12tribes Posted October 8, 2011 Posted October 8, 2011 The king of the South simply isn't atheism. In the end, Satan himself will impersonate Christ. Why would an atheist care? Satan is looking to fool the religious, those people which make up around 99% of Earth's population. I thought Egypt was the king of the south? Daniel 11:8-9 (8) And shall also carry captives into Egypt their gods, with their princes, and with their precious vessels of silver and of gold; and he shall continue more years than the king of the north. (9) So the king of the south shall come into his kingdom, and shall return into his own land. Quote Galatians 3:29(29) And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.
skyblue888 Posted October 8, 2011 Posted October 8, 2011 Exactly and Atheistic France was spiritually the king of the South in 1798 inflicting a deadly wound to the papacy, the king of the north. And ever since Atheism has been getting stronger and stronger, pushing at the king of the north, especially in the last few decades. It will continue to push at the king of the north until its wound is healed. When it is healed, the king of the south will be defeated and the king of the north will for a short time rule the world again. But the loud cry of the Gospel of the merits and righteousness of Christ will indirectly expose the king of the north and many from both camps will be won over to the truth and they will be sealed into the truth so that they cannot be moved even in the face of a buy-and-sell decree and the death decree. Probation will close and at the time of the fifth and sixth plagues the king of the north will come to his end with no one to help. sky Quote "The merits of His sacrifice are sufficient to present to the Father in our behalf." S.C.36.
ClubV12 Posted October 8, 2011 Author Posted October 8, 2011 The way I understand Daniel 11:8-9 is that Egypt won't be destroyed by the King of the North (the NATO Alliance, USA, Europe, Papacy) nor will Libya and some other countries. They will ALLY with the King of the North (a mark in their hand, not their head) to avoid being destroyed but they will be conquered (pay homage to, accept the commands AND protection of). Whereas The King of South, predominately the radical Islamic Nations that refuse to ally, will be destroyed. No one comes to the aid of the now "all conquering" King of the North because the true nature of that King is revealed and is also about to be destroyed by the final plague(s) and the 2nd coming of Christ. The plagues begin AFTER probation has ended, then the King of the North will indeed be destroyed. "I saw that the four angels would hold the four winds until Jesus’ work was done in the sanctuary, and then will come the seven last plagues. These plagues enraged the wicked against the righteous; they thought that we had brought the judgments of God upon them and that if they could rid the earth of us the plagues would then be stayed. A decree went forth to slay the saints, which caused them to cry day and night for deliverance." EW 36, 37 Quote
Lysimachus Posted October 9, 2011 Posted October 9, 2011 Found some more great videos with Roosenberg! Daniel 11: King of the North Who is the King of the South? Islam vs Christianity Post-Islam Christianity Hosted by Signs of the Times. Quote ~Lysimachus (Marcos S.) Author of article, Vindicating the Year-Day Principle of Prophetic Interpretation (see attachment for article) Currently writing a book, Vindicating the Historical School of Prophetic Interpretation Founder of the largest and fastest SDA Apologetics Group on Facebook, Seventh-Day Adventism - Defending the Pillars of the Faith Writer and apologetics contributor at Adventist Defense League Vindicating the Year-Day Principle of Prophetic Interpretation.pdf
ClubV12 Posted October 10, 2011 Author Posted October 10, 2011 Oh, good find Lysimachus. I have been watching his recent (several weeks now) appearances on Signs of the Times as well as his videos on the web site. Fascinating stuff. Quote
BobRyan Posted December 25, 2012 Posted December 25, 2012 Tim Roosenberg seminar videos. http://www.islamvschristianity.org/index...d=1&from=10 This guy is giving a three part Daniel 11 seminar for Adventists. Thanks for sharing this! in Christ, Bob Quote John 8:32 - The Truth will make you free“The righteousness of Christ will not cover one cherished sin." COL 316.
