I used to be a rocker

[Guest]

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[phkrause]

I like it! All my husband plays is country and western on the radio...

haha LOL, my wife loves C&W music, so I had to listen and I've come to like it somewhat. I do have my problem with the message it gives, but than r&r also has its message which isn't that great either and I'm a r&r addict, or was I should say. That's all I really ever listened to. But as I've gotten closer to the Lord I've been able to go cold-turkey and have actually listened more to what the learicks(sp) say than just listening to the music, which I really loved.

[nuff sed]

I used to listen to Country Western music because it was preferable to Rock music. One day I came across Southern Gospel Music and Bill Gaither's Homecoming group. I haven't listened to Country Western since. You may not like the beat but the messages are generally headed in the right direction.

[doug yowell]

Since I became a Christian I've always found it interesting that the subject of music and it's attending influence has been such a volatile and divisive topic among Christians. Non-Christians usually have good natured disagreements about which genre is preferable. Most seem to agree that music itself is not objectively good or bad. But take music into the spiritual rehelm and it creates on a whole different attitude amongst Christians. I'd like to see the subject of music treated in an analytical fashion, without all the personal attachments,by a group of Christians. Is it possible or is the baggage too heavy?

[Gail]

Since I became a Christian I've always found it interesting that the subject of music and it's attending influence has been such a volatile and divisive topic among Christians. Non-Christians usually have good natured disagreements about which genre is preferable. Most seem to agree that music itself is not objectively good or bad. But take music into the spiritual rehelm and it creates on a whole different attitude amongst Christians. I'd like to see the subject of music treated in an analytical fashion, without all the personal attachments,by a group of Christians. Is it possible or is the baggage too heavy?

Kinda like money, eh?

[doug yowell]

Originally Posted By: doug yowell

Since I became a Christian I've always found it interesting that the subject of music and it's attending influence has been such a volatile and divisive topic among Christians. Non-Christians usually have good natured disagreements about which genre is preferable. Most seem to agree that music itself is not objectively good or bad. But take music into the spiritual rehelm and it creates on a whole different attitude amongst Christians. I'd like to see the subject of music treated in an analytical fashion, without all the personal attachments,by a group of Christians. Is it possible or is the baggage too heavy?

Kinda like money, eh?

I don't know. Maybe.I've never had enough to have to require a sky cap to carry it for me.

[Gail]

Doug, perhaps music hits a bone with so many because it is a subject that touches people's hearts. It is personal, like feelings.

Maybe? I don't know...

[doug yowell]

Doug, perhaps music hits a bone with so many because it is a subject that touches people's hearts. It is personal

I think you're right. It's like today's religion... everybody's got one but don't try messing with it.

[aldona]

Doug, perhaps music hits a bone with so many because it is a subject that touches people's hearts. It is personal, like feelings.

Maybe? I don't know...

You've forgotten the Supreme Rule of the Adventist Self-Appointed Music Critic...

"If I don't like it, God doesn't like it."

AJ

[Bravus]

In response to the Antestor (Christian) song that I posted, Norman wrote:

Quote:

The music that you posted I personally would never listen to because it is rebellious, selfish and ungodly.

How does one arrive at that conclusion? What evidence is adduced, what standards apply? It can't be the lyrics, because they were a very straightforward plea to the listener to come to Jesus for salvation. Presumably there must be some particular features of the vocal style, instruments, playing style or something... but I'm honestly not sure how one sings or plays guitar or drums in a style that is 'rebellious, selfish and ungodly'.

Can anyone explain?

[Norman Byers, N.D.]

In response to the Antestor (Christian) song that I posted, Norman wrote:

Quote:

The music that you posted I personally would never listen to because it is rebellious, selfish and ungodly.

How does one arrive at that conclusion? What evidence is adduced, what standards apply? It can't be the lyrics, because they were a very straightforward plea to the listener to come to Jesus for salvation. Presumably there must be some particular features of the lyrics, instruments, playing style or something... but I'm honestly not sure how one sings or plays guitar or drums in a style that is 'rebellious, selfish and ungodly'.

Can anyone explain?

Hi Bravus, I want to start off by saying I'm sorry if I offended you, that was not my intent. In the past I would know by simply listening to the music whether it was godly or not. I still do that but now I listen for songs that are sentimental as well and try to avoid them. I also stay away from sensual songs. I really enjoy beautiful music and that's a change God has done in me. In 81 when I had this enlightenment about music, I had been playing heavy rock guitar for 8 years every day for hours. I was a lot more devoted than I am now. (wish I had the time I'd do it again, only different music) But I was into my music and felt it, lived it, communicated with it and understood it's power over people. Music was my life and wife. (had no time for woman) We used that power in the bands I played in to get people to do what we wanted on the dance floor. We thought it was fun and yet empowering. It went to our heads and we were our own little gods. ungodly music has an effect on the nervous system and create pride and strengthens the carnal nature. In all reality, for me to crank the amp up and turn on the effects was a way to fulfill the emptiness that I had with in. I felt good and it was in a selfish way.

