Twilight Posted December 16, 2009 Posted December 16, 2009 There are not many that will disagree that God needs our "co-operation", in the matter of salvation. But what does that co-operation consist of? What is it we "do" when we co-operate with God? Over to you... God bless, Mark :-) Quote The best wisdom is always second hand...
Moderators Gerr Posted December 16, 2009 Moderators Posted December 16, 2009 We "are justified by his grace as a gift, through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus, whom God put forward as a propitiation by his blood, to be received by faith." Rom 3:23,24 ESV Quote
pnattmbtc Posted December 16, 2009 Posted December 16, 2009 Quote: There is not a point that needs to be dwelt upon more earnestly, repeated more frequently, or established more firmly in the minds of all than the impossibility of fallen man meriting anything by his own best good works. Salvation is through faith in Jesus Christ alone.(FW 18) Quote Christ exalted the character of God, attributing to him the praise, and giving to him the credit, of the whole purpose of his own mission on earth,--to set men right through the revelation of God.
Moderators Gerr Posted December 16, 2009 Moderators Posted December 16, 2009 Quote: There is not a point that needs to be dwelt upon more earnestly, repeated more frequently, or established more firmly in the minds of all than the impossibility of fallen man meriting anything by his own best good works. Salvation is through faith in Jesus Christ alone.(FW 18) AMEN! AMEN! AMEN! Quote
karl Posted December 16, 2009 Posted December 16, 2009 Check out the book, "Steps to Christ." Short and sweet. As you draw near to Him with confession and repentance, He will draw near to you with mercy and forgiveness. Quote
Moderators Gerr Posted December 16, 2009 Moderators Posted December 16, 2009 Check out the book, "Steps to Christ." Short and sweet. As you draw near to Him with confession and repentance, He will draw near to you with mercy and forgiveness. Are you saying it is man who takes the initiative? the first step? Quote
karl Posted December 16, 2009 Posted December 16, 2009 Are you saying it is man who takes the initiative? the first step? Not at all. God always makes the first moves (He had to create us to begin with and it goes on from there.) God sets the stage, but we must act on it. He presents to us the options. We choose. He is always wooing us. We respond appropriately (hopefully.) He is: The Father waiting for His son, The suitor down on his knee waiting for a "Yes.," The bridegroom hoping his bride is faithful, The benefactor extending to me the lavish gift and wondering why I'm more concerned about the scuff on my shoe. Quote
Woody Posted December 17, 2009 Posted December 17, 2009 I fight with the Holy Spirit every day. He tell me yes ... I tell him no. We go back and forth. Some days "I" win ... some days HE wins. Quote May we be one so that the world may be won. Christian from the cradle to the grave I believe in Hematology.
olger Posted December 17, 2009 Posted December 17, 2009 "Great peace have they which love Thy law, and nothing shall offend them." Quote "Please don't feed the drama queens.."
Moderators Gerr Posted December 17, 2009 Moderators Posted December 17, 2009 I fight with the Holy Spirit every day. He tell me yes ... I tell him no. We go back and forth. Some days "I" win ... some days HE wins. "Do not waver, for a person with divided loyalty is as unsettled as a wave of the sea that is blown and tossed by the wind. Such people should not expect to receive anything from the Lord. Their loyalty is divided between God and the world, and they are unstable in everything they do." Jam 1:6-8 NLT Quote
skyblue888 Posted December 17, 2009 Posted December 17, 2009 "You cannot have a thought without Christ. You cannot have an inclination to come to Him unless He sets in motion influences and impresses His Spirit upon the human mind. And if there is a man upon the face of the earth who has any inclination toward God, it is because of the many influences that are set to work to bear upon his mind and heart. Those influences call for the allegiance to God and an appreciation of the great work that God has done for him. Then don't let us ever say that we can repent of ourselves, and then Christ will pardom. No, indeed. It is the favour of God that pardons. It is the favor of God that leads us by His power to repentance. Therefore, it is all of Jesus Christ, everyting of Him, and you want to just give back glory to Him." E.G. White, Faith and Works, p.73. sky Quote "The merits of His sacrifice are sufficient to present to the Father in our behalf." S.C.36.