ClubV12 Posted December 25, 2012 Author Posted December 25, 2012 I need to clarify a few things about this thread I started some time ago. I USED to follow Roosenberg with a great passion. I have studied his work in depth and am especially intrigued with his most recent understanding of how the 1260-1335 year segments of time fit within the larger 2,300 year prophecy. That was then, my more recent studies have led me to conclude that Roosenberg's analysis are not as accurate as I once believed. In comparing the multitude of Seventh-day Adventist "theological theories" regarding Daniel 11:40-45 I am more and more convinced that we have over looked a very important theologian and his contributions. Uriah Smith and his book Daniel and the Revelation. Of this book Sister White says it will retain it's interest until probabtion closes. She also notes Uriah Smith was led of God in writing out this work and the light it brings should be appreciated by all, until the end of time. Considering what she has to say about this book and it's author, I am compelled to take it seriously and appreciate it. A great diservice has been done to this book in denigrating it's conclusions and essentially relagting it to the dust bin of history. While we seek out "new learned men" with new theories that fit better with our current headlines. New ideas that tickle the mind and excite us with wonderful thoughts. In this the devil is well pleased to turn our attention away from the work of our pioneers. I utterly reject Lewis Were's attacks on the book and the author, this man has perhaps done more to discourage a close study of Daniel and the Revelation than any other single author. Reject Uriah's conclusion at the peril of rejecting light from the throne of God. And be prepared to eat a heaping helping of "crow" when at last it is found, Uriah had it right and there are few that have even read or opened his book. And yet, he is routinely dismissed by gossip, rumor and hear say. Most who do this don't even know WHAT they are rejecting, having only heard the rumors and gossip. Roosenberg is doing an interesting work, but I believe it's WAY more complicated than it needs to be. Especially in regard to his recent views on the 1,260-1335 year segments. While Daniel is indeed complex, we don't need people making it even more complex than it needs to be. Where are we today? Daniel 11 verse 45, thats it. Verses 40-44 have already been fulfilled and were finished in 1856, just like Uriah said. This is further confirmed by Sister Whites statement from December 1856 that some of those who were with her at a conference would live through the seven last plagues and be translated. The ONLY way this prophecy could have been fulfilled was if ALL of Daniel 11 could have been fulfilled in the mid 1800's. As Uriah said there were, up to verse 45. The Crimean War, which ended in February 1856 fufilled verse 44. The King of the North was indeed Turkey at that time. I believe Turkey will once again be the King of the North, will unite the Islam world, will devastate Israel and will setup "HQ" on the Mount of Olives. This will so anger the NATO powers and behind the scenes the Papal powers, they will come against Turkey to reclaim the "Holy Land" and setup their own "HQ". They will come not as conquers or as a war machine, but as a "saviour", a peace maker, a rescuer from evil and a hero. THEN they will enforce their "back to God" movement with the mark of the beast. You see, it is not about "Islam or Christians" who will rule in Israel, it is BOTH! Work out the timeline. Roosenberg is close, but Uriah nailed it. The Lord could have, would have, wanted to return in the 1800's. Like the children of Israel being turned back into the Wilderness, so it is with us today. Our fathers and grand fathers blew it, we continue to wander and look for my "signs", we are fools and will seach in vain. We have the truth right before our eyes and have ignored it for over a 100 years. Quote
ClubV12 Posted December 25, 2012 Author Posted December 25, 2012 I wonder... Did the Children of Israel continue to look for more "signs" and entertain the latest and most theological theories about how they would soon enter the promised land? OR, did some recognize the fact that they were indeed going to wander for forty years and weren't going nowhere? I wonder... What lies they told their children in the wilderness about why they were there and how they would "soon" be going home? When they knew, they were to die in the wilderness. Just as our pioneers were told by Sister White, that the Church had blown it and that we too would wander for many more years. History has indeed repeated itself. There is ONE verse left, only ONE, Daniel 11:45, the same players identified in verses 40-44, just waiting for the final climax. When you see verse 45 fulfilled, run to the country. The Sunday laws will quickly follow, the last events after this will come very fast, there will be no time to wait. The "sign" we should be waiting for is not the Sunday law, it is verse 45. Quote
