidence of things not seen. Quote
Wingnut Posted November 18, 2015 Posted November 18, 2015 1 minute ago, Samie said: "Seeing is believing" comes short of faith which is the evidence of things not seen. Faith is not blind. Quote
pnattmbtc Posted November 18, 2015 Posted November 18, 2015 What does that mean? (I mean that faith is the evidence of things not seen) Can you explain what anything means? You seem to just repeat phrases, and when asked questions regarding what something means, you deflect them (e.g. Q.Why is believing the truth important? A.To overcome the evil of not believing the truth). Quote Christ exalted the character of God, attributing to him the praise, and giving to him the credit, of the whole purpose of his own mission on earth,--to set men right through the revelation of God.
pnattmbtc Posted November 18, 2015 Posted November 18, 2015 Believing is seeing. Quote Christ exalted the character of God, attributing to him the praise, and giving to him the credit, of the whole purpose of his own mission on earth,--to set men right through the revelation of God.
Wingnut Posted November 18, 2015 Posted November 18, 2015 10 minutes ago, Samie said: We were made holy and perfect on the cross. Scriptures say so. And I believe it. I am just amazed how preachers who emphasize faith can't believe this. I too am a bit of a Pollyanna. But this is what God says of this world.. 1 John 2:16 For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life, is not of the Father, but is of the world. Matthew 6:32 (For after all these things do the Gentiles seek:) Most of the world pursues this. Thus most of the world is deceived. Quote
pnattmbtc Posted November 18, 2015 Posted November 18, 2015 Friendship with the world is enmity against God is another one. Quote Christ exalted the character of God, attributing to him the praise, and giving to him the credit, of the whole purpose of his own mission on earth,--to set men right through the revelation of God.
Wingnut Posted November 18, 2015 Posted November 18, 2015 Ye are the salt of the earth... How much salt is there next to how much earth? Quote
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.