karl Posted December 17, 2009 Posted December 17, 2009 "You cannot have a thought without Christ. You cannot have an inclination to come to Him unless He sets in motion influences and impresses His Spirit upon the human mind. And if there is a man upon the face of the earth who has any inclination toward God, it is because of the many influences that are set to work to bear upon his mind and heart. Those influences call for the allegiance to God and an appreciation of the great work that God has done for him. Then don't let us ever say that we can repent of ourselves, and then Christ will pardom. No, indeed. It is the favour of God that pardons. It is the favor of God that leads us by His power to repentance. Therefore, it is all of Jesus Christ, everyting of Him, and you want to just give back glory to Him." E.G. White, Faith and Works, p.73. sky Great quote, Sky. Just remember, she is neither Calvinist nor Universalist, so this has to be balanced by the other things she says about the right exercise of the will. She named her treatise on this topic, "Steps to Christ." In it, she is clearly trying to portray that the sinner has a part in this process. She encourages the weakest of us with thoughts such as you have presented above, but she is not exonerating the sinner of participation. She is, rather, noting that an infinite Source of grace and power is waiting and eager to help in time of need. She is saying the same thing that Jesus said when He told the disciples, "Without me, ye can do nothing." Quote
pnattmbtc Posted December 17, 2009 Posted December 17, 2009 The question about who makes the first move reminds me of this: Quote: When a man takes one step toward God, God takes more steps toward that man than there are sands in the worlds of time.(The Work of the Chariot) Quote Christ exalted the character of God, attributing to him the praise, and giving to him the credit, of the whole purpose of his own mission on earth,--to set men right through the revelation of God.
karl Posted December 17, 2009 Posted December 17, 2009 The question about who makes the first move reminds me of this: Quote: When a man takes one step toward God, God takes more steps toward that man than there are sands in the worlds of time.(The Work of the Chariot) There is absolutely no question that God makes the first move. Lots of moves. Huge moves. Quote
skyblue888 Posted December 17, 2009 Posted December 17, 2009 Originally Posted By: skyblue888 "You cannot have a thought without Christ. You cannot have an inclination to come to Him unless He sets in motion influences and impresses His Spirit upon the human mind. And if there is a man upon the face of the earth who has any inclination toward God, it is because of the many influences that are set to work to bear upon his mind and heart. Those influences call for the allegiance to God and an appreciation of the great work that God has done for him. Then don't let us ever say that we can repent of ourselves, and then Christ will pardom. No, indeed. It is the favour of God that pardons. It is the favor of God that leads us by His power to repentance. Therefore, it is all of Jesus Christ, everyting of Him, and you want to just give back glory to Him." E.G. White, Faith and Works, p.73. sky Great quote, Sky. Just remember, she is neither Calvinist nor Universalist, so this has to be balanced by the other things she says about the right exercise of the will. She named her treatise on this topic, "Steps to Christ." In it, she is clearly trying to portray that the sinner has a part in this process. She encourages the weakest of us with thoughts such as you have presented above, but she is not exonerating the sinner of participation. She is, rather, noting that an infinite Source of grace and power is waiting and eager to help in time of need. She is saying the same thing that Jesus said when He told the disciples, "Without me, ye can do nothing." Of course I agree. "Faith is the gift of God but the power to exercise it is ours." P.P.421. sky Quote "The merits of His sacrifice are sufficient to present to the Father in our behalf." S.C.36.
skyblue888 Posted December 17, 2009 Posted December 17, 2009 Originally Posted By: pnattmbtc The question about who makes the first move reminds me of this: Quote: When a man takes one step toward God, God takes more steps toward that man than there are sands in the worlds of time.(The Work of the Chariot) There is absolutely no question that God makes the first move. Lots of moves. Huge moves. I agree. If He did not make the first move, we would never have any inclination toward Him. When we draw nigh to God it is only because we are not resisting the influences that He has set in motion impressing His Spirit upon our human mind. Right? sky Quote "The merits of His sacrifice are sufficient to present to the Father in our behalf." S.C.36.