Gibs Posted December 26, 2012 Posted December 26, 2012 ClubV12, I know there is many views on this and won't give mine now as am not tottally settled on it yet. But here is something from Sister White that may help all to see further that care to unravel this prophecy, and it is unsealed to us now I am sure. "I saw that the two-horned beast had a dragon's mouth, and that his power was in his head, and that the decree would go out of his mouth. Then I saw the Mother of Harlots; that the mother was not the daughters, but separate and distinct from them. She has had her day, and it is past, and her daughters, the Protestant sects, were the next to come on the stage and act out the same mind that the mother had when she persecuted the saints. I saw that as the mother has been declining in power, the daughters had been growing, and soon they will exercise the power once exercised by the mother. {SpM 1.4} I saw the nominal church and nominal Adventists, like Judas, would betray us to the Catholics to obtain their influence to come against the truth. The saints then will be an obscure people, little known to the Catholics; but the churches and nominal Adventists who know of our faith and customs (for they hated us on account of the Sabbath, for they could not refute it) will betray the saints and report them to the Catholics as those who disregard the institutions of the people; that is, that they keep the Sabbath and disregard Sunday. -2- {SpM 1.5} Then the Catholics bid the Protestants to go forward, and issue a decree that all who will not observe the first day of the week, instead of the seventh day, shall be slain. And the Catholics, whose numbers are large, will stand by the Protestants. The Catholics will give their power to the image of the beast. And the Protestants will work as their mother worked before them to destroy the saints. But before their decree bring or bear fruit, the saints will be delivered by the Voice of God. Then I saw that Jesus' work in the sanctuary will soon be finished. And after His work there is finished, He will come to the door of the first apartment, and confess the sins of Israel upon the head of the Scape Goat. Then He will put on the garments of vengeance. Then the plagues will come upon the wicked, and they do not come till Jesus puts on that garment, and takes His place upon the great white cloud. Then while the plagues are falling, the Scape Goat is being led away. He makes a mighty struggle to escape, but he is held fast by the hand that leads him. If he should effect his escape, Israel would lose their lives. I saw that it would take time to lead away the Scape Goat into the land of forgetfulness after the sins were put on his head. {SpM 2.1} Maybe more later, 1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world. Quote A Freeman In Jesus Christ
Administrators Gail Posted December 26, 2012 Administrators Posted December 26, 2012 The other day someone told me that she had listened to a sermon where the Muslims would be heavily involved. Were's view is that Smith erred in thinking Turkey, but that it would be the whole world gathering together to Armageddon by the 3 unclean spirits, AND that the battle is between Christ and Satan. I tell people that we probably don't understand the most of it, that like any subject I have sat down with contained in the Bible, once you start the subject gets bigger and bigger. Quote Isaiah 32:17 And the work of righteousness shall be peace; and the effect of righteousness quietness and assurance for ever.
ClubV12 Posted December 26, 2012 Author Posted December 26, 2012 Where I differ in a MAJOR way with yourself Gibs, Sky, Dr.Rich and many others who post on this forum are that my conclusions are in harmony with the General Conference of Seventh-day Adventists. That organized and officially recognized the world over as the body that comprises the Church known as Seventh-day Adventists. I am not blind to the apostasy in some cases of our organized Churches. I am not blind to how far we as a people have drifted from the blue print of Sister White. I pray the same prayer Daniel and others before him have prayed. For my own sins and the sins of my people, I account myself among those who must continue to wander. Like Daniel, like Nehemiah before him, I am a reformer and I choose to suffer affliction with the people of God, who are that organized body of believers known as Seventh-day Adventists. Warts and all, these are the people I love, pray for, work with and will stay with. This body of believers, headed by the General Conference, have not rejected Uriah's work, they know better. The G.C. has not accepted in full Roosenbergs work, they, like me, are considering his views with care. I have no interest in views on prophecy that tend to "tear down", that are "new light" that displaces "old light". I build on that which has come before, THIS is where the harmony is. THIS is where unity is found. I utterly reject the concepts and ideas of those who have removed themselves from this body of believers, the organized Seventh-day Adventist Church. I will not argue the points they raise, I will seek to do as Jesus did. Speak truth based on a firm foundation that was laid by our pioneers. On those points where we are still seeking light, I will consider views that remain in harmony with the brethren, the counselers, appointed by God to lead this great Church to the end. Even though, they are men, they will make mistakes, my trust is in our Lord to work out all things to His glory, in spite of the failings of man. Quote