Music is the language of the soul someone once said and I agree. What cannot be expressed in words can sometimes be expressed in music and those who are in tune with music can hear an unspoken message in it that will influence us.

What I do is find scripture verses that define God's character. Like those verses that I posted, they speak of peace. Quietness is another characteristic of God. Self control is another one that comes to mind which applies to music. When I play it's my goal to make people feel good and I want them to love to sing about the Lord. I don't always achieve that but I'm working on it.

My goal in playing is also to please God as well as please people. So I apply that principle to the music I listen too as well. I ask God to help me with the music I listen to and would like to play.

For me to stand at the foot of the cross with my guitar can be a sobering thought as I try to play something that will bless my Savior and lead others to Him. Again the same goes for the music I listen to.

The Holy Spirit has spoken to my conscience a number of times when I am listening to a song that is ungodly, not necessarily evil but just not spiritual. There are secular songs that I listen to that are uplifting and ennobling, they make me feel like royalty, classical music does that for me.

There are some guitarist that don't play Christian music and their music is godly. It's what's in the soul that will determine what comes out. As God's children with the mind of Christ I believe we should be able to discern this. I can and I'm just like anyone else. I better stop before I write a book. I want you to know that I don't think of you less if you listen to music that I wouldn't. I would only tell you to seek God with all you heart on this subject because music is a powerful energy that affects our spirits.

take care,

Norman

[Bravus]

Thanks for your gracious answer, and I wasn't offended at all, just looking to understand.

I do think that your association of particular sounds with particular emotions may be conditioned by your own past experiences and a particular cultural 'moment' and place, and that therefore generalising them to everywhere and everywhen (which I know you haven't) may not be valid.

As long as we each continue to seek God's face it's hard to go far wrong...

[doug yowell]

Originally Posted By: Gail

Doug, perhaps music hits a bone with so many because it is a subject that touches people's hearts. It is personal, like feelings.

Maybe? I don't know...

You've forgotten the Supreme Rule of the Adventist Self-Appointed Music Critic...

"If I don't like it, God doesn't like it."

AJ

How do you know that,AJ,did you take the class?

[doug yowell]

Thanks for your gracious answer, and I wasn't offended at all, just looking to understand.

I do think that your association of particular sounds with particular emotions may be conditioned by your own past experiences and a particular cultural 'moment' and place, and that therefore generalising them to everywhere and everywhen (which I know you haven't) may not be valid.

As long as we each continue to seek God's face it's hard to go far wrong...

This was also a gracious answer, Brav.

[doug yowell]

I was into my music and felt it, lived it, communicated with it and understood it's power over people. Music was my life and wife. (had no time for woman) We used that power in the bands I played in to get people to do what we wanted on the dance floor. We thought it was fun and yet empowering. It went to our heads and we were our own little gods. ungodly music has an effect on the nervous system and create pride and strengthens the carnal nature. In all reality, for me to crank the amp up and turn on the effects was a way to fulfill the emptiness that I had with in. I felt good and it was in a selfish way.

Music is the language of the soul someone once said and I agree. What cannot be expressed in words can sometimes be expressed in music and those who are in tune with music can hear an unspoken message in it that will influence us.

What I do is find scripture verses that define God's character. Like those verses that I posted, they speak of peace. Quietness is another characteristic of God. Self control is another one that comes to mind which applies to music. When I play it's my goal to make people feel good and I want them to love to sing about the Lord. I don't always achieve that but I'm working on it.

My goal in playing is also to please God as well as please people. So I apply that principle to the music I listen too as well. I ask God to help me with the music I listen to and would like to play.

For me to stand at the foot of the cross with my guitar can be a sobering thought as I try to play something that will bless my Savior and lead others to Him. Again the same goes for the music I listen to.

The Holy Spirit has spoken to my conscience a number of times when I am listening to a song that is ungodly, not necessarily evil but just not spiritual. There are secular songs that I listen to that are uplifting and ennobling, they make me feel like royalty, classical music does that for me.

I agree 100% with your analysis of music and it's attending power,Norman. To me, your's is a credible and inspiring testimony and should be cause for thoughtful consideration wherever you speak out on it.

[Norman Byers, N.D.]

Thanks for your gracious answer, and I wasn't offended at all, just looking to understand.