Members phkrause Posted December 18, 2009 Members Posted December 18, 2009 Originally Posted By: Redwood I fight with the Holy Spirit every day. He tell me yes ... I tell him no. We go back and forth. Some days "I" win ... some days HE wins. "Do not waver, for a person with divided loyalty is as unsettled as a wave of the sea that is blown and tossed by the wind. Such people should not expect to receive anything from the Lord. Their loyalty is divided between God and the world, and they are unstable in everything they do." Jam 1:6-8 NLT Gerry aren't we all like that. At least Redwood is being honest! pk Quote phkrause When the righteous are in authority, the people rejoice; But when a wicked man rules, the people groan. Proverbs 29;2
Members phkrause Posted December 18, 2009 Members Posted December 18, 2009 dgrimm I agree, but all of us can give all sorts of Bible texts about this or that, but we are still up and down everyday, and we are all like that. pk Quote phkrause When the righteous are in authority, the people rejoice; But when a wicked man rules, the people groan. Proverbs 29;2
Members phkrause Posted December 18, 2009 Members Posted December 18, 2009 Amen dgrimm pk Quote phkrause When the righteous are in authority, the people rejoice; But when a wicked man rules, the people groan. Proverbs 29;2
Moderators Gerr Posted December 18, 2009 Moderators Posted December 18, 2009 Originally Posted By: Gerry Cabalo "Do not waver' date=' for a person with divided loyalty is as unsettled as a wave of the sea that is blown and tossed by the wind. Such people should not expect to receive anything from the Lord. Their loyalty is divided between God and the world, and they are unstable in everything they do." Jam 1:6-8 NLT [/quote'] Gerry aren't we all like that. At least Redwood is being honest! pk Of course! We ALL have those moments. But to say that the believer is in that state of mind until Jesus comes, then if I have that kind of experience day by day by day, then I would have to question myself whether I am really converted or not. The gospel "teaches us to say “No” to ungodliness and worldly passions, and to live self-controlled, upright and godly lives in this present age," Titus 2:12 NIV. When we start wavering, that's when we get in trouble. A newly grafted scion can be easily dislodged. A newborn can easily be misled. But each day, the union of the graft to the host should become stronger and stronger until no storm can dislodge it anymore. And the newborn can grow to maturity to where he can stand strong. But to be wavering until Jesus comes? Comprising with sin till Jesus comes? That's a dangerous notion! I can't do that! Quote
Members phkrause Posted December 18, 2009 Members Posted December 18, 2009 Originally Posted By: pkrause Of course! We ALL have those moments. But to say that the believer is in that state of mind until Jesus comes, then if I have that kind of experience day by day by day, then I would have to question myself whether I am really converted or not. The gospel "teaches us to say “No” to ungodliness and worldly passions, and to live self-controlled, upright and godly lives in this present age," Titus 2:12 NIV. When we start wavering, that's when we get in trouble. A newly grafted scion can be easily dislodged. A newborn can easily be misled. But each day, the union of the graft to the host should become stronger and stronger until no storm can dislodge it anymore. And the newborn can grow to maturity to where he can stand strong. But to be wavering until Jesus comes? Comprising with sin till Jesus comes? That's a dangerous notion! I can't do that! Gerry I do agree with you on all that you have said. I was just saying that we all do that daily. But yes it should get less and less as our walk with Jesus gets stronger and stronger. pk Quote phkrause When the righteous are in authority, the people rejoice; But when a wicked man rules, the people groan. Proverbs 29;2
Moderators Gerr Posted December 18, 2009 Moderators Posted December 18, 2009 EGW calls it, "settling into the truth," I believe. Quote
Moderators Gerr Posted December 18, 2009 Moderators Posted December 18, 2009 Quote: Comprising with sin till Jesus comes? That's a dangerous notion! I can't do that! That should read: "compromising with sin....." Quote
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