Gibs Posted December 26, 2012 Posted December 26, 2012 ClubV12, I wonder if you find the "daily" is taken away yet since that is brought up in this prophecy you are considering. And has the "abomination that maketh desolate" been placed yet in your see? The verse, Da 11:31 And arms shall stand on his part, and they shall pollute the sanctuary of strength, and shall take away the daily sacrifice, and they shall place the abomination that maketh desolate. I think I know your answer and so I am very reluctant to point out that some things are not in order in the historic see of it. There is other subjects I would rather explain as this one is very complex to delineate out so it can be seen. I choose to let you run with it where you will but I may when winter pens me in post a thead of it myself and also would just not care for other views but just to present it to be perused for consideration only. Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world. Quote A Freeman In Jesus Christ
ClubV12 Posted December 26, 2012 Author Posted December 26, 2012 I take Sister Whites advice on the Daily, let it not become an issue of division. For the time being, while I continue to carefully consider this important issue, I take the same position our pioneers took before 1844. It was only AFTER 1844 that division started to come in as it regards the daily. Before that, they were in perfect unity, as I am in perfect unity with them today. I will not run ahead of the Lord or the brethren. If need be, to promote unity, I will put my ideas aside in favor of my brethren, when doing so does not violate a clear command of my personal duty to the Lord. That we may all move as one toward our understanding. See page 282 for Uriah Smiths comments on the daily in the book, "Daniel and the Revelation". I see no reason to dismiss Brother Smiths viewpoint. My current study is focused on the three woes. Two of which are passed, the third will follow suit with the first two. It will be a continuation of Islam vs Christianity. Quote
BobRyan Posted December 27, 2012 Posted December 27, 2012 I need to clarify a few things about this thread I started some time ago. I USED to follow Roosenberg with a great passion. I have studied his work in depth and am especially intrigued with his most recent understanding of how the 1260-1335 year segments of time fit within the larger 2,300 year prophecy. That was then, my more recent studies have led me to conclude that Roosenberg's analysis are not as accurate as I once believed. In comparing the multitude of Seventh-day Adventist "theological theories" regarding Daniel 11:40-45 I am more and more convinced that we have over looked a very important theologian and his contributions. Uriah Smith and his book Daniel and the Revelation. Of this book Sister White says it will retain it's interest until probabtion closes. She also notes Uriah Smith was led of God in writing out this work and the light it brings should be appreciated by all, until the end of time. I thought Ellen White had some differences with Smith when it comes to prophetic interpretation in Daniel and Revelation. Here is a web site talking about the differences. I have not read through it - http://the2520.com/PDFs/UriahSmithTruth.pdf in Christ, Bob Quote John 8:32 - The Truth will make you free“The righteousness of Christ will not cover one cherished sin." COL 316.
ClubV12 Posted December 27, 2012 Author Posted December 27, 2012 Bob, it is most unfortunate that the issues between Uriah and James continue to discourage the good counsel and blessed book, "Daniel and the Revelation". The issues between Uriah and James are complex and changed over the years. At times they were in perfect agreement, at other times, they were not. Of course the same could be said of the brethren concerning the "daily" and it's meaning. Because the pioneers did not understand, and we still don't, the meaning of the 1,335 they left it out of the 1850 chart. This adds fuel to the fire for the futurists who claim the 1,335 are literal days and other such nonsense. There are many hooks to hang your doubts on... I've looked very closely at the debate between Uriah and James and have concluded there is an abundance of misinformation and outright lies concerning it. The weight of evidence in support of Uriahs book is heavily in favor of Uriah and not toward James. But if I were to use any direct Ellen White statements to support that position I would be doing precisely what she told Uriah and James to STOP doing, stop arguing about it. So I will not engage the dispute. I have not willingly come to the conclusion that "Daniel and the Revelation" is in fact THEE book we should be focused on today. It is not a popular position and I have indeed suffered persecution for even suggesting my support from church members. In