I do think that your association of particular sounds with particular emotions may be conditioned by your own past experiences and a particular cultural 'moment' and place, and that therefore generalising them to everywhere and everywhen (which I know you haven't) may not be valid.

As long as we each continue to seek God's face it's hard to go far wrong...

I understand how you can come to that conclusion but there are many others who can tell you the same thing who have have been or are musicians. There is one thing that I think we should be aware of and seek for discernment about, and that is ungodly music. It's up to us to seek God and seek His approval. It does have the same effect on us all and that is, it separates us from God.

In some cases it takes a while to be able to identify this music or it may be a desire to hang on to it because it has a hold in us. I was blessed with in a moment and saw these things, which quickly led me to break all my LPs. (That would be the equivalent of a CD to those who are too young to know what LPs are) :-)

Take care,

Norman

[Guest]

I was blessed with in a moment and saw these things, which quickly led me to break all my LPs. (That would be the equivalent of a CD to those who are too young to know what LPs are) :-)

Take care,

Norman

I gave away all my LPs one time.

[Bravus]

My point was just that distorted electric guitars are a recent technological phenomenon, so 'ungodly music' prior to about 1940 must have used different instrumentation. There have been various 'unholy intervals' identified, but the current tempering of the scales is a Western phenomenon only a couple of hundred years old, so it must have been different in Bible times and the Dark Ages and in systems like those in India and China that use completely different musical scales. And so on.

[Norman Byers, N.D.]

My point was just that distorted electric guitars are a recent technological phenomenon, so 'ungodly music' prior to about 1940 must have used different instrumentation. There have been various 'unholy intervals' identified, but the current tempering of the scales is a Western phenomenon only a couple of hundred years old, so it must have been different in Bible times and the Dark Ages and in systems like those in India and China that use completely different musical scales. And so on.

I think that in every age and every culture there is a defining tone, or quality of music that is godly. It would be interesting to hear some music for the 1600s from let's say, China to see how we would respond to the musical language of that day.

Norman

[Guest]

That would be interesting.

[SivartM]

If we're going to divide up musical tones into "godly" and "ungodly", we probably ought to do the same for colors, numbers, and web browsers. I propose that sage green is godly but forest green is not, for obvious reasons.

[LynnDel]

Very good, Sivart!

[John317]

Don't worry- as you mature, you'll understand. :-)

We're talking about the affect of different tones, or differenet beats, and kinds of music, upon the mind and body, i.e., our spirituality.

Different numbers, colors, or web-browsers have no such affect on our spirituality.

[SivartM]

Don't worry- as you mature, you'll understand. :-)

We're talking about the affect of different tones, or differenet beats, and kinds of music, upon the mind and body, i.e., our spirituality.

Different numbers, colors, or web-browsers have no such affect on our spirituality.

I know what you're talking about, I just don't think it's factual. Musical beats can increase heart rate, tones can invoke certain emotions, but I've never seen a correlation between music preferences and spirituality. The most that music does to me is change my mood, and I don't mean into a satanic rebellious rage.

I doubt that as I mature I'll understand, because we are from different generations; your generation saw rock music and such as new, edgy, rebellious. My generation thinks it sounds good. Quite a difference there.

[Norman Byers, N.D.]

If we're going to divide up musical tones into "godly" and "ungodly", we probably ought to do the same for colors, numbers, and web browsers. I propose that sage green is godly but forest green is not, for obvious reasons.

There's a difference. Music is composed of sound and sound is energy and energy when it is unleashed has an effect. It is also a language that many do not understand but when it is understood it can be a blessing or a curse. It can be spiritual or carnal and will bring about the same results to the listener.

There are people who listen to music and can feel the energy and it may bring them to tears and they have cultivated the ability to distinguish good music that expresses true love. Then there are those people who listen to the same music and say "boring". They are not capable of seeing its beauty, they do not understand the language and are like the some of the men of today who only see women as a means of personal gratification instead of a beautiful living being.

The Bible tells us Pro 22:24 Don't make friends with anyone who has a bad temper. Pro 22:25 You might turn out like them and get caught in a trap. The same principle applies with music, if you are listening to sensual music all the time guess who will be sensual? If you are listening to vile music all the time, guess who will be vile? If you listen to godly music all the time, guess who will be godly? I'm generalizing and over emphasizing to get a point across.

As a musician I have learned what music is and does, I suggest that others do the same. Seriously, music has such a big part in our lives it would do us all well to learn about it more instead of speaking about what we think without any experience.

Like people who go to church and don't know why, so are a lot of today's music listeners, clueless. Why be that way, why not learn about this important issue which can impact your spirituality for good or for bad.

Norman