fact, I was specifically threatened to be removed as a Sabbath School teacher for my support of his book!!! This is the one book the evil doer does not want Seventh-day Adventists to read and he has done an amazing job in achieving that goal. James will have to answer for his roll in bringing this about. Uriah was not perfect, neither was Ellen White in all regards. Like all people following Christ, they grew in their understanding. But the fundamental truths they both taught and agreed on, remain as solid today as they were since 1844. Mark Uriahs words, Israel is doomed, it will burn, there will be another holocaust. The Papal powers will not be the ones who do it, it will be Islamists. The USA will not interfere, Europe will not engage, the Jews have gathered themselves together for a great slaughter. Who will be the power that "conquers Israel"? I believe as Uriah believed, it will be Islam. And when that happens, THAT is the sign that all things are about to wrap up. Time to get out of town. The stage is set in this current day, like Uriah, I see Turkey being a key player in bringing the Islamist together, marching into Jerusalem and becoming the occupying power. Time to dust off "Daniel and the Revelation", read it again, for the first time. Read it in terms of what Uriah would say today if he was writing it today. Subtle changes, but the basics remain. I have found great peace in just accepting Uriahs counsel, after having dug through the garbage of every wind of doctrine on Daniel for the last two years. In the link you posted, authored by Louis Were, note that in most respects he does not address the specific issues on a doctrinal basis. His attack is primarily on the character of Uriah. I do not see the spirit of Christ in his analysis. This author has been a serious player in denigrating Uriahs work. He is the primary reason I was threatened to be removed as Sabbath School teacher in fact! I do not hate the man, I'm giving the trumpet a clear and distinct sound of warning. Quote
Windsor Posted December 29, 2012 Posted December 29, 2012 Uriah Smith's book should not be relegated to the dustbin of history. Neither should we say it is without error. If it is without error, I guess there really is no longer any need to read the actual book of Daniel and Revelation. Quote Remember Adventists Online?
hch Posted January 14, 2013 Posted January 14, 2013 I thought Egypt was the king of the south? Daniel 11:8-9 (8) And shall also carry captives into Egypt their gods, with their princes, and with their precious vessels of silver and of gold; and he shall continue more years than the king of the north. (9) So the king of the south shall come into his kingdom, and shall return into his own land. Quote His child Henry Bible student/Author https://www.loudcry101.com
BobRyan Posted January 14, 2013 Posted January 14, 2013 I have not willingly come to the conclusion that "Daniel and the Revelation" is in fact THEE book we should be focused on today. It is not a popular position and I have indeed suffered persecution for even suggesting my support from church members. In fact, I was specifically threatened to be removed as a Sabbath School teacher for my support of his book!!! This is the one book the evil doer does not want Seventh-day Adventists to read and he has done an amazing job in achieving that goal. James will have to answer for his roll in bringing this about. Uriah was not perfect, neither was Ellen White in all regards. Like all people following Christ, they grew in their understanding. But the fundamental truths they both taught and agreed on, remain as solid today as they were since 1844. Mark Uriahs words, Israel is doomed, it will burn, there will be another holocaust. The Papal powers will not be the ones who do it, it will be Islamists. The USA will not interfere, Europe will not engage, the Jews have gathered themselves together for a great slaughter. Who will be the power that "conquers Israel"? I believe as Uriah believed, it will be Islam. And when that happens, THAT is the sign that all things are about to wrap up. Time to get out of town. The stage is set in this current day, like Uriah, I see Turkey being a key player in bringing the Islamist together, marching into Jerusalem and becoming the occupying power. Time to dust off "Daniel and the Revelation", read it again, for the first time. Read it in terms of what Uriah would say today if he was writing it today. Subtle changes, but the basics remain. I have found great peace in just accepting Uriahs counsel, after having dug through the garbage of every wind of doctrine on Daniel for the last two years. I don't mean to be saying anything negative about Uriah Smith - just that Ellen White's messages place a lot of emphasis on the NSL being "the sign" to get out of town. Having said that Roosenberg places a lot of emphasis on Islam as the king of the South in the last days in Daniel 11 and makes a pretty good case for it being a major player. I am still looking into his material. in Christ, Bob Quote John 8:32 - The Truth will make you free“The righteousness of Christ will not cover one cherished sin." COL 316.
ClubV12 Posted January 14, 2013 Author Posted January 14, 2013 The National Sunday Law is the last opportunity to "get out of town". I believe for most who will wait right up until that last minute, it will be to late. We need to catch the waymarks of prophecy being fulfilled along the way. It is my opinion that the fulfillment of Daniel 11:45 is one of the very last waymarks. When it is clear that verse 45 is fulfilled if I have any assetts left, I will sell them. I will certainly move out of any big city at that time and making preparation to leave even a small town. You think you can sell your house AFTER the National Sunday law is enacted? I don't think so. How long between Dan 11:45 and 12:1? Could be quite awhile, so one needs to make serious preparation for the long haul. Quote
Lysimachus Posted January 16, 2013 Posted January 16, 2013 So has anyone else here yet finally decided to GIVE IN and get a Facebook account? The entire Adventist world is teaming with activity on Facebook. My friend Scott and I started a new Forum Group on Facebook entitled: "Seventh-Day Adventism: Defending the Pillars of the Faith". It is my hope that some of you will not be so "picky" about putting their information on Facebook, and just join. Besides, you can leave out as much info as you want on Facebook, and just create a fake name if you want with some pretty pictures. No need to post your pic if you don't want, but I don't see the need of being so private. I do hope you join ClubV12! And BobRyan! You guys are needed in our group, we are discussing some of the most exciting, and some advanced, topics! Please join! http://www.facebook.com/groups/119771368183504/ Quote ~Lysimachus (Marcos S.) Author of article, Vindicating the Year-Day Principle of Prophetic Interpretation (see attachment for article) Currently writing a book, Vindicating the Historical School of Prophetic Interpretation Founder of the largest and fastest SDA Apologetics Group on Facebook, Seventh-Day Adventism - Defending the Pillars of the Faith Writer and apologetics contributor at Adventist Defense League Vindicating the Year-Day Principle of Prophetic Interpretation.pdf
hch Posted March 31, 2013 Posted March 31, 2013 The National Sunday Law is the last opportunity to "get out of town". I believe for most who will wait right up until that last minute, it will be to late. We need to catch the waymarks of prophecy being fulfilled along the way. It is my opinion that the fulfillment of Daniel 11:45 is one of the very last waymarks. When it is clear that verse 45 is fulfilled if I have any assetts left, I will sell them. I will certainly move out of any big city at that time and making preparation to leave even a small town. You think you can sell your house AFTER the National Sunday law is enacted? I don't think so. How long between Dan 11:45 and 12:1? Could be quite awhile, so one needs to make serious preparation for the long haul. As I read it, the last events will be rapid ones! Is it wise to wait for our property to be worthless before we make plans? Quote His child Henry Bible student/Author https://www.loudcry101.com
ClubV12 Posted March 31, 2013 Author Posted March 31, 2013 Thats the delima! WHEN should you sell, not only property, but use all the assetts at your disposal to further the last efforts of the work? We don't want to be premature, like what happened in the great disappointment. We don't want to be to late when it is worthless. We do have counsel that those who have truly dedicated all to Him, will know when the time comes. The more I study Daniel I come to the conclusion that those "rapid events" of the last days will follow shortly after Daniel 11:45, the last prophecy "way mark" to Daniel 12:1. Daniel 12:1 is probation closing. So how much time between verse 45 and 12:1? Tricky question, but based on "rapid events", well, what DOES that mean? Just to remind folks on this thread, I no longer support Roosenbergs interpretation, but God bless his efforts! He is certainly drawing people, like myself, to study the questions for themselves. Quote
hch Posted March 31, 2013 Posted March 31, 2013 Thats the delima! WHEN should you sell, not only property, but use all the assetts at your disposal to further the last efforts of the work? We don't want to be premature, like what happened in the great disappointment. We don't want to be to late when it is worthless. We do have counsel that those who have truly dedicated all to Him, will know when the time comes. The more I study Daniel I come to the conclusion that those "rapid events" of the last days will follow shortly after Daniel 11:45, the last prophecy "way mark" to Daniel 12:1. Daniel 12:1 is probation closing. So how much time between verse 45 and 12:1? Tricky question, but based on "rapid events", well, what DOES that mean? Just to remind folks on this thread, I no longer support Roosenbergs interpretation, but God bless his efforts! He is certainly drawing people, like myself, to study the questions for themselves. As I read Daniel 11 we recently past verse 43. Trouble in Egypt, Libya, and Ethiopia. Their dictators have all been removed. The one in Egypt imprisoned. The one in Libya shot. And the one in Ethiopia died of natural causes last August. Now these three countries are claiming to be in US's steps - democracies. Then as I read it verses 31-36 come next that I read as Iran attacking our US fleet in the Gulf and President Obama unleashing Star Wars on them. If that scenario is accurate, now is a good time to get our houses in order. while there is still a market. Blessings Quote His child Henry Bible student/Author https://www.loudcry101.com
ClubV12 Posted April 1, 2013 Author Posted April 1, 2013 I don't follow your connection on the sequence of the verses HCH. Daniel 11 history unfolds in a precise order, one thing follows another. Revelation skips all over, but not Daniel. For us to be passed verse 43 then it follows verse 42 is done. Likewise verses 31-36 would have already taken place. The only way around this would some kind of dual-fulfillment. I'm not a big fan of dual fulfillment, it has it's place (like Matthew 24). But certain rules of interpretation have to be very carefully considered. Otherwise, we end up with dual fulfillment on a massive scale and it's every man for himself! By the way, I see Egypt as siding with the Islamists in a full blown way before this is over. Abandoning "NATO" completely and throwing all it's weight toward a Caliphate. I see Libya as "please don't hurt us NATO, we'll do whatever you say". But thats just an opinion, not written in stone. Quote
hch Posted April 1, 2013 Posted April 1, 2013 I don't follow your connection on the sequence of the verses HCH. Daniel 11 history unfolds in a precise order, one thing follows another. Revelation skips all over, but not Daniel. For us to be passed verse 43 then it follows verse 42 is done. Likewise verses 31-36 would have already taken place. The only way around this would some kind of dual-fulfillment. I'm not a big fan of dual fulfillment, it has it's place (like Matthew 24). But certain rules of interpretation have to be very carefully considered. Otherwise, we end up with dual fulfillment on a massive scale and it's every man for himself! By the way, I see Egypt as siding with the Islamists in a full blown way before this is over. Abandoning "NATO" completely and throwing all it's weight toward a Caliphate. I see Libya as "please don't hurt us NATO, we'll do whatever you say". But thats just an opinion, not written in stone. Lest we forget some parts of Daniel are on the explain and expand mode. He makes a statement and then gives a caveat to explain what led up to it. As I read Daniel 11, it begins with the 3 kings in Persia:Cyrus, Darius, and Artaxerxes. From there it flows to Daniel 12:1 where Christ stands for His people in 1844. Then it loops back to 11:6 in response to the angel's command to John that the little book must prophecy again. When Daniel 11:31-36 came about this time, Daniel pauses to explain what led up to them, which is found in v .37 to at least 43. The trouble in Egypt began with the Arab Spring in 2011. Their leaders were deposed in the sequence Daniel described: Egypt (jail for life), Libya (shot), Ethiopia (died natural causes 8/2012). And now they are in America's steps (all claim to be democracies). So as I read it Iran will attack America's fleet in the Gulf and President Obama will unleash SDI (BMD) against them and the final events will be rapid ones. not everybody reads it that way, but not everybody was saying Pope Benedict would leave office before the Spring of 2013. FYI This is a complete list of my Benedict tweets & the date: Pope Benedict XVI has but a very short time left (3 September 2011) #Pope Benedict XVI marks his last year with a Latin America trip that includes a visit to #Cuba (23 March 2012) With Benedict XVI in his last year, Who’s going to be the new pope? As I read it a demon masquerading as John-Paul II will take the job! (3 April 2012) Is Pope Benedict going to be pope in 2013? (29 April 2012) Months ago I tweeted that pope Benedict XVI is a short timer. Now Vatican power play is news! Y u b last 2 know? (28 May 2012) If Pope Benedict’s 8th year is really his 7th, his time ends before May 2013 (7 July 2012) Pope Benedict’s 8th year is really his 7th, because his ascension year was John-Paul II’s last year. Will Benedict XVI’s 7th year B his last (8 August 2012) Pope #Benedict XVI As I read Daniel’s prophecy, 7’s number of completeness. His ascension year (zero) 2005. He might last till spring 2013? (30 September 2012) Pope Benedict announced this morning (Monday February 11, 2013) that he is resigning as of 28 February 2013. So I will stay with what I know from studying Bible prophecy and let everyone else study to show themselves approved of God needing not to be ashamed from their own personal studies. Quote His child Henry Bible student/Author https://www.loudcry101